Slashdot Mirror


The Future of Journalism Online

twitter writes "The slide in newspaper subscriptions continues for obvious reasons: convenience, variety, depth, cost and user control are all in favor of pull media. The BBC is wondering what this will ultimately mean for journalism. One interesting issue is brought up: 'papers like France's Libération [have] traditionally shunned advertising it deemed politically compromising and relied on its cover price for its income.' Even they see that internet distribution is the answer, but the BBC worries about the details." From the article: "The International Herald Tribune now sees itself as a media organisation rather than just a paper; their website features video stories and has taken the step of charging for premium content. 'Good journalism costs money and so we are trying to see what we can do to make sure we can continue to grow and support the business,' said Meredith Artley, director of digital development at the International Herald Tribune. "

53 comments

  1. The Future of the Monolithic Journalism Stack by newscloud · · Score: 2, Interesting

    The traditional mainstream media is essentially a monolithic workflow stack for reporting information that depends on scale for advertising revenue. The Internet doesn't change the basic structure of the operation - or its incentives. In contrast, the future of journalism online is like to be distributed, more like honey from a beehive. In this spirit, we released our platform to the open source community this past week. There is much work to do. We're like a tenth of a nanosecond past the big bang of online journalism.

    1. Re:The Future of the Monolithic Journalism Stack by Fred_A · · Score: 1
      In contrast, the future of journalism online is like to be distributed, more like honey from a beehive.
      Uh, what ?
      Journalism online is going to be a sticky mess ? It's going to be attacked by bears ? You'll only be able to get at it if you smoke the journalists first ?

      What kind of analogy is that ?
      --

      May contain traces of nut.
      Made from the freshest electrons.
  2. inevitable... by MollyB · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Hasn't this has been on the horizon since NBC started broadcasting in color? This is the slowest death of a particular medium since radio was supposedly doomed.

    I think some people like to read something they can fold, is light and cheap. (Eco-/.er's: I'm thinking recycled paper) and best of all, doesn't need to be charged or plugged in.

    Nope, didn't read tfa.

    1. Re:inevitable... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Honestly, post-consumer recycled paper isn't significantly more eco-friendly than "virgin" paper. Point by point, all the supposed advantages simply don't stack up.

      Destruction of forests: the pulp used in newspaper stock isn't tearing down old growth hardwood rainforests. It comes from tree farms with quick growing conifers. Tree farms are a much better source for the application, as the straight rows of similar sized trees allow for a significant increase in the efficiency of automated harvesting and processing. While tree farms may not be as environmentally beneficial as old growth virgin forests, nature generally gets its chance to do its thing for the vast majority of the time. And the land used in these forests is almost universally land that had been clearcut in order to plant farms, only to find that the local climate and soil conditions are not suited to crop growth. And while, yes, the acreage of old growth coverage is steadily declining, the total acreage of forested areas in the united states has been fairly consistently increasing since about the 1920's. The vast majority of this land is tree forests, with a very small minority (probably less than the amount of virgin forest being clearcut) being naturalized plantations.

      Pollution from paper mills: Recycling post-consumer paper actually causes more local water pollution than making paper from virgin stock. Bleaching the various dyes out and removing the adhesives used in many post-consumer recycled paper requires harsher chemicals than bleaching virgin softwood pulp. Recycling pre-consumer trimmings from a factory floor DOES have an environmental benefit here as there is generally less dye and other chemical additives that have to be removed from the pulp.

