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Earning Virtual Currency on your Credit Cards

Posted by ryuzaki0 on from the now-that's-a-perk dept.

ptorrone wrote to mention an article on the MAKE blog, where the author theorizes that perhaps someday instead of frequent flyer miles we'll get WoW gold or EQ plat as a reward for using our credit cards. From the article: "It's not a matter of if, just when - credit card companies, Pay Pal, Amazon, eBay and the individual "gaming" companies eventually bridge the real and virtual currencies with loyalty programs and private label credit cards - there's too much money out there to -not- to do this. This 'demographic' is the battleground. The more you spend, the more you earn, sorta. Virtual $ isn't a crappy electronics doo-dad, it's just a number in a computer. Maybe you'll get some discounted airline tickets when you hit level 60 too, you deserve it! Earn your way to a new graphics card, why not."

47 comments

  1. That's funny by springbox · · Score: 1

    I thought credit cards already enabled you to use "virtual currency"

    1. Re:That's funny by Threni · · Score: 1

      No, my credit cards allow me to use my real money that I've earned. It's no more virtual than paper money - there's no conceptual difference between giving someone £10 in paper than authorizing £10 of your money be sent to them via your credit card company, other than that you're trusting a third party to do the transfer.

    2. Re:That's funny by networkBoy · · Score: 1

      no, the credit card allows you to spend money on the premise that you will later repay the money. You do not have to actually have any money to use a credit card. What you described is a debit card. [/pedantic]
      -nB

      --
      whois gawk date unzip strip find touch finger mount join nice man top fsck grep eject more yes exit umount sleep dump
  2. ummm by rocket97 · · Score: 0

    Just what we need... another reason for poor college kids to get a new credit card and max it out, taking even longer for them to get out of debt once they graduate.

    --
    "The two most abundant elements in the universe are hydrogen and stupidity." -Harlan Ellison
  3. How is this going to work? by Opportunist · · Score: 2, Interesting

    If you get in-game cash for spending money with your credit card (or whatever "out of game" way), one of two things will happen:

    1. Inflation kicks in worse than ever.
    2. It gets harder to get money the "normal" way.

    All fluff stripped, it's just another way to "buy" in-game currency. So one or the other will happen.

    --
    We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    1. Re:How is this going to work? by spyrochaete · · Score: 1

      You're absolutely right. Why are gold farmers often against the TOS, but something like this isn't? It just means the richest people will have the most powerful characters. Why screw with our suspension of disbelief by correlating real money with game money?

    2. Re:How is this going to work? by vertinox · · Score: 1

      1. Inflation kicks in worse than ever.

      No. If WoW gold was tied to your credit card, then it would be pegged to a static value to the dollar. Kind of like how the yuan is pegged to the dollar. Now it would be a matter of how much money your are willing to spend rather than how much gold a single farmer can farm.

      2. It gets harder to get money the "normal" way.

      Not really. They'll be less farmers since you can just get WoW gold from your credit cards directly and I'm assuming that unless your credit card company is paying asian farmers and doesn't have a deal to get gold from Blizzard direclty, that the need for farmers would just go away.

      Not that this is a bad thing... It just means people will buy their gold directly from the corporations rather than the farmers and then the farmers will loose their income and go away.

      If you want to make your gold the old fashioned way you still can and now without the hassle of massive farmer, but... This still means your gameplay experience will be determined by how much money you put into the game rather than how much time you put into the game.

      However this is neither here nor there, because the real root of this problem is that WoW's economy is not a zero sum system and is broke to begin with. All one has to do to create the currency is kill things and sell the items they drop (or they have gold on them) this means that there is an infinite supply of gold into the game.

      Either they are going to have to make it closer to the real world and have a limited supply of currency or they will have to have a limited supply of items or creatures that you can kill. As in prices of items drop the more people sell them to NPC vendors, NPC vendors items increase in price due to inflation, animals and mobs go extince, and items found become more scarce...

      The problem is that most people don't want to play a game like that, but in reality that is the only way to make a real world economy. Unless you live with real world inflation and scarcity there is no way an MMOG can say it has a real economy. (I think Ralph Koster tried this in early Ultima Online but no one liked it... Maybe some other game will try it in the future)

      --
      "I am the king of the Romans, and am superior to rules of grammar!"
      -Sigismund, Holy Roman Emperor (1368-1437)
    3. Re:How is this going to work? by lgw · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Why screw with our suspension of disbelief by correlating real money with game money?

