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UK's Journalists Calling For Yahoo! Boycott
truthsearch writes "The UK's National Union of Journalists is calling for a boycott of Yahoo! because of its 'unethical behaviour' in China. Yahoo! has given details of at least three people to Chinese authorities who were subsequently imprisoned. 'The NUJ regards Yahoo!'s actions as a completely unacceptable endorsement of the Chinese authorities. As a result, the NUJ will be cancelling all Yahoo!-operated services and advising all members to boycott Yahoo! until the company changes its irresponsible and unethical policy.' Yahoo! sent a response to The Register."
Yet another company selling its soul to line up at the trough of Chinese traffic.
boycott: an agreement usually among a particular segment of the population to reduce or stop the use and purchase of certain products or activities. (from here)
Question 1: How can you reduce or stop something that's non-existent?
Question 2: Agreement? Among journalists? Yeah, right.
And yes, I Googled for that definition.
You can rail against the PROC-friendly attitude of Yahoo! (and others) all you like, but the company simply isn't going to care until you hit them where it hurts...in the pocketbook.
Kudos to the National Union of Journalists for putting their beliefs into action, but will this blow to the pocketbook be enough, or is Yahoo! even going to notice?
____
~ |rip/\/\aster /\/\onkey
People who care would be unlikely to be using anything-yahoo other than a throw-away spam address.
Ultimately, U.S. companies in China face a choice: comply with Chinese law, or leave.
Most of my quick responses to this boil down to "Then LEAVE," but the money is so shiny, isn't it? In any case, the whole letter is interesting, and is worth reading TFA if you haven't yet.
Slashdot Burying Stories About Slashdot Media Owned
But Yahoo!, along with Google and MSN, are business, first and foremost. None of these are meant to be champions of the people. All of these business want to do business in China, and currently the only way for them to do so is to abide by the laws established in China. Are those laws necessarily fair to the people? No. Is it the responsibility of Yahoo!, Google or MSN to bring about a revolution in China? No. A business is supposed to make money.
However, there is some nudging to be made. Google alerts the user when results are being ommitted. Nothing peaks one's interest more than "There's something here they don't want you to see".
Those who believe the Internet is private,
find their privates are on the Internet.
Yet again, we have somone here who's not seeing the big picture (the parent).
You see, the more contact that the Chinese people have with the West, regardless of how censored it is, the more they will see how free we are. And, considering that it's impossible to filter out everything that China's Communist Dictorship would have a problem with, there WILL be things that get through. And if we include Yahoo!'s "mistakes", there will be even more shit that China's dictators will object to.
No sir, I disagree - they're puting one more free foot|tenticle into China.
Well I dont think the boycott of yahoo, will do any good. Governments will always find ways to get data out of the corporate servers about you and me. Might take time but the governments normally win cases by invoking national security and stuff.
So in short, if the government wants details of all your emails they will have it "By hook or By Crook"
~http://www.muchhalasworld.com
I totally agree that corporations should not be sharing private information with governments. But it would be a lot easier to take the boycotters seriously if they had a sensible suggestion as to what Yahoo could possibly do about it. Just withdraw from the country? Let their Chinese management get arrested for breaking the law by not sharing the data?
Are the boycotters also boycotting every other corporation that does business in China, or just the ones unlucky enough to have a high-profile demand made of them?
Bogtha Bogtha Bogtha
Yahoo acted under the letter of the law. They are not to blame for this, rather the government of China is. No matter what else, some of the data that the government of China does not want it's people to see is leakign past, so it si better for them to be there in the long run.
Another case of liberals going overboard. Nothing to see here, move along.
I wonder why they aren't calling for a boycott of Google too? Maybe they are next.
Will Google support the journalists, and remove any Yahoo! feeds from news.google.com or do they already not use Yahoo!?
Oh You POS
At the end of the day the real problem here is China, not any of the US companies operating there. The letter from Yahoo! points out the obvious, if you're there you have comply with the local law, they had no choice at the time. As for whether or not any US company chooses to operate in china, what difference does it make with regards to human rights there in China? At the very least, a US company operating in China has the ability to pay a decent wage and give their Chinese employees good benefits but beyond that how could they possibly change China's human rights policies?
While I respect the views of NUJ, I also respectfully disagree with who they are choosing to boycott here. They disagree with China's politics so they boycott a US company? What exactly is that supposed to prove or accomplish? If you want to bring about any sort of change within China through a boycott, then for Christ's sake, boycott all of the crappy sweatshop goods that come out of China!
Yahoo doesn't get to choose to ignore laws they think are wrong. If the DOJ shows up at a library wanting to know who is reading about a certain topic they have to comply, even if they believe the order is wrong and evil, and/or unconstituional. If the DOJ shows up at Yahoo and demands the same thing, they must also comply. Why would Chinese laws would apply any less?
It's WILDLY hipocritcal for the US Congress to haul Yahoo in and chastize them for complying with the same kinds of immoral, illegal, intrusive orders that they themselves are allowing the US government to issue.
