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Working At FASA After the Borg

amitlu writes "What's it like to be assimilated by Bill Gates' empire? Russ Pitts from The Escapist talks two game industry veterans, Bruce Shelly of Ensemble and Jordan Weisman of FASA, to contrast two hugely different opinions on the matter. While Bruce, still employed by Microsoft, has nothing but nice things to say, Weisman paints a much different picture. From the article: 'Let's say, part of what they wanted from us was our development culture, because we'd worked very hard to have this collaborative, effective team, and they wanted to kind of build those kinds of teams and kind of capture that. In reality, ... the machine of Microsoft, unintentionally, I believe, and inadvertently, ripped that apart. Rather than model itself around what we had done, our [culture] got forced into their model. ... We lost that special sauce that we had built.'" Speaking of FASA, if you're interested you can sign up for the Shadowrun Beta. They're only looking for 360 players, at the moment, and only ones with gold Live accounts.

49 comments

  1. FASA and Activision were great by Drakino · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I really miss the days that FASA and Activision worked together on MechWarrior 2. The follow ups out of FASA/Microsoft just didn't quite ever live up to those older games, and MechAssault helped drag what used to be a fun mech simulator franchise down into "Halo with Mechs". True, it opened it up to a wider audience, but the fun of the franchise left for many people.

    1. Re:FASA and Activision were great by quanticle · · Score: 1

      MechWarrior 3 (a Fasa + Microsoft collaboration) was a far more fun game than MW2, IMHO. The plot, and the gameplay elements (customization of 'Mechs, especially) made MW3 more fun to play than Mechwarrior2. The somewhat modernized graphics also helped.

      --
      We all know what to do, but we don't know how to get re-elected once we have done it
    2. Re:FASA and Activision were great by AcidLacedPenguiN · · Score: 1

      amen to that. Honestly, if Microsoft announced a Battletech game that was based more on a sim style approach like Mechwarrior 2, or even slightly more arcadey like Mechwarrior 3 for PC or/and Xbox360 I'd probably sploodge my pantalones.

      --
      disclaimer: I've been known to store numbers in my ass for which to dig out when quantities are required.
    3. Re:FASA and Activision were great by jythie · · Score: 1

      Are you sure you are not thinking Mechwarrior 4 here?

      Mechwarrior 3 was Activision.

    4. Re:FASA and Activision were great by PrescriptionWarning · · Score: 1

      Even though Mechwarrior 4 (Microsoft) didn't have the customization that 2 and 3 had (activision), I found 4 to be the most enjoyable one, mainly due to good multiplayer and the fact that its customization though simpler, was still very powerful and more realistic (as realistic as huge walking robots can be anyway)

      i still hope the day soon comes where we'll get another mechwarrior, the mechassault games were just temporary distractions

    5. Re:FASA and Activision were great by iCEBaLM · · Score: 1

      Being an old school mech pilot who has purchased every mechwarrior game since crescent hawks (and subsequently competitively played them online for over a decade) I have to really disagree. Customization in Mech2 far outweighed the craptastic hard point system in Mech3. In fact Mech3 was a joke. The single player was OK, the multiplayer was horrible, the customization aspects were junk and no real community formed for that particular game. Mech4 was lightyears better but still not as good as Mech2 would have been with updated graphics and network play.

      As single player games on their own, without having a vested interest in Battletech I can see people liking Mech3 over Mech2 but when all is said and done Microsoft screwed Battletech fans.

    6. Re:FASA and Activision were great by iCEBaLM · · Score: 2, Informative

      Mech3 was actually Microsoft/Microprose/Zipper. It was certainly not Activision.

    7. Re:FASA and Activision were great by Danse · · Score: 1
      As single player games on their own, without having a vested interest in Battletech I can see people liking Mech3 over Mech2 but when all is said and done Microsoft screwed Battletech fans.

      I guess that's going to be the tradition from Microsoft, as now they're going to screw Shadowrun fans as well. I fucking hate what they're doing to the SR franchise with this retarded Halo/Unreal game that they decided to slap the Shadowrun name on. They call it creative license. I call it bullshit.
      --
      It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds. - Captain Hammer
  2. way to be clear, Zonk! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    They're only looking for 360 players, at the moment, and only ones with gold Live accounts.

