Westboro Baptist Church Gets In the Music Game

The people who picketed the funerals of dead soldiers and brought you such charming websites as "God Hates Fags" are getting into the music business with their single, "Whorish Face." The parody of the Lady Gaga hit "Poker Face" was written by Westboro Pastor Fred Phelps' granddaughter Megan Phelps-Roper. With all the trouble these people have caused already do they really want to face the fury of Weird Al?

Comments

Why?

[Profane MuthaFucka]

Why do we give these people the time of day?

Re:Why?

[Locke2005]

This is Amerika, where you are entitled to your beliefs, no matter how unenlightened they may be, as long as you don't hurt anyone else. Personally, I feel that protesting at funerals DOES hurt innocent people, and that the best way to deal with these these "latents" is to show up at their rallies and engage in every sort of Public Display of Affection allowed by law in front of them, all the while smiling and telling them "we love you, brother!"

Re:Why?

[conureman]

These guys may hang with the Lunatic Fringe, but they know what to say to get to their target audience. And the News seems to really cater to the Fringe Fans, heck, I've gone to watch a wildfire myself.

Re:Why?

[calmofthestorm]

Eh as much as I hate these people, I'm glad to see them still alive and hating. As long as they get to spread their hateful rhetoric, I can be quite sure no one is going to threaten my free speech. The oppression always comes at the fringes first.

Re:Why?

[Kell Bengal]

Also, the lunatic fringe is helpful in innoculating the rest of us from the related, milder forms of crazy.

Re:Why?

[Rob the Bold]

This is Amerika, where you are entitled to your beliefs, no matter how unenlightened they may be, as long as you don't hurt anyone else. Personally, I feel that protesting at funerals DOES hurt innocent people, and that the best way to deal with these these "latents" is to show up at their rallies and engage in every sort of Public Display of Affection allowed by law in front of them, all the while smiling and telling them "we love you, brother!"

They don't just protest. A friend of mine was driving with his sister when he came across a bunch of Westboro protesters. His sister leaned out the car window and shouted a suggestion to them (no, not that, just to "go home to mommy"). Weeks later, he got a call from a police department on the other side of town. His car had been reported as causing a hit-and-run accident. The cops investigated and found the allegation bogus. The Phelpsies had filed a false police report to get back at their "enemy", causing a little anxiety and irritation and criminally wasting public resources at the same time.

Why not?

[MonsterTrimble]

Because we need someone to look crazier than Scientology & PETA?

Not the first time.

[JoshuaZ]

They've made parodies before. For example, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_U4xrutRgs entitied "God Hates the World" which is a parody of a Michael Jackson song. One thing that is fascinating about this sort of thing is how most cults are completely removed from the surrounding culture. In the case of Westboro Baptist they are surprisingly knowledgeable about the general popular culture.

Re:Not the first time.

[sznupi]

...and yet they are still somewhat detached, don't you agree?

Nothing new or unexpected really, every new cult (also those we call major religions now) is like that at the beginning.

Re:Not the first time.

[conureman]

I've seen a little cult action up-close, and the Leadership has always tried to act VERY hip. I remember sitting down with Kristina Seher and "restoring" some old Rock Standards [Think "Weird Pat" Robertson doing The Beatles], up at Boonville. It helps to indoctrinate folks if you get 'em singing.

God hates the world?

[operagost]

No. John 3:16 "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

Maybe they really want Romans 12:2 "Do not conform any longer to the pattern of this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. Then you will be able to test and approve what God's will is--his good, pleasing and perfect will."
I suppose they get their theology from 1 John 2... but God's asking us not to love the world. That's not the same as him not loving the world. After all, he created it. You'd think they'd see themselves in verses 18 and 19.

Re:God hates the world?

[Anonymous Coward]

You're assuming they have any interest in theology besides the "God Hates Fags" part. Unfortunately, they are American evangelical Christians, so the believe all the bits of the Bible that tell you who to hate are the literal truth, and the "love your neighbor" bits are commie socialist pinko propaganda inserted by "the librels" (spelled phonetically...)

They've even got their own "Conservative Bible", because apparently the KJV was just too nice.

Re:God hates the world?

