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WinVNC vs. KVM Extender?
systmc asks: "I'm trying to decide between using WinVNC or a KVM extender at a customer's site. I'd like to use WinVNC but I'm concerned about it's CPU usage on a WinNT system (with an inactive client connected CPU usage was at around 8%, even with Raw encoding. PCAnywhere was about 0.5%). Does anyone have experience tweaking VNC? If hardware winds up being necessary, what KVM Extender would you recommend?"
Have you tried TightVNC? I don't know about it's CPU usage, but IMHO it is much better and faster than normal WinVNC. It can also do JPEG-encoding on the picture data, so it is really bandwidth-efficient.
This is the place where you write something that will make you seem like a complete idiot.
You haven't explained why you want to use a remote machine.
If it's to run applications, then the WinVNC/PCAnywhere/etc route is a good one. It's more flexible, because you don't need a cable. You can share the machine between more than one person, and you don't need extra hardware.
Personally, for remote administration, I'd always use the KVM extender solution. If the machine that you're administrating isn't behaving, then the remote control software probably isn't working properly either. Remote software doesn't let you watch bootup screens, or reconfigure the Bios.
So, before you make a decision, I think you need to look carefully at the purpose of the solution.
What kind of machine is it at the client's site? If it is W2K you could use rdesktop. This is apparently a fairly chatty protocol (compared with Citrix at least) but it is probably more CPU efficient.
However, as another poster said, I think the KVM is the way to go, for the same reasons.
The old Timbuktu does a decent job. I have a client that's moved a number of their machines over to that to replace pcAnywhere. They feel it's faster and has less impact on the remote machine. I believe it gives you something that pcAnywhere doesn't have: you can have multiple clients connected at once as long as at most one is in Control mode (vs. Observe mode).
Make sure you don't have "poll entire screen" checked. It's a pig.
My personal setup is TightVNC with everything BUT "poll entire screen" checked. It's pretty zippy, even over dialup, so long as you aren't redrawing the entire screen.
Perhaps a better (and more professional) solution is something like Citrix. VNC limits you to one connection at a time, while Citrix allows multiple sessions simultaneously. In addition, Citrix is probably the fastest VNC-style thing I've used, and the Metaframe protocol works reasonably well, even over a modem. It's also more secure - rather than a VNC login, you use your Windows login, just like it's local (except it isn't). It's about the closest thing available for Windows to a remote XDM.
But I agree : vnc is a lot more efficient on *NIX that on NT...
And as for security, someone mentionned, there is not so much encryption with vnc. At least, the vnc password is not sent in cleartext on the wire, but after that every keystrokes goes as it is into an udp packet.
But I'm using VNC through a VPN tunnel to work from home, and since the generated network traffic is relatively light-weight, it's working pretty well to control *NIX-based hosts...[Pruneau
Somebody mentioned the trouble with VNC for remote administration, if the PC isn't working then VNC may not be up either. KVM's don't suffer from this. But they're distance limited. Compaq makes a product that gives the best of both worlds. It's a PCI card for the "controlled" PC. It hooks into the video, keyboard, mouse, and power. It has it's own power supply and NIC in it. It gives you a KVM-like control over TCP/IP. You control it via java and a web browser. A company I used to work for deployed these in several hundred servers that were located all over the U.S. It got us out of jams where VNC or a KVM would not.
Anything that isn't made by Belkin. Many people swaer by them, but for me, they've caused no end of trouble. Half the time, they don't switch when you request them to, other times, they'll switch of their own accord. And they suck at handling non-PC hardware. I can't use them with my SPARC, and my Alpha works intermittently at best through them.
"The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike." -- Delos B. McKown
If you happen to have Compaq servers check out their Lights Out Management boards. They are almost a complete PC on a card. Intel i960 CPU, RAM, ATI Vid, and a NIC. They let you completely remote control the system through a web browser. It has its own power supply so you can restart the system and follow it through the POST test and everything.
Pretty slick. They are $499. I put them in all new servers now.
I cannot understand why people talk about WinVNC, Proxy, PcAnywhere etc. Just use the included NetMeeting and enable Remote Desktop. I have it on all my servers and it's fast enough for me. Everywhere I go computers have NetMeeting installed (included in Windows) so you can call the servers. NetMeeting have encryption and uses normal NT accounts for users/password (or Active Directory/domain admins).