    360 slots doesn't, sound like a lot. Oh, Zonk meant, players with XBox360s. I thought "editing" was about, being clear.

    1. Re:way to be clear, Zonk! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      and I thought the Preview button was about checking your punctuation.

    2. Re:way to be clear, Zonk! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It was a comment on, the unnecessary and misplaced commas, in Zonk's sentence. Something, any reasonable "editor" should have well, under control.

  3. Umm... by vertinox · · Score: 1

    Speaking of FASA, if you're interested you can sign up for the Shadowrun Beta. They're only looking for 360 players, at the moment, and only ones with gold Live accounts.

    Apparently they aren't looking very hard.

    --
    "I am the king of the Romans, and am superior to rules of grammar!"
    -Sigismund, Holy Roman Emperor (1368-1437)
    1. Re:Umm... by jandrese · · Score: 1

      Is that the version of Shadowrun where you jog down the street blowing away monsters with your big guns?

      I think I have an idea why Shadowrun veterans might be hard to find for the beta.

      --

      I read the internet for the articles.
    2. Re:Umm... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They don't have to look that hard. They only want 360 of them. ...oh, hold on...

    3. Re:Umm... by BDZ · · Score: 1

      Yeah, this is an FPS with elves and magic in a "re-worked" Shadowrun universe...In other words, it has nothing to do with the actual pen and paper game. There was a story about this posted some months ago when Microsoft posted a promotional video. I saw things such as a raise dead spell and elves with guns running about. Apparently the key to the game is to be the team to get the most relics. The relics are the source of all (finite) magic in the re-imagined world.

      When I first heard they were making a Shadowrun game I was very excited expecting it to be an RPG. Heck, I figured this would be my sole reason to buy an X-Box. Then I saw what they were building and how the entire game world was being changed and felt sick to my stomach. I honestly don't understand the reasoning behind using an established game world to market a game while turning it into something that would totally turn off anyone who'd be attracted by the Shadowrun name.

      This SR veteran GM will not be signing onto any beta of this game let alone dropping money on it or the console to play it on. Nor will any of my players.

    4. Re:Umm... by Kimona · · Score: 1

      The "only looking for 360 players" bit is incorrect. We have not published specific numbers of invites we intend to issue. Expect a small number of participants to be invited in December, followed by significantly more in January and the coming months. More info on the forums at www.shadowrun.com -Kimona, lead producer, Shadowrun (FASA)

    5. Re:Umm... by Kimona · · Score: 1

      Ah, ok, I get it. Xbox 360 players. True, this beta is 360 only, and you need a Gold account. And thanks to all who are expressing interest in the beta - we have received many thousands of applicants in the last 24 hours. -Kimona, lead producer, Shadowrun (FASA)

  4. How Long WillThis Lame Joke Last??!! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Bill Gates' Empire?? The Borg?? Will you people ever end this lame schtick?

    Given that Bill Gates no longer runs the company, and has fairly little to do with Microsoft these days, using him to bash Microsoft makes about as much sense as dissing Lee Iacoca, and has as much timeliness.

    Second of all, outside of slashdot, and in the real world, I've never heard of Microsoft referred to as the Borg. It was not funny in 1994, and it's even more tired now that Star Trek has been off the air for more than a few years.

    You people need to grow up.

    1. Re:How Long WillThis Lame Joke Last??!! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You ass-clown. This is how you spend your time? I think it just supposed to be a clever analogy to the fact that they assimilate all the competition and try to control how you use your computer. It's used here because this is a geek site, populated by many Trek fans. The analogy is still very relevent. Judging by the fact you hadn't pieced this together, you probably belong on goatse instead of slashdot.

    2. Re:How Long WillThis Lame Joke Last??!! by PygmySurfer · · Score: 3, Informative

      If you read the article, you'd see The Escapist is responsible for the Borg labeling this time, not Slashdot.