      Because it has already happened, and was inevitable for any successful game. Open market or black market, real money will be able to purchase anything of value. That's what makes it real money.

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
    4. Re:How is this going to work? by MerlynEmrys67 · · Score: 1
      Not quite. WoW can also take money OUT of the economy. Lets see - many gold to train skills at each level, how much stuff was taken out of the economy to open the gates of AQ?. Then there are bird flights, repair, mounts to buy (1000 Gold for epic don't forget), even more rare weapons to construct (Someone in my guild was gathering 100 Aracanite bars, and some other rare stuff just to make a sword)

      True those don't even begin to take as much gold out as gold is being put into the system - but it is wouldn't take Blizzard long if they wanted to drain gold out of the system, just give something REALLY cool and say it will cost you 10,000 Gold to make it/buy it/??? and poof watch the money escape

      --
      I have mod points and I am not afraid to use them
    5. Re:How is this going to work? by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      You forget that this not only applies to those who buy ingame money from farmers but to everyone. Believe it or not, there are still people who either don't know about money traders or who do not want to use them. I belong to the second group. Currently, the influx of money comes from people who buy their gold from farmers. Then it would come from everyone who spends money with their CC. And unlike farming, who still have to fight mobs for money, this money would come literally from thin air. Poof, it's here.

      So this means you either have a worse inflation than ever before (because there are now farmers AND thin-air money), or the developers have to cut the influx of money on other ends (i.e. less drops or less money for drops).

      And this money is "legal". Unlike the farmed gold, which does at least occasionally leave the game with the suspension of guilty accounts, this money is here to stay.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    6. Re:How is this going to work? by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Yes, WoW takes money out of the economy. But the system of incoming and outgoing gold is not correlated in any way. In a "normal" economy, the amount of money is fixed while the supply of goods determines its value. It is exactly the other way 'round in MMORPGs. The amount of goods is "fixed" (with the spawn rate) while the amount of gold is variable. In theory, you can hold on to your gold and not spend any, and you can still harvest more gold.

      Also, Gold traded to other players (for buying Arcanite or other goods) doesn't matter at all. That gold is still in game, it's just no longer in your hands, but it is in other hands. It's not gone from the system. The amount of money also shrinks exactly by the time when you generate most: When you hit level 60. You have all skills (no more money to be spent training), you have your equipment (no more money spent for that), transportation is (for a 60) incredibly cheap (since it has to be affordable for lower levels too), all that's left is repairs and new content.

      Inflation has been a severe problem for many MMORPGs. There are many reasons why it's a problem (because, well, what's the problem if everyone has more gold and prices go up, it's a zero sum game), one being that NPC prices don't match money value anymore, this in turn kills crafters who mostly rely on stuff that could be bought from NPCs (mostly consumables), and most of all it hurts new players who try to catch up with older players. They have no chance. You farm and farm to buy something, only to find out that the price rises as quickly as your purse and that you'll never be able to buy it.

      To make the top-rich people spend their money, you'd have to offer them something they want to have to give up their wealth for. This by itself is another problem. What do you want to offer them? It has to be something you can buy (or money wouldn't leave the system). On the other hand, it must be something they really, really want (or they won't spend the coin). And then it must be something that isn't going to tip the balance too heavily (or it becomes pointless to play for the non-rich players).

      Usually, what MMORPGs do, is to offer something "super-epic", an item or set that gives you abilities that you cannot gain any other way. People will willingly go broke to get it. On the downside, everyone has to farm the inane amount of money it costs and buy it to stay "in the loop", because those items usually represent the "I win" button on your character. I.e. longer farming, longer treadmill, even after you hit maxlevel, you're still no match to the "top players".

      This leads to frustration. Mythic tried something akin to this with their Trials of Atlantis expansion for Dark Age of Camelot. It almost killed the game. There were very few new players willing to go through 3 months of leveling, only to notice that they have another 6 months of farming ahead of them before they can sensibly compete in PvP battles.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    7. Re:How is this going to work? by Chris+Mattern · · Score: 1

      Yep. Final Fantasy XI did something pretty clever. Most player-to-player trades happen through the Auction House in that game. The AH had always charged a small fee for placing items on Auction; what Square did is change the fee to depend on how much you were asking for the item. So as prices go up, people pay more in auction fees.

