BYO Linux Router To Australia's Fibre Network

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BYO Linux Router To Australia's Fibre Network

Posted by timothy on Sunday May 23, 2010 @07:38PM from the please-live-near-the-coast dept.

An anonymous reader writes "Run a Linux router to connect your ADSL service but worried about what will happen when the Australian Government rolls out fibre broadband to your house or business? Worry no more. It turns out that customers on Australia's new National Broadband Network will be able to run their own homebrew Linux router to connect to the network and route traffic any way they please."

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What's the story? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-23 19:43 · Score: 2, Insightful

So, when someone brings a new network connection to your house, via a standard ethernet cable, you'll be allowed to connect a device of your choosing to the end? Socking. This makes the frontpage of slashdot now?
1. Re:What's the story? by Techman83 · 2010-05-23 19:54 · Score: 3, Informative
  
  I know a few the tech support guys at my Provider, they're used to me sending logs from my BSD based firewall. A fair percentage of Modem/Routers are linux based anyway. The only real difference here is the termination is no longer a modem provided by the customer. You'll still need something that talks PPPoE to authenticate to the network, be it a hardware based router or a plethora of software based distro
  
  --
  # cat /dev/mem | strings | grep -i cat
  Damn, my RAM is full of cats. MEOW!!
2. Re:What's the story? by Thanshin · 2010-05-23 19:55 · Score: 0
  
  you'll be allowed to connect a device of your choosing to the end? Socking.
  
  I am socked, I tell you. Socked!
  Tonight at 11, "Connecting your fridge to australian intertubes. What will be the minimum legal size for chicken breasts?".
3. Re:What's the story? by WarJolt · 2010-05-23 20:00 · Score: 1, Informative
  
  my dd-wrt router does pppoe. Who wants a power hungry diy router when cheap and cheerful works well too?
4. Re:What's the story? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-23 20:01 · Score: 1, Funny
  
  I don't get it... is this a pun on proxies?
5. Re:What's the story? by mjwx · 2010-05-23 20:04 · Score: 4, Funny
  
  Tonight at 11, "Connecting your fridge to australian intertubes. What will be the minimum legal size for chicken breasts?".
  Dont laugh, I've already soldered an RJ45 connection to the iron. The cat is next.
  
  --
  Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
6. Re:What's the story? by Thanshin · 2010-05-23 20:07 · Score: 5, Funny
  
  Dont laugh, I've already soldered an RJ45 connection to the iron. The cat is next.
  I think soldering an RJ45 to your cat will probably kill it.
  I case I misunderstood you, ironing your cat will also kill it.
7. Re:What's the story? by Techman83 · 2010-05-23 20:07 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  Well if you use an atom it's not _that_ power hungry and those little routers just don't have the memory/performance.
  
  --
  # cat /dev/mem | strings | grep -i cat
  Damn, my RAM is full of cats. MEOW!!
8. Re:What's the story? by jrumney · 2010-05-23 20:23 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  If you're running any servers, you have the power hungry box anyway.
9. Re:What's the story? by TheThiefMaster · 2010-05-23 20:24 · Score: 3, Interesting
  
  If anyone wants to build their own router and is concerned about power usage, size, heat or noise (i.e. doesn't want to use an old desktop) I would recommend them to look into mini-itx systems. The power supplies for an entire typical mini-itx are rated lower than the cpu alone requires in a desktop. They can be made not only fanless, but completely moving-parts-free. And best of all, they're not much larger than the router you'd be replacing!
  It's not cheap though, unfortunately.
10. Re:What's the story? by rjch · 2010-05-23 20:32 · Score: 4, Funny
  
  Dont laugh, I've already soldered an RJ45 connection to the iron. The cat is next.
  I think soldering an RJ45 to your cat will probably kill it.
  Yeah, RJ45 connectors are plastic and will melt easily. Much better just to crimp it to the cat. Just make sure you get out of the way very quickly afterwards.
11. Re:What's the story? by jimicus · 2010-05-23 20:39 · Score: 4, Funny
  
  I think soldering anything to a cat puts the solderer at greater risk than the solderee.
12. Re:What's the story? by spec8472 · 2010-05-23 20:50 · Score: 1
  
  All chicken breasts will need to be appropriately covered before being allowed on the intertubes.
  Naked chicken breasts will be blocked unless an appropriate 'Proof of Age' mechanism is in place.
  Anyone having pictures of naked chicken breasts from a chicken under the age of 18 will be reported to the AFP.
13. Re:What's the story? by dangitman · 2010-05-23 20:52 · Score: 4, Funny
  
  Dont laugh, I've already soldered an RJ45 connection to the iron. The cat is next.
  Are you using CAT-5e or CAT-6?
  
  --
  ... and then they built the supercollider.
14. Re:What's the story? by MichaelSmith · 2010-05-23 21:05 · Score: 5, Funny
  
  We had this pot belly stove in the corner of the living room and during the summer the cat loved to use it to survey the room at eye level but when we used it for the first time in the autumn there was this horrible screech and the cat rocketed across the living room, into the kitchen and stopped, buffing, under the kitchen table.
  The treatment for burns is immediate immersion in cold water and fortunately the bath was half full so I picked up the cat and started to "immerse" the patient in the water. I tell you, the resulting scratches lasted months.
  