  5. Another comment i made earlier explains by unity100 · · Score: 1

    Exactly why they are not able to adopt the collaborative and cooperative demeanor of fasa. Then, the post was quickly modded down by a microsoft zealot, apparently it was destined for this, it seems :

    Seriously, microsoft represents the opposite of what made the internet a civilization-wide revolution as of now : Cooperation, Collaboration, Coexistence, Friendly Competition, Sharing, Curiousity, Modesty.

    No surprise, considering the roots of this company was formed by 3-4 fledgling young geeks back at 1970s, when the above concepts were in decline since the 60s and materialism&yuppieness&personal achievement and wealth was on the rise into the 80s. These were youngsters then who wanted to hit it big, and hit it good. And due to the nature of the times they have matured in, they have become kinda yuppie geeks, people of the 80es themselves.

    1-2 among them, you know who, were much more willing on treading this path and also easy in mind about scratching anything that proved to be a burden, and they scratched their friends/colleagues who they started on the road with. Geekdom was rising then, tech was coming, i.t. was forming, so they got an advantage, they formed juicy business deals while following the path of 'scratch all, hit it big, 'im a material girl'. they crushed and stamped out many competition back then, with the same philosopyh that provided scratching of friends/colleagues. (dos'es era). after some time, when 'deal them, tie them, bring them in the darkness and bind them' policies succeeded with the advent of windows and office, they became real big. ms pWnEd all pcs round the world by then, seemingly. computer meant 'windows' in some countries' non-techie slang.

    then the internet came. due to the nature of it, which is a carrier of information, its nature formed on the philosophical properties of 'information' (information in the sense of knowledge, news) - seeking of free flow, no-bars, easy sharing, non-ownership as much as possible, common to all and so on.

    microsoft did not realize what the hell this was going to be later. after all, they owned pcs around the world, and it ran on them. more the internet propagated, more pcs would be needed, they calculated probably. they were right it happened as such and also it helped windows sales.

    but after all, in all cases of knowledge/information being present, sharing occured, and with the sharing information/knowledge redoubled itself with every passing instant. internet grew huge.

    once you set the roots of something, then build a community/company/society around it, it recruits people of similar kind to itself, and bonds with societies/companies/communities of similar kind to it. so, when microsoft woke up to internet, it naturally responded according to its own personality - tried to stamp out competition. we all know netscape/ie thing. they were successful in this too. maybe the last time they succeeded in this. after some time they crushed netscape, internet has grown to a place that was a community/nation by itself and at that time it/(we) have developed a trans-internet society/culture with experience, preference, knowledge, lore, even politics about anything going on in i.t. and internet. at THAT point microsoft stopped winning.

    then came the google. it was just compliant with the philosophy over the net - simple, no-evil (as much as possible), up-to-point, non-aggressive, not limiting, cooperative and such. people embraced, and it grew huge.

    they mocked google and other companies that followed the new non-yuppie, non-'hit it big' thing, as they were locked in suits of the 80es still. they mocked, but mocks or laughs or bravado are pitiful when the majority of human civilization (as much as the percentage on the internet, which is something huge itself) is going some way and you are not.

    so what happened ? they couldnt fit the times, they were not able to fit the people on the net and give them what they needed, some other people did that, the fir

    1. Re:Another comment i made earlier explains by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Microsoft is a big, bad corporation which never learned to share because they were formed in the late 1970s when peace and love were on the wane, and greed and materialism were waxing full? Idiot.

      The reason you were modded down (and if I had an account with mod points, I'd use them all to mod you down right now) is because you're a pretentious TWAT who only THINKS he's clever. Instead you're just another linux turdling with a persecution complex.

      Kindly fuck off.

    2. Re:Another comment i made earlier explains by unity100 · · Score: 1

      Indeed, your wise, civil, visionary post gives much more insight on the matter than my 'little twat idiot' post, isnt it ?

      Not only that, but it also hints that you are a microsoft freakie, and due to your uncivil, aggressive and no-manner behaviour gives another reason to hate microsoft and all things associated with it.

      Become a civilized human being first, then shit around about other people. People like you should never get any responsibility, leave aside mod points.

  6. blurry eyes by mrscorpio · · Score: 1

    Anyone else see "FAFSA" when they saw this headline?

