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On The History Of Dead Or Alive

Posted by simoniker on from the with-the-kicking-and-the-punching dept.

Thanks to IGN Xbox for its article documenting the history of Tecmo's Dead Or Alive fighting game franchise. The piece discusses the "series that brought [Ninja Gaiden developer] Tecmo from an underrated developer to one of the most popular companies in the industry", focusing on titles including Dead Or Alive 2 ("...introduced many concepts that have yet to be fully utilized in other fighting games") and the forthcoming Dead Or Alive Ultimate ("All the buzz is around the online play at this moment, and whether or not Team Ninja will be able to pull it off successfully.") TeamXbox also has an interview with Tecmo's delightfully deranged Tomonobu Itagaki, who declares: "To be thrown off of a cliff by an ugly opponent might make you feel bad even if the fight was fair, but to be thrown off by a beautiful woman... that should make you feel good about losing."

33 comments

  1. How can you mention Dead or Alive... by RogueyWon · · Score: 5, Interesting

    How can you mention Dead or Alive without mentioning Xtreme Beach Volleyball? So far as I remember, this holds the entirely laudible distinction of being the only X-box-only game to have made it into the Japanese top 10. It probably also holds some kind of record for the number of derogatory jokes it's inspired.

    The weird thing is that it isn't actally that bad a game, nor is the content particularly shocking. It's... like... girls in bikinis. You've seen worse on Baywatch. In fact, here in the UK, you can walk into a newsagent and buy worse in a mainstream tabloid newspaper (eg. The Sun, The Star) and those are sold for a few pence each with no age restrictions. I guess it's a good illustration of how double-standards apply to video-games.

    1. Re:How can you mention Dead or Alive... by Singletoned · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Couldn't agree more.

      I thought DoA:XBV was a wonderful game, and quite an original one at that. It was very peaceful with no real objective or aim. You just wandered through the game playing a bit of volleyball, looking around the island and collecting swimsuits and items.

      When it came out I had a weeks holiday from work and bought loads of games (DoA:XBV, Panzer Dragoon Orta, Metroid Prime, and a few others), intending to play them that week and then take them back for a refund at the end of the week. I ended up playing DoA:XBV all week as it was so captivating.

    2. Re:How can you mention Dead or Alive... by AliasTheRoot · · Score: 1

      it cant have been in the top ten in Japan, unless it was the top ten bikini based volleyball games on Xbox charts.

      It was a pretty fun game, mixing elements of volleyball and dating simulation.

      The beat em ups were a bit lame tho, somewhere between Soul Calibur/Virtua Fighter and Tekken in quality.

    3. Re:How can you mention Dead or Alive... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Uh, I honestly can't say I remember how DOAX did in Japan upon release (I'd assume well enough, given the number of XBOX systems out there), but I know Ninja Gaiden had broken the top ten list (as well) for the first week of its release.

      DOAX didn't deserve it. Ninja Gaiden did.

    4. Re:How can you mention Dead or Alive... by RogueyWon · · Score: 1

      Yeah, that figures. The information I had on DOAX breaking into the top 10 is pretty old now, while Ninja Gaiden is a pretty recent release. The amusing thing is that pretty much every X-Box owner in Japan would have had to have bought these two games for that to happen. Interesting to see if these will start getting more common as MS increases its focus on the Japanese market.

    5. Re:How can you mention Dead or Alive... by Psychochild · · Score: 1
      I guess it's a good illustration of how double-standards apply to video-games.

      I'm a professional game developer, so I get this a lot.

      Scott McCloud in his bood Reinventing Comics had a wonderful insight:
      "Public perception MATTERS. As long as the broader community assumes that comics, by their nature, are without social value and, by their nature, are suitable only for kids -- then charges of obscenity will always hit their mark." (p. 89)

      Even though he was talking about comics, you can apply this just as easily to any form of entertainment, including video games. People are stuck in the mode of thinging that video games are something that little Tommy does after school, ignoring the fact that Tom Sr. plays games after work.

      Anyway, I highly recommend McCloud's previous book, Understanding Comics, to people that are interested in computer games, especially in the development of games. There's a lot of insight in his books that can be applied to video games as easily as they can be applied to comics.

