NASA Could Explore Titan With Squishable 'Super Ball Bot'

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NASA Could Explore Titan With Squishable 'Super Ball Bot'

Posted by Soulskill on Friday December 27, 2013 @07:24AM from the totally-serious-names dept.

An anonymous reader writes "IEEE Spectrum reports on a rover design being developed at NASA Ames Research Center: Super Ball Bot. The premise is that the rover's brain and scientific equipment would be suspended in the center of a structure made of rigid rods and elastic cables. The rods and cables would be deformable, allowing the rover to roll over complex terrain without damage. This design would be ideal for exploring a place like Saturn's moon Titan. Its atmosphere is thick enough that a probe could drop the rover from 100km above the surface, and it would survive the fall without a parachute. 'In a scenario studied by the team (PDF), the robot could be collapsed to a very compact configuration for launch. Once it reaches the moon, it would pop open and drop to the surface, flexing and absorbing the force of impact. By shortening and lengthening the cables that connect its rigid components, the ball bot could then roll about the surface. These same cables could be used to pull back parts of the robot, so that science instruments at the center could be exposed and used.'"

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So let me guess. by 3seas · 2013-12-27 07:26 · Score: 2

They shoot the super ball at the target and it bounces back with the data.
1. Re:So let me guess. by Savage-Rabbit · 2013-12-27 07:33 · Score: 1
  
  They shoot the super ball at the target and it bounces back with the data.
  No, that could knock Titan out of orbit.
  
  --
  Only to idiots, are orders laws.
  -- Henning von Tresckow
I built them already by Sarten-X · 2013-12-27 07:29 · Score: 2

Anybody remember Sodaconstructor?

--
You do not have a moral or legal right to do absolutely anything you want.
1. Re:I built them already by SuricouRaven · 2013-12-27 07:57 · Score: 1
  
  If someone could remake that in 3d, and allow for multiplayer interactions and controllable bots, there is so much more potential in the concept.
Am I the only who saw... by Nutria · 2013-12-27 07:39 · Score: 1

"NASA Could Explode Titan With ..."

--
"I don't know, therefore Aliens" Wafflebox1
1. Re:Am I the only who saw... by Wintermute__ · 2013-12-27 08:15 · Score: 3, Funny
  
  DO NOT TAUNT the Super Ball Bot
I thought the methane ocean was of interest? by gargeug · 2013-12-27 07:40 · Score: 1

Why wouldn't they send a UAV or UUV to go swim around in the oceans? I figured that was what was really interesting on Titan because it could contain life.
1. Re:I thought the methane ocean was of interest? by SuricouRaven · 2013-12-27 08:05 · Score: 2
  
  Not sure how to power a UAV. At that distance solar power is very limited.
2. Re:I thought the methane ocean was of interest? by tomhath · 2013-12-27 08:17 · Score: 2
  
  Just burn natural gas, it's every where on Titan. Oh wait...
3. Re:I thought the methane ocean was of interest? by cusco · 2013-12-27 08:27 · Score: 1
  
  Internal combustion? Take along oxygen and you should be able to burn the atmosphere.
  
  A balloon wouldn't need any fuel, and there are designs to change buoyancy of the balloon so that it could descend to the surface and sample, and then re-ascend.
  
  --
  "Think about how stupid the average person is. Now, realise that half of them are dumber than that." - George Carlin
4. Re:I thought the methane ocean was of interest? by morgauxo · 2013-12-27 09:38 · Score: 2
  
  Life in Titan's oceans??? ummm.. those oceans aren't water!
5. Re:I thought the methane ocean was of interest? by gargeug · 2013-12-27 11:34 · Score: 1
  
  UAV -> Underwater Autonomous Vehicle
6. Re:I thought the methane ocean was of interest? by gargeug · 2013-12-27 11:37 · Score: 2
  
  Ummm, no shit. But there is no rule that says all life has to be exactly like us, and thats why those methane oceans are interesting because they could harbor life that uses different building blocks.
7. Re:I thought the methane ocean was of interest? by GarethIwanFairclough · 2013-12-27 11:37 · Score: 1
  
  Obvious answer is obvious. RTG. Provided we can get the material for it.
8. Re:I thought the methane ocean was of interest? by MichaelSmith · 2013-12-27 11:46 · Score: 1
  
  Thats a far better idea.
  