  --
  http://michaelsmith.id.au
15. Re:What's the story? by Runaway1956 · 2010-05-23 21:39 · Score: 1, Offtopic
  
  Well, since we are all way off topic anyway - my brother in law always bragged about his welding skills. He SAID he could weld a cat's ass to a pine board. The man never demonstrated that ability, but I pictured the scene in my mind every time I heard him bragging. I never got beyond the part where he might choose to attach his leads to a semi-conductive cat or a non-conductive pine board. Either he's just another dumb redneck, or he's a HELL OF A LOT smarter than I am! ;^)
  
  --
  "Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
16. Re:What's the story? by AK+Marc · 2010-05-23 21:42 · Score: 1
  
  Many FTTH terminate in a proprietary router. DSL connections require a router capable of that protocol. This connection is regular Ethernet that you can plug any capable router or computer into. No need for a FTTH router provided by the telco, no need for an ADSL router. I expect he was comparing it to the ADSL it's replacing. No more need for the specialized routers. Not important news, but interesting nonetheless.
  
  --
  Learn to love Alaska
17. Re:What's the story? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-23 22:12 · Score: 0
  
  You won't be so smug when your puny SOC has been subjected to a couple dozen megabits per second. You won't even need to use a VPN to make your router the bottleneck.
18. Re:What's the story? by yakumo.unr · 2010-05-23 22:28 · Score: 1
  
  Don't have the memory/performance to do what exactly?
  The Buffalo routers that come with ddwrt pre-installed now, like the WZR-HP-G300NH, are great, USB for NAS, the works.
19. Re:What's the story? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-23 22:58 · Score: 0
  
  They could also look into those Plug Computers. Low power Linux computer size of a power brick at around $99. They have upped the specs to 1.2GHz ARM recently.
  http://www.plugcomputer.org/
20. Re:What's the story? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-23 23:12 · Score: 0
  
  this thread reminds me of the "hamster-duct-tape" news group.
  I was young back then, thanks!
21. Re:What's the story? by ickleberry · 2010-05-23 23:13 · Score: 1
  
  My Pico ITX server uses only 15w, the router uses a similar amount. I was thinking if I could get a cheap USB-powered ADSL modem and Wifi dongle for it I could get rid of the router and maybe save about 30e worth of electricity a year. Nobody wants USB DSL modems and you'd almost get a wifi dongle for free on a box of matches these days so it would pay for itself within about 3 months. The only problem is I'd still need a switch and if I got one of those it wouldn't save me anything.
22. Re:What's the story? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-23 23:15 · Score: 0
  
  I call BS.
  Please, link to any reference for a FTTH that has a proprietary premises interface. Sure, the PHY is probably tuned for the telco, but nobody is going to carry anything but Ethernet frames for IP service. They would be losing out on the entire industry's economies of scale.
  Take it somewhere else.
23. Re:What's the story? by profplump · 2010-05-24 00:47 · Score: 1
  
  Doesn't have the memory/performance to handle a large number of TCP connections, IPSec, gigabit, more than a couple of isolated Ethernet interfaces, etc. There are lots of reasons that a 200 MHz CPU with 8 MB of RAM might not be enough router. They don't necessarily apply to every network or user, but it's absurd to suggest that no such situation exists on home networks.
24. Re:What's the story? by TheThiefMaster · 2010-05-24 01:23 · Score: 1
  
  They only have one network socket, you'd need to add one, or use a usb adsl/cable modem, and then get it to work with linux.
  I loved this bit from the website:
  
  What are typical applications for a plug computer ?
  The application range is bounded only by the imagination of the developer community. Here are some typical use cases:
  Compact, high performance home file server for home computers.
  Multimedia server for DLNA-enabled players, such as the Sony PS3.
  Web proxy, enabling fast, cached access to your favorite web sites.
  Storage of home video surveillance streams.
  Automate downloads and uploads to your favorite photo sharing web site.
  Only if you add external storage...
  Apparently without external storage, the plug's only use is "and more!"
25. Re:What's the story? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-24 01:38 · Score: 0
  
  BitTorrent mainly.
  When you have about 500 incoming/outgoing connections, those cheapass off the shelf routers run out of RAM for the NAT tables, your web browser then becomes unable to load new websites, the DNS server on the modem crashes and you have to go reboot it.
  Oh, and they also don't have IPv6 though that's a software problem rather than hardware.
26. Re:What's the story? by Bert64 · 2010-05-24 01:54 · Score: 1
  
  Try a guruplug, 2 gigabit ethernet ports, 512mb ram, 1.2ghz arm cpu, boots from flash... perfect for a small router and they're quite cheap.
  
