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What Cities Want Your IT Skills?

Posted by timothy on from the telecommuting-only-goes-so-far dept.

itwbennett writes "Are you a SQL expert? Check out apartments in Jacksonville, Florida. Oracle more your speed? Head down to Dallas, Texas. Looking for a job that uses your Windows skills? Send some resumes to Providence, R.I. Blogger Kevin Fogarty looks at the top skills in demand in the fastest-growing US IT job markets and finds that different cities want different kinds of techies." This reminds me of the recent book Who's Your City? Considering how many people of all stripes live in any large city, and how much migration goes on for work, school, or other reason (I'm thinking of a few I've lived in, like Austin, Seattle, and Philadelphia), it amazes me how strong are the differences in social atmosphere between cities.

123 comments

  1. Fuck yeah by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Because work is the most important consideration of where you choose to live.

    1. Re:Fuck yeah by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      For some folks with families to feed... it is.

      Ask 1,000,000 Mexicans in the US illegally if you doubt this.

    2. Re:Fuck yeah by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Not to mention the opposite: Young people with few ties to a given geographical area. Why not experience new places and get paid more at the same time?

    3. Re:Fuck yeah by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I moved, more or less on blind faith and my brother's recommendation of the area's IT market, 13 hours from Illinois to my current residence of North Carolina for the better job market.

      When all was said and done, I ended up with a far better job, with a ton less stress, and a $24,000/yr raise in salary out out of it to boot.

    4. Re:Fuck yeah by jfern · · Score: 1

      Sadly it is. I'm in the bay area because of my job, and I'd rather be somewhere that had a better ratio of single women to single men.

    5. Re:Fuck yeah by SanityInAnarchy · · Score: 2

      Or for people who are actually passionate about their careers.

      For example, right now, I care very little about where I live, other than that I have fast Internet, and either I get freedom to choose the tools I want, or I get tools I actually enjoy using. For example, suppose I was given the choice between web development jobs in Ruby on Rails, Node.js, ASP.NET, or Oracle ADF. I might try the ASP.NET job out of curiosity, but there is no fucking way I'm doing Oracle ADF 8 hours a day. In fact, pretty much anything related to Oracle is already a code smell.

      I mean, I don't care what the nightlife is (I don't drink), I don't much care about where I sleep (requirements are clean, safe, good Internet), and the other things I care about are likely to be just about anywhere -- a martial arts program, interesting women... Money is rarely a factor.

      But the work is what I'm actually doing with my life. (Or, at the moment, school, but I've worked before, and I take the same approach to internships.)

      --
      Don't thank God, thank a doctor!
    6. Re:Fuck yeah by Saint+Stephen · · Score: 1

      Oracle + C# is actually pretty fun.

      At my Oracle place we weren't permitted to use P/SQL. I used a python-esque syntax to have these insanely complex 5-page plus queries, but the catch was they were filled with CTE (common table expressions). I didn't have to give Oracle any hints - it just found them and optimized away 99.99% of the query and executed blazing fast but I could do totally dynamic sorting/searching.

      Combine that with C# and stay the hell away from Toad, and you're home free. Just write your own Query tool and did I mention stay the hell away from Toad?

    7. Re:Fuck yeah by SanityInAnarchy · · Score: 1

      Oracle + C# is actually pretty fun.

      I suppose it could be, given a sufficient level of abstraction, but I think when you get to the point I'd want, your code is also reasonably portable to other databases, in which case, why are you bothering with Oracle?

      At my Oracle place we weren't permitted to use P/SQL.

      So... no triggers? At all? How'd you do autoincrements?

      Ok, I guess I'm nitpicking, maybe. I definitely agree with that policy, although it also knocks out another big reason people would want to use Oracle in the first place.

      I used a python-esque syntax to have these insanely complex 5-page plus queries, but the catch was they were filled with CTE (common table expressions). I didn't have to give Oracle any hints - it just found them and optimized away 99.99% of the query and executed blazing fast but I could do totally dynamic sorting/searching.

      That's kind of cool. Not as cool as maybe not generating that crap in the first place, but I won't deny Oracle has a pretty powerful optimizer.

      Still, wouldn't be my first choice. I'd much prefer to start with something like DataMapper -- I get to use Ruby, I get to write Ruby pretty much all the time, I almost never have to touch SQL, yet it's usually fairly intelligent with its queries.

      --
      Don't thank God, thank a doctor!
    8. Re:Fuck yeah by jgtg32a · · Score: 1

      Is this a troll or do I just have a substantially different outlook on life?

    9. Re:Fuck yeah by matthew_t_west · · Score: 1

      AC's got a point, but people live in different circumstances in different parts of their lives.