[Locke2005]

Unfortunately, there is enough ambiguous content in the bible that you can get almost any interpretation you want out of it, if you go into it with already strongly held beliefs and an intent to do so.

Personally, I believe God Loves Homosexuals (that's we he made so many of them!) and that Jesus, who was known for hanging out with and comforting the outcasts of society, would have had no problem with embracing someone whose sexual preferences were in the minority. Although the bible contains several proscriptions on homosexual behavior, the usual example cited (Sodom & Gomorrah) is a bad one, since these cities were destroyed for allowing the practice of homosexual rape, not mere homosexuality.

Re:God hates the world?

[operagost]

Unfortunately, there is enough ambiguous content in the bible that you can get almost any interpretation you want out of it, if you go into it with already strongly held beliefs and an intent to do so.

I just quoted examples that aren't.

I won't comment on your second argument, other than to say that in order to accept it you must accept that homosexuality is a natural state, like skin color or being deaf. If you consider homosexuality a chosen behavior (like drug abuse), then it's flawed.

Re:God hates the world?

[operagost]

By rolling them in with all evangelical Christians, you're being closed-minded as well.

Re:God hates the world?

[clarkn0va]

And furthermore, there is a difference between hating a person and hating their actions, hence the saying "love the sinner, hate the sin". I strongly disagree with the statement "God hates fags", while maintaining that the bible's condemnation of homosexual acts is ever relevant.

Re:God hates the world?

[dsavi]

If you look in the Bible as you have done you will find that the whole deal is incredibly unbiblical. Their whole system works on provocation, something that was not taught in the Bible, as stated in a post before this they made their own "Conservative Bible" (The Bible explicitly condemns adding or taking anything away from the Bible), and then there's their horrible misconceptions about hate. The list goes on.

Re:God hates the world?

[Anonymous Coward]

I feel the need to amend your comment slightly.

If you consider homosexuality a chosen behavior (like drug abuse), then you're an idiot.

One can choose to act on one's impulses, but one cannot choose who one is physically attracted to. I'm straight. I couldn't just choose to start being attracted to men. It's simply not possible, because I'm just not.

If you think it's a choice, then maybe you're just bisexual and haven't figured that out yet.

Re:God hates the world?

[Anonymous Coward]

As long as I have been aware of such opinions and interpretations of Christian faith such as these evangelicals have, I have wondered how they have managed to disregard the teachings about children and the sermon of the mountain (how was it again called) of Jesus. Of course, they would naturally disregard anything that condemns their behaviour even if Jesus himself had said it.

Re:God hates the world?

[Anonymous Coward]

Homosexuality is a naturally occurring behavior. If you believe it is not, please explain the documented cases of homosexuality in non-human animals.

Re:God hates the world?

[anglophobe_0]

Sodom and Gomorrah is, I suppose, the passage of choice for those who want to convince you that God is about to fry you for disobedience of His law, but it's by far not the only place in the Bible that addresses homosexual behavior. Read it with an open mind, and I believe it's obvious (although by no means a major theme) that homosexual behavior is outside of God's will (and therefore sin - missing the mark).

But, like I mentioned, homosexuality is not a major theme of scripture. The Bible has WAY more to say against adultery than against homosexuality as such. I think that one of the major failures of modern Christianity is the attempt to place sins in tiers, something the Bible doesn't do. As far as your standing with God goes, if you never committed any sin but telling a white lie, you would have fallen short, and thus deserved Hell. If you committed atrocities that would make Hitler, Stalin and Mao seem like boy scouts, you would have fallen short, and thus deserved Hell. Either way, the point of the Bible (and Christianity) is that Jesus' death on the cross squared up your accounts, and you now benefit from Jesus Christ living up to God's will. If you have faith in Him, it doesn't matter whether you're an occasional liar, a murderer, a thief, an adulterer (or someone who lusts in your heart), or a homosexual, or all of the above - you now have a good standing before God.

Homosexuality is, according to the Bible, a sin, but no worse of a sin than any other. Too many Christians have let their personal distaste for homosexuality prevent them from seeing homosexuals the way God does - as His wonderful creations who need a healthy relationship with Him.