  --
  http://spamdecoy.net - free throwaway anonymous email - avoid spam!
27. Re:What's the story? by drsmithy · 2010-05-24 02:21 · Score: 1
  
  They only have one network socket, you'd need to add one, or use a usb adsl/cable modem, and then get it to work with linux.
  Or you can used tagged vlans and a switch supporting same (pretty cheap these days).
28. Re:What's the story? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-24 02:40 · Score: 0
  
  I guess now I know why it called Catx cable; where x = 5/5e/6...but what do the numbers mean? The number of lives left in the cat after you are done?
29. Re:What's the story? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-24 03:12 · Score: 0
  
  I am wondering if I can get gigabit though a maine coon.
30. Re:What's the story? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-24 03:18 · Score: 0
  
  small chicken breasts are banned entirely
31. Re:What's the story? by cynyr · 2010-05-24 03:21 · Score: 1
  
  400+ connections, WIFI with WPA2 streaming of 1.5Mbps video, QoS for the aforementioned, plus running a http filter for only a few of the ports, will they work with say, FIOS at full speed? yep, USB will provide enough speed to saturate gigabit, or not.
  it's not a huge cost difference to move to a mini-itx via, looks like $350 case/psu/harddrive, 4 GbE, wireless N, 64bit X86 CPU, 512MB ram, etc. That will draw 5-10W(whole board not just the CPU) at full tilt. Now the advantage here is that you can run whatever you would like on it. Granted a real switch for the internal net, and a good router may work just as well.
  
  --
  All of the above was encrypted with a Quad ROT-13 method. Unauthorized decryption is in violation of the DMCA.
32. Re:What's the story? by Cimexus · 2010-05-24 03:37 · Score: 1
  
  I have to agree. How is this news? Here in Australia like every freaking where else, we can connect any router we want to our connections now. Why on earth would anyone think this would change when the NBN rolls out? O.o
33. Re:What's the story? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-24 05:44 · Score: 0
  
  Oh, and they also don't have IPv6 though that's a software problem rather than hardware.
  Because IPv6 is so readily available for homer users?
34. Re:What's the story? by AK+Marc · 2010-05-24 07:39 · Score: 1
  
  I did a fed proposal for FTTH. Because of the bundling of telephone and TV and Internet, the demarc was a box outside the house that "split" the FTTH for TV, VoIP, and Internet. So, there was a router at every house for that purpose. It is trivial to set that router to act like a home router (public outside IP, private inside IP, serving DHCP). In fact, I'd say that would be easier than serving up a /30 public to the inside (certainly more IP efficient in a time when IPs are running low). But, since IP addressing wasn't part of the bid, I didn't get that far. I imagine the bean-counters would be leaning towards handing out private addresses like our DSL routers do by default. So I don't know any FTTH service that doesn't operate in the manner I describe, so look up anything made anywhere. As for how it's configured, that's up to the carrier.
  
  --
  Learn to love Alaska
35. Re:What's the story? by cmdotter · 2010-05-24 13:17 · Score: 1
  
  Is this a bad thing? Or that we will be lamenting the loss of curiosity?
36. Re:What's the story? by aiht · 2010-05-24 14:58 · Score: 1
  
  My ISP (Internode) offers home user access to native IPv6.
  If I could get my router to do it, I would - just so I can play with IPv6, not because I need it.
37. Re:What's the story? by dave87656 · 2010-05-24 16:16 · Score: 1
  
  The fact that it will continue to be a standard ethernet cable connection rather than a specialized modem/router connection to fiber hardware it what is news.
Huh? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-23 19:45 · Score: 0

Um, what are you guys smoking? We can already do that now on our existing ADSL infrastructure.
1. Re:Huh? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-23 19:47 · Score: 1, Insightful
  
  But how about on Australian Filtered fiber?
2. Re:Huh? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-23 21:21 · Score: 1, Interesting
  
  How is changing your router going to get around filters? It's ISP based, the outgoing routes are going to be filtered anyway.
3. Re:Huh? by jonwil · 2010-05-24 17:45 · Score: 1
  
  The point of TFA is to explain that you will get an Ethernet jack as the end of the connection and that you dont need an expensive proprietary "router" that supports Fiber just to plug into the Fiber network. The connection to the fiber will be an ONT. Whether the ONT will be an IP device or just a passive device that handles the network layer isn't clear.
Kewl by petejk2 · 2010-05-23 19:46 · Score: 1

Awesome bunnies!
As one would expect nowadays, but ... by wilfie · 2010-05-23 19:52 · Score: 4, Informative

Virgin in the UK used to refuse support until you connected a Mac or Windows box directly. Routers were 'not supported'.
1. Re:As one would expect nowadays, but ... by Zontar+The+Mindless · 2010-05-23 20:05 · Score: 3, Informative
  
  Telstra used to have the same requirement. IIRC, you couldn't get online at all except by using their crappy connect-ware on a Windows box (and cloning the MAC address to your router didn't work).
  I was sooo glad when I moved into an area where I could get service from Internode -- "If it speaks TCP/IP and it works for you, it works for us, too." Heaven.
  So, yes, this is news.
  
  --
  Il n'y a pas de Planet B.
2. Re:As one would expect nowadays, but ... by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-23 20:38 · Score: 0
  
  I have a Motorola Cable modem as provided by Optus, and I can plug an router of my choice into the RJ45 jack on the back.
  The technican even said I could ring up and give them the MAC address to be able to use my own Cable router, but I haven't needed to do that yet.
3. Re:As one would expect nowadays, but ... by andr00oo · 2010-05-23 20:40 · Score: 1
  
  Virgin in the UK used to refuse support until you connected a Mac or Windows box directly. Routers were 'not supported'.
  UK Virgin doesn't support routers (pron: rooters) Got it.
4. Re:As one would expect nowadays, but ... by AK+Marc · 2010-05-23 21:25 · Score: 1
  
  AT&T (known as SBC or Southwestern Bell at the time) required Windows back in 1998 or so for their DSL. Or, more accurately, they required PPPoE before it was built into commodity routers and only supplied Windows disks with their crappy PPPoE software. At least for the area I was being served. The constant PPPoE drops and about 12 months of complaints and a complaint to the FCC later, they managed to give me a DHCP address so I didn't have to do PPPoE anymore.
  