      Chris Mattern

    8. Re:How is this going to work? by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Still rather little money compared to the influx. How high a fee can you ask for? Make it too low and the effect is zero. Make it too high and nobody uses it.

      In fact, "fees" for some service cannot balance money matters in an MMORPG. They can slow the process a little but they can't halt inflation. To halt inflation, the amount of money in the game would have to be static (obviously, since NPC prices and drops, i.e. the other variables in the inflation equation, are static). This would, in turn, require people to stay broke constantly (because they start with zero money), and all their accumulated wealth would have to be in their equipment and spent on services (training, transport, etc).

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    9. Re:How is this going to work? by Chris+Mattern · · Score: 1

      Well, Square did some good planning from the outset, too. For one, there's not that much money flowing *into* the economy, because most mobs don't drop cash, they only drop items. As far as I can recall, only Beastmen drop gil, and they don't drop much. Nobody is *ever* excited about the money when farming--it's always about the items. That really cuts down on the cash inflow compared to most MMORPGs where everybody drops money. You still have selling items to vendors (rarely done because the prices are so crappy), some quests, earning rank, but overall it's not that much. Square has done some intelligent thinking about how to keep inflation under control--which isn't to say they've beaten it. But a recent raid on gilsellers with deletion of their accoutns (and cash hoards) has been bringing prices down of late.

      Chris Mattern

  4. Fiat Money by Dolly_Llama · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Virtual $ isn't a crappy electronics doo-dad, it's just a number in a computer.

    Dollars, and any other fiat money are too. Just cause it's printed and you can carry some in your wallet doesn't give it any intrinsic value - only the one that we agree to give it.

    --

    Somewhere, something incredible is waiting to be known. -- Carl Sagan

    1. Re:Fiat Money by Smidge204 · · Score: 1

      Well, technically it does cost money to *produce* the physical currency, and therefore it must have some intrinsic value... for example, I could take a thousand dolars worth of pennies, smelt the copper and zinc into ingots and sell it as scrap metal. The value of the metal is less than the coin, but it still has value.

      Virtual currency doesn't even have that, unless you count the value of the physical storage the data occupies - which is so tiny it's just as good as zero.
      =Smidge=

    2. Re:Fiat Money by the+chao+goes+mu · · Score: 1

      Yes, technically money isn't purely fiat currency (with a value derrived entirely from government edict). It is what is sometimes referred to a "token currency", where an item of some value is agreed to represent a much higher amount of value than it actually does.
      Pedantic enough for you?

      --
      Boys from the City. Not yet caught by the Whirlwind of Progress. Feed soda pop to the thirsty pigs.
    3. Re:Fiat Money by exi1ed0ne · · Score: 1

      Over 90% of Federal Reserve Notes (FRN) exist only as bits and bytes. Paper costs 3 cents to produce, regardless if it's a 1, 10, 100, etc. Coinage costs a bit more, and have exceeded their face value many times in the past. For example, dimes are smaller than nickles because dimes were originally silver and nickles were made out of (ahem) nickle. Both quantities of metal are now worth way more than their original face. Pennies before (fuzzy, so check yourself) 1983 are worth more for their copper content than $.01. We might see the same condition with zinc, since that's what makes up most coinage today.

      In fact, it's perfectly legal for a store in "meat space" to accept WoW gold for purchases (ignoring any WoW user policies) as long as the store agrees to accept it. The truth is there is very little difference between WoW gold and FRN, only how wide the acceptance.

      --
      Pessimists.net - as if life wasn't depressing enough.
    4. Re:Fiat Money by lgw · · Score: 1

      The truth is there is very little difference between WoW gold and FRN, only how wide the acceptance.

      WHile you can use any agreed-upon currency for private debts, a FRN is quite a bit different from WoW gold when it comes to public debts. This, in fact, is what *makes* a currency a national currency: you have to pay your taxes in dollars, and the federal government only offers to repay its debts in dollars. It's kind of a big deal.

