Domain: verso.com
Stories and comments across the archive that link to verso.com.
Comments · 7
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Re:ports
Actually, there is a product that blocks it without being a man in the middle. I know for sure because I'm one of the developers who worked on it. It's called NetSpective WebFilter. It runs in promiscuous sniffing mode only (no proxy), and it blocks Skype perfectly (along with several other protocols). I've also studied Skype well enough to know how big a security risk it really is.
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There's slightly more to it than that...
I posted this ealier but was a bit vociferous, here's a calmer version of my earlier post:
The article is belaboring something that has been a fact of web development for at least the past year or two. Both browsers have had things that only work on only their platform for years. Anyone remember BLINK and MARQUEE? How about javascript? They use different DOMs so different code has to be used to do the same thing. Sites like Dynamic Drive have been seperating their scripts into IE-only and Netscape only for as long as I've been going there.
Netscape has been flouting standards for as long than MSFT with their proprietary LAYER tag and inventing Javascript. Frankly as at now (but not for long with Mozilla in the works) MSIE supports more of CSS1 than Netscape for proof of this check out this page and use this image as a reference. In MSIE it renders with few flaws while in Netscape it looks like a Picasso. The problem is therefore not with MSIE's support of CSS1 standards at least not now.
The problem is that MSFT's proprietary additions to their browser such as the XML parser built into the browser which is available for scripting and others are so tempting to developers that they ignore the fact that these things work only on IE and rationalize (if you can call it that) this away with "Most people use IE." The fact that W3C takes a long time to ratify standards has not helped this either. PS: For all those who do not realize how long both browsers have been incompatible and flouting standards read Dynamic Html : The Definitive Reference by Danny Goodman for an informative read.
PS: The above post is very correct, MSFT doesn't force websites to use it's proprietary additions or to script only for IE, bad web developers do this. If people didn't use the IE specific things in the browser for websites on the world wide web (as opposed to a local intranet were such things can be mandated) then this would not be an issue. Web developers are more to blame for the browser segregation than MSFT.
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There's slightly more to it than that...
I posted this ealier but was a bit vociferous, here's a calmer version of my earlier post:
The article is belaboring something that has been a fact of web development for at least the past year or two. Both browsers have had things that only work on only their platform for years. Anyone remember BLINK and MARQUEE? How about javascript? They use different DOMs so different code has to be used to do the same thing. Sites like Dynamic Drive have been seperating their scripts into IE-only and Netscape only for as long as I've been going there.
Netscape has been flouting standards for as long than MSFT with their proprietary LAYER tag and inventing Javascript. Frankly as at now (but not for long with Mozilla in the works) MSIE supports more of CSS1 than Netscape for proof of this check out this page and use this image as a reference. In MSIE it renders with few flaws while in Netscape it looks like a Picasso. The problem is therefore not with MSIE's support of CSS1 standards at least not now.
The problem is that MSFT's proprietary additions to their browser such as the XML parser built into the browser which is available for scripting and others are so tempting to developers that they ignore the fact that these things work only on IE and rationalize (if you can call it that) this away with "Most people use IE." The fact that W3C takes a long time to ratify standards has not helped this either. PS: For all those who do not realize how long both browsers have been incompatible and flouting standards read Dynamic Html : The Definitive Reference by Danny Goodman for an informative read.
PS: The above post is very correct, MSFT doesn't force websites to use it's proprietary additions or to script only for IE, bad web developers do this. If people didn't use the IE specific things in the browser for websites on the world wide web (as opposed to a local intranet were such things can be mandated) then this would not be an issue. Web developers are more to blame for the browser segregation than MSFT.
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CSS1 Browser Test
Oops I forgot to included the reference gif but not the actual standards test. click here to test which browser conforms more to the CSS1 standards. If it looks like a Picasso (as in Netscape) then the browser is not conforming to standards, while if it looks like a bunch of boxes (like in MSIE) then it is standards compliant.
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Re:RH installsNetscape3 vs IE3? IE3 couldn't do decent HTML3.2 at the time and its CSS implementation was completetly wrong (the microsoft css gallery spectacularly missed the point of the language). Admittedly the w3 specs at the time were incomplete, but mistaking size definitions broke CSS and people didn't attempt it mainstream until the 4.0 browsers. IE3 had an internal default style sheet (much like the idea of Verso's core/base style sheet) that let you overwrite base tag attributes accidentally!
With HTML rendering left - N3 was much more consistent in its rendering (remember the transparent GIF problems if it was a background image in the 16 bit version?) and was a clean trim app (4 was bloated misdirected tripe, argh!). IE didn't win until 4, and wasn't fast until 5. IE3 was shite.
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Re:stylesheet support?
The Style Sheet support is FANTASTIC! (I'm a web developer, so I've seen the havoc that trying to support different browsers can reak!)
For a really good CSS test, check out:
http://style.verso.com/boxacidtest/
It renders horribly in Netscape 4.x series, but in Mozilla, it is EXACTLY the same as the reference picture. It got me pretty excited :) -
Netscape Fails Acid Box Test Woefully
I did here's a link to the site.
View it in Netscape Communicator 4.7 it looks like the product of a night of drugs, booze and bad code. Look at it in IE 5 and besides a spacing problem it looks fine.
Since the page is completely standards compliant and IE shows it better than Netscape this means that IE is the more standards compliant browser.
This is more obvious to anyone who has tried to create a website and expected that because something is in the standards it should look fine in Netscape, sadly this is not so.My homepage looks fine in IE but Netscape acts really funky about certain things so I ended up having to sniff browsers to decide what pages to show people.
I loved Netscape when I first got on the Web and hated IE. Slowly but surely IE drew level with Netscape and now (as much as I hate to admit it) IE is a better product. Even without the useful and timesaving features like Auto form filling (I fill forms every other day online and it's great that now each form has a memory of the things I've typed in it...no more constantly retyping my address at MapQuest every time I need directions) or Auto Password fill (use with care) IE5 is more standards compliant and thus is a better than Communicator 4.7 .
We need to help Mozilla. If we fail, we will lose the war.
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