      When I graduated college, my Dad said, "Go to where you can get a job." Well, it was 2002 and there was another tech slump, so I was applying to jobs as a recent graduate with much more qualified applicants in the pool. So I decided to move where I wanted to live. It took me a while, but I found good work as a network admin.

      Plus a job isn't a life. That's the point the AC is making. You can find work anywhere. I'm serious. You just need the skills people want. My skill set is broad and not very deep (except for in CS/IT) so I can work in a lot of sectors. Life is way more than a job. And people that focus too much on their career lose balance and miss out on living life.

      As a bonus for choosing my city before my job: I started my family after having a solid job in a place I wanted to live.

      --
      Browse at 1. You'll thank me later.
  2. Want to be cut off from tech companies completely? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Birmingham, AL.

    I hate this place.

  3. Only skill needed in Washington D.C.... by gatkinso · · Score: 2

    ...your security clearance.

    Oh what's that? You've actually touched a keyboard in the past? That's nice, too.

    --
    I am very small, utmostly microscopic.
    1. Re:Only skill needed in Washington D.C.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I dropped my clearances to work in the private sector. I just didn't want to live in the Washington area and our customer didn't want to have any contractors outside of arm's reach.

    2. Re:Only skill needed in Washington D.C.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is truth.

      My brother made almost 3x as much in washington DC as I made in a surburb of Chicago, doing pretty much exactly the same work, thanks to a Top Secret: CSI clearance he had left over from the Air Force.

    3. Re:Only skill needed in Washington D.C.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      CSI? Do you mean SCI?

      While getting paid more for the higher level clearance is definitely cool, there are always tradeoffs. Working on black projects, you are pretty much isolated from the world, both in terms of work area and what you can discuss with others outside your particular compartment.

    4. Re:Only skill needed in Washington D.C.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I kind of liked not being able to talk about work with others. They didn't have to feign interest.

      You just have to hear "you could tell me but you'd have to kill me" about a billion times.

    5. Re:Only skill needed in Washington D.C.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yup. Only tonight I was looking through the jobs scene and I came across what I can only describe as entry level helpdesk work, with a pay package of a seriously senior sys and network admin (15 years+). All you needed was a DoD level II pass (or something similarly titled). Ridiculous.

    6. Re:Only skill needed in Washington D.C.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Probably. I don't have it so I don't know what it was exactly. he only told me about it the one time.

      He actually worked on capitol hill in senators offices. same crap I did at the time, fixing broken outlook, etc. Difference was the emails in the inboxes he was looking at may contain national secrets along with the ads for v14g'ra and forwarded "omg george carlin said this its so true!" messages.

    7. Re:Only skill needed in Washington D.C.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is truth.

      My brother made almost 3x as much in washington DC as I made in a surburb of Chicago, doing pretty much exactly the same work, thanks to a Top Secret: CSI clearance he had left over from the Air Force.

      Absolutely true. But that well's running dry and I'm glad I made my move into the private sector, too. I'm in a military/contractor heavy town as well and had a clearance left over from my time in the Army - but I've still 6 years on it and I work in Apple/Linux paradise.

      Why would I take a crapload more money for Windows Server hell?

  4. So... by TheRealFixer · · Score: 3, Interesting

    What I learned from this list, is all anyone cares about is Project Managers. So, who's actually going to do all the real work?

    1. Re:So... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Offshore labor from the lowest-cost body shop.

    2. Re:So... by spads · · Score: 1

      Yep, you can tell the recovery is in full swing when helium skills demand is sky-rocketing.

      --
      Bukowski said it. I believe it. That settles it.
    3. Re:So... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Its called outsourcing...

    4. Re:So... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Random homeless people that will be teached to do the work by the manager

    5. Re:So... by CaroKann · · Score: 1

      Everyone is always chomping at the bit to work on something, so you need project managers to make sure that only the right work gets done. If you need a garden shed then don't let them build a skyscraper. Instead direct that extra energy to get some weeds pulled.

    6. Re:So... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Random homeless people that will be teached to do the work by the manager

      Not randomly; you appear to have the right qualifications.

    7. Re:So... by evilviper · · Score: 1

      I bet there's high demand for fast food employees, too. It's just not on this list because that's not "IT".

      --
      Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
    8. Re:So... by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      I'm going to guess it's because the list came from Dice.com, and that IT people got pushed into that category as well. Dice.com charges a lot to post a job title, so maybe companies aren't willing to do it except for high-paying jobs.

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    9. Re:So... by moj0joj0 · · Score: 1

      Yep, you can tell the recovery is in full swing when helium skills demand is sky-rocketing.

