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Involving Kids In Free Software Through Games
SynrG writes "Platinum Arts Sandbox puts into childrens' hands the ability to role play in a 3D world and edit that world using simplified controls. The expressions on the faces of our kids as they played were priceless; both the ups and the downs. I wanted to capture this on video and share it. After having established a rapport with upstream, we took a 20 minute clip of one of our play sessions and gave a copy to them to use to help further their work. Here is the edited result. They were very pleased to have that kind of feedback and found the video valuable for determining where the software still needed improvement and to notice which aspects particularly pleased the children."
I went into reading about this very skeptical. I've been part of a few "no-subscription" virtual worlds aimed at kids, and watched a bunch of inventive and creative kids be horribly disappointed when the companies (I'm looking at you, Disney) pulled the plug on them.
But from the rather poor write-ups I'm finding, it sounds like this is Open Source, so even if its pulled there is still use for it.
Care to actually tell us more about the platform?
Do you all want to be a parent of some soul-less little pokemon-playing faggot glued to a monitor during all of their waking hours? Do you want to teach them that escapism is an acceptable way to deal with life? Do you want your kid to be the overweight, friendless baby-talker who reads lame fantasy books all day? Do you want to raise somebody who will grow to be 300 pounds and who will want to live with you rent-free through their adulthood, urinating in a bucket they keep in their room and emerging only to ask for your money?
Yes. Like father, like son.
How is giving kids free software to play with equivalent to involving them in free software? If they aren't working on the software itself, how are they involved? I understand it is a sandbox that they can play with, but what is the importance of its openness as far as the kids are concerned?
I have taught high schoolers to develop video games in their free time using a FOSS game engine I put together. That seems more like involving kids in free software, to me.
This, on the other hand, is a cool way of allowing kids to interact with video game simulations in a way that allows them to be creative. It sounds like it works well for a relatively young age group as well, which is a good thing. However, while the summary of this interesting idea is not bad, the subject line is somewhat insane. I don't think we need to artificially emphasize the openness of our projects to garner a good reception on Slashdot.
Insert self-referential sig here.
I've typed "newent" a few times, and that game looks a lot like Sauerbraten to me, but I din't see anything about Sauerbraten or Cube 1/2 in the article or on the game's page... http://www.sauerbraten.org/
I saw two kids playing a video game. They treated it just like the old
Donkey Kong game. There was no sign of creativity. they merely used the EDIT mode to "cheat." This will soon fill up with the same old debate on open source software and 3d worlds.
teaches more. Doom + Myst isn't a magical formula for learning unless the plan is to populate Second Life. But an open source, immersive environment is exciting if, say, Powers of 10 is the bar. Doesn't virtual reality promise means of illustration limited only by imagination? Game environments seek to temper all the running around (that is so fun) with puzzles that are, in a way, signatures of what abstract thinking skills its players possess.
Would were! Should is! Could be! And live a hundred times three.
i wish i had mod points today. perfect response. you sir, are a genius.
Do you all want to be a parent of some soul-less little pokemon-playing faggot glued to a monitor during all of their waking hours? Do you want to teach them that escapism is an acceptable way to deal with life? Do you want your kid to be the overweight, friendless baby-talker who reads lame fantasy books all day? Do you want to raise somebody who will grow to be 300 pounds and who will want to live with you rent-free through their adulthood, urinating in a bucket they keep in their room and emerging only to ask for your money?
Yes. Like father, like son.
i snorted diet coke out my nose and a little up into my ear. that was ear sucking good
It might get them interested in modding, I guess, and then they'll move on to something which actually allow them to write some code too. E.g., see the Oblivion or Fallout 3 or NWN2 scripting.
Most of the basic concepts involved in programming are just as applicable to and learnable from scripting, as from C++ or whatever else. E.g., according to a recent article, apparently one hurdle that half the population can't get over, is the humble "a = b" assignment. If a kid managed to get over it in a script to make their +5 Sword Of Ganking available in a game via a simple quest, or to put in a new uber-spell in NWN2, it's something they can apply later in a real programming job.
And to some extent most such mods involve starting from _some_ sources, and sharing your own source. It's not really F/OSS that would please RMS, but it can serve to drive a point home. Especially when they run into stuff like that they can't import their favourite companion or weapon from Oblivion into Fallout 3, because it's copyrighted by Bethesda and most mod sites have stern worded restrictions on that kind of thing. And they can also see what it's like to be on the other side of the fence, when someone else takes your sources and models, with or without permission, and makes his own mod out of them. It seems to me like you then can make your own informed choice between such stances as "meh, I couldn't care less" (Public Domain), "... as long as he gives credit" (BSD) or "... as long as he shares his changes too" (GPL) or a few others. (Over-simplified view of those licenses, to be sure, but you get the idea.)
Or maybe decide that "mine! all mine!" is what fits their personality the best, I guess.
On the other hand, I see no reason not to start directly from one of those games in the first place. If I were trying to get a kid interested in coding, I'd probably rather start from something like that.
A polar bear is a cartesian bear after a coordinate transform.
Come on! you programmers must remeber this? screw your 3d complicated systems. Update a better 2d graphics of a number munchers type game. Done!