      Energy Savings: Numbers have been thrown out by many pro-recycling concerns that paint a net gain from recycling, but these almost universally include pre-consumer recycling and generally include the energy required to harvest the raw wood from forests but do not include the energy costs of collecting old paper and taking it to the recycling plant. Sending trucks out to each and every house to pick up old newspapers actually consumes more energy than the highly industrialized large scale harvesting of farm grown softwoods. True, there may be some reduction in the amount of garbage collection needed, but this does not balance out as it is much more difficult to efficiently manage separate fleets of garbage and recycling trucks to manage at peak efficiency with the varying waste and recycling levels found in most municipalities. Basically, the garbage trucks are not coming back completely full, meaning they have to drive more miles per amount of waste collected. Pre-consumer recycling DOES come out ahead in the collection department. Simply because the individual pickups are larger and of a much more consistent size, allowing for much more efficiency in the fleet. One quick test to see if recycling uses less energy is in the cost of recycled products. Recycled paper products, particularly 100% post-consumer recycled paper, cost much more than the equivalent virgin product. This means it costs more to produce recycled products, and a large portion of that cost is in energy costs required to collect and process the post-consumer content. And this is even considering that most curbside pickup is either paid for directly by the resident or through the municipality providing the pickup and therefore recycling is already subsidized by taxes. The energy economics can be further elucidated with recycling center drop-off points. These shift the burden of transportation primarily on the person bringing in the wastes, yet recycling centers do not pay for paper recycling dropped off. Some recycling centers even charge for paper drop off or are subsidized by the community. Aluminum cans, however, are paid a decent premium at drop off. This is because the energy costs required to reduce bauxite ore to metallic aluminum are far greater than the energ

    2. Re:inevitable... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      newspapers wont die. at least for the other 4/5 of the world that has no easy access to the internet.
      also, it doesnt really help to think in "either/or". i can see clearly how online news sources and newspapers can coexist, one giving perspectives and instant updates, the other giving long and thorough approaches to important events.
      simply,the best companies will be the ones who can get the best out of both worlds.

  3. It's a matter of trust... by Amigan · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Blogosphere is known and acknowledged to present specific points of view. Newspapers have lost a lot of trust with readership because they have chosen to present the news that they want - rather than just reporting the facts. The blogosphere has rattled their cage considerably with all its opinions, and newspapers feel that they have to responds in kind.

    When sources used are questionable (unnamed or fictitious), corrections don't occur on bad facts, people start to question the value of newspapers. The on-line versions are going to have to compete in the 24x7 world, and actually improve their standards of reporting if they want to compete with the blogosphere.

    jerry

    --
    "Software is the difference between hardware and reality"
    1. Re:It's a matter of trust... by s20451 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Newspapers have lost a lot of trust with readership because they have chosen to present the news that they want - rather than just reporting the facts.

      This made me laugh. Have you ever read a political blog? They spend half their time shouting that the mainstream media is biased and ineffective, and the other half quoting MSM articles that happen to flatter their preconceptions.

      The death of the mainstream media is hugely exaggerated. There is very little "news" that percolates from the blogosphere, compared to traditional, full-time, employed journalists.

      --
      Toronto-area transit rider? Rate your ride.
    2. Re:It's a matter of trust... by jlarocco · · Score: 4, Interesting
      The on-line versions are going to have to compete in the 24x7 world, and actually improve their standards of reporting if they want to compete with the blogosphere.

      Maybe I'm only one, but I simply don't trust blogs as news sources. Even at their best, their "news" is rehashed from a real news source.

    3. Re:It's a matter of trust... by GodInHell · · Score: 1

      Maybe I'm only one, but I simply don't trust blogs as news sources. Even at their best, their "news" is rehashed from a real news source. Not the only one at all. Can't trust any of those sites that just post news from other sources.. I mean.. who would want that!?

      Blogs are way overrated though. Even at their best editorials in newsprint are just opion pieces, interesting only when they offer a really new idea or are authored by an actual news-maker, blogs are basically just editorials written by nobodies. Bleh.

      -GiH

    4. Re:It's a matter of trust... by veganboyjosh · · Score: 1

      Can't trust any of those sites that just post news from other sources.. I mean.. who would want that!?

      how is this different than different papers printing the exact stories--word for word--from the AP or UPI?

    5. Re:It's a matter of trust... by GodInHell · · Score: 1
      I was sort of cracking wise.. considering the site we're on.

      -GiH

    6. Re:It's a matter of trust... by tehcyder · · Score: 1

      You used the word blogosphere three times in that post, so unfortunately I completely missed your point while I was vomiting.