      More likely is that you're nearing peak in the selected region when unessential or even unimportant jobs begin to balloon (and isn't balloon the precursor to burst bubbles?)

    10. Re:So... by Aceticon · · Score: 2

      Actually that's a very good question. The ratio of PMs to Devs should be at least 1-to-5 at the lowest level (i.e. 1 team leader per 5 developers) and as one goes up the management chain the ratio between a level and the one below should remain similar.

      For a company to have as many devs as managers the ratio would need to be at least 1-to-2 .

      So, how come the top looked-for professionals in almost all cities are Project Managers?

      The only explanation I can think of is that Developers are listed in a more specific way (i.e. Oracle devs, C Devs, Java Devs, .NET Devs) while Project Managers are all under one category.
      So if you aggregate all Dev entries into a coarse "Developer" category, then it does add up to a PM-to-Dev ratio which is closer to 5-to-1.

    11. Re:So... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're forgetting that it might because it is easier to find a developer or outsource that overseas than it is to find a certified project manager. All this says is that there are a lot of open jobs for PM's and that the developer slots are filled. Maybe developers don't turn over as fast as PMs

    12. Re:So... by zevans · · Score: 1

      I am currently in project management, moving the virtualisation teams offshore. Fear me.

      --
      "... and more and more now there are all kinds of electronic goodies available" -- Pink Floyd 1972
  5. Project Management by iceperson · · Score: 1

    Looks like it's time to get my PMP cert

    1. Re:Project Management by blair1q · · Score: 2

      Good luck. The only certified PMP I know has been unemployed since we fired him a year ago.

      Get some project management experience and then apply for the job.

    2. Re:Project Management by Chris+Mattern · · Score: 1

      First, you have to get your PMP cane and hat.

    3. Re:Project Management by iceperson · · Score: 1

      I wasn't aware that project management experience and a PMP cert were mutually exclusive...

    4. Re:Project Management by syntap · · Score: 1

      Lol, not unless you cheated on your PMP exam application form. You have to document years of project management experience, broken down by PMI's definition of project components, as a part of the application. One can lie I supposed, but they randomly audit those applications.

    5. Re:Project Management by blair1q · · Score: 1

      I'm laughing. My ass isn't falling off, but it's on the schedule.

      The only certified PMP I know couldn't find MS Project with a map and a computer with only MS Project on the desktop.

    6. Re:Project Management by syntap · · Score: 1

      MS Project is a tool one can use, but not the only one. The PMP exam tests knowledge of the Project Management Body of Knowledge, not skills with Microsoft Project. Go to Brainbench or similar for those kinds of certifications.

    7. Re:Project Management by sjames · · Score: 1

      They have schools and certs for that? How hard can it be to beat a hoe where the bruises won't show?

    8. Re:Project Management by blair1q · · Score: 1

      I wasn't using MS Project as a requirement of the PMP exam. I was using it as a placeholder for the word "ass" as in "find his own ass with both hands". I.e., it didn't matter if he could legitimately claim to have been in a job that had experience in the field, because there was no correlation between his claim and his ability, even after he took the courses and passed the test.

  6. and DC costs alot to live there by Joe_Dragon · · Score: 1

    and DC costs alot to live there vs other areas.

  7. SharePoint, SharePoint, and some Lync too by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Whether you like it or not, the demand is FAR exceeding the available resources, and it's going to be awhile before the bottom falls out on this niche. Developers cum admins are quickly exposed, and thus the technical architecture/admin roles are just seeing insane salary growth - both FTE and contract. Until India and South America can play catch up, this is a very good spot to be currently. That is until the next "niche" high-demand Microsoft rollout, which will likely be Duet as adoption grows.

    Once again, before modmonsters come hammering down on me, I'm not necessarily advocated the USE of this product, I'm only pointing out the demand and opportunity. If our masters can exploit need, why can't we?

    1. Re:SharePoint, SharePoint, and some Lync too by Alex+Belits · · Score: 1

      And how much of this "demand" is actually "HAALP! Some consultant built us a massive Sharepoint-based solution, and it does not fucking work!"?

      --
      Contrary to the popular belief, there indeed is no God.
    2. Re:SharePoint, SharePoint, and some Lync too by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Late reply I know, but most of it. That's the best part. The vast majority of my billing comes from fixing mistakes from low-cost or underqualified consultants. That holds true for any niche in IT.

  8. Re:Want to be cut off from tech companies complete by Hatta · · Score: 2

    There are a lot of rich people in Birmingham
    A lot of ghosts in a lot of houses
    Look over there!...A dry ice factory
    A good place to get some thinking done

    --
    Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
  9. Just look at twitter for Seattle by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The twitter tag #Seattle will list tons of IT jobs

  10. Stupid article by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Just the fact it lumps together C, C++ and C# in the same category is the fucking proof the author has no clue about software development...