Glass houses, stones, pot, kettle... etc. etc. This is simply dog wagging.
set softtabstop=4 shiftwidth=4 expandtab nocp worlddomination
While I do understand the need to comply with local laws in order to do bussiness there, to what extent can Yahoo! ethically take this stance? This is the question they fail to answer, and saying "This is a real example of why this issue is bigger than any one company and any one industry." is really just passing the buck so they can keep making the bucks. What is hard to know is just how much leverage companies like Yahoo and Google have in these situations. I have a feeling it's not much by Yahoo's reponse anyways, or I think we would be hearing more from them about how they might be putting pressure on the Chinese Gov't to release them from having to divulge such information.
Their stance seems to be that they are just hoping for change due to the increasing distribution of access to technology. While there is some merit to that hope, I think these companies need to be a little more proactive about voicing and engaging in opposition to the repression. Hoping for a cultural revolution isn't going to start one. Somebodies got to actually take some action, not that it has to be Yahoo, but by their being so passive to the situation makes them appear to be more in the Gov'ts camp than the people's.
"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro" -Hunter S. Thompson
Consider it outside the context.
"NUJ advises boycott of 'unethical' Yahoo!"
It sounds to me like they were offended by some yokel publically masturbating in his front yard.
Fight hunger. Filet a politician and send him to a 3rd world country of your choice.
So let me get this. Journalists are not ok with Yahoo! ethics, once, in China, but are somehow just fine with how MS' behavior over decades in the whole world.?
Beta is broken and the link to classic doesn't work. Stop wasting our time or there won't be anybody left here.
when the US Government gives China a waiver every year to continue to recieve it's Most Favored Nation trading status?
This is simply a case of CYA on the part of Yahoo. Yahoo does business in China, therefore Yahoo must abide by Chinese law when dealing with Chinese matters or face consequences.
People seem to forget that each country makes their own laws, and anyone wishing to do business in those countries must abide by the local laws.
Yes, the Chinese laws are bad, but I cannot change them, Yahoo and Google cannot change them, and certainly the UK Journalists cannot change them.
For UK papers to accuse someone of unethical practices. The sloppy MMR reporting has led to a huge growth in diseases which should almost be wiped out. The Daily Mail is constantly preaching hate. I think it was the news of the world which itself helped organise what were essentially lynch squads for pedophiles who had already done their time and received adequate punishment.
China is working to be a huge economic superpower. They can only become one with the interaction of other nations and companies in those nations. If no one did any business with China they would remain weak and be forced to act on the pressures of other nations.
These days economic persuasion is one of the most effective ways of bringing about reform. Having international businesses operate there puts no economic pressure on them at all.
Developers: We can use your help.
Such firm self-righteusness form everyone.
So, how come nobody here has a problem with Linux being big business in China right now?
we should all boycott the US government now!
Yahoo has, thus far, refused to move its servers from China to the USA.
Both Microsoft and Google have, thus far, declined to locate their servers in China.
In other words, Yahoo has the power to make substantive changes to its business model (to protect human rights) without significantly injuring its position in China. Unfortunately, the entire management of Yahoo, up to Jerry Yang (who is Chief Yahoo and has strong affinity to Chinese values), supports catering to Beijing.
We, in the West, should hit Yahoo as hard as we can by hitting its bottom line. Until Yahoo rises to the decency of Google, which itself is no angel of goodness, we should financially pummel Yahoo by boycotting its services.
I am tired of companies insisting that there is nothing they can do. When a company in the US wants a US law changed, they spare no expense.
I am also tired of the bullshit claim that businesses are soulless entities that have no responsibility to the public and only to their shareholders. Businesses are made up of individuals who make the decisions (e.g., to sell out Chinese journalists) which have real life effects on people. It is possible for businesses to make decisions that are not based only on the bottom line. Oscar Schindler owned a business and he found a way to help people.
Maybe Yahoo should stop crying "poor me there is nothing I can do" and start lobbying to improve the situation in China.
Hopefully this boycott and all the negative publicity that Yahoo will receive because of it will help them pull their head out of their ass and start doing the right thing.
I found this line especially poignant:
In many cases, Yahoo! does not know the real identity of individuals for whom governments request information, as very often our users subscribe to our services without using their real names.
Might be what they're implying here is most journalist contacts in China aren't stupid enough to supply their real info.
Maybe instead of boycotting a route for information to/from/about a communist dictatorship, the NUJ should try boycotting the dictatorship. Crazy idea, huh?
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Amnesty International has reported recently that Box Store Giant WalMart, in an effort to feed our unquenchable consumerism with continued low prices is paying it's Chinese workers HALF of the legal minimum wage in China. What's worse is the legal minimum is still considered a HUNGER wage (meaning you still go hungry even though you work full time)
I'm pleased to see that some effort is being made to punish companies that choose to do business with despotic governments, it's the only power consumers actually have. While the west continues to purchase cheap goods made by slaves in a despotic regime, the despots won't see anything wrong with their continued subjugation of people and denial of human rights as guaranteed by the UN. Continuing to purchase ANYTHING from these companies is a tacit approval of their policies.