On a non-theological front, I do believe that different wrongdoings should be in tiers. Murder is WAY worse than lying, and genocide is probably worse than a single murder. On this scale, I would not label homosexuality as any sort of wrongdoing, nor would I say it's wrong to be a furry or etcetera.

P.S. I don't even think you have to quit homosexuality to become a Christian...I just think it's highly likely you'll want to afterward. Also, don't get me started on how silly I think it is for people to try and promote Christianity through political means.

Re:God hates the world?

[clone53421]

If all naturally occurring behaviors are perfectly acceptable ways to behave on the basis that they are naturally occurring, please explain the documented cases of murder, cannibalism, rape, incest, etc. in non-human animals.

Re:God hates the world?

[clone53421]

The difference may be in the definition of “world”. On the one hand, God loves the “world”, i.e. people, and we are to love our neighbours, etc. On the other hand, 1 Jn 2:15-16 says that we should not love the “world”, then goes on to clarify that it is referring to certain aspects of civilization, not the people:

15Do not love the world or anything in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him. 16For everything in the world—the cravings of sinful man, the lust of his eyes and the boasting of what he has and does—comes not from the Father but from the world.

Of course, being an inflammatory ass for the sake of making a point is probably not an effective evangelism technique. Somebody needs to explain that to these people...

Re:God hates the world?

[hairyfeet]

And for those that think the above poster is kidding? Well here is the conservative bible project. I don't know which is worse, a group deciding the bible is too nice, or that they are using a Wiki to condense the hate down to nuclear bomb proportions.

And OT, but WTF was /. editors thinking when they came up with Idle? This has got to be the most fucked up web page and comment box I've ever seen, and I used to hang out at Geocities.

Re:God hates the world?

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes God loves homosexuals. Also he loves murderers and NAMBLA members and heroin addicts and also Westboro-type nuts. Not because he "made" them that way (we have free will after all), but because he's kind. Even to depraved people like us.

Sodom and Gomorrah feature attempted homosexual pack rape. So did another city in the Bible - Gibeah. And what did happen in Gibeah eventually was heterosexual pack rape and murder of a man's wife. Both cities were destroyed - Sodom and Gomorroh by God directly, and Gibeah by the tribes of Israel. These stories indicates a fearful symmetry of God's wrath on sin.

However, we don't have to infer too much from the fate of Sodom. The Old Testament is explicit - homosexual relations between consenting adults are immoral and the consequence being death by stoning. Ditto for adultery. Ditto for bestiality. The New Testaments commands us to withhold judgement but is even more explicit about the sinfulness of homosexuality. It even mentions lesbianism (for the first time in the Bible) explicitly immoral. (By the way, "judgement" here does not mean "opinion" but 'real' judgement ... as in "a judge with power to punish")

Re:God hates the world?

[Anonymous Coward]

Sure. NAMBLA members claim their particular predilictions are 'naturally occuring' too. They even refer you to existing documentation on pedastry in ancient cultures.

Please explain why such 'naturally occuring' behavior is wrong if homosexuality is not wrong.

Coming back to your question: The Bible states that the entire creation now "groans" under the burden of sin. Forget about animal homosexuality - the orignal sinless world that God created before the Fall had no killing. Even animals we now regard as carnivorous only ate herbs. "And to every beast of the earth,... I have given every green herb for meat" -- Genesis 1:30

Re:God hates the world?

[Bakkster]

But let's be fair, calling the WBC 'Christians' is being very loose with the term. 'Bible thumper' is more accurate, since they care only about using the Bible to further their agenda, rather than what it (or eponymously, Christ) actually says. Just like how terrorists misquote the Qur'an, even though the Islam religion is against everything they proclaim.

Gotta love these fake Christians

[Anonymous Coward]

The sad thing about this is that people lump this lot in with real Christians.

For the record, you will find that God hates homosexuality but loves the people

Re:Gotta love these fake Christians

[Anonymous Coward]

For the record, you will find that God hates homosexuality but loves the people

According to whom? Certainly not according to the Bible. According to Proverbs 6:16-19, there are six things God hates, and homosexuality is not one of them:

There are six things the LORD hates, seven that are detestable to him: haughty eyes, a lying tongue, hands that shed innocent blood, a heart that devises wicked schemes, feet that are quick to rush into evil, a false witness who pours out lies and a man who stirs up dissension among brothers.