    1. Re:Stupid article by blair1q · · Score: 1

      This is almost exactly what I was going to post, except I would have put the "fucking" 4 words to the right.

  11. Yahoo is really desperate by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I live near Toronto, and I got scouted by Yahoo's Sunnyvale office. They were looking for server admins.

    1. Re:Yahoo is really desperate by otis+wildflower · · Score: 1

      Of course they're desperate: Yahoo is a shithole.

  12. Re:Want to be cut off from tech companies complete by oakgrove · · Score: 1

    I hate this place.

    I'd say the same thing about Jacksonville, FL. I can't say anything about your SQL prospects here but I do have a nice little gig as a java coder. /bragging

    --
    The soylentnews experiment has been a dismal failure.
  13. There are lots of cities... by Lifyre · · Score: 1

    There are lots of cities looking for people of all stripes. Buffalo, NY for instance is looking for IT people of all stripes with a fairly robust number of smaller companies. Look outside of the places you might expect and there may be a surprising amount of opportunity in the second tier cities like Buffalo.

    --
    I'll meet you at the intersection of "Should be" and "Reality"
    1. Re:There are lots of cities... by demonlapin · · Score: 1

      There's always work available in undesirable places. The question is whether it's worth the money.

      In my case (not IT), it was - my town is a dump, but I'm earning twice what I would in a nice place, and the cost of living (esp housing) is low.

    2. Re:There are lots of cities... by otis+wildflower · · Score: 1

      Taxes in Buffalo are fucking insanity. Even if you like the weather, the taxes, utilities, etc. are bullshit.

      Hell, I have a ton of friends in Buffalo, but that's what IM is for. I love to visit and get the only wings worth eating, but then I get to leave and not pay the rapacious income or property tax!

    3. Re:There are lots of cities... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually, taxes are comparable to other metro areas in the country. Hunt Real Estate (can't bring up the link right now as it's on a subscription site that I no longer have access to) did a study of the cost of living adjusted for salary in the top 50 metro areas in the United States, and although Buffalo area property taxes are have high rates, home values are much lower and fees are much lower compared to similar cities in the southeast and southwest. If you add in the quality of the public schools and excellent services (parks, plowing, no extra fee for garbage or any other services) (in the suburbs at least) that come with the taxes, you come out with much more disposable income.
      Plus, there's so much less of a rat race here; why would I want to live in another city making $20k more gets thrown right into a house that costs 3x more, a commute 2x as long, having to pay for a decent private school etc?

    4. Re:There are lots of cities... by Alex+Belits · · Score: 1

      It's their Libertarian Repellent Program.

      --
      Contrary to the popular belief, there indeed is no God.
    5. Re:There are lots of cities... by Lifyre · · Score: 1

      Thanks for saving me the effort of posting all that. It's insane that people look at one part without looking at the whole picture.

      The weather may not be for everybody but watching them handle a snow fall is nothing short of amazing.

      --
      I'll meet you at the intersection of "Should be" and "Reality"
    6. Re:There are lots of cities... by zevans · · Score: 1

      Ah, that's because you get better throughput from striped employees.

      --
      "... and more and more now there are all kinds of electronic goodies available" -- Pink Floyd 1972
  14. Somewhat Useless Stats by DoomHamster · · Score: 1

    Lumping C, C++, C# jobs together seems a bit useless.

    1. Re:Somewhat Useless Stats by gatkinso · · Score: 1

      Well, they all begin with C...

      Seriously, I mostly agree. C and C++ more easily can be lumped together, C# not so much.

      --
      I am very small, utmostly microscopic.
    2. Re:Somewhat Useless Stats by zevans · · Score: 1

      The interesting question is how many of the applicants for the C# roles have any clue about OO.

      --
      "... and more and more now there are all kinds of electronic goodies available" -- Pink Floyd 1972
  15. Re:Want to be cut off from tech companies complete by DrgnDancer · · Score: 2

    Dude. Move an hour north. Huntsville is nothing but tech jobs. I have a great job, and get near weekly inquires from recruiters about whether I'd like a different one. In a pinch you could commute here, though it'd be a bit of a dozy.

    --
    I don't need a million points of light, just two points of multi-mode fiber and a 10 Gig-E router.
  16. Linking by gmuslera · · Score: 1

    The only IT skill that deserved a link (probably to explain what is it to typical site users) was Linux?