  --
  Learn to love Alaska
5. Re:As one would expect nowadays, but ... by mikael_j · 2010-05-23 21:28 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  I was sooo glad when I moved into an area where I could get service from Internode -- "If it speaks TCP/IP and it works for you, it works for us, too." Heaven.
  The downside to policies like that is of course obvious if you've ever worked tech support for an ISP, you get some pretty scary setups that people are trying to bring online. I really didn't mind the truly insane stuff like the guys with 15 year old Amiga towers running some binary hacked version of AmigaOS and various hacked together pieces of hardware, at least those guys knew what they were doing (even if their hardware and software did strange things), it was the guy running Mac OS 9 with IE5 or Win95 OSR2 with Netscape 4.x that hurt, because while the former guys were well aware of just how crazy they were the latter group tended to fly into rants about how their 30 year old car still ran like a charm so why wouldn't a ten year old computer work as well as a new one (to those about to tell me that getting OS 9 or Win95 online really isn't that hard, well no, it isn't, not if you're at the machine, it's got all the necessary drivers and a somewhat fresh operating system install, if you're trying to guide someone who hates computers with a vengeance over the phone and he's using a computer that's been mismanaged since the first day he owned it, yeah, good luck with that).
  
  --
  Greylisting is to SMTP as NAT is to IPv4
6. Re:As one would expect nowadays, but ... by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-23 21:57 · Score: 0
  
  When telstra first started adsl only windows 95 and windows 98 were supported. The installers would refuse to install if presented with anything less. Even windows nt would cause them to run resulting in no installed Internet.
7. Re:As one would expect nowadays, but ... by c0lo · 2010-05-23 22:49 · Score: 1
  
  Virgin in the UK used to refuse support until you connected a Mac or Windows box directly. Routers were 'not supported'.
  From which I understood: the only virgin in the UK is soooo kinky
  
  --
  Questions raise, answers kill. Raise questions to stay alive.
8. Re:As one would expect nowadays, but ... by Gonoff · 2010-05-23 22:55 · Score: 1
  
  They don't care what I plug into it as long as there is only 1 mac address. In fact, I know people who have recently set up with them. They got nice new Netgear wireless routers in the bundle.
  It would be sensible sometimes when fixing problems to connect the PC directly. This would help rule out some causes.
  
  --
  I'll see your Constitution and raise you a Queen.
9. Re:As one would expect nowadays, but ... by Skapare · 2010-05-23 22:59 · Score: 1
  
  Comcast tried to pull that on me when I was getting it installed. I just told them "all I have is wireless so there is no way I can connect direct". Then they said "then you'll need to get a wireless router". I said "done". I didn't tell them the router ran Linux.
  
  --
  now we need to go OSS in diesel cars
10. Re:As one would expect nowadays, but ... by jo_ham · 2010-05-23 23:25 · Score: 1
  
  I'm using Virgin in the UK right now, and that is no longer the case. They will troubleshoot and support a router-based connection - the cable box outputs bog standard ethernet, and they don't care what you have it hooked up to.
11. Re:As one would expect nowadays, but ... by Nevynxxx · 2010-05-24 00:20 · Score: 1
  
  They *did*, but as it was MAC address based, you just faked the MAC. I had a Linux server/router pluggin years before it was even Virgin.
  As others have said, now a days they provide WiFi routers if you ask nicely, and support any number fo machines accessing.
12. Re:As one would expect nowadays, but ... by networkBoy · 2010-05-24 01:59 · Score: 1
  
  They still only officially support Windows or OSX.
  When I moved back under their coverage from a vastly better provider I had to get a tier 3 support person to set it up (previously had remote call forwarding on the line now to be used with DSL) because the old service on the line was incompatible with regular home service and you couldn't set it up on the internet.
  When she asked what operating system I was using I responded: "let's go with Windows XP". She laughed and said returning linux customer eh?
  So XP was entered into the service notes and all was well.
  
  --
  whois gawk date unzip strip find touch finger mount join nice man top fsck grep eject more yes exit umount sleep dump
13. Re:As one would expect nowadays, but ... by dropadrop · 2010-05-24 02:00 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  Allowing using any devices and supporting them is not the same thing.
14. Re:As one would expect nowadays, but ... by XMode · 2010-05-24 02:07 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  Bah.. That's nothing.. Our 'any router will do' policy once got me in to an argument with a customer that lasted a good 20 mins. When I advised him for the 5th time that while he had a router, he would ALSO need some form of computer to get internet pages, he demanded to speak to my supervisor.
15. Re:As one would expect nowadays, but ... by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-24 02:12 · Score: 0
  
  You could do a firmware upgrade on those, making it like any other ADSL modem.
16. Re:As one would expect nowadays, but ... by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-24 02:20 · Score: 0
  
  Not supported does not mean it doesn't work. If you rely on ISP 1st line support to get your internet working you shouldn't be using anything other than Mac or Windows anyway.
17. Re:As one would expect nowadays, but ... by bugs2squash · 2010-05-24 04:10 · Score: 1
  
  I think there's a limit to how much detailed knowledge of a homebrew furball we can expect a level1 tech to have ? We should give the guy a chance and connect something that he can help to get to working, and then when we replace it with our own system at least we can be sure that the broadband is working. The tech's job is to get the broadband to do what it says on the box, not to assist us with our inventions.
  Frankly I think it is good of them to help troubleshoot any CPE at all.
  