Remeber to small kids, Actually being able to do something is fun in it self.
The 3d ultra high budgeted interesting plot and gameplay systems are for our old disillusioned selves. Kids? a 5 cent rubber balloon filled with hot air that you bat around with them often keeps their attention longer then the 60$ remote controlled velociraptor. never mind a real dinosaur book.
Having newphews helps in the understanding. (pre-empting the "slash dot we don't procreate)
I for one would never allow my son to compete with robots, they have a distint unfair advantage with their cold bloodsucking ways. It's only a matter of time before they all gang up on us!
Oh honey look... How cute... an angry slashdotter!
20 minutes later, the kids got bored and moved on to something else.
Actually, 20 minutes later the kids think they can fly as well and try it by jumping out of the balkony.
Open Source is not a topic children should be expected to understand. In a world where most children have enough advertising and propaganda shoved down their throats on a daily basis, why are we even discussing this?
Oh wait, it's because the title of the article is completely irrelevant.
If I had kids, I wouldn't let them waste their lives away in some retarded video game. What happened to raising adjusted kids who learn conversational skills and stay healthy through sports or even robotics competitions?
How will they learn to program advanced robots without ever spending time in front of a computer?
Do you all want to be a parent of some soul-less little pokemon-playing faggot glued to a monitor during all of their waking hours? Do you want to teach them that escapism is an acceptable way to deal with life? Do you want your kid to be the overweight, friendless baby-talker who reads lame fantasy books all day? Do you want to raise somebody who will grow to be 300 pounds and who will want to live with you rent-free through their adulthood, urinating in a bucket they keep in their room and emerging only to ask for your money?
Hrm Maybe an insecure anorexic high anxiety urinating everywhere due to fear of not living up to there parents social expectations kind of child would be more fun. You catch them on the computer and you walk slowly up to them...."We need to have a talk" you say to your child."Who did you goto prom with?" "My friends" your child replies. "Not prom king/queen this year huh?"you ask. "No..." "Get on the scale!!" You demand as you grab your childs hair....
Fuck no. Feeding a kid too many video games is like feeding them too much McDonalds. It causes their minds to resemble an alcoholic liver: fatty, bloated yet totally ineffective at its function, eventually unable to fend for itself. Buy your fatass kids a bike and tell them to hit the road. Then lock the doors for a few hours and let'em cry. They'll thank you for it later!
They sure will otherwise it's the back of the hand again...
I would first like to point out that this was the original news title: Free 3D Game Maker Gets Kids Involved Through Play The new one seems to be a bit misleading. The goal of Platinum Arts Sandbox is so that kids and adults can quickly and easily create their own video games and 3D worlds. The software is free and open source. I recommend watching the tutorial video to see how the in game editing works: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g44Ww2bg2_E I have used Sandbox to teach a HS afterschool club, at a Middle School, a kids summer camp over 3 weeks with about 60 kids, with my college students, etc. Also many other teachers from around the world are using it. In addition it has been featured at various conferences and included in a software package that goes out to 500 German schools. In addition it has been voted one of the top 100 projects of 2008 at moddb out of over 5k, and waiting on voting to see if it makes it in the top 5. In my classes kids have learned to design levels, model, script, code including adding their own monsters, and how to use SVN. Kids as young as six have had work submitted. To learn more about its specific features you can go here: http://kids.platinumarts.net/what-is-sandbox.html I think what SynrG has done with his kids is extremely valuable. They are learning new ways to express their imaginations, create stories through roleplaying, learn game design, and more. The next step is teaching them how to use scripting to make quests. I think a big mistake aspiring game developers make is not seeking out game developers and the proper communication channels. This is something I really try to hit home with my students. You can gain so much insight about the software, and also about the developers themselves and their experiences. And generally with free software there is a much greater chance to get in contact with these individuals, whereas with commercial products contact is much more limited, if you get any responses at all. And this way the kids get to learn the ins and outs from the developers themselves. Communication and being able to express yourself in general is a really important skill to learn, especially as an aspiring developer and these kids are getting a great opportunity to start early. As a note to the guy that was worried it might get "ripped away" that isn't going to happen. I started this project for elementary kids in my afterschool program and I don't plan on stopping anytime soon :) Also to the person that suggested that this could get people into modding, such as NWN. Why would you do that? You're going from a project that has everything completely open down to the engine source and SVN, to a closed source project where you're lucky to even get much game code. I think if you can start with a good standalone that is a much better experience. Take care and enjoy the software!
-mike
Creator of the Coop Doom 3 Mod Last Man Standing and Platinum Arts Sandbox Free 3D Game Maker
If I had kids
If the rest of the post is indicative of your personality, I wouldn't worry too much about this occurrence.
The expressions on the faces of our kids as they played were priceless; both the ups and the downs. I wanted to capture this on video and share it.
Notice the emphasis... Am I the only one who's disgusted by the parents who think their kids are cute and insist on showing you photos of them, but in reality have some really ugly looking kids? I didn't even want to bother RTFA for fear I may see a video of another parent touting the looks of their child as "cute".
Disclaimer: I am not god.
We may not be created equal
But we can be treated equal.