      --
      To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
  4. its that pesky market again by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    undermining perfectly legitimate global media corporations and denying shareholders their money. sent in the swat teams!

    there will always be a market for the cheap shoddy sensationalist celeb obsessed claptrap you get in tabloids because 90% of the population are morons.

    everybody else can think for themselves and can make do with reading news agregation sites (like /.) with a pinch of salt.

    Screw the broadsheets anyway, they've been nosediving downhill like all media outlets. I bought 'the independent' for the 1st time in ages whilst waiting for my aunt at her hospital appointment, it had a 2 page spread on "i'm a celebrity, get me out of here". threw it in the bin. ffs if a significant percentage of the readership is interesting in that pile of drivel then the rest of the paper must be aimed at the mentally subnormal too.

    1. Re:its that pesky market again by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      forgot to say

      if they want to cut costs, drop that sport crap, put it in a separate rag called something like "journalists w*nking themselves dry over 22 overpaid cheats kicking a ball around a field". hell, we've proven that people are willing to pay extra money just to watch this crap and listen to the inane commentary, why not pay to make them pay extra to read exactly the same drivel the next day?

      news is news. sport is sport. sport is only news if like somebody gets shot on the pitch. over 50% of the population isn't interested in sport. drop it from 'serious' newspapers NOW and save money.

    2. Re:its that pesky market again by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The newspapers are really not going to be dropping sports anytime soon, in a manner that is similar to feature creep in software. Of that 50% of the population that is interested in sports, for a significant portion of them, dropping the sports section would be a total deal-breaker and the customer will simply go elsewhere for their news. So by dropping, say, 1/10th of the total size of the issue, the newspaper company might lose 1/3rd of their customers. By dropping the business section, the paper might drop another 1/10th of the thickness and lose 1/4th of the customer base. And so on and so on. For the vast majority or customers, there is probably a small handful of features that are actually deal-breakers in that if that feature is not included, then they will not purchase the product (newspaper in this instance.) For an example, we'll imagine a product with 100 possible features, with every customer having 3 make it or break it features. A feature that a customer does not want can usually be ignored and so is rarely a deal-breaker unless is causes severe usability issues or an inordinate increase in the amount of resources needed. Since the customer will only purchase the product that has every feature they require, coming out with 100 different products with only one feature each will simply not do, and will be extremely awkward to distribute. Coming out with the almost one million different combinations of three features that would satisfy each and every customer would simply be asinine. The way to be profitable is to include enough features that a significant portion of the population has all three of their features satisfied. While it may not be reasonable to expect every single feature to be implemented in a single product, a manageable line of products could be created that satisfies enough of the customers to continue doing business. Combining features that play well off of each other is the art of creating a marketable product.

  5. The Future of Journalism Online... by superbrose · · Score: 2, Funny

    ...is right here at /.

    1. Re: The Future of Journalism Online... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

    2. Re: The Future of Journalism Online... by bladesjester · · Score: 1

      I, for one, fear for the future =]

      --
      Everything I need to know I learned by killing smart people and eating their brains.
  6. Digital Paper by GodInHell · · Score: 4, Insightful
    Personally, I've been waiting for a more convinient way of recieving my newspaper for awhile now. Slices of cut up tree are a waste of space (and trees) but as a medium for spreading information, it's worked for centuries. The promise of digital paper is that I won't have to trust that my newspaper boy will deliver my paper before I leave for school/work (it has yet to happen for me) or pay a marked-up price at the coffee shop on my way in. I'd rather just sigh in frustration and dig through the political leanings of site like drugde than pay for access to the NYT's editorials and deeper content.

    But I would be thrilled if I could simply plug my newspaper into my computer every morning, grab the newest issue, and read it on the train, at lunch, when I'm waiting for meetings to start, in class when I'm doing that instead of working, generally when I have a moment. That's the promise of digital paper, and I really hope the news paper guys pick up on it as fast as they can.