  --
  http://michaelsmith.id.au
9. Re:I thought the methane ocean was of interest? by SuricouRaven · 2013-12-27 21:15 · Score: 1
  
  Or Unmanned Aerial Vehicle. I assumed that was the meaning, as it's more common, and 'UUV' referred to a waterborne one.
10. Re:I thought the methane ocean was of interest? by TheTurtlesMoves · 2013-12-27 23:15 · Score: 1
  
  This is in fact quite difficult. Sure in some sci fi story it works because you just arm wave all the details away. But when it really comes down to what can really work its more limited. First off methane is a poor universal solvent compared to water. This already makes things much more difficult. Second even the basic idea of a bi-lipid membrane doesn't even work in methane (its a non polar solvent). Its cold so reaction rates are low... etc....
  
  Different building blocks is even more difficult. The classic argument is something based of silicon. If you have silicon you have carbon and carbon can just form so many more stable compounds that anything else, and vastly more than silicon. Life as we know it uses most of the periodic table. The is a really good argument to be made that life will be chemically similar to us. (ie water is the solvent, things based around carbon, some sort of information store like DNA).
  
  --
  The Grey Goo disaster happened 3 billion years ago. This rock is covered in self replicating machines!
11. Re:I thought the methane ocean was of interest? by dryeo · 2013-12-28 06:18 · Score: 1
  
  The atmosphere is mostly nitrogen and probably wouldn't burn. Might work for a boat though I hate to think about engineering an internal combustion engine to operate at those temperatures.
  
  --
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
NASA demands bouncing... by RevWaldo · 2013-12-27 07:44 · Score: 2

...followed by rolling, followed by rolling of the third type.

.

--
Prisencolinensinainciusol. Ol Rait!
1. Re:NASA demands bouncing... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-27 08:08 · Score: 0
  
  These balls are making me testy.
  Best. Line. Ever.
Wake me up when it's actually built by Rosco+P.+Coltrane · 2013-12-27 07:46 · Score: 2

NASA is extremely good at burning through gigabucks doing design studies, 99.9% of which are never built. This is just another one of those designs. I'll be impressed when I see it strapped to a rocket and sent up.

--
"A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
1. Re:Wake me up when it's actually built by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-27 08:26 · Score: 3, Informative
  
  NASA is extremely good at burning through gigabucks doing design studies, 99.9% of which are never built.
  It turns out that if you make the things without the design studies, you end up wasting terabucks.
2. Re:Wake me up when it's actually built by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-27 08:42 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  Want to talk about gigabucks
  in 2011, NASA had a smaller budget than the military air conditioning bill in Iraq/Afghanistan
  http://www.npr.org/2011/06/25/137414737/among-the-costs-of-war-20b-in-air-conditioning
3. Re:Wake me up when it's actually built by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-27 11:33 · Score: 0
  
  But employed 10 times fewer people.
4. Re:Wake me up when it's actually built by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-27 12:23 · Score: 0
  
  They also weren't invading countries and killing people.
"..and besides..." by Smidge204 · 2013-12-27 07:47 · Score: 3, Funny

"It works in Kerbal Space Program."
=Smidge=
1. Re:"..and besides..." by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-27 08:22 · Score: 0
  
  Boy am I glad you signed your post, otherwise I would have thought that between logging in and pressing "submit" someone broke into your house, bound you up and used your account to comment.
  Wait a minute... What happened to the 203 other Smidges? Why didn't you sign Smidge204?
2. Re:"..and besides..." by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-27 09:10 · Score: 0
  
  There can be only one!
Those titanians wont know what hit them... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-27 07:50 · Score: 1

The Elders tell of a young ball much like you. He bounced three metres in the air. Then he bounced 1.8 metres in the air. Then he bounced four metres in the air. Do I make myself clear?
I don't understand by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-27 07:53 · Score: 0

Why not send one brain thingy that orbits Titan and another wheel thingy that does the roving?
1. Re:I don't understand by Immerman · 2013-12-27 09:44 · Score: 2
  
