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Sun's JRuby Team Jumps Ship To Engine Yard
itwbennett writes "'To be honest, we had no evidence that Oracle wouldn't support JRuby, but we also didn't have any evidence that they would,' said Charles Nutter, explaining why Sun's entire 3-member JRuby team will be leaving the company to work for application hosting company Engine Yard. Nutter called getting hired by Sun about two-and-a-half years ago and being given the chance to work full time on JRuby a 'dream come true.' And said that the decision to leave Sun came down to making sure 'JRuby will get to the next level.'"
If I were a Sun employee, I'd do the exact same thing.
They don't know if Oracle will continue supporting JRuby, and they also don't know if Oracle won't continue support...so they are quitting. Why do I get the feeling that these 3 guys are being melodramatic divas? I more worried that JRuby is in the hands of these clowns than about what Oracle will do.
Much like Dan Bernstein.
My web apps are all written in assembler, am i right? am i right? M$ 4 life!! Disgruntled programmers/sysadmins lacking chops unite!
Some will prosper with Larry,
Some will die with Larry,
Some will jump from Larry,
Some will be pushed by Larry.
The one thing that won't happen is the question not getting asked, and it will be "are you good/viable/strategic(insert favourite acronym here) for Oracle, not are you good for Sun".
they won't die wondering !
I've taken dumps more important than this announcement.
Python is OK because it's mature and you can build good infrastructure such as Zope with it, but talking about organisations using RoR being out of business in favour of PHP and Perl?! ROTFL.
Oh naive curr. This is not your fathers Internet where running code and rough consensus meant anything. I'm sure with the proper publicity photos, you tube videos and social media consultancy this project can be hi profile, media centric and the darling of those who tweet.
Whats usability or performance go to with anything today? Hell, this is one of the mild examples.
I'm surprised ICANN hasn't already contacted them for their new language registry yet. Better get certified quick before the price goes up.
Need Mercedes parts ?
Ur smart I kan has date?
It's the ruby VM that's slow. There's nothing about the language itself that makes it slower than any other dynamic languages.
I can't help but wonder whether you're actually a chronological 13-year-old, or just an intellectual and emotional 13-year-old.
> If there's one thing even slower or more pointless than jvm and ruby,
> it's ruby on rails. I guess someone didn't get the memo,
> but RoR's 15 minutes are up.
To the contrary, people are cranking out new Rails apps at a furious rate, and lots of Java and C# apps are getting ported over to Rails. It's good times.
The Army reading list
...is that now EngineYard has full-time folks working on Rubinious, JRuby, and Ruby 1.8.6. It's Ruby implementation central over there.
The Army reading list
> If there's one thing even slower or more pointless than jvm and ruby,
> it's ruby on rails. I guess someone didn't get the memo,
> but RoR's 15 minutes are up.
To the contrary, people are cranking out new Rails apps at a furious rate, and lots of Java and C# apps are getting ported over to Rails. It's good times.
Until the uber-cool hip web development crowd with the collective attention span of a squirrel on a meth bender catches sight of their new new shiny....
OMG!!! 3 people jump ship from a bought out company!!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jury_nullification
If it's called Ruby on Rails, and this company is EngineYard, are they going to make program trains?!
... the ramblings of a guy named Nutter.
Since Malda likes em young, I'd guess he is a chronological 11-13 year-old.
Do you even lift?
These aren't the 'roids you're looking for.
Benchmarks are actual observations -- what we in the real world like to refer to as "science".
If you've got a benchmark of a larger application that you'd like to share that shows just how much the JVM sucks, I'm definitely curious. Ruby 1.9 works well for me now, but I'd been considering JRuby as a performance boost. If you can show me it's actually a failure, that would save some time.
Don't thank God, thank a doctor!
Has something to do with each session needing to spawn its own JVM in JRuby or something like that...
And we're seeing a lot of speed improvements coming down the pike with Ruby 1.9 and Rails itself should prove to be significantly leaner and more modular with Rails 3.
"Will we be employed by Oracle when we reach the age of retirement?"
"Don't count on it."
"Will we be employed by Oracle when we reach middle age?"
"Seems doubtful."
"Will we be employed by Oracle at the end of the day?"
"No."
Of course they are. Especially the apps that run too fast, nothing says adding customer value than spending months in moving to a slower platform.
Not sure about PHP, but when you make such comparisons between RoR and Perl solutions you should at least be aware of recent developments such as the Catalyst framework.
Not to mention things such as perl5i which tries to aggregate most of what is known as modern Perl.
Perl is an evolving language and Perl code from 8 years is very different from modern Perl code.
Yeah, but Ruby doesn't need to use the Ruby VM anymore than any language is tied to a given backend.