  17. Bottom of the list... by SJHillman · · Score: 1

    Anywhere in NY outside of NYC. I moved from the Mohawk Valley to Rochester just to find any IT job, and now I'm a highly paid consultant at $33k/yr

    1. Re:Bottom of the list... by RMingin · · Score: 1

      Not snark: 33k/year is highly paid in rural NY? Is that part time? I make 40K/year in very distant suburbs of PA. That's full time, though.

      --
      The preceding comment is my own, and in no way construes an opinon of the Emperor of Mankind.
    2. Re:Bottom of the list... by avm · · Score: 1

      Eek. If that's how IT is I'll keep driving a truck at $55k/yr. I used to live in NY but wanted a change and moved to rural PA.

    3. Re:Bottom of the list... by SJHillman · · Score: 1

      Sarcasm intended... it's full time, 40+ hrs/wk minimum. New York just sucks because of the taxes and the fact the politicians do everything they can to get businesses to leave the state. I've considered hopping the border to PA for more than just the legal fireworks and cheap gas. Also, I wouldn't call Rochester "rural"... it's the second largest metro area in the state after NYC :-p

    4. Re:Bottom of the list... by Eponymous+Hero · · Score: 0

      yikes, when i was a php developer in san diego pulling $70k/yr i always thought i'd be able to make more on the east coast. i didn't move for several reasons, but i'm glad i never ran into this issue when i was looking.

      --
      insensitive clod overlords obligatory xkcd car analogy russian reversals whoosh pedant fanbois ftfy in 3...2...1..PROFIT
  18. I am experiencing this by fadethepolice · · Score: 1

    I have been spending the last few months hopping hotels between columbus, cincinnati, and cleveland. There is real growth in this area if you can get in with a good corporation that is *in* with the ohio government and corporate network. The only way to describe myself now is as a total engineering whore. GIS database? Biogas? Solar projects? Urban Streetscapes? Got groundwater contaminated with Fracking Brine? Whatever pays baby. Never really spent any time in ohio before January. It was pretty cool rolling into Columbus this morning and hearing on the news what I heard in the office yesterday..... Now I automatically scope out the safe room when I enter any building in case a giant tornado rolls through. Ice room. Safest place in the hotel.....

  19. You work in IT .. Why move? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Information Technology allows you to pretty much work from anywhere on the planet.
    Why not live somewhere comfortable and on the odd occasion visit the office.
    I know I do. Considering moving to Singapore or some similar location.

    1. Re:You work in IT .. Why move? by blair1q · · Score: 1

      Hey. IT guy. Bad cable or something on the server in the crawlspace. Get that, will you?

    2. Re:You work in IT .. Why move? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hey. Cable monkey, replace the cable, thanks.

    3. Re:You work in IT .. Why move? by blair1q · · Score: 1

      Sorry, budget for half a body. IT guy is still up.

  20. It is by ideaz · · Score: 1

    The city that gets me the job?

    1. Re:It is by blair1q · · Score: 1

      Pretty much. Or they're supposed to. That's part of what your FICA pays for. Not that they're any good at it.

  21. Uhh... "SQL" is a subset of "Oracle" by AtlantaSteve · · Score: 5, Insightful

    This summary reminds me of every dumb phone I've ever received from incompetent I.T. recruiters, as they mindlessly read off buzzwords...

    Recruiter: Do you have "JEE"?
    Me: Yeah.

    Recruiter: Do you have "Java"?
    Me: That's included in the previou... oh, nevermind. Yeah.

    Recruiter: Do you have "Oracle"?
    Me: Yeah.

    Recruiter: Do you have "SQL"?
    Me: That's part of...... yeah.

    Recruiter: Do you have "agile"?
    Me: Oh fuck my life...

    1. Re:Uhh... "SQL" is a subset of "Oracle" by etymxris · · Score: 2

      Yeah HR has no clue. Our company has an HR/IT person that's supposed to be up on these things, but she pronounces C# as "sea pound".

    2. Re:Uhh... "SQL" is a subset of "Oracle" by ub3r+n3u7r4l1st · · Score: 1

      Most people spend more time on their cell phone than on their monitor, chances are they will say "press the pound key" rather than "press than sharp key".

      --
      New Economic Perspectives
    3. Re:Uhh... "SQL" is a subset of "Oracle" by Forrest+Kyle · · Score: 1

      What are you talking about? I'm a developer, and to me it is the Pound Sign. It's only the Sharp Sign if you are a musician.

    4. Re:Uhh... "SQL" is a subset of "Oracle" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What are YOU talking about? I'm a developer and to me it is the hash sign. Pound sign looks like this £

    5. Re:Uhh... "SQL" is a subset of "Oracle" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If they're going to ask you in nonsensical ways, you might as well answer in nonsensical ways...