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
    5. Re:Fiat Money by exi1ed0ne · · Score: 1

      True, the Gubmit only accepts taxes in FRN in violation of the Constitution Article I, section 10. The ability to discharge all your debts in one currency has quite a bit of appeal. "One stop shopping" is what creates most of the acceptance, as well as demand. Although to be fair, the vast majority of people out there have no idea what money or currency represents and use it without question.

      That doesn't change the fact that there are huge problems with any fiat currency. Back in the recesses of time, when we traded asset/service for asset (gold/silver) the transaction was extinguished at the moment of exchange. Value for value. With non-redemable fiat currencies (FRN, WoW Gold, etc.) The transaction isn't finished until you take the non-redemable currency from the trade where you earned it (like your paycheck) and exchange it for something of value (like groceries). Until you do it is a "receivables" risk at least equal to inflation.

      In any evaluation, the FRN is no different than any other fiat currency throughout all of recorded human history. It's nothing more than a confidence game. In that regard, I put it in the same class as WoW Gold.

      --
      Pessimists.net - as if life wasn't depressing enough.
    6. Re:Fiat Money by lgw · · Score: 1

      Atricle 1 Section 10 restricts the states from creating their own currencies. It's not a restriction on federal power.

      Men with guns want you to pay taxes. They accept dollars. They do not accept WoW gold. A government is an entity which can force people to pay taxes. That government has a currency only if it accepts payments in that currency. I have to accumulate dollars to pay taxes with even if I don't want to use dollar for any private transaction (at least, according to tax law, people do get buy on the edges).

      Now, if WoW accepted WoW gold as payment to play the game, I might agree with you. Think about all the things that would have to be different for WoW to stay in business accepting WoW gold as it's only form of payment, and you'll see the difference I mean.

      A FRN has value precisely because the US government manages to stay in business accepting only FRNs as payment. This makes a FRN more than just a convenient token with which to measure each side of a barter.

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
    7. Re:Fiat Money by exi1ed0ne · · Score: 1
      Atricle 1 Section 10 restricts the states from creating their own currencies. It's not a restriction on federal power.

      Not really. In the beginning, the Constitution limited the Federal Governments revenue to "billing" the states in proportion to their population. It wasn't until much later that they set the stage to escape the fiscal dicipline of gold by direct taxation of the people. I won't get into the whole 16th amendment thing because as you point out, the men with guns are asking you "nicely" to pay. You also could mention tarrifs and such, but the world monetary system was gold and silver at the time. The founders knew quite well the horrors of unbacked paper money. Just look at what happened to the Continental, or the 1500% inflation in Massachusetts issued currency during the Articles of Confederation. Fiat currency was one of the major reasons for the revamping the Articles of Confederation into Constitution in the first place!

      I have to accumulate dollars to pay taxes with even if I don't want to use dollar for any private transaction (at least, according to tax law, people do get buy on the edges).

      You also have to accumulate dollars if you want any commodity, since they are also priced in FRN. (Oil, gold, silver, palladium, etc.) This is one reason central banks need FRN in their vaults, and gives an artificial boost to the percieved "value" of the FRN. However, there is no requirement for you to use FRNs in your daily transactions. You could have a contract where your employer pays you in turnips. The fact that you have to convert some turnips to FRN to pay taxes is imaterial. The same could be said if I work in Canada and get paid in loonies. In both cases I have to trade for FRN - so what? I'll give you the convenience factor, but that's no way to protect purchasing power.

      There are plenty of private currencies out there that you can get real goods and services for, and more than just in the margins. The Ithica Hour, Pheonix Dollar, Goldmoney, and the Liberty Dollar all spring to mind. (Although the Ithica hour is really labor debt money) I accept Liberty Dollars, Gold Money, etc.

      Now, if WoW accepted WoW gold as payment to play the game, I might agree with you. Think about all the things that would have to be different for WoW to stay in business accepting WoW gold as it's only form of payment, and you'll see the difference I mean.

      What WoW accepts for payment is up to them. I would have a hard time accepting WoW gold, just the same as I would "Fred Bucks". Now if WoW gold was backed by a real asset, then that would be different.

      A FRN has value precisely because the US government manages to stay in business accepting only FRNs as payment.