Re:Gotta love these fake Christians

[clone53421]

Note the lack of the word “only”. That list is not comprehensive.

Re:Gotta love these fake Christians

[Anonymous Coward]

Note the lack of the word “only”. That list is not comprehensive.

Is the Bible as a whole comprehensive? Because that list is the only reference in the entire Bible to anything that God hates. Yet somehow people think they can decide what God hates, even though the only reference to God hating anything at all fails to mention it.

By your logic, I can argue that God hates puppies. Better yet, God hates you.

Re:Gotta love these fake Christians

[NonSequor]

For the record, you will find that God hates homosexuality but loves the people

According to whom? Certainly not according to the Bible. According to Proverbs 6:16-19, there are six things God hates, and homosexuality is not one of them:

There are six things the LORD hates, seven that are detestable to him: haughty eyes, a lying tongue, hands that shed innocent blood, a heart that devises wicked schemes, feet that are quick to rush into evil, a false witness who pours out lies and a man who stirs up dissension among brothers.

That's a really good list.

I tend to think that Leviticus shouldn't be included in Christian canon as it's largely concerned with the Jewish concept of ritual purity which is discarded in Christianity. I went to a good church as a child (although I didn't really believe back then) where the focus was on love and forgiveness and I don't think anyone ever read from Leviticus. In general, I think the idea of pinning down religion to a matter of ritual and binary compliance with a set of procedures is a bad idea and I see Jesus's teachings as railing against that view within the community of his time.

It's nice to see people around here talking about this civilly.

Re:Gotta love these fake Christians

[tomhudson]

For the record, you will find that God hates homosexuality but loves the people

Really? You wouldn't know it seeing how many gays are in positions of leadership in xian churches.

He must also love gossips and rumour-mongers, seeing as most fundie churches are SO busy telling everyone else how they should live or they're going to hell.

What next? Condemning transsexuals as "just men in dresses"? Or that divorced people can never remarry? Or that I'll go to hell for saying that i am absolutely convinced there is no possibility of god existing in this universe, and people who claim otherwise should put up or shit up?

And no, your book (which should be classified as hate literature) doesn't count as "proof", any more than Star Wars would prove the existence of "the force."

Re:Gotta love these fake Christians

[clone53421]

Wow, you UTTERLY fail. You can’t even properly do a word search to find references to the phrase “God hates” or similar?

Re:Gotta love these fake Christians

[Fujisawa Sensei]

For the record, you will find that God hates homosexuality but loves the people

According to whom? Certainly not according to the Bible. According to Proverbs 6:16-19, there are six things God hates, and homosexuality is not one of them:

There are six things the LORD hates, seven that are detestable to him: haughty eyes, a lying tongue, hands that shed innocent blood, a heart that devises wicked schemes, feet that are quick to rush into evil, a false witness who pours out lies and a man who stirs up dissension among brothers.

That's a really good list.

I tend to think that Leviticus shouldn't be included in Christian canon as it's largely concerned with the Jewish concept of ritual purity which is discarded in Christianity. I went to a good church as a child (although I didn't really believe back then) where the focus was on love and forgiveness and I don't think anyone ever read from Leviticus. In general, I think the idea of pinning down religion to a matter of ritual and binary compliance with a set of procedures is a bad idea and I see Jesus's teachings as railing against that view within the community of his time.

It's nice to see people around here talking about this civilly.

The Christians pick and choose which parts they think are canon depending on their mood. For instance they throw out the whole, kill anybody eating shellfish, but they want to keep the Ten Commandments.

Real Christians? Where?!

[sznupi]

For starters, being Christian would suggest following the basic teachings coming from Jesus of Nazareth. Eschewing material wealth is among the main ones. That eliminates 99% of supposed adherents.

More generally, building you church inside you as a spiritual concept and not as a wealthy organisation also seems to be one. Heck, and I can't exactly see how supporting any wars fits, too...

Re:Real Christians? Where?!

[Anonymous Coward]

I actually feel a little elated every time I see someone post with that sentiment. I catch so much hell for being a Christian because of what other people have done in its name.