JRuby targets the JVM
IronRuby targets the .NET/Mono CLR (i.e same VM used by C#)
The JVM is a specification, not an implementation, so how can it be slow?
Which JVM are you saying is slow?
In the *real* real world Java runs on an actual implementation of the JVM spec, not the spec itself.
I used to work with Charlie Nutter and Tom Enebo years ago, when we worked on the same Web team. And I was thrilled to hear when they moved to Sun, really was the best deal you could imagine. Note that JRuby wasn't actually bought by Sun, but remained a separate project, only the developers were paid by Sun to work on JRuby. So I wish them the best as they move to their new digs.
Good luck, guys!
So we take one of the slowest and most bloated virtual machines for static languages, the JVM,
Boy, do you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about! JVM one of the slowest VMs? You need to get your head out of the '90s. It's one of the fastest now. And JRuby is one of the fastest Ruby implementation. (Definitely faster than Ruby 1.8, which is dreadfully slow.)
You're correct that Ruby's dynamic typing doesn't go well with JVM's static typing, which is why Scala is much faster than JRuby. Still, the JVM is so impressive, and Ruby nice enough to work with, that JRuby is still a pretty good idea.
That makes less than no sense -- JRuby is certainly capable of using Java threads as Ruby threads.
Don't thank God, thank a doctor!
At least with Ruby on Rails, that fifteen minutes is enough time to write a blog engine, a photo sharing site, and a social networking app. I kid!
You want the truthiness? You can't handle the truthiness!
At least with Ruby on Rails, that fifteen minutes is enough time to write a blog engine, a photo sharing site, and a social networking app. I kid!
Yeah, we need more of those.
Because he's not just a God of Java, but he's also a God of Ruby. He's up there with Gosling, Naughton, and Sheridon. He's up there with Matz and DHH.
It's fascinating how you can reach a "god of ruby" status by slapping together a slow web framework.
That's not entirely true; Charles Nutter (one of the subjects of TFA) has pointed out on several occasions particular features of the Ruby language that make it hard to make implementations that are both complete and correct and also quick.
Still, the degree to which the "Ruby is slow" thing is about the implementation (and particularly the pre-1.9 CRuby implementation) is underlined by how much faster Ruby 1.9 and JRuby are than Ruby 1.8.x.
Sounds like a combination of Rails requiring separate Ruby processes and JRuby normally using a separate JVM per invocation; JRuby 1.3.0, though, includes Nailgun integration so that it is easier to avoid using a separate JVM per jruby invocation.
JRuby is a faliure for ME and for my project. This doesn't make it a failure for him and his project.
I looked it over, as a part of looking Java over. It's not a good fit. Doesn't mean it's not the right answer to some other problem. (OTOH, I'm not certain why JRuby is better than Groovy or Jython. My guess it that it would have lots to do with re-using existing code.)
If you're going to be using ANY of those, all time critical portions will need to be written in Java. No surprise there. It's like Ruby and C, only the interfacing is easier, and the result isn't quite as fast.
Personally I looked them all over and chose D (Digital Mars D). It's weakness is that it doesn't have many libraries. But it can interface to C libraries and, slightly, with C++ libraries. (OK, I'm using the beta version, D2.x.) It's not quite as fast as C, but it has built-in garbage collection, and it has an object model sort of similar to Python's. For my project that's the best fit I've found. Yours is likely to be different. Maybe you should chose Ruby, or Python, or C, or C++, or LISP, or Ada, or ...well, if you get much beyond that, I won't understand what features of the language make it desirable. I don't know Haskell, Clean, Mozart, OCaML, etc. Assembler...well, if that's the best language you're working closer to the metal than I would choose to work. But sometimes it's the right answer.
Don't diss a language just because it isn't right for what you're doing right now.
I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
JVM is slow? Really?
http://blogs.oracle.com/ohrstrom/2009/05/pulling_a_machine_code_rabbit.html
Good to know there are smart people out there. SUN went downhill a number of years ago when McNealy was still jaw flapping about how badly Microsoft sucked and how the network was the computer and we'd make the world a better place. Then CPU failures helped crash a few thousand businesses...the dotcom bust came and well the rest is over $300,000 in 2002 money stock options down the tubes. Oracle should have let SUN squander and then bought up the pieces at a garage sale. Good to see these guys jump ship and make sure that JRuby lives on after the fact. I wish them the best of luck and admire them for their chutzpah. Michael Murdock, CEO DocMurdock.com (Formerly SUN's WESTERN AREA AIC for StarCat/StarKitty) 1998-2002
Nobody was working on the jruby package, so it's getting cut from Fedora 12. Anybody at EngineYard want to pick up the ball?
My God, it's Full of Source!
OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
What's this shit about slashdot not letting you read the bulk of the comments if you're not logged it. I take the title back, I haven't been away long enough.