      Actually, it's the petro-dollar phenomenon coupled with military/police force. Those guys with guns you talked about. However, the FRN as the world reserve currency is on it's last leg. It's lost over 50% of it's value on international markets in the past few years, and the fundamentals say it has much further to drop. Just look at the charts of any commodity (they are all priced in FRN) for how much purchasing power has been lost. I have most of my liquidity in tangible assets, so I'm walking the walk so to speak on this one.

      This makes a FRN more than just a convenient token with which to measure each side of a barter.

      I can always buy FRN. The relentless inflation (thanks Alan and Ben!) of the supply of fiat currency ensures I'll always be able to get it cheaper tomorrow than today. Bottom line is there isn't any magic to the FRN, and most people don't even know what it is. Heck, most folks I talk to think it's still backed by the (supposed) gold in Ft. Knox!

      --
      Pessimists.net - as if life wasn't depressing enough.
    8. Re:Fiat Money by lgw · · Score: 1

      You also have to accumulate dollars if you want any commodity, since they are also priced in FRN. (Oil, gold, silver, palladium, etc.) This is one reason central banks need FRN in their vaults, and gives an artificial boost to the percieved "value" of the FRN.

      This is really a non-issue, and I don't get why people think it's of more than importance than the "perceived value" you mention. Anyone can buy commodities in Euros or whatever, as any broker will do the exchange. Prices are *listed* in dollars, but so what? Futures prices are also priced in dollars, but again, so what - just buy dollars futures to go along with your oil futures and there's no currency risk.

      What WoW accepts for payment is up to them.

      Think it through. If Blizzard accepted only WoW gold as payment, how can they possibly stay in business? They'd have to be able to pay all of their expenses, employees, and debts in WoW gold! If an entire WoW gold based financial ecosystem existed to make this possible, which would in turn require Blizzard to act responsibly as a reserve banker, control their money supply, etc, then, yes, their currency would be just as "real" as a dollar. But WoW gold isn't a "real" currency because these things are not true. Blizzard can't pay their employees in WoW gold, nor can they pay their power bill, and trying to sell bonds priced in WoW gold would certainly be interesting. Blizzard can't accept only WoW gold for payment, even if they wanted to. Dollars are "real" money in a way that WoW gold simply isn't.

      However, the FRN as the world reserve currency is on it's last leg.

      If by "world reserve currency" you mean "only world reserve currency" and by "last leg" you mean "last 50-100 years" then I agree completely. US Dollars (not many actual printed notes (or bits) are used as a reserve currency, but dollar-priced public and private bonds instead) are used as a reserve currency because we've been the only economic superpower for so long. If the EU, or India, or China, or somebody emerges to compete with us and has a single stable currency with a multi-decade history of reasonable management, of course reserve bankers will shift to a mix of it and dollars. Reserve bankers use dollars today as the only sane option, but spitting reserves between two stable currencies is much safer than any one currency.

      Of course, countries who are major net exporter to the US also have a ton of dollars just lying around, but that won't change until those countries have a viable economy without being major next exporters to the US, which won't happen quickly. If another major player emerges, these net exporters will of course start accumulating that country's currency as well.

      Heck, most folks I talk to think it's still backed by the (supposed) gold in Ft. Knox!

      Well, there is still a fortune in gold stored there, and other federal reserve "banks" across the country. I used to live next door to the one in Houston - built like a fortress. But of course the total the fed keeps in gold and foreign currency is a micro-percentage of the money supply.

      You talk about an inflationary currency like that's a bad thing, but I don't see it (as long as we're talking less than 4% or so). As long as you don't keep money stuffed in your mattress, just about any place else you put it will pay you roughly-inflation-adjusted returns, so it's almost a non-issue (so long as savings accouts don't bump into the 5.25% ceiling). An inflationary currency provides an illusion of financial progress for most people, and that's pretty important to happyness.

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
  5. it'd be better if... by gEvil+(beta) · · Score: 1

    I'd much rather have a system whereby my credit cards get credited with payments for playing more online games. If I make level 60 in WoW, I should get 10 bucks credited back or something. Of course, that goes directly against their current business model, so that will never happen.

    --
    This guy's the limit!
    1. Re:it'd be better if... by mattgreen · · Score: 1

      Why should you get paid $10 because you hit a level cap in a crappy computer game?