      Recruiter: Do you have JEE?
      You: Yes. (you can't tell after one question)

      Recruiter: Do you have Java?
      You: I did up until about a week ago, but I got mugged and the burglar took it.

      Recruiter: Do you have Oracle?
      You: Yes, but my doctor gave me a prescription, so I'm no longer contagious.

      Recruiter: Do you have SQL?
      You: I am SQL, does that count?

      Recruiter: Do you have agile?
      You: Most likely, but I have to roll a D20 to find out.

    6. Re:Uhh... "SQL" is a subset of "Oracle" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      But... Butt... it's See Octothorpe!

    7. Re:Uhh... "SQL" is a subset of "Oracle" by kaizokuace · · Score: 1

      What are YOU talking about? I'm a professional tic tac toe champion!

      --
      Balderdash!
    8. Re:Uhh... "SQL" is a subset of "Oracle" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is a pound sign £
      This is a hash #

    9. Re:Uhh... "SQL" is a subset of "Oracle" by XManticore · · Score: 2

      Well, the musical sharp sign is actually different to the hash sign in like in C#. The vertical lines in the sharp sign have a 'negative' slope, from bottom right to top left, /pedantic.

      I refer to # as a hash, a pound is £ but YMMV if you are from the States. But C# is see sharp, doesn't matter what the symbol is, that's what the damn language is called. Calling it see pound out of ignorance is one thing, but insisting on being obtuse is a different thing entirely

    10. Re:Uhh... "SQL" is a subset of "Oracle" by syntap · · Score: 3, Insightful

      When I read SQL vs Oracle I take that to mean one has experience in Oracle setup, backup, maintenance, etc. as opposed to being a data miner or analyst. In my experience those are different skill sets that one can specialize in.

      But the recruiters are just going through key terms to check off, and the questions a non-technical recruiter gives to technical people are often quite amusing.

    11. Re:Uhh... "SQL" is a subset of "Oracle" by syntap · · Score: 1

      It is pronounced "Sea Sharp" and here is a blog posting (not mine) about the history of the name:

      http://jameskovacs.com/2007/09/07/cnet-history-lesson/

      "So back to the original question of the origins of C#. The codename of C# was Project Cool, which was rumoured to be a clean-room implementation of Java. This was back in the days when Sun was suing Microsoft over bastardizing the Java language. As I recall, Sun didn’t like the Microsoft-specific extensions in J++, which allowed it to interoperate with COM. So where did the name C# come from?

      C# name was musically inspired. It is a C-style language that is a step above C/C++, where sharp (#) means a semi-tone above the note. (Being a musician myself, I think this is awfully fun.) Back when .NET made its debut, an amusing quip from the Linux crowd was to refer to C# as Db (D-flat), which is the same note as C#, but has different connotations. Two MS Research languages also bear musically-related names: Polyphonic C# and F#. "

    12. Re:Uhh... "SQL" is a subset of "Oracle" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      rofl

    13. Re:Uhh... "SQL" is a subset of "Oracle" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I always thought C# was (C++)++ with the ++'s arranged in a square. And when it was introduced, that was the general feeling of everyone else I knew in the industry as well. Retconning is funny. Like that patchy server's name...

    14. Re:Uhh... "SQL" is a subset of "Oracle" by tlhIngan · · Score: 1

      That might be true for why it's officially called C-Sharp, but the meaning of the # comes from C++.

      It's a better C++, so they wanted another ++ on it, so they put ++ below the ++ on C++. So it looked a little like:

      ++
      ++

      which hey, they could shrink to C# (see? it now looks like ++ on top of ++). Stylize it a bit and it looks like a #.

    15. Re:Uhh... "SQL" is a subset of "Oracle" by Missing.Matter · · Score: 1

      Actually in the sharp symbol, the vertical lines have infinite slope (they are perfectly vertical). The vertical lines in the hash symbol have positive slope. /pedantic.

    16. Re:Uhh... "SQL" is a subset of "Oracle" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I call it C-Gartenzaun, because the hash mark looks like a garden fence and I just like using German words in Computer Science to make things fun.

      Ever tried to use the German translation of "stack"? It's funny and almost no German computer scientist will know it but will laugh their ass of when they hear it. It's Keller (i.e. cellar)
      Developing in "Sonnenfinsternis"? (if you answered yes to "got Java?", you are or have probably been working in Eclipse ...

      Really fun to use :)

    17. Re:Uhh... "SQL" is a subset of "Oracle" by zevans · · Score: 1

      Yeah, F#, the saddest of all programming languages.

      --
      "... and more and more now there are all kinds of electronic goodies available" -- Pink Floyd 1972
  22. Avoid Austin... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Whatever you do, avoid Austin. It is beyond a glut of IT people here. 20 years experience? Make a cardboard sign, and find an intersection not occupied to get change. Oh, avoid the guy with the scraggly beard and tutu... That is a mayoral candidate and has nearly won.