Other fun misnomers:

"Thou shalt not kill" was supposed to be "thou shalt not murder", but was altered in translation. The bible never says anything about lethal force in self defense. As a corrolary, God directing his people to war was always a "this time" deal. Anyone invoking anything from the bible to justify a modern war is borderlining on blasphemy.

The bible says judgement is not for us to deal out, but at the same time we are to discern between what we personally view as acceptable and what should be looked down upon. There's a difference.

The Crusades were defensive conflicts started in response to the violent spread of Islam. What they became is a matter of debate, but the original unblackened purpose was preservation of life and culture. There are very strong parallels to our present war.

The pope only matters to Catholics. Seriously. I know this sounds obvious, but there seems to be some serious misconception on this topic. It's a Catholic thing.

Alchohol is not evil. Jesus himself produced a great quantity of good wine for a wedding. Lack of self control and the consequences that follow are what preachers should be shouting about.

And one last little nitpick: It drives me insane to see all the pictures of Jesus looking emasculated and wimpy and making limp-wristed gestures of sentimentality like some starving monk. Jesus was a carpenter. He made furniture and houses. With handtools. He was the middlepoint between lumberjack and engineer. I wanna see a picture of him wearing plaid with beef jerky in one hand and a protractor in the other.

Re:Real Christians? Where?!

[Anonymous Coward]

Jesus was a carpenter.

This is a common misconception. In truth, Jesus was the son of a carpenter (or the foster son of a carpenter). It is not clear what his actual profession was, if he ever had one. Most likely is that he was a rabbi.

The only reference to Jesus being a carpenter in the New Testament is this:

Mark 6:2-3

And when the sabbath day was come, he began to teach in the synagogue: and many hearing him were astonished, saying, From whence hath this man these things? and what wisdom is this which is given unto him, that even such mighty works are wrought by his hands?

Is not this the carpenter, the son of Mary, the brother of James, and Joses, and of Juda, and Simon?

The first verse mentions teaching in the synagogue, which carpenters don't generally do. The second verse calls him a carpenter, but other translations use the phrase "Is not this the son of the carpenter, the son of Mary". Also, the Greek version uses the word "tekton", which can be translated in a number of ways, including "poet" and "author".

Re:Real Christians? Where?!

[tomhudson]

Jesus was an unemployable bum, same as most of todays religious leaders couldn't hold a real job if their life depended on it. They're charity cases, con artists living off the proceeds of fleecing their flock.

Re:Real Christians? Where?!

[Anonymous Coward]

Jesus was a carpenter.

This is a common misconception. In truth, Jesus was the son of a carpenter (or the foster son of a carpenter). It is not clear what his actual profession was, if he ever had one. Most likely is that he was a rabbi.

The only reference to Jesus being a carpenter in the New Testament is this:

Mark 6:2-3

And when the sabbath day was come, he began to teach in the synagogue: and many hearing him were astonished, saying, From whence hath this man these things? and what wisdom is this which is given unto him, that even such mighty works are wrought by his hands?

Is not this the carpenter, the son of Mary, the brother of James, and Joses, and of Juda, and Simon?

The first verse mentions teaching in the synagogue, which carpenters don't generally do. The second verse calls him a carpenter, but other translations use the phrase "Is not this the son of the carpenter, the son of Mary". Also, the Greek version uses the word "tekton", which can be translated in a number of ways, including "poet" and "author".

I love it, you pick and choose the translation that you use. The KJ translation was made by people inspired by the God himself. There is no possibility for mistake, because God himself guided them.

To claim otherwise is to deny his omnipotence. Doubt your own faith before doubting the accuracy of the Bible.

Re:Real Christians? Where?!

[Fujisawa Sensei]

Jesus was a carpenter.

This is a common misconception. In truth, Jesus was the son of a carpenter (or the foster son of a carpenter). It is not clear what his actual profession was, if he ever had one. Most likely is that he was a rabbi.

The only reference to Jesus being a carpenter in the New Testament is this:

Mark 6:2-3

And when the sabbath day was come, he began to teach in the synagogue: and many hearing him were astonished, saying, From whence hath this man these things? and what wisdom is this which is given unto him, that even such mighty works are wrought by his hands?

Is not this the carpenter, the son of Mary, the brother of James, and Joses, and of Juda, and Simon?