      Anyway, to make this post quasi-on-topic: I think the article is a bit incorrect. Tecmo was known for a lot of games before their more recent titles hit the shelves. The original Ninja Gaidens on the NES were classic games. I've also heard nothing but praise for Tecmo Bowl, even though I've never played the game myself. So, a fair amount of people obviously knew about Tecmo before the Dead Or Alive games.

      Have fun,
      --
      Brian "Psychochild" Green
      MMO developer's blog
    6. Re:How can you mention Dead or Alive... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Xtreme Beach Volleyball [...] It's... like... girls in bikinis."

      So post a link to the freakin' screenshots already!

    7. Re:How can you mention Dead or Alive... by beerits · · Score: 1

      When it came out I had a weeks holiday from work and bought loads of games (DoA:XBV, Panzer Dragoon Orta, Metroid Prime, and a few others), intending to play them that week and then take them back for a refund at the end of the week.

      If you had no intention of keeping the games why didn't you just rent them?

    8. Re:How can you mention Dead or Alive... by Singletoned · · Score: 1

      Because it's cheaper to buy the games and then take them back 10 days later for a full refund. However, every time I do that I always end up keeping a couple of them because they are so good.

      The people in the shop know I do it and don't mind. They resell the games as new and I end up spending more on games this way (as well as getting more value for my money).

  2. If only... by Sneeka2 · · Score: 1

    If only these games would be available on the PS2... Why has the series been discontinued for PS2 after DOA2? (yes I known, Microsoft)

    Must... resist... XBox. Must... not be... drawn in... by... the evil...

    --
    Bitten Apples are still better than dirty Windows...
    1. Re:If only... by Babbster · · Score: 4, Informative
      I've never heard that Microsoft paid off Tecmo/Team Ninja/Itagaki to make DOA Xbox-exclusive. The only explanation I've ever heard (multiple times) is from Itagaki saying that he felt the Xbox was the most powerful graphically and he wanted the games to be played the way they were intended instead of making ports that just won't look as good. He's also made clear that the situation could easily change with the next console generation.

      That being said, I'm sure there are financial incentives given to publishers if they release exclusively on a particular console, probably in the form of lower licensing fees. Of course, this is obviously just as true for Sony (see Rockstar/GTA for a clear example of paying off a developer for console exclusivity). Considering the paucity of [US] third-party exclusives on the Gamecube, I don't know if Nintendo offers incentives.

    2. Re:If only... by SuiteSisterMary · · Score: 3, Interesting

      The story goes that when they got an Xbox dev kit, they ported over the PS2 version of DOA2 (which didn't even look as good as the Dreamcast version) to the point where it ran, then sat back in amazement as it ran at over 130 frames per second.

      --
      Vintage computer games and RPG books available. Email me if you're interested.
    3. Re:If only... by AliasTheRoot · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I'll attest to this, the DC version of dead or alive 2 is far better than the ps2 one, just the same as soul calibur is better than soul calibur 2.

      Still apart from this beach ball game and project gotham, there's nothing i want to play on the xbox (and i have msr on the dreamcast), so spending 200 on the opportunity to have a console with a crappy controller and more hassle with scart cables doesnt appeal.

    4. Re:If only... by Xlipse · · Score: 1

      The Xbox doesn't have a crappy controller, your clod. It's a helluvalot better than the "Dual Shock" flimsy crap you get with the PS2.

    5. Re:If only... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Wow. Insult the poor controller, get insulted personally in return.

      Xbox fans need to eat less red meat and watch less mook movies.

    6. Re:If only... by 0racle · · Score: 1

      I have to say the only reason right now I would buy an Xbox would be for DOA, but the Xbox isn't cheap enough for that yet.

      --
      "I use a Mac because I'm just better than you are."
    7. Re:If only... by 0racle · · Score: 1

      I find the PS2 controller a lot more comfortable then the XBox's, and I haven't broken it yet so it can't be that flimsy.

      --
      "I use a Mac because I'm just better than you are."
    8. Re:If only... by xgamer04 · · Score: 1

      It's because Microsoft, in their infinite wisdom, included BounceX as one of the DirectX APIs for the 'Box. They originally intended it to help with things such as basketball games, but those crazy guys at Tecmo already had another plan for it. ;)

      --
      When you look at the state of the world, how can you not become a radical, liberal anarchist?
    9. Re:If only... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why the hell would you want it to be on PS2? Even though it is a good console, it will never half way match up to the XX. Its just smart to get as many exclusive games as you can. The more you have the more people are going to buy your system for that game or games how ever it is.