I say HEAR HEAR NUJ! Now is the time for all good people to come to the aid of the party and stop purchasing goods from countries where the most basic of human rights are ignored. If we want to end global poverty, I'd suggest it's a damn sight better to empower the people in their own countries to pay for their own infrastructure by ensuring that companies that operate in those geographies pay a fair and reasonable wage. The continual cycle of funnelling aid which reaches only the priveliged few is not working. We have years and years of evidence to support the fact that it's not working to end the conditions in those countries.
This is the shining light of democracy that all the people of earth are expecting to come from the US and elsewhere, instead they find themselves working thanklessly for little or no pay in conditions that would curdle your stomach, all so that the fat westerners can have their cake and eat it too.
As consumers it is our responsibility to inform ourselves, and just say NO.
if I claimed I was emperor just because some watery tart lobbed a scimitar at me they'd put me away!
I've been boycotting Yahoo for years - I don't buy any ads from them.
It's like DRM-encumbered CDs. For some, it may be a political issue; but for most, it's a product quality issue. If I don't buy your product or service because I don't like how you produce it (or something else), that's a boycott. If I don't buy it because I don't like the product or service, that's just plain old market action.
You don't target a Yahoo boycott at users; you target it at advertisers. Don't forget who the products are, and who the customers are.
Another case of liberals going overboard.
I thought libersls favored government intervention. I thought conservatives favored freedom (except when they want to restrict it in the name of freedom -- but that's just neocons, I guess).
And I thought anyone with an open mind could see that both the boycotters and the 'engagers' have valid arguments. In any case, this certainly defies simplification of the liberal/conservative sort. (And, yes, I know my neocon barb was guilty of the same oversimplification.)
1. Would it have made a difference if you had such information?
2. Since all any government has to say is "Child Porn" in an investigation and you'll cough up everything you have anywhere in the world, do you see how you'll never be able to have a policy that could ever allow you to decide which demands you will honor, and which you should refuse?
3. Is it just possibly not worth doing business with China and emerging with unclean hands while things like this can happen there?
"It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
The AC post, that is.
No one's saying Google's behaviour is good in this, but the moral equivalence between Google and Yahoo just doesn't exist.
...of a line from Les Mis : “If I speak, I am condemned / If I stay silent, I am damned.” Maybe I'm the only one here who cares, but doesn't it strike you as oddly fitting the whole thing? (Well, other than the fact that Les Mis = French != British, and there's nothing to do with China anywhere in the ething, but even then, there's the whole Europe thing going.)
Who knows. Maybe it's just me.
Creative misinterpretation is your friend.
Yahoo! overstepped the law to pander to the chinese authorities. Due process was not followed.
They sold dissidents fighting for change for contracts.
This is why they are 100% evil.
Collaborators. Grasses. Snitches. Judas
In my hood yahoo'd all be dead
Now they are trying to spin it away.
What can Yahoo do? Follow the law in Hong Kong and not sell out heroes to the commies
I think we need to be wary of going harsh on China - sure they are no angels but they are a million times better than Saudi Arabia and just about every other Middle Eastern country - they are going to try and ally themselves with China, especially concerning weapons (that they are too retarded to develop themselves) and energy. We need to be on China's side first because lets face it, China and Chinese society has more in common with us than with those dirty hand chopping daka-dakas who want to take over the world and make sure we all get our adultery flogging. What ever we do regarding China's censorship issue must be allot more diplomatic and positive than the way we've handled the Middle East because they are good people.
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Um, am I the only one who will acknowledge that Yahoo has a legal duty to its shareholders, as a corporation, to maximize profits using any legal means necessary.
Don't get me wrong-- I don't have any loyalty to Yahoo ('specially that worthless search engine), but if Yahoo didn't take this opportunity on "moral grounds" you can be 100% certain that they would immediately be sued by their shareholders...
Just my $0.02, and btw IANAA (I am not an attorney), just spend too much time with a few that I know.
E = m * c^(Hammer)
They talk about how tech companies are bad by obeying laws that would allow US companies to operate in China yet totally drop the ball on human rights issues and let hundreds of thousands of chinese employees in sweat shops create cheap manufactured products and allow other US companies to sell these items to the US consumers to gobble up. I don't hear them scolding Disney lately for their inhuman practices of allowing these factories to operate and get rich off of the backs of poor chinese citizens?
I don't agree with what went on but this just smacks to me of a case of the dime late and the dollar short syndrome. These companies are just the product of a bigger problem. The US not doing anything but complain to other US companies instead of the Chinese government itself.
Government officals should not wield the sword of Democracy with one hand and cover their eyes with cheap Yuen with the other.