    I believe (as in a hope or aspiration which I have not verified with evidence or research) that there is still a market for the thoughtful and thorough reporting one recieves from a newspaper which cannot be found on the evening news shows. There is a cultural advantadge in sharing root sources of information which we can all reference, rather than squabling over which version of the news is more Republican or Democrat leaning - this is the traditional role of the newspaper. "Did you see the front page today?" "I know, person Y did X." Check CNN, FOX, and ABC news, they almost never focus on the same stories.. and even when they do, the treatment is often so different that you wouldn't recognize one from the other. For example, as I write this, Fox is pushing the death of James Kim, CNN is running a Pinnochet story, and ABC.. well they're confusedly running a rolling banner which includes everything from Pinnochet to Anna Nicole's baby, with no mention of mr Kim. So, where is the common social icon, the idea we take away together of what happened today that mattered? That's important.. that's what a strong and vibrant local newspaper gives to a community, around which a sense of unity can gather. This kind of seperate news for seperate audiences approaches we have now leads to division and a lack of focus in the social conciousness.

    At least that's this hack's opinnion.

    -GiH

    1. Re:Digital Paper by phantomlord · · Score: 1

      My local paper has a pretty decent internet presence. Somewhere between 4-5am, the site is updated with most of that day's content and then breaking stories are noted through the day (which generally turns into tomorrow's articles).

      The problem is that my paper really doesn't do a lot of investigative reporting and 75% of the content is articles straight off the news wires. Most of the stories they actually write (pretty much everything but the sports page) are written through a prism of narrow bias (usually in subtle ways of framing an issue so only the side they want to look positive does) instead of simply reporting the facts. Finally, the editorial pages are completely self contradicting and filled of the same bias (Years of "There is too much secrecy and corruption in Albany." During the run up to the election "Elliot Spitzer is a great candidate but he speaks in generalities instead of specifics about what he wants to do. He needs to be up front and honest to the voters." A week before the election "Elliot Spitzer is the right man for the job." Now "Spitzer won the election, now he needs to do the things he promised to do and he should start by opening the curtains to how government is run." Hello... you endorsed him even though he wouldn't tell you a single specific thing he was going to do... You did nothing but complain about the problem yet you endorsed perpetuating it and now you're going to complain again even though your guy won.)

      I usually check it out once a day just to see if I miss anything... but the local tv stations generally have better investigative reporting and nearly everything important going on in town ends up on one of the various local talk radio shows with people calling in and debating it. I'll opt for the mayor and the police union president coming onto the radio and telling their sides of the crime problem first hand vs what the paper decides to nitpick from interviewing either one. Simply, I don't subscribe to the newspaper anymore because they're more about an agenda than facts these days.

      --
      Don't leave your mind so open that your brain falls out. Don't close it so much that you cut off the blood.
  7. It's all in the delivery by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I'd definitely subscribe to a newspaper...if it were possible for me to subscribe to one. I live approximately halfway between Baltimore and Washington, D.C. in a 300-unit apartment complex. I've tried to subscribe to both the Washington Post and the Baltimore Sun, but neither offers delivery in my area. In one of the most connected areas of the country, I find it hard to believe that I can't pay someone to toss a newspaper tossed on my front stoop, but that's the truth.

  8. You don't need to. by khasim · · Score: 2, Insightful
    Nope, didn't read tfa.

    You don't need to. It's no different from the thousand other stories just like this.

    And the answer hasn't changed yet. The newspapers are losing their readers because the newspapers are abandoning their readers. Real journalism is dying at the newspapers. It's dying on the television news programs. The only show that still has some in depth and insightful research is The Daily Show. How pathetic is that?

    This isn't about getting on the web with video clips.

    This is about digging for the facts and presenting them in context. If you have to offend some government official, so be it. We'll respect you more for that than if you just regurgitate their press releases. The concept of being paid for "work" involves you doing some actual "work". When some part time policy hobbyist knows more than your political reporters, you have a problem.
    1. Re:You don't need to. by Planesdragon · · Score: 3, Informative

      The newspapers are losing their readers because the newspapers are abandoning their readers. Real journalism is dying at the newspapers.

      Not here in Albany NY. The Times Union has done as much investigative journalism as anyone could hope for -- they even went to court to get information.

      Nationally, the NY Times and other papers of similar weight remain bastions of actual reporting.

    2. Re:You don't need to. by theLOUDroom · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Nationally, the NY Times and other papers of similar weight remain bastions of actual reporting.