  --
  Nullius in verba
18. Re:As one would expect nowadays, but ... by troll8901 · 2010-05-24 04:14 · Score: 1
  
  When I advised him for the 5th time that while he had a router, he would ALSO need some form of computer to get internet pages, he demanded to speak to my supervisor.
  Oh, so you were that person I spoke to!
  I tell you, my trusty LA30 is able to handle anything I throw at it. Why would I need a computer for?? Clearly you don't know what you're talking. I demand to speak to your supervisor!
19. Re:As one would expect nowadays, but ... by AK+Marc · 2010-05-24 07:31 · Score: 1
  
  Wow, one would have thought that one of the biggest ISPs would accept commodity PPPoE hardware. If I were them, I'd use the opportunity to sell a "supported" router to my customers at a high markup. But, given that it took about a year and a letter to the FCC to get my service working, I can't say I'm surprised.
  
  Not that it matters, but in my case, it was a matter of a weak line plus the added finickiness of PPPoE that made my connection not work from 4 pm to 8 pm on most days. but the DHCP, it worked fine. And, since they'd only test lines sometime around noon (when no residential customers were home, which was probably my problem), it never tested bad for them, so they kept refusing to fix it.
  
  --
  Learn to love Alaska
20. Re:As one would expect nowadays, but ... by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-24 23:05 · Score: 0
  
  Although Internode tech support is semi-legendary for doing their best no matter what gets thrown at them as long as the customer is willing to play nice. (As anyone who's worked tech support knows, this requires a very good sense of humour and reliable mute buttons on the headset mikes.)
This is news? by Osty · 2010-05-23 20:11 · Score: 4, Informative

Doesn't every ISP allow you to do this? Your ISP provides with a modem of the correct type (DSL or cable) and you provide your own router. If they give you a modem that is also a router, you can turn that off or ask them for a plain old modem. With many ISPs, at least in the US, you can even provide your own modem.
I've been running my own Linux router for the past 12 years across multiple ISPs, from T1 providers back in college to DSL providers to Comcast, and have never had a problem doing so. The tech support may be clueless if you call ("Did you reboot your router?" "Let me do that ...
1. Re:This is news? by Osty · 2010-05-23 20:25 · Score: 1
  
  Doh! Stupid Slashdot. That should continue:
  "... [wait 30 seconds while you pretend to reboot your router] ... Rebooted. Problem still exists"). But then you shouldn't need router-side tech support if you're going to run your own Linux router.
2. Re:This is news? by kestasjk · 2010-05-23 20:35 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  I'm in Australia (Perth), I have my own modem and use a FreeBSD gateway (so that I can use PF for firewalling and traffic queuing; for Skype and gaming at the same time), which I've been using for ~6 years and over two ISPs.
  
  So to answer your question; no, this isn't news. If the new proposed national broadband network didn't allow a router of choice that would be news, because that would be absolutely ridiculous.
  
  --
  // MD_Update(&m,buf,j);
3. Re:This is news? by cheater512 · 2010-05-23 20:36 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  This skips the router.
  Ethernet cable out of the wall goes straight to your Linux box. Nothing inbetween.
4. Re:This is news? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-23 20:57 · Score: 0
  
  That is because there is a router (battery-backed) outside your house interfacing with the fiber. They surely won't be letting you touch those fibre boxes.
5. Re:This is news? by AHuxley · 2010-05-23 21:23 · Score: 1
  
  Depends on the network in Australia. In the past as noted, some used unique Surfboard cable units or set up adsl units.
  To play unmetered games you had to have applications running to tell the network about your connection and ip.
  Mac and Linux support was a joke.
  The idea that you have device freedom is nice considering the lock down we hand on many networks in the past.
  P2p users can get the best rated/value units and max out their shares and memory ect.
  This is much better then getting some "safe" "listed" 1 usb/ethernet box or a 4 port wireless box that gets clogged after you turn on your p2p app for a short time due to low end cost cutting hardware limits.
  So yes this is good news, end users can get real value or a 'pro' unit rather than an 'approved' $x00 rebadged consumer grade device.
  