  23. Why no catagory for careers? by walterbyrd · · Score: 1

    Slashdot has categories for everything else. As I write this, there are, at least, two articles that are career related. And why not? Careers are an important of "news for nerds, stuff that matters."

  24. What flavour of Oracle? by theshowmecanuck · · Score: 1

    It is interesting to see so much Oracle demand, but Oracle encompasses many areas now. The database, financials, etc. At one time if they listed Oracle, it meant they wanted either someone who was good at PL/SQL, maybe Oracle Forms, or as an Oracle DBA. But now that isn't the case any more. For example, around this area (Greater Toronto Area), if they ask about Oracle, they are talking more often than not about Oracle Financial applications. But the ads only list 'Oracle' as a requirement (HR people without a clue as to what they are asking for). But there are a ton of other Oracle apps. So the one number for Oracle they give in this survey is misleading.

    --
    -- I ignore anonymous replies to my comments and postings.
    1. Re:What flavour of Oracle? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Its the same for every platofrm, when someone asks for ".NET" skills it could mean AJAX, MVC, jQuery or hundred other stuff that Microsoft felt like piling onto .NET

  25. What I'm doing by otis+wildflower · · Score: 1

    Moving to a city with zero income tax and a relatively low cost-of-living, but plenty of stuff to eat, do and see. 20 Schrute bucks if you can guess which city and state ;)

    At this point, I'd need to spend $80-100k per year to pay in sales tax in an average state what I'm paying right now in income tax. Fuck income tax.

    1. Re:What I'm doing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Im guessing... Austin TX?

    2. Re:What I'm doing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Orlando?

    3. Re:What I'm doing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Harrisburg?

    4. Re:What I'm doing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Moving to a city with zero income tax and a relatively low cost-of-living, but plenty of stuff to eat, do and see. 20 Schrute bucks if you can guess which city and state ;)

      At this point, I'd need to spend $80-100k per year to pay in sales tax in an average state what I'm paying right now in income tax. Fuck income tax.

      Austin, Tx? The same place I just moved to...

  26. Bangalore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's why the word "Bangalored" is in the dictionary.

  27. Too little data by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    A lot of the categories have nearly no data, even using national results.

    For example, [Software Engineer -> All Experience Levels -> National] has only 176 respondents. [Software Developer, ...] is even worse with only 83 data points!

    Can't really conclude much, except that this is all much ado about nothing. And certainly not with the precision language like "1.8% average increase" implies (for Software Developer salary nationally)!

    (And that even assumes that the dubious methodology in described here http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/354519/How_i_Computerworld_i_s_2011_Salary_Survey_was_conducted doesn't destroy its credibility before they even got started!)

  28. Detroit? by bar-agent · · Score: 1

    They actually listed jobs for Detroit? Does anyone still live there? I thought it was the new "Escape from New York."

    --
    i'd hit it so hard, if you pulled me out you'd be the king of britain [bash.org]
    1. Re:Detroit? by BSsci.Daemonology · · Score: 1

      Detroit IT jobs are growing. I know several people (none of them know one-another) who have moved there and are working, all from the Chicago area with the exception of one from Sillicon Valley.

    2. Re:Detroit? by gr8_phk · · Score: 1

      I'm still here. We're on the bleeding edge of vehicle electrification (hybrids electric cars etc...). Qualified engineers (and software people) are not that common. Then there are all the companies that tried to diversify out of automotive and are now becoming more established in other industries without leaving town. Also, witness a resurgence among the hacker/maker crowd in actually making things - you can make anything here and find companies to assemble/manufacture at any scale. BTW when they say "Detroit" they really mean the burbs which are very nice. Michigan is also a fantastic place to live for a lot of reasons.

  29. C, C++, C# by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Oh really? Do those all go in one group because they start with C?

    Remind me to research this hot new technology of "software developer" to add to my resume too...

  30. No Objective-C? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Interested that there is no mention of Objective-C, iPhone or Android Development jobs despite the growing number of ads I have seen regarding these type of job openings.

  31. Lots of jobs for OLD programming languages... by Cutting_Crew · · Score: 1

    The problem i seem to be having is that whenever someone wants a Java Developer there seems to be a common set of additional requirements along with that(Hibernate, Struts, JBoss, WebSphere, WebLogic) and with C++ there also seems to be a common set of requirements for that too..(ASP.net, C#, IIS, VB.net, Visual Studio 2003,2005,2008, Microsoft SQL Server). Oh yeah and don't forget about MFC...even Microsoft has abandoned it, yet companies still want to use it. I haven't used Visual Studio*.* is years and because of it - you are not qualified.