  6. Not a good idea, that doesn't mean it wont happen by slughead · · Score: 1

    the author theorizes that perhaps someday instead of frequent flyer miles we'll get WoW gold or EQ plat as a reward for using our credit cards.

    My old work place used to give out credit-card points as a reward to their employees, which we could cash in on gift cards to various places like best buy and what not. It was great, considering they paid us next to nothing.

    Recently (after I quit, thank god), the management decided to keep all the points for themselves. We're talking about a half a million points per month, here--roughly $7,200 in gift cards at Best Buy.

    Since the management does nothing on the job but play MMORPG's instead of working, I predict they will dominate the EQ world 6 months after they implement this points-to-plat program, and then suddenly stop playing shortly after due to bankruptcy.

    --
    Latewire
  7. Probably not cash, but why not some other perk? by Lachryma · · Score: 1
    Why not get special in-game items? Make them untradeable/unsellable if you don't want to muck up your marketplaces.

    It wouldn't take a whole lot to get people to snap up a new credit card.

    1. Re:Probably not cash, but why not some other perk? by geminidomino · · Score: 1

      It would have to be a lot better than gold in some crappy computer game to get me to ding my credit score.

  8. Only an idea though.... by Drogo007 · · Score: 1

    Most of the comments seem to be missing the fact that the Post Title is (surprise surprise) highly misleading. This is NOT an imminent plan to do this. THis is one blogger's wishful thinking that's being repeated as gospel by WOW and Everquest addicts who desperately want this to be true.

  9. Taxability of WoW Gold by Ted+Cabeen · · Score: 4, Informative

    If this happens, it will make it even more likely that the IRS actually weighs in on the issue of the taxability of items obtained through online gameplay. There was a story on NPR's Marketplace a few weeks back about the fact that if you work and obtain something in payment that can be exchanged for money, you owe income tax on it, even if you don't sell it. Since eBay clearly establishes a value for a single piece of WoW gold, you are liable for income tax on that $0.05 you've earned when you sell that BoE item in the auction house or when you loot it. Do you claim the value of your WoW gold as miscellaneous income?

    Note: I am not a tax lawyer, and this is not to be interpreted as tax or legal advice. Contact the IRS if you have any further questions.

    1. Re:Taxability of WoW Gold by MagicDude · · Score: 2, Insightful

      IANAL either, but I had a different view on gold selling. I always thought that gold selling and such wasn't about selling tangible comidities, but rather about hiring a guy to play the game with you. Everything in the game is "owned" by blizzard, and by paying our monthly fee, we're allowed to utilize their environment and virtual items by the rules they set down. So when we buy gold, we're paying some guy to "be our friend" in the game and play along with us, which could range from helping us in a raid, to trading these items. Thus I submit that gold sellers and such are not comidity brokers selling items, but are gaming assistants who render their services as desired by the purchasing party within the game universe for a set fee, and thus they should be taxed as any other business would provides only services and no products.

    2. Re:Taxability of WoW Gold by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I have a related question. If you work to produce something as a hobby, do you legally owe tax on the value of that product, even if you have no intention of selling it?

      For example, if you carve jade figurines in your spare time, and don't sell them -- are you liable for the tax value of the difference between the value of the raw jade and the value of the figurines?

    3. Re:Taxability of WoW Gold by WorkerGnome · · Score: 1

      Would this mean if you lose an item, you can write it off as a loss?
      How about deducting your monthly subscription fee as a cost of doing business?

    4. Re:Taxability of WoW Gold by Ted+Cabeen · · Score: 1

      A jade figurine that you carve does not have a known value when it is created. You might be a great carver creating something with a value of thousands of dollars, or you could be horrible and might be only able to sell it for the jade value. Until art is sold, it doesn't have a known value. WoW gold on the other hand, is fungible, and there is a known value for it.

      Again, IANAL, and this is speculation at best.

    5. Re:Taxability of WoW Gold by Derkec · · Score: 2, Informative

      The current answer appears to be that you shouldn't claim it. The IRS has taken the position of shrugging and meakly walking the other direction.