      As Huey Freeman would put it:
      Read Dummy!

      The NYT might look great compared to Fox News, but they have been far from exemplary.

      --
      Life is too short to proofread.
  9. Another behemoth grapples with the Internet by postbigbang · · Score: 3, Insightful

    They're all online media companies now. And this is where they fail: not asking their own journalists, rather than the sales department, about what they should do in the midst of declining sales, stodgy offerings, and peek-a-boo online subcriptions. The guys out in the trenches get it, it's the exec on the golf course that are having trouble making shots while eyes become increasingly glued to monitors, mobile PDAs, and other life in the post-paper era.

    The IHT is that silly paper at the conceirge desk at the hotel in Singapore, the airline lounge, and other places abroad. If you look at their advertisers, you can tell their audience. Apparently, execs now get their news-- real news-- from places like RSS and Atom feeds. Fancy that.

    --
    ---- Teach Peace. It's Cheaper Than War.
    1. Re:Another behemoth grapples with the Internet by swiftstream · · Score: 1

      As an American having lived more than half my life abroad, I can tell you that the IHT is anything but "silly." It's published by the NYT corporation, and I personally prefer it to the NYT and every other major US paper I've read.

      If you want good English news abroad, the IHT is almost always the way to go.

      --
      Be a PATRIOT--because the only thing we have to fear is the lack thereof.
  10. 'Good journalism costs money" not! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    what costs is cronyism, nepotism and patronism

    corporations don't care

  11. Welcome by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I for one welcome our Ad-Infested Journalist Overlords.

  12. No. by jb.hl.com · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I could, easily, read my chosen paper online, but I choose not to. The typography is better and easier on my eyes. The viewing area is bigger, and can fit more information in it without having to scroll down (reading from paper feels far more natural than reading from a screen). It's more convenient (I can read a paper on my couch, in the canteen at work, in bed, on the can, just about anywhere really...). Papers aren't going to die any time soon.

    --
    By summer it was all gone...now shesmovedon. --
    1. Re:No. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's more convenient (I can read a paper on my couch, in the canteen at work, in bed, on the can, just about anywhere really...). Papers aren't going to die any time soon. Laptop... paper is more portable, but it isn't the only portable option.

      Also, you can print out online news. If printers were a little better and a little more widespread then the actual distribution side would absolutely be killed by PDFs. I don't see any moves in that direction from the printer companies though, more fool them.

      p.s. I also read the Guardian, but the paper version has less Aleks Krotoski.

  13. Print journalism is bunk because of television by Toby+The+Economist · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Who cares? Print journalism is bunk because of television. There's no award for "best investigative sentence" - which is what modern newspapers have been reduced to, with a very, very few exceptions (IHT and The Economist).

    Modern print journalism, like television, is a source of disinformation.

    Disinformation is information which leads you to *think* you are informed but actually leads you away from being *truly informed*.

    News is defined as *functional information*. Almost everything in a newspaper is NOT news. It fills up your time, fills up your brain, and leads you to think you're being informed when actually you're being filled up with irrelevent, contextless, useless knowledge.

    Most of the major issues in our lives are not news-worthy - in the sense of being *newspaper* news worthy; and those which are *cannot* be dealt with in the space and attention span commanded by a newspaper column. The very attempt to do so entirely distorts the reality of the problem and this itself is part of the disinformation.

    We need to loose television. We won't, and that's why we're screwed.

    1. Re:Print journalism is bunk because of television by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Do you suffer from a tight tv?

  14. Didn't Judith Miller work for the NY Times? by khasim · · Score: 1
    Nationally, the NY Times and other papers of similar weight remain bastions of actual reporting.

    That's possible. But they also have people like Judith Miller working for them.

    Sorry, I'll take The Daily Show over her "reporting" any day.
  15. info on medical e-publishing kiing off print -same by docinthemachine · · Score: 2, Interesting

    The progressive killing off of traditional print publishing by e-publishing is true and here to stay in all fields. Hre is a review of how strong this trend is in medical e-publishing where free open source e-text is replacing traditional medical journals. The same is happening for fiction. read more here at : http://docinthemachine.com/2006/12/05/is-paper-med ical-publishing-dead/

  16. So, the people that believes in e-paper was wrong by ghostbar38 · · Score: 1, Interesting

    More people use a notebook for reading news in anyplace or they cellphone and not those wear concepts of e-papers...

