Etch Goes Beta

An anonymous reader writes to tell us that Debian 'etch' has finally hit beta (testing) complete with graphical installer. The new version includes a default 2.6 kernel, auto laptop detection, secure apt to verify downloaded packages, improved log file and bug reporting, added language support, and much more.

Comments

That was pretty quick.

[The Nine]

Seems not so long ago Sarge came out after an eternity of waiting. Good to see things speeding up a bit.

First post?

debian-installer for etch hits beta

[free2]

"debian-installer for etch hits beta" would be a more accurate title.
etch is "testing" ever since sarge was released as "stable"

Re:debian-installer for etch hits beta

[Kvorg]

Exacty, as is plainly stated on the referred page. I do understand Etch in beta makes better news, but this is just ridiculous misreporting. Could please Slashdot editor fix the article: -> Debian Installer for Etch goes beta would be much better, thank you! :-)

Woohoo! Sorta ;)

[tmasky]

So, effectively there's a Debian release that's caught up to distributions that's had some of this technology for years?

Don't get me wrong - it's great news. I've always believed that having different distributions has always been a strength of GNU/Linux.

But hey - Debian's only just finally caught up. Why's it taken so long? (low priority I'm guessing?) Where is this new release leading to? A new way of installing and managing Debian in general?

I'll personally be much more inclined to use Debian for certain tasks in my enterprise environment in the future. Specifically thanks to the safeguards against apt repository poisoning.

Great stuff dudes =)

Re:Woohoo! Sorta ;)

[DonVino]

I also always believed, that having different distributions is a real advantage for GNU/Linux. But as you can see in many forums, there are many flamewars about the "best" distribution. I think, technically it is really a strengh, but many people just don't get the point, and weaken the whole GNU/Linux Community against Microsoft. Why should they fight GNU/Linux, when they do it by themselves?

Re:Woohoo! Sorta ;)

[didit]

"caught up"? How many linux distributions try to provide a really cross-platform installer? Have a look here to see what I mean by cross-platform.

Re:Woohoo! Sorta ;)

[DrSkwid]

MS v Linux is a specious conflict.

Re:Woohoo! Sorta ;)

[Tom]

Why's it taken so long?

Because a huge part of Debian users couldn't care less about a GUI installer and want more important stuff done first. Most of the machines I put Debian on never switch out of text mode in their entire life, for example, and I'm still happily using dselect and apt-get because it gets the job done and that's all I care for. It'd take longer to find a mouse to plug into that server than it takes to go through a few menues.

Debian isn't behind, Debian is way ahead of most of the other distros in many ways. And it has other priorities. That's why I use it, that's why most of the people who use Debian use it.

Re:Woohoo! Sorta ;)

[Nate B.]

To be honest, I've used the Sarge (current Stable) net install image exactly twice. The first was mostly out of curiosity and then I bumped the install to Sid and built up the partition as I wanted to try Xorg. The second was just a week ago when I built up a partition on a laptop that I wanted to use as a network monitor. It was perfect as I wanted to control the packages I installed.

The graphical installer would probably be fine as it should give the administrator confidence that Xorg will be correctly configured. The current Debconf system works, but it wasn't until Xorg was running after issuing startx that I was sure.

Otherwise, the last time I saw the installer was three or four years ago. The last two laptop upgrades I used rsync to transfer everything over, tweaked the X config file, ran alsaconfig and away I went.

Re:Woohoo! Sorta ;)

[xenocide2]

I think it's got less to do with who uses Debian for console only applications like servers, and more to do with the fact that one needs only install Debian once. The Debian Developers, the people in the best position to introduce such a software haven't done so in the past because it isn't their itch. Even if you look at the beta screenshots, it's the same procedure and installer done up in GTK. Compared to Fedora's installer, this is pointless.

And it's not like Debian doesn't have a great chance to improve and beat Fedora: the Fedora graphical installer really blows at net installs. I got a couple of errors when installing it; they leave common errors hanging on a dialog asking if I want to retry. On retry it came through fine. But they should at least pick up some of the fine points the FC gui installer has. Explanitory information is very useful for someone who only has the installer CD. Hopefully, this is only a very rough beta to prove that they can at least accomplish the same things a txt installer does with a graphical installer.

Re:Woohoo! Sorta ;)

[krmt]

The gtk frontend to the installer doesn't use Xorg, but gtkfb on directfb instead. So you still won't be certain that Xorg will be correctly configured while you're installing. Sorry.

This *is* news

[H4x0r Jim Duggan]

This is news because Debian is ahead of the field in some ways, but is always tarnished by it's outdatedness. This outdatedness causes people to think things like "Debian is only for servers you don't have physical access to" etc.

testing now with installer and security updates

[free2]

This doesn't mean etch will be released as stable soon. All RC bugs will have to be fixed first.
But since there is now a security team for testing, http://secure-testing-master.debian.net/ ,
it means you can now install testing and use apt to get security updates.