      More detail here: http://www.legalaffairs.org/issues/January-Februar y-2006/feature_dibbell_janfeb06.msp

    6. Re:Taxability of WoW Gold by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ok, I picked a bad example. What if you grow vegetables in your garden? If you only grow them for yourself, are you responsible for paying tax on those vegetables' market value (minus your expenses for seeds, land, etc.)?

    7. Re:Taxability of WoW Gold by generic-man · · Score: 1

      No. You don't owe income or sales taxes on things you don't sell.

      --
      For more information, click here.
  10. If you value your credit card's "points" by courtarro · · Score: 3, Insightful

    This sounds like a really bad financial move, considering the stability of online systems' finances. What happens when you buy $2000 worth of computer equipment on your card, only to have WoW roll back to before you made the purchase and wipe out your side earnings? Until online currency has the same financial and legal protections as true currency, stay away. No thanks.

  11. How about WoW gives me real money for their gold? by Thrymm · · Score: 1

    I wouldnt want their in game BS currency for using my credit card. I would rather them pay me on my credit card for earning the gold, or farming it. Wait I can do that now just by selling out to those farming sites.

  12. Bad Premise by Rydia · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Not only does this pressupose that there are enough people out there that a) play MMOGs and b) want to buy gold for said MMOGs over current cost, but also that marketing and transaction costs given there IS an audience wouldn't swallow any benefit, making the card worthless for all but the heaviest spenders.

    Even if the market DID exist, card companies are only going to want a certain number of brands/external services in their card stable, anyway. So, what percentage of the small amount of the population that would shell out for MMOG gold would make the gold their first-third priority? Over Disney, perhaps. Over cash back? Over groceries? Gas? Travel?

    Plus, a lot of the gold business isn't for the hardcore... it's for those who just want a little boost. If you're only cashing in twice over your career, why the heck would you get a CREDIT CARD to accumulate small amounts over a long time?

    I swear, if I didn't dislike blogs so much, I'd start one to catalogue all the idiocy. People in and around the videogame industry seem to all have a serious case of overinflated sense of importance and think the tail wags the dog.

    1. Re:Bad Premise by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Obviously, you haven't seen my dog for the tail truely does wag the dog.

  13. Hmm... by Kyokugenryu · · Score: 1

    If I write a post in a random blog on an improbable event, but a generally good idea, can I get it posted on /. too? This is beyond simple wishful thinking. The secondary market for online gaming is nowhere near the size of usefulness of the airline industry. If I got a choice between frequent flyer miles and Lineage II Adena, I'd take the Adena, but that would require some deal between NCSoft and a credit card company to provide virtual currency, and I really don't even see this ever happening.

  14. Incredibly stupid. by mattgreen · · Score: 2, Insightful

    MMOs are always on the cutting edge of materialism it seems.

    In spending *real* money on a credit card, I can apply these benefits toward things that are *not* real? Does anyone actually think this is a good idea? You might as well just not get any benefits from your credit card!

    1. Re:Incredibly stupid. by Petrol · · Score: 1

      Do you mean 'not real' like a movie ticket?

      Would it seem foolish if you were to earn a voucher for a movie ticket? I expect it wouldn't, and if you'll grant this much, then how is it any different from earning an in-game voucher? It's all entertainment. You're making the mistake of thinking it's different because it's a "virtual world" when it's really one more type of entertainment.

      --
      ...and that's the end of our show. Donk!
  15. Anyone know of a company that provides these? by eries · · Score: 1

    Has anyone worked with a company that provides private label credit cards? I've found plenty by googling, but none panned out - I can't even tell which ones are legitimate and which only serve huge enterprise customers.

    --
    Can your IM do this?
  16. yeah, sure, by Khashishi · · Score: 1

    I tag thee "speculation"

  17. eq2's station exchange by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'm currently making around $20 a day just playing everquest 2. As far as Sony is concerned, it's perfectly within the rules. I use their auction site to sell the money I make in the game. That money is transferred to my paypal account for which I have an physical paypal debit card(mastercard) which also works at atms.

    There's been months when I've made close to $900.

    There are other people playing who are making much more than me. One friend of mine is making in excess of $100 a day.

    I don't care about earning ingame money for real life purchases. I'm making real life money for ingame purchases, MUCH more interesting.

    (I don't run bots, I use sony's auction website www.stationexchange.com)