    1. Re:blurry eyes by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      Anyone else see "FAFSA" when they saw this headline?
      Got financial aid applications coming up, eh? :-) Thank <deity> I'm done with that, <deity> forbidding I ever go back to grad school for a second time. *crosses fingers*
    2. Re:blurry eyes by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I saw FAFSA the 1st time thru, not because of applications, but those pesky loans are almost paid off!

  7. Nope.. by Channard · · Score: 1

    .. you're thinking of Tomb Raider.

    1. Re:Nope.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No really, it will be Quake with Shadowrun graphics.

      Roleplaying on the 360? Like if ever. Until they roll out the online add-ons and then the kids can run down the streets shooting at each other. And then it will be roleplaying because, Hey! Presto! I can upgrade my char.

      I'm sure it will be so much better than MS combat flight simulator 3.

  8. Shadowrun....... by Merls+the+Sneaky · · Score: 1

    Support a real Shadowrun game, one that is actually RPG. This FPS crap for Shadowrun sucks.

    http://www.shadowrun-online.com/sro/

    They are currently making a proof of concept to present to Microsoft for a MMO Shadowrun game.

    1. Re:Shadowrun....... by skam240 · · Score: 1

      just what the world needs, another mmo...

      what i'd like to see is a solid single player shadowrun rpg. sort of a like the genesis version only made for this generation of hardware.

      --
      I ignore Anonymous Coward posts. If you want to discuss something, that's awesome. Log in.
    2. Re:Shadowrun....... by Shadarr · · Score: 1

      That's what I've been hoping for since the Genesis game came out. Doesn't look like it's going to happen though. Instead, we get CounterStrike with elves and Everquest with deckers. Oh well, time to move on. Resident Evil 4 was great last year, I'm sure more great games will come out next year.

    3. Re:Shadowrun....... by DorkusMasterus · · Score: 1

      Actually, what you should do, if you want a real Shadowrun RPG, is to hope this sells mildly well. That way, they'll see that the IP has legs and will develop more games in that "world". Otherwise, the thing will sell horribly, and you won't see another Shadowrun game for quite some time, if at all. I agree that the SNES and Genesis versions with just an upgrade would be worth buying, but you're not going to see that, unless the FASA division makes some cash on this one.

    4. Re:Shadowrun....... by Qzukk · · Score: 1

      if you want a real Shadowrun RPG, is to hope this sells mildly well.

      With emphasis on the "mildly". If it sells like crazy, then you can bet we'll see 4 more FPSes before anyone even thinks about an RPG.

      --
      If I have been able to see further than others, it is because I bought a pair of binoculars.
    5. Re:Shadowrun....... by Danse · · Score: 1
      That way, they'll see that the IP has legs and will develop more games in that "world".

      I've seen this argument made a few dozen times on the MS Shadowrun forums. It really makes no sense. If the game they created sells, then they'll create more of the same. It's what they do. The "world" that they've created with this game bears little resemblance to Shadowrun. Yeah, it's got elves and trolls and technology, but so what? That still doesn't make it Shadowrun. I guarantee that if they'd gotten a group of maybe six or eight Shadowrun players together with the game designers, they could have come up with at least half a dozen game design concepts that would blow this one away, and still remain true to the SR universe. What do they have now? Counter-Strike/UT with elves and stuff. How original... blah.
      --
      It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds. - Captain Hammer
  9. I guess I've been lucky then by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Okay, there has been crap to deal with, but that was the kind of crap you'll always have to deal with publishers or platform owners... We'll see what the future brings.

  10. I don't have time to beta a new game by BigBuckHunter · · Score: 3, Funny

    I appoligize, but I do not have time to beta a new game. I am currently Beta-ing Oblivion IV for PC.

    BBH

  11. Yea, we need to treat MS right everyone by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    So, how long ago were you assimilated unit Astroturf593?

  12. The article, is crap, tho' by Jeremiah+Cornelius · · Score: 1

    It somehow asserts in it's opening paragraph the MS acquired code from Apple, which acquired it - in turn - from Xerox PARC.