  A few reasons spring to mind:
  * Especially with a "messy" mobility system like this, reaction times matter. Granted, when directly overhead 100km only adds about a millisecond of minimum additional round-trip lightspeed lag, but most of the time your satellite will be considerably further away.
  * your satellite is in orbit - meaning around 1/2 to 3/4 of the time the planet is between you and your brain, more if you're in a valley. Better hope you're not in a perilous situation when the cord gets cut, and you'll only have a few hours at a time of "brain link" at a time. You could extend that by orbitting higher, but that means longer "braindead" periods as well, and greater lag.
  * bandwidth - you're navigating via computer vision system, and a live video stream is about as bandwidth-intensive as you can get. And more surface-to-orbit bandwidth comes with very definite power costs.
  * and finally - What's the benefit? The brain is a solid-state system, and thus pretty much impervious to anything that doesn't damage the mechanical components. Moreover, offloading the the brain to an orbiter doesn't eliminate the need for a brain in the rover - it'll be a much simpler brain if all it's doing is passing data back and forth, but if it has enough horsepower to handle the real-time video compression you'd almost certainly want, it's probably got more than enough horsepower to actually run the rover directly.
  
  --
  --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
be careful by albeit+unknown · 2013-12-27 07:55 · Score: 4, Funny

Caution: Super Ball Bot may suddenly accelerate to dangerous speeds. Super Ball Bot contains a liquid core, which, if exposed due to rupture, should not be touched, inhaled, or looked at. Discontinue use of Super Ball Bot if any of the following occurs: itching, vertigo, dizziness, tingling in extremities, loss of balance or coordination, slurred speech, temporary blindness, profuse sweating, or heart palpitations. If Super Ball Bot begins to smoke, get away immediately. Seek shelter and cover head. Do not taunt Super Ball Bot.
Titan will welcome new NASA Tumbleweed Overlords by retroworks · 2013-12-27 07:57 · Score: 1

It moves more like a tumbleweed than a superball. And I remember seeing many tumbleweeds around Roswell, NM, come to think of it.

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Gently reply
Science Boner. by RightSaidFred99 · 2013-12-27 08:00 · Score: 1

You know, I hate war and death and whatnot but some of the technology and equipment of the military gives me what I like to call a War Boner.
This gives me a Science Boner. That's god damn cool, looks like something you'd read about in a science fiction book 20 years ago.
1. Re:Science Boner. by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-27 18:16 · Score: 0
  
  Military technology and engineering has always been out paced civilian technology. If you are involved in war and people are coming to kill you there is no such thing as a budget. As adversaries are always trying to counter the technology your adversaries develop. In the modern age the advancements made by all sides during WW2 illustrates how far and fast technology can be developed when prioritized over everything else. The US program to go to the moon also advanced and leveraged the US ICBM missile development giving the US temporary dominance over the Soviets in that era. Military avionic, satellite, HMI, and computer technology advancements also filters down to the civilian market.
Obligatory Zap Brannigan by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-27 08:01 · Score: 0

Those balls have got a lot of ... uh ... hutzpah.
Just wondering by rossdee · 2013-12-27 08:02 · Score: 1

Hpw is it going to get to Titan in the first place? Do we have a rocket that can go that far these days?
1. Re:Just wondering by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-27 08:17 · Score: 0
  
  We can send things outside the solar system, for any reasonable definition of "outside the solar system." I'm sure we can get one to fall into a moon part of the way out.
2. Re:Just wondering by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-27 08:21 · Score: 0
  
  SpaceX
3. Re:Just wondering by Em+Adespoton · 2013-12-27 08:24 · Score: 1
  
  We can send things outside the solar system, for any reasonable definition of "outside the solar system." I'm sure we can get one to fall into a moon part of the way out.
  
  Do we have a rocket that can go that far these days?
  The stuff sent out of the solar system was sent in the 70's -- a lot has changed at JPL/NASA since then.
  Even the stuff last sent to Titan was sent before the dot com bubble burst, wasn't it? It just took a while to get there.
  Of course, if this thing is in the planning stages, it'll be 2020 before it is "ready to roll" at which point who knows if we'll have a rocket capable of sending something to Titan again....
4. Re:Just wondering by Immerman · 2013-12-27 09:53 · Score: 2
  
  >Do we have a rocket that can go that far these days?
  Certainly. The discovery of the "gravitational slingshot" Interplanetary Transport Network decades ago means we can get pretty much anywhere in the solar system with no more energy than it takes to escape the Earth, it just takes a while.
  
  --
  --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
5. Re:Just wondering by radarskiy · 2013-12-27 14:49 · Score: 1
  
  New Horizons was launched in 2006. If an Atlas V can launch one of the fastest things ever, why do you think it could not get something to Titan?
HFB by SuricouRaven · 2013-12-27 08:07 · Score: 2

Do not taunt Happy Fun Ball
Exposed? by spasm · 2013-12