  --
  Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
6. Re:This is news? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-23 23:20 · Score: 0
  
  How is this anything new? sounds like Verizon FIOS here in the states. fiberoptic from the curb runs to the ONT on the outside of your house and then ethernet and or coax runs out the ONT and into one of Verizon's actiontek routers, or you can use your own.
  VZ's actiontek has the benefit of having a coax connector on it and supporting MOCA. using your existing coax infrastructure in the house MOCA can push over 100mbit between the ONT and the actiontek router. you can also get MOCA bridges that allow the PC to directly connect to the MOCA network via its ethernet connection. as far as i remember MOCA allows for upto 7 devices bridges/routers per coax segment.
  Ive heard though that VZ is phasing out MOCA?
7. Re:This is news? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-24 05:24 · Score: 0
  
  This skips the router.
  Skips the modem/mcu.
  A router routes packets, a modem converts connection types. They are NOT interchangeable, although both can be inside the same unit.
8. Re:This is news? by jonwil · 2010-05-24 17:58 · Score: 1
  
  My guess is that the ONT will be a layer 2 device converting Optical Fiber to Ethernet, i.e. it replaces the DSL modem. To use it you will need to connect a device (either a computer of some sort or a dedicated router with a WAN port) that supports PPPoE into this wall socket.
  Your ISP will give you a public IP address which is assigned to the WAN port or Ethernet card on the device plugged into the wall socket.
Re:Jews for Nerds! by Zontar+The+Mindless · 2010-05-23 20:14 · Score: 1, Informative

All Jews possess the following features: ... shitty taste in dental hygiene.
(Shouldn't rise to the bait, but...)
Right, this *totally* explains my Jewish dentist redoing all my upper teeth last year so that I could actually start smiling instead of cringing -- at a 40% discount off his listed fees -- because I'd obviously needed the work done quite badly for years.
Oh, did I mention that he's an *Iraqi* Jew?
Thanks for sorting that out for me, AC!

--
Il n'y a pas de Planet B.
breaking news by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-23 20:24 · Score: 5, Funny

linux users will also still be able to use the national electricity network to power their devices.
1. Re:breaking news by GigaplexNZ · 2010-05-23 21:17 · Score: 3, Funny
  
  Darn, so buying that generator was a waste of time.
2. Re:breaking news by Nerdfest · 2010-05-24 01:48 · Score: 1
  
  If you got the kind that runs on water running through a turbine, you probably spent way too much as well.
Does this skip the filter? by WarwickRyan · 2010-05-23 20:26 · Score: 1

The summary says that you can 'route your data in way you want', does this mean that you can avoid the internet filter? Or have they implemented the filter properly (i.e. centrally)? Which would make this a non-story.
For the record, it wouldn't surprise me if they had implemented the internet filter at consumer-router/modem level. They're bright enough to do it that way.
1. Re:Does this skip the filter? by MichaelSmith · 2010-05-23 21:11 · Score: 1
  
  I believe the filter they want to implement will be at ISP level. I don't actually know how they plan to implement it. They seem to want to block URLs so blocking hosts would block more than intended. I am willing to bet that a non-encrypted link to an http proxy outside the country would fix the problem for you. SSL being reserved for a future time when Stephen Conroy actually listens to his advisers.
  
  --
  http://michaelsmith.id.au
2. Re:Does this skip the filter? by totally+bogus+dude · 2010-05-23 21:14 · Score: 1
  
  Firstly the filter isn't implemented yet; the current proposed plan will do the filtering at the ISP-level, i.e. you won't be able to bypass it from your home connection (aside from by using a VPN or getting your kiddie porn through anything other than unencrypted HTTP on port 80).
  I'm still hopeful the filter will be dropped. It doesn't seem to have much support, especially if the audience at least week's Q&A is anything to go by.
  Not sure exactly why this qualifies as "news", although I suppose it's quite plausible that a government-backed national broadband network would require a particular device and/or OS in order to access. So I suppose the news here is that a government hasn't made a mind-boggingly poor technical decision.
3. Re:Does this skip the filter? by AHuxley · 2010-05-23 21:31 · Score: 1
  
  The filter works on every ISP in Australia and would 'pop' every packet.
  A url type request moving from your 'home' to the exchange would hit a a low end "Narus" like unit and would inspect every packet request vs a very long ever expanding list of adult and political sites.
  If you request the wrong site, your page is blocked and your IP would be noted.
  Not much news on what too many requests to a banned site would do?
  Hit it 3 times does the ISP go into log mode??, 50 and a state task force gets some paperwork to sneak and peek??
  A few more and you have a few vans parked outside one morning??
  
  --
  Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
4. Re:Does this skip the filter? by MichaelSmith · 2010-05-23 21:38 · Score: 1
  
  I wonder how hard the system would be to DDOS? Once we identify the blocked URLs deploy scripts which will query them at a great rate from a number of different systems. Also if you can identify the node in the ISP system which does the filtering try to get its attention from outside the ISPs network. That would make the DDOS bit easier.
  Maybe we can fill up a few RAID arrays with trace data.
  
  --
  http://michaelsmith.id.au
5. Re:Does this skip the filter? by AHuxley · 2010-05-23 21:39 · Score: 1
  
  SSL would be opened by Australian defence and intel spooks as a default as part of their choke point NSA like grip on the few outside optical links.
  Just as SWIFT is in parts of the world and all Australian banking details are in realtime.
  The only fun part is they cannot really use much in court as everybody would then know and stop using that aspect of the net ;)
  Does Stephen Conroy want to make SSL famous and upset passive long term intel gathering?
  
  --
  Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
6. Re:Does this skip the filter? by MichaelSmith · 2010-05-23 21:47 · Score: 1
  
  On holiday recently I was confined to Malaysian internet cafés for my /. access and looking over the shoulders of my fellow internet consumers I noticed that a lot of porn is delivered by webmail so I wonder what the filterers plan to do about that? Ban specific webmail URLs?
  