    This is simple muddling of ideas: that imitating a technology and a design are somehow equivalent to acquring products and companies. It is a kind of intellectual laziness and shorthand, written by someone not particularly conversant in th edetails of either technology or business.

    It also demonstrates a mastery of opinion over knowlege of the subject at hand. In particular, of Microsoft. I would venture to say that the author of the piece was not around to see the original Apple GUI, or the introduction of Windows 1.0 through 3.0.

    A better, more accurate and relevant anecdote about Microsoft would be the semi-ethical acquisition of QDOS and Tim Patterson from Rod Brock and Seattle Computer products. This was the birth of MS, as IBM's OS supplier of choice, and propelled them from being a purveyor of ubiquitous BASIC ROMs, to the most cash-rich corporation in history (outside of banking.

    Linkage:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seattle_Computer_Prod ucts
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tim_Paterson

    --
    "Flyin' in just a sweet place,
    Never been known to fail..."
  13. I doubt they'll find 200.... by mbourgon · · Score: 1

    They're only looking for 360 players
    And given the apathy towards it by the Shadowrun FANS (as well as FPS people who see Counterstrike-with-elves), I don't think they'll find that many. Maybe 200.

    --
    "Sometimes a woman is a kind of religion, she can save your soul & set you free from all your sins" - Bad Examples
  14. Re:Another whine i made earlier exudes by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's so funny, hearing a Slashdot zealot whine about "what Microsoft is like", when they have no idea what it's like to work there (or anywhere, most likely of all).

  15. Re:Another whine i made earlier exudes by unity100 · · Score: 1

    I dont care how it is like working there. I am talking about how they treat the rest of the world.

    In groups/societies exhibiting such kind of behaviour, the inner philosopy cant be all rosy.

    you and your teammates may have created a little collaboration oasis in lower middle level of the company, but, the behemoth acts according to its own personality.

  16. Not FASA, just FASA Interactive by mcvos · · Score: 4, Informative

    Unlike what the article says, Microsoft did not acquire FASA. They only acquired FASA Interactive. FASA itself still exists as a holding company, and still owns the paper versions of their games, which they license to a variety of other companies, including WizKids, who in turn license Shadowrun to the German company FanPro, who is currently publishing the fourth edition of Shadowrun. Earthdawn is licensed to Living Room Games. Other games have been licensed to other companies.

    FASA Interactive, and thus Microsoft, only owns the rights to computer games based on these settings.

  17. Mechwarrior 3 was MicroPROSE, not Microsoft.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Nor Activision

    See here..

    http://www.mobygames.com/game/windows/mechwarrior- 3/cover-art/gameCoverId,63884/

    Personally it's my favorite, along with the original and often overlooked Mechwarrior 1.

    1. Re:Mechwarrior 3 was MicroPROSE, not Microsoft.. by jythie · · Score: 1

      Heh. Yep, my bad.

      I had glaced at the wikipedia article and somehow read "MechWarrior 3 was the first MechWarrior game not develped by Activision." as "MechWarrior 3 was develped by Activision."

      I have to agree, it was also my favorite. Unfortunatly due to a math bug it can not run on newer processors so it is going to be a coaster from now on ;-;

  18. Re:Another whine i made earlier exudes by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You're fucking nuts. Either that or just incredibly overdramatic, maybe both.

  19. Re:Another whine i made earlier exudes by unity100 · · Score: 1

    And curiously, you are an anonymous coward.

    i wonder why is that ...

  20. It all depends... by master_p · · Score: 1

    If my coworkers were something along these lines, then I wouldn't mind working for the Bor^H^H^H^H Microsoft....

  21. corporate culture by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
    Let's say, part of what they wanted from us was our development culture, because we'd worked very hard to have this collaborative, effective team, and they wanted to kind of build those kinds of teams and kind of capture that.
    ...which would only mean that someone believed the happytalk that flies around prior to an acquisition. I can't think of any acquiring company that really adopted the culture of an acquiree. In reality, the best case is acquirees that are allowed to continue on as largely separate entities with a culture separate from that of the parent.

    Defining company culture is a job of the top level executives. This is one of the areas where they are out for bragging rights; cloning the culture of a company they acquired would not make them marketable for other jobs.