Believe me! I've tried them all! (winvnc, tightvnc...)
BTW: Don't forget to lower your colors (256color desktop. it's faster).
I'm using the tightvnc distribution of VNC on WinNT (and linux as well) and I'm not seeing nearly the cpu usage that you are... when its active, there's a bit of a jump, but inactive my cpu (on a three-monitor system, no less--600mhz P3 with 128 MB RAM. With the Tight compression selected, 8 bit color, and jpeg compression enabled, its very usable even over a modem. The only real advantages PC Anywhere has over it in our office is the built-in file transfer capabilities of PCanywhere, and the ability to dial directly into a computer. aside from that, VNC has it beat, as far as I'm concerned.
At my old job, we had Proxy by Funk Software on all the PCs in the two locations, and all of the NT/2000 servers. Worked well, but was a little pricy when dealing with 350 desktops. You can get a 30 day trial of the software to see if you like it, and it supports modem, IP, and IPX. It's a little slow over a modem, and I recogmend disabling the translation effects on 2k machines, like fadeing. It hates PC anywhere though, they don't play well together. It was decent over a t1 connection that had traffic all day, and we could use it on dial-in users as well.
.asp file I believe, but I forget the name, but then you can admin the entire Active Directory thing and possibly some other things.
As for PC Anywhere, we had some service providers who used it, and it worked well, and some times better than Proxy. VNC was something I used as a band-aid for a few rare things like I hinted at above, but works well on a no cash budget.
Also, Win2k server has a single user license included for remote administration purposes, and both NT and 2k support workstation administration though the tool kits they have. For 2k, you only need the server cd in a 2k workstation to install the package. It is a
Who wants Pork Chops?
what KVM Extender would you recommend?
Tom's Hardware recently did a review of 5 KVM switches. They gave the top nob to, not suprisingly, the Belkin F1DS102T, which has some nifty features such as audio and usb switching.
But the C/S design is also a problem. Microsoft no longer provides public ILS servers, and to access the Directory server you have to sign up for Hotmail. (Lovely spam! Wonderful spam!) MS does not provide listings of public servers. Instead they refer you to netmeet.net -- which seems to be down.
I did find one university ILS server. But I suspect its owners are unaware that it's accessible to the world at large. No thank you, my relationship with the fibbies is already sufficiently complex.
I'm looking at commercial service providers. Don't seem to be a lot of them.
And yes, I'm aware of Expertcity. Many advantages, including Mac and Solaris support. (Didn't they use to support Linux?) But they've found low-end customers unprofitable, so you have to be prepared to spend at least $400/month to get their attention.
I seem to recall that there's an ILS-compatible client for Irix. Anyone know of other non-MS clients?
I don't know why nobody ever mentions RemotelyAnywhere when this question comes up.
It works entirely from a browser, and is quite nice.
It includes a mobo info page (uses MBM), network graphs, file management, upload/download, SSL, works through firewalls (inc. VNC-like usage), telnet/SSH/FTP server (dunno how (in)secure they are; you can disable them).
I like it.
If it's Windows 2000, enable the Terminal Services with remote management option (which legally allows you to not buy WTS client licenses). You can then use the web-based terminal services ActiveX, or the normal Windows Terminal Server client.
If it's NT 4.0, see about an upgrade to Win2000.
Only thing this won't give you is access to the attached terminal process, which if you're running something like SQL or Lotus Domino, and you want to see the process console -- well, that's a walk to the server room.
Also remember you can admin Win2000 boxes from any Win2000 box. Right-click on My Computer, go to Manage, then Action...Connect to Another Computer. Gives you access to services, logs, storage, user/group accounts....
I've used WinVNC (or Tridia's package of it) for some time. It can spike the CPU on slower (PPro, slower PIIs) machines, but IMHO is very good for what it does. We ditched PC Anywhere in favor of VNC and even use in on HP-UX boxes in some cases. Best of all, I can admin all my NT servers from my non-M$ desktop, which tickles me with glee every day.
Amateurs discuss tactics. Professionals discuss logistics.
It's not any less CPU-intensive on the host, unfortunately.
I've found the WTS "Remote Admin" mode to be totally worthless when the server freezes a process, but is otherwise responsive. Usually there's the dying message of the server process or daemon still up on the screen. Write the error down, click OK, reboot, and report the error to the vendor. Rinse and repeat.