    That makes media focus in the internet market, just as Google does focusing in the mobile market[Spanish]

    --
    ghostbar page.
  17. What about quality as a factor? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Articles like this one miss two of the key factors driving (IMHO) the drop in subscriptions: the loss of competition in many markets, and a significant drop in quality. In my town (Rochester, NY), we used to have at least two major newspapers. This dropped to one Gannett-owned newspaper, and the quality of the product has been in a continuous death-spiral ever since. The most visible aspect of this has been a reduction in the size of the paper ("Hey, instead of competing with the new online media on content, let's shrink the physical size of our product, concomitantly shrink the actual content, and rely almost entirely on AP stories!"). Give me quality content in a non-microprint form that beats (or uniquely supplements) what I can get online, and I'll buy the paper.

  18. Oh noes! by Butisol · · Score: 1

    The mainstream media has an agenda. Go to those MSM websites where they allow "discussion" comments (notice how few actually do) at the end of their articles. You will notice that comments must be approved by an editor before they get posted. They don't trust the people to moderate their own discussions. WHY IS THAT? Now people have a genuine alternative to funding the vanguards of political correctness... at least until it becomes illegal to post any wrongthink on the net. Then the MSM will have a renaissance.

    1. Re:Oh noes! by Oniko · · Score: 1
      Much as I'd greatly prefer an ideal society where everyone is free to express their opinion without the need for approval... I think most of them are just trying to avoid being sued over comments about the GNAA, surprise buttsecks, the Jewish Banker world conspiracy, and/or links to tubgirl.


      Most places I've seen seem to automatically approve any opinion out to the reaches of wingnuttery on either side, so I don't agree that that's their motivation. The Intarweb can be a nasty, nasty place. I ran across a youtube video (lost the link) that a little old lady had put up to detail the service of her husband (who had recently passed away) in WWII. The comments? Lots of random nonsensical sexual references, congratulations to the deceased for 'escaping' the miserable old hag, bitch, etc, and other completely inappropriate obscenities.


      Slashdot is a self-moderated forum for nerds. It can generally assumed that its readers are old enough to not be scarred and reasonable enough not to sue if they run across a detailed account of pedophiliac rape or a strident Holocaust denial. Most members of the MSM cannot make these assumptions.

  19. The IHT has little real news by postbigbang · · Score: 1

    And I've looked at the IHT at my hotel room desk, and had RSS feeds that had already scrolled past every single major piece in the IHT. It was neither newsworthy, nor bereft of US propaganda. It seemed constantly sanitized, trying to put on some weird patina of neutrality.

    You're obviously a fan and not eager to look at it critically. It's moldy by the time it reaches a hotel in say, Singapore, and worse, smells of Lysol.

    I otherwise respect the NYT, and the WSJ, despite them both having very different egos to protect. The NYT has done an iffy job of web adaptation, and the WSJ survives based on greed/need, not journalism. Those that weild by ink by the barrel had advertisers that paid for that ink. The WSJ is infinitely more reflective of that, and the NYT is somewhat distracted by guilt. The IHT needs to have adapted a decade ago. But in this world of instant reinvention, there's a strange chance that they might succeed where others have misstepped. I doubt this, however. Print journalism is reeling and starting to sing swan songs because they're clueless. As long as they listen to their sales departments and not their readers, they'll die horrid little deaths.

    Fie.

    --
    ---- Teach Peace. It's Cheaper Than War.
    1. Re:The IHT has little real news by swiftstream · · Score: 1

      And I've looked at the IHT at my hotel room desk, and had RSS feeds that had already scrolled past every single major piece in the IHT. It was neither newsworthy, nor bereft of US propaganda. It seemed constantly sanitized, trying to put on some weird patina of neutrality.

      You're obviously a fan and not eager to look at it critically. It's moldy by the time it reaches a hotel in say, Singapore, and worse, smells of Lysol.