    Other things i see scattered around involve Tuxedo, clearcase and so forth. I had never heard of those before. I had to go look it up to see what they even were. Tuxedo is COBOL(YIKES). Clearcase? I just use Subversion, Git or CVS or something. It seems that being in a small shop that uses tools that just get the job done, usually using software that is open source and 100% free, has now made me undesirable to software managers who want everything under the sun or who want experience with older technologies.

    1. Re:Lots of jobs for OLD programming languages... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well, it's like with the medieval popes' edicts against heretics: you never take stuff *out*, you only pile new stuff on top - after all, what if, theoretically, the old stuff ever came in handy, nevermind that it hasn't been seen for 200 years? Saves you whole three seconds of thinking, and that's *some* efficiency!

    2. Re:Lots of jobs for OLD programming languages... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      To me it sounds like you want a job that will allow you to use C++ or Java all day without any third party interference and that will almost never be the case. ASP.net, C#, IIS, VisualStuido, SqlServer...these are all key technologies a developer needs to be skilled at in this day in age.

    3. Re:Lots of jobs for OLD programming languages... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you are casually dismissing Clearcase and saying you'll "just use Subversion, Git, or CVS or something," please stay the hell out of enterprise software configuration management. You're undesirable because you don't know what you're talking about and are unwilling to learn.

    4. Re:Lots of jobs for OLD programming languages... by Cutting_Crew · · Score: 1

      again i will emphasize that I have always worked in a small shop that just gets the job done - and usually its faster, easier and cheaper to use open source alternatives(3rd party APIs included) to get the job done. I have never wrote and worked in a place where you have hundreds of employees who need to share codebases like Clearcase seems to live off of. So i wasnt casually dismissing it but after looking at it more closely, theres probably only about 10% of Clearcase functionality thats not in any number of open source free repository control software packages. Obviously if you had read the part that I work in a small shop, then you would have realized why I have never used or would ever need something as big and expensive as ClearCase

      In the past, if i would have used ASP.net, C#, IIS, then that means that you can't port it to another OS and i have always worked in cross platform shops. I probably should have been more clear about that before.

  32. Re:Want to be cut off from tech companies complete by ThePromenader · · Score: 1

    ...I'm checking them out... I've got it figured out. Talking Heads, 'Cities' - great song! Although I always heard 'thinking' as 'drinking' in the last line you cited.

    --

    No, no sig. Really.

    ThePromenader
  33. What Cities In The US Want Your IT Skills? by Yvanhoe · · Score: 1

    Fixed that for you

    --
    The Wise adapts himself to the world. The Fool adapts the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the Fool.
  34. That's a change by dbIII · · Score: 1

    Instead you expect HR to make a hash of it.

    Translation: to many in the English speaking world "#" is a hash. I've never heard anyone call it "sea hash" though no matter how much of a dope they are.

  35. Salaries can be misleading by Bicx · · Score: 1

    Although I live in the region listed as having the lowest salaries for IT, I think it's worth noting that I also live in a state with no income tax and a very appealing income to cost-of-living ratio. I was recently researching a job position in Chicago, and spent some time determining how my salary would need to change in order to maintain the same standard of living I have in east TN. Long story short, I hit the salary ceiling for the job in question before reaching an income offering the comforts I have now.

  36. Where's hairyfeet? by GameboyRMH · · Score: 1

    ...and all the other people who argue that *nix admins are super-rare? Look at those Unix and Linux numbers in the article. Read them and weep.

    --
    "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
  37. Richmond VA, Charlotte, Philly, and DC hiring by Muad'Dave · · Score: 1

    CapTech (my employer) is actively seeking top-tier Java developers, .NET developers, architects, sharepoint experts, etc. We have offices in Richmond VA, Charlotte, Philly, and DC. We only hire the best of the best - if you're qualified, check us out at http://www.captechconsulting.com./ The current job listings are here: http://www.captechconsulting.com/careers/jobs.

    Good luck!

    --
    Tiller's Rule: Never use a word in written form that you've only heard and never read. You will end up looking foolish.
  38. I Cringe when I see C, C++ and C# clubbed together by tekxtc · · Score: 1

    Is it just me?

  39. Re:Want to be cut off from tech companies complete by DrgnDancer · · Score: 1

    If you're still watching this (doubtful I know since you're AC, but it can't hurt), and you actually want to get out of Birmingham, message me. Lots of good stuff going on here in the great white (OK, rarely white, mostly hot) northern tip of AL.

    --
    I don't need a million points of light, just two points of multi-mode fiber and a 10 Gig-E router.