  --
  http://michaelsmith.id.au
7. Re:Does this skip the filter? by AHuxley · 2010-05-23 22:35 · Score: 1
  
  Webmail would be a pic attachment? - unless Australia goes for skin tone filters too, I am not sure what could be done.
  If the http link was to a listed site, the email app would be like a web browser and get the image blocked.
  
  --
  Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
8. Re:Does this skip the filter? by jibjibjib · 2010-05-24 00:02 · Score: 1
  
  We don't actually have an internet filter here in Australia, so asking "have they implemented the filter properly" isn't meaningful. But in the unlikely event that the government's plan doesn't fall in a heap and we do end up with a filter in a year or two, it'll definitely be implemented at the ISP level.
  People in Australia are free to own their own modems and computers and run their own operating systems on them. There's a huge variety of hardware in use. It'd be logistically impossible, as well as very unpopular, for the government to forcibly replace everyone's modem.
9. Re:Does this skip the filter? by deniable · 2010-05-24 02:56 · Score: 1
  
  The NBN isn't implemented yet either and we're betting that it won't get much further. A few roll-outs in the South-East corner and not much more. Hopefully the filter is as successful. Oh joy, Lateline is showing Conroy attacking Google. The man makes Alston look like a genius.
10. Re:Does this skip the filter? by mabinogi · 2010-05-24 11:21 · Score: 1
  
  they have not implemented the filter at all, and will not implement the filter.
  The filter only exists (and will only ever exist) in the imagination of Steven Conroy and non RTFAing slashdotters (ie. most of them).
  
  --
  Advanced users are users too!
Free internet filtering! by TheIonix · 2010-05-23 20:31 · Score: 0, Troll

Too bad it's Australia, the internet you get is crippled and filtered.
1. Re:Free internet filtering! by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-23 20:59 · Score: 0
  
  Not yet it isn't.
2. Re:Free internet filtering! by MichaelSmith · 2010-05-23 21:13 · Score: 3, Funny
  
  Not. Yet.
  Though I do check /s/ every night after the wife has gone to bed purely to make sure it is still there.
  
  --
  http://michaelsmith.id.au
3. Re:Free internet filtering! by AHuxley · 2010-05-23 21:42 · Score: 1
  
  Just as Australia enters the late 20th C with optical, Stephen Conroy takes us back to the digital dark ages again.
  
  --
  Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
4. Re:Free internet filtering! by Skapare · 2010-05-23 23:03 · Score: 1
  
  From the sounds of it, Conroy is aiming for the Victorian era, somewhere around the latter 1800's.
  
  --
  now we need to go OSS in diesel cars
5. Re:Free internet filtering! by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-24 14:11 · Score: 0
  
  Both of you, stop using the C word!
Re:Jews for Nerds! by rdebath · 2010-05-23 20:38 · Score: 1

You should'a turned right at Digg, not left. Go start back at Google, 4chan is that'a'way.
Re:Coz this is a power hungry AUSSIE diy router. by MichaelSmith · 2010-05-23 21:00 · Score: 1

Unfortunately not but I thought this one was funny.

--
http://michaelsmith.id.au
Thats nice but... by Eth1csGrad1ent · 2010-05-23 21:08 · Score: 2, Insightful

..once the filter kicks in the Internet will stop at your ISP... a bit like owning a ferrari in Antarctica
1. Re:Thats nice but... by Skapare · 2010-05-23 23:08 · Score: 1
  
  But not at the other end point of your overseas encrypted tunnel.
  
  --
  now we need to go OSS in diesel cars
2. Re:Thats nice but... by Eth1csGrad1ent · 2010-05-24 00:34 · Score: 1
  
  its a fair point... but wait for the scope creep. The black list will become the grey list, anonymous proxies and encrypted packets are next. The only reason they're not on Conroy's list is because none of his aides have explained them to him. NBN here we come... anyone know what the data charges are like via a sat. phone ?
3. Re:Thats nice but... by networkBoy · 2010-05-24 02:10 · Score: 1
  
  high.
  Very very high.
  
  --
  whois gawk date unzip strip find touch finger mount join nice man top fsck grep eject more yes exit umount sleep dump
4. Re:Thats nice but... by mjwx · 2010-05-24 13:08 · Score: 1
  
  its a fair point... but wait for the scope creep.
  
  Businesses will bury the government long before that happens.
  
  The filter isn't implemented and the way things are going it's less likely then ever.
  
  If encrypted packets become common place, ISP's will just ignore them or filtering infrastructure will simply collapse. It's a lose-lose (win-win for us) situation.
  
  --
  Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
Posted by timothy by Swampash · 2010-05-23 21:15 · Score: 1

Nuf said.
That's great except... by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-23 21:17 · Score: 0

That's great except there won't be an internet to connect to in Australia. When you filter the internet you can't call it the internet anymore. It's an inter-networked series of government approved servers.
Nobody was worried by Quick+Reply · 2010-05-23 21:40 · Score: 1

Why would I be worried? I thought that it was obvious that you can use existing networking equipment otherwise the NBN would be pointless if you can't use it. That's even if NBN makes it to mainland Australia.
Comment removed by account_deleted · 2010-05-23 22:00 · Score: 2, Informative

Comment removed based on user account deletion
Wow by ledow · 2010-05-23 22:59 · Score: 1