      Not only that from every thing that I know you have to build games for every system. If you build it for PS2 then the XX verson will be at the same graphic level or even some times worse. Thats why I hate GC.


  3. WTF? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
    "one of the most popular companies in the industry"
    We're talking about Tecmo now? From what do they base the conclusion on??? Score another one for the Idiot's and Garbage Network.
    1. Re:WTF? by WaKall · · Score: 4, Informative

      Super Tecmo Bowl for NES. Hands down best NFL game for 8 bit systems ever, and long held the crown, until the Madden series came along. This game alone is enough to cement them a seat in video game history, in my mind. It's the only sports game I ever played more than a few times. I think I ran through 12-13 seasons of it, at least.

      But seriously, when you consider all of the complete-unknowns in the video game industry, Tecmo does stand out. They are no (Capcom/Konami/Square/Enix/Rare). But, they've been making games since the NES, and good ones here and there. I can't think of any for the PSX/N64 era, but they have good ones on NES, SNES, Genesis, PS2, and Xbox.

    2. Re:WTF? by bigman2003 · · Score: 1

      Super Tecmo Bowl rocked. Up until about a week ago, I thought it was the best (most fun) football game ever.

      Then I picked up ESPN/NFL2K5. Even a lame-ass like me, who has problems with games that use a lot of buttons, can handle this one. The play is great, it looks amazing, and is a lot of fun.

      Finally- Tecmo Bowl gets unseated in my mind as number 1..after 14 years!

      --
      No reason to lie.
    3. Re:WTF? by Elwood+P+Dowd · · Score: 1

      I can't think of any for the PSX/N64 era, but they have good ones on NES, SNES, Genesis, PS2, and Xbox.

      The original DOA was PSX only, right?

      --

      There are no trails. There are no trees out here.
    4. Re:WTF? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The original DOA was PSX only, right?

      IIRC, there was a Saturn port, too.

    5. Re:WTF? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes, there was a Saturn port, and apparently it was more arcade "perfect" than the PSX one. It's been said that the DOA1 that will be on the DOA Ultimate disc is based on the Saturn version.

    6. Re:WTF? by Jesterboy · · Score: 1

      Yeah, it was only on the PSX, since the "arcade" and "Saturn" don't count as real video game platforms anymore.

      Poor, poor Saturn; such a good, yet often maligned, system.

    7. Re:WTF? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The Saturn port came first and was more arcade-accurate. The arcade game wasn't a boob fest, although the models were proportioned as we know them. VF2 is better.

      The later PS port added exaggerated boob physics and was pretty bad in comparison. Tekken 3 and Soul Edge/Blade are better.

      I own all of these games, and of them all, the PS port of DOA is easily the worst game I mention.

  4. I'll tell you why... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
    Why has the series been discontinued for PS2 after DOA2?
    Because Tecmo realized that people wouldn't buy Dead or Alive if they could buy Tekken (and to a lesser extent, Virtua Fighter) on the same system. Smart folks they have running the place. A different source told me that the decision to move to the Xbox came after they paid $699 for Linux but that has yet to be confirmed.
    1. Re:I'll tell you why... by Sneeka2 · · Score: 1

      Well honestly, if I could choose between Tekken 4 and DOA3, I'd rather go for DOA. Also, there's no other game like DOA Xtreme Volleyball for the PS2, is there? :,-(

      --
      Bitten Apples are still better than dirty Windows...
  5. Short form: sex sells. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    To be thrown off of a cliff by an ugly opponent might make you feel bad even if the fight was fair, but to be thrown off by a beautiful woman... that should make you feel good about losing.

    No shit, Sherlock.

  6. "Worse" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You seem to have an interesting notion of what "worse" means, as if a beautiful scantily clad female is somehow bad.

    1. Re:"Worse" by RogueyWon · · Score: 1

      Heh, sorry. I was talking from the perspective of the "games are evil" gutter press and ambulance-chasing lawyers. cf. the story on Manhunt