"testing" is now a full debian distro (if not official) as are "oldstable", "stable" and "unstable"

Re:testing now with installer and security updates

[tenco]

it means you can now install testing and use apt to get security updates.

If debian had proper wlan-support, i would. But madwifi is still not in the repos.

Re:testing now with installer and security updates

[free2]

http://madwifi.org/wiki/UserDocs/GettingMadwifi

Re:testing now with installer and security updates

[wertarbyte]

Yes, Debian has no support for WLAN at all, since there are no other chipsets then those from atheros.

Screenshots

[xgamer04]

This is one time I wish we did have some screenshots :(

PS

Re:Screenshots

[abdulla]

You can check out screenshots of the new graphical installer here.

Re:Screenshots

[sdnoob]

OMFG! it's d-i with a mouse. so they put a different interface on the same friggin' questions. whooop-dee-friggin-do. if you couldn't navigate the sarge installer, what the hell are you doing with linux in the first place. go play in an open window instead.

Re:Screenshots

[xgamer04]

if you couldn't navigate the sarge installer, what the hell are you doing with linux in the first place.

Ignoring your baseless accusation, improving Linux usability will only come from clueless users using it. Seasoned computer users usually don't get very confused when it comes to interfaces. They just poke around. And wanting to see screenshots of something new doesn't make anyone a newbie. It shows they are curious, which is a much more-needed attribute in the free/open source world than being a dick.

Story gets it terribly wrong

[Florian]

The installer for Etch has gone Beta (as it clearly states on the page the story links to), not Etch itself. The Etch release is scheduled for late 2006, which is still an ambitious goal given the amount of necessary work - such as moving all documentation that doesn't meet the Debian Free Software guidelines into non-free.

The /installer/ is beta

[Nimey]

Sigh, another misleading Slashwank headline (and another post whining about same).

Ubuntu?

[charlie763]

Can we expect this in the Ubuntu Dapper release? Many people have been asking a graphical installer while other prefer the non-graphical installer. I just want the option.

OT: KDE deps screwed up?

[Arkaein]

A little off-topic, but I'd appreciate insight from any Debian devs reading this discussion. I've been trying to upgrade to KDE 3.4 in testing for a while now, but I can't make the upgrade without a whole lot of stuff being uninstalled. From what I've read this has to do with the switch to GCC 4.0 and getting all the apps and their dependencies compiled against it, just wondering if there's any timeline (including guesstimated ones) for when things should be settled down.

Re:OT: KDE deps screwed up?

[Trinn]

I believe it works in unstable, as I am running unstable and have kde 3.4.3-1, and the reason for the problems, btw, is a transition to a new C++ abi

A new kernel, a new license discussion

[wertarbyte]

How are they going to solve the license issue with various drivers of the linux kernel? I was quite scared that the official Debian packages for Kernels > 2.6.8 did not contain those disputed drivers, leading into losing my network connectivity on my system. It will get pretty scary of netinstall disks do not have the network drivers required for installation :-/ I know that there are non-free-modules-packages, but I had the experience that they were not looked after enough.

Re:A new kernel, a new license discussion

[Anonymous Coward]

If you are concerned about this then maybe debian isn't the best distro for you as one of their main objectives is to be free (as in speech). There are other debian based distro's which will probably have these non free modules.

Why bother? The new installer is almost the same.

[jbn-o]

This installer is only graphical in the most technical sense of the term. The screenshots of Etch's beta installer I've seen will not satisfy most users who want a "graphical" installer.

To my eyes, Anaconda is looking like a more approachable installer for those who aren't technically inclined. But Anaconda could ask fewer questions and place technical stuff behind "Advanced..." buttons.

Graphical installer

[ajdlinux]

The story does not mention that the graphical installer is still considered alpha/experimental. The graphical installer is in its early stages at the moment. I think Ubuntu Dapper Drake will have the graphical installer as it is always based on Debian Sid. Andrew

Re: WLAN Support

[Anonymous Coward]

Humm, that's funny. I'm running Debian Sarge and my only network connection is a wireless card. Laptop-mode, wireless-tools, laptop-net, etc are all in Debian.

Why does anyone need a GUI install?

[Anonymous Coward]

The Sarge installer uses an ncurses interface which is fast and extremely user-friendly. It is literally easier to install Sarge on a lot of hardware than to install winnderrz xp now (did both just last week). What purpose would a GUI install serve other than to use more system resources to provide the interface?

There is one option I'd love to see built into the installer -- the ability to compile a system optimised kernel as an automated task, perhaps as a part of base-config. Now *that* would be useful.