Amazing. You can use an Ethernet-based device to connect to a domestic broadband network. Wonderful modern technology, isn't it?
Hint: If posting a story where the *opposite* actually sounds more shocking, you're not posting news. You're posting things people already know. News needs to be "new", true and (usually) unexpected, unusual, shocking, controversial etc.
browns gas aka 2hydrogen+1Oxygen by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-23 23:01 · Score: 0

If you use the gas from electrolysis for welding you can do some pretty amazing things. i the improved welding ability is related to the fact that hydrogen ions or protons are smaller and so faster moving at a particular energy, even at a low density.
what does this mean in practical terms? in the few opportunities ive had to use a browns gas welder, i was able to move my hand through the flame, and without adjusting could
weld a nail to a brick, or turn road gravel into a molten glassy obsidian that cools to a glossy black that you could sell as jewelry. im fairly sure that you dont want to move your hand through an oxy torch. (correct me if anyone has more experience than me).
What difference would it make anyway? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-23 23:42 · Score: 0

Whatever tech they use 'outside the house', as long as whatever bo they provide Internet service with ends in a standard Ethernet port, which assigns an IP address by DHCP or uses some other industry standard such as PPPoE, then what "brand" software runs on whatever you connect to that is irrelevant.
If it doesn't end in an ethernet port, I'd never subscribe to it anyway.
No Rush by bloodhawk · 2010-05-24 00:43 · Score: 1

Even if for some bizarre reason your linux router wasn't supported (slow news day at slashdot maybe?), I doubt anyone would be at any real risk. Current deployment rate of the NBN should have most of Australia up to ADSL 1 levels by around 2030. Then watch as the government realises "Oh shit Australia has poor backbone connections to the US and Singapore and what we have done don't mean shit as we are all sharing the same tiny piece of pipe".
1. Re:No Rush by deniable · 2010-05-24 02:58 · Score: 1
  
  Current deployment rate of the NBN should have most of Australia up to ADSL 1 levels by around 2030.
  You're a starry-eyed optimist.
2. Re:No Rush by Cimexus · 2010-05-24 03:52 · Score: 1
  
  Actually with the opening of PPC1 last year, and upgrades to SXC currently in progress, we have plenty of bandwidth to the US and Asia. International capacity is no longer the problem. The problems are:
  1) RIMs with insufficient backhaul and Telstra having no real incentive to upgrade them;
  2) Inter-city connections - plenty of bandwidth there too but overpriced thanks to the monopoly/duopoly for many routes
  If you're lucky enough to be somewhere with a direct copper line to the exchange and non-Telstra DSLAMs, things are pretty decent. Due to the massive increase in international capacity in the last few years, quotas have doubled or tripled for the same price (e.g. I was paying $60 for 25 GB 2 years ago, now I'm paying $40 for 50 GB). But that's a big 'if'. It's a real geographical lucky dip and if you are unfortunate to be in Telstra's RIM hell then yeah, Australian internet is like the third world. Hopefully the NBN will level the playing field a bit...
I love the sound of that by PopeRatzo · 2010-05-24 01:28 · Score: 1

Australia's new National Broadband Network
"National" Broadband Network.
Music to my ears.

--
You are welcome on my lawn.
1. Re:I love the sound of that by XMode · 2010-05-24 02:18 · Score: 1
  
  Its not what you think.. Trust me.
Use the right cat by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-24 02:28 · Score: 0

Use at least a 6 lb cat, them older 5 lb kitties just don't cut it in the modern networking arena.
1. Re:Use the right cat by tdelaney · 2010-05-24 08:30 · Score: 1
  
  6 pounds? What kind of tiny cats do you guys have? Now, if you'd said 5kg and 6kg I'd still think the cats were a little on the small side ...
  For the record, my smaller cat is 6.5kg (perfect weight for frame) and the larger is 8.2kg (just very slightly overweight - perfect weight would be about 7.8kg).
Hooray by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-24 02:46 · Score: 0

You can now wire your linux kernel right up to the national nanny filter!
Australia and china should go make their own 'internet'.
WTF are ISP resellers required anyway? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-24 03:57 · Score: 0

Wouldn't it be a lot more efficient for the govt to fund the National Broadband Network through a basic fixed levy added onto residential land rates that local councils charge (similar to the way I hear the state of Queensland is apparently funding it's state ambulance service) & just have retail charges (maybe by ISP resellers) for commercial users using a lot of bandwidth.
After all economies of scale are the way to defray costs & such a scheme would make any other alternative ISPs uncompetitive overnight.
So I changed providers... by Anonymous Coward · 2010-05-24 20:18 · Score: 0

I live in Japan and have had fiber for the last 5 years - I get a ONU from the fiber owner (NTT or KDDI) which is a small powered box where the fiber optic goes in, and it has a normal ethernet port.
All 3 ISPs I have had forced me to rent a crappy home router, and in the first 2 cases they stayed in the box and I used a linux box running pfsense for my internet needs - no issues. But it looks like my current ISP is doing something nasty - rumour is that they use 802.1x authentication before providing a connection, so atm I plug in my crappy ISP provided router, let it get a lease, then connect my linux box. This is great for 24hrs, then I need to repeat the whole process :(
Not. Cool.
End of the day all you need is a device that can do PPP(oE) and you are set. You could plug your PC right into the NTU/ONU and just do it from your desktop if you wanted :)
Not sure how this is "news"...