The first verse mentions teaching in the synagogue, which carpenters don't generally do. The second verse calls him a carpenter, but other translations use the phrase "Is not this the son of the carpenter, the son of Mary". Also, the Greek version uses the word "tekton", which can be translated in a number of ways, including "poet" and "author".

If he were a rabbi, a poet, or an auther, where his writings?

In practise, yeah

[sznupi]

Just look around you (and a little further than your comfy backyard), see what kind of world he supposedly created.

Re:In practise, yeah

[operagost]

He didn't create most of the crap as I see it around me.

Re:In practise, yeah

[sznupi]

Who then?...

Re:In practise, yeah

[vxice]

Thats right he only created what was good. Someone else created the bad stuff right? Convenient that neither are available for comment but they are there trust me. Just like we trusted the priests that Zeus and his lot controlled everything. Although in their defense they didn't even pretend like the gods liked everyone and instead just had petty little playground fights between each other.

Re:In practise, yeah

[tomhudson]

So god is NOT sovereign? We kind of figured that out already, but thanks for agreeing.

It's their right to be...

[MZeora]

I'm the last person to stick up for them, but they're just doing what they think is right. Of course I think they should be added on to the list of terrorists. I don't care about their beliefs and I don't agree with their morals and what they do. They teach their children to hate the homosexual which for all we know may be just as natural as skin colour. Extremists in all forms are dangerous. It's where we draw those lines are important. All peoples have the right to believe what ever they want. It's not their right to shove it down my throat and expect me to like it. From my studies Christianity (originally) taught that you have to learn to seperate yourself from the rest of the world to attain "salvation" reading St. Augustine and all that (long before the bible was cannonised). From what I've read. The teachings of Jesus is fine and is a good ethical code, but the entire bible needs to be taken with a massive grain of salt for it to be palpable to me. Theses nut cases have pretty much thrown 90% of Jesus's teachings out. Calling them real Christians is like calling Al-Queda real Muslims. It's offensive to those who actually use their faith in a positive well mannered way. Of course, I'm a mixed bag of beliefs, I think I'm best summed as a Spiritual Humanist, but maybe that because I get what Caul Sagan was saying.

Re:It's their right to be...

[Anonymous Coward]

Calling them real Christians is like calling Al-Queda real Muslims. It's offensive to those who actually use their faith in a positive well mannered way.

That quote should be modded +5.

Re:It's their right to be...

[Nathrael]

Calling them real Christians is like calling Al-Queda real Muslims. It's offensive to those who actually use their faith in a positive well mannered way.

No true Scotsman, eh? I love how people keep rejecting the idea that there are jerks and saints in pretty much *any* organization out there...

Re:It's their right to be...

[clone53421]

No true Scotsman isn’t always a logical fallacy. Sometimes it’s a statement of fact.

For instance, no true atheist believes in god.

Dangerous position

[geek2k5]

I do hope that the Westboro people realize that they are putting themselves in a dangerous position by their protests. One of these years they may get on the bad side of people who have guns and know how to use them.

Re:Dangerous position

[Kell Bengal]

Given their tendency to picket soldier's funerals, I'm glad the Patriot Guard Riders are level-headed. Nothing says "America Disagrees With You" like 100 Harley riders carrying flags standing between you and the people you're trying to bother. I'm not an American, but people like the PGR make me think that the spirit that made that country great still lives on.

Re:Dangerous position

[v1]

Even though they're loaded with blanks, it would be quite amusing to see where someone getting a 21 gun salute, for the soldiers suddenly all swing and take aim at the picketers and make them piss themselves while scattering as the guards shot at them...

How Charming

[woody.jesus]

Such a charming display of simple faith ... her daddy is her preacher, you know, and I'm sure that she spends all her days desperately trying to make da-da happy. But daddy is stern like the patriarchs of old, and somehow she's never quite good enough. So it's over the knee and down with the panties .... whap! whap! whap! ... "You're not good enough for daddy-god!!" ... spank! spank! spank! ... "You'll have to do better if you want to make daddy-god happy!" whap! whap! ... "now get down on your knees girl, mouth opened in PRAYER for the holy communilinugus!! And prepare to recieve the blessing of the LORD, even though he hates you!"