      I'm not sure what you mean by "sanitized," but I guess I like it. Maybe the Atlantic edition, which is what I've spent my years reading, is better than the Asia edition.

      And I've never been to Singapore, but the IHT is printed in a few dozen cities around the world, so I severely doubt it takes long enough to get to Singapore that it is actually moldy (in fact, I wouldn't be at all surprised it is printed in Singapore).

      --
      Be a PATRIOT--because the only thing we have to fear is the lack thereof.
  20. Not resubscribing to my paper by j-schoolgeek · · Score: 2, Insightful

    My newspaper subscription is ending, and I've decided not to resubscribe, in large part because of the subscription cost. My paper costs $180 for the year. I decided that if I want print versions of news, I can subscribe to Time or Newsweek for a fraction of the cost. No, it's not daily, but I think it's often more insightful.

  21. Trust your neighbor. by twitter · · Score: 1

    Have you ever read a political blog? They spend half their time shouting that the mainstream media is biased and ineffective, and the other half quoting MSM articles that happen to flatter their preconceptions. ...There is very little "news" that percolates from the blogosphere, compared to traditional, full-time, employed journalists.

    Well, that's what the journalist's job is ... but they get tipped by your neighbor and critiqued by the blogs. Not even Clark Kent could see everything. It takes a whistle blower to out a scandal. All the gumshoe can do is some crude fact checking before passing the story on. If there's an advertiser conflict of interest, even that might not happen. If it does happen, there are thousands of people who know what they are talking about, ready to share their opinion. You might not be able to tell the difference but neither can the average gumshoe and that does not make the good opinions any less of a new resource.

    Those resources are getting better too. As more people catch the news as it happens, you will see more of that first hand footage. There are also lots of good new news sites that are hiring full time journalists as well as taking whatever comes their way.

    An interesting and good political blog comes from none other than RMS. I don't think he's ever found anything useful on MSNBC.

    --

    Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.

    1. Re:Trust your neighbor. by xe0nes · · Score: 1

      If there's an advertiser conflict of interest, even that might not happen.

      Not always true, but at some papers, yes... I work for DenverPost.com, and I can remember even recently seeing an ad showing up in an article on the site that was critical of that advertiser. Of course, it was an accident, but there was no scramble to change it, either. I don't agree 100% with the Post's politics (less than 50%, really), but I respect the integrity of many of the journalists there, especially in the online side. Although, only a couple people in the online side of things write anything more detailed than a headline or photo cutline, normally.

      I think some things are changing, little by little, as the whole industry starts to slide things over to the online side. We've seen an insane number of sweeping changes in the last year as the online side gets more and more important relative to the print side.

  22. But you have, right? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
    An interesting and good political blog comes from none other than RMS. I don't think he's ever found anything useful on MSNBC.

    Yet time and time again, when stories are posted that link to MSNBC stories that agree with your POV you've had no problem whatsoever descending on the article and absolutely agreeing with the theme at hand.

  23. real news source by ElephanTS · · Score: 1

    It all depends what you call a real news source. They're all at it! The BBC reads off AP and Reuters all day long. Some 'news' items start as press releases. Governments feed media agencies stories. It's a really complex web which often just comes down to 'trusting' or 'belief'. This is what the internet has shown me anyway.

    --
    spoonerize "magic trackpad"
  24. Worthless by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This article is saying nothing new. Nothing that hasn't been said since the early '00s

  25. Gossip Tabloids changed at all? by tulsaoc3guy · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I would venture to say that the gossip tabloids, both British and American, have been largely unaffected by the Internet.

  26. What it means is Journalism is Dead. by maillemaker · · Score: 1

    I am coming to the conclusion that digital content /really/ /is/ going to be valued as "free" in the very near future.

    We see with things like YouTube that there are millions and millions of people willing to create and produce video content for free. Most of it might not be as polished as "professional" journalism, but evidently the masses don't care.

    I read today on NPR about a company that is doing something similar with T-shirts (threadless.com) (have not checked the URL). People submit t-shirt ideas, which get voted on by the community, and the top-voted ones are made and put up for sale. Now in this case the winning submitters get paid a couple of thousand dollars, but once again, you have a situation where thousands of people are creating and submitting content for the community for free.

    With millions of monkeys on the internet, there are always going to be a handful willing to write up some Shakespear for free.

    This means it's going to be harder and harder to find a handful of monkeys people are willing to pay to read.

    --
    A work that expires before its copyright never enters the public domain and thus enjoys eternal copyright protection.
  27. Are they reporting news or opinion? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    When it comes to news, the paper variety wins out every time. They're the only ones who'll reprint the press releases to masquarade as an article. No web site can be bothered to do it. Nor can anyone be bothered to spend their own time and money collating information that some BBC journo will do for them.

    When it comes to opinions, I still to on-line. The traditionally corporations lose too much by voicing an opinion that disagrees with their sponsors. And the BBC are the _worst_ offender here, despite being paid with public money. Not one of their articles about copyright or civil liberties offers a few against the copyright extension etc.

  28. Lessons from Vietnam: The Credibility Gap by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

    The AP gets caught falsify sources and admits they have "talking points".
    Reuters gets caught photoshopping (cut-n-paste, clone tool, etc.) photos.
    It has been shown that most of the reporting about Katrina was false.

    Really why trust them?

    from: http://shrinkwrapped.blogs.com/blog/2005/11/revisi ting_less.html
    posted Nov 15, 2005

    Lessons from Vietnam: The Credibility Gap

    The MSM* was permanently changed by the Vietnam war and its aftermath, including the Watergate scandal and the Nixon impeachment. [As commenter Jon Ravin points out in the interest of accuracy, Nixon was never actually impeached, but resigned when his impeachment became inevitable. This correction was made at the time of the original post-SW] The experiences of that time explain much of the agenda journalism of the MSM today, but I would submit that they have not only forgotten the most crucial lesson from Vietnam, but their failure to remember will ultimately destroy them as a uniquely important and powerful force in our society.

    First some history:

    During the years of the troop escalation in Vietnam, ultimately topping out at over 550,000 American military personal, the Pentagon and the White House, still fighting the last war in terms of Public Relations, continually measured our success in the war by pointing to "body counts". Using an outdated model of war in which the media play the role of conveyors of information controlled by the Pentagon and the administration, daily body counts of enemy combatants were touted as evidence, in the infamous words of General Westmoreland, that we could see "the light at the end of the tunnel." From 1965 on, we were, according to the daily body counts, winning the Vietnam war. When the Tet offensive took place in January of 1968, the reason the public was so shocked and ready to see our military victory as a defeat was that the expectations of victory "right around the corner" were crushed. We never knew that the North Vietnamese, post-Tet, were ready to sue for peace; all we knew was that an enemy who was supposedly being decimated was able to launch a major offensive. The conclusion was that either our military and the administration were incompetent, or that they had been lying to us all along. This lead to the "Credibility Gap". No longer would our press, feeling with some justification that they had been used and lied to, allow themselves to be so gullible. From this point on , the press almost universally saw themselves in an adversarial role against the military and the Executive branch of government.

    It is important to note that the Pentagon and White House were only doing what had always been done in war time. The purpose of news in war time is to support the morale of the home front and to that end, propaganda has always been an important aspect of warfare. Unfortunately for the Johnson and Nixon administrations, while the nature of war hadn't really changed, the nature of our media had. We had close to real time news emanating from the battlefields of Vietnam. Reporters could see that there were attacks not being reported, injuries and deaths of Americans being swept under the rug, and constant reports of impending victory which were easily refuted.

    This is extremely relevant to our war effort today. The military realizes that we are fighting a new kind of war, which includes a significant public relations aspect on the home front. [The military may have recognized this, but there has been precious little evidence that the Bush Administration has caught on to this aspect of the Information War.] The MSM does not yet recognize that fact; they are still fighting the last war.

    We are winning in Iraq and have been for some time. When the Iraqis vote on their Constitution, with significant voting from the Sunni areas, the MSM will not be able to disguise the fact. [Though they "buried the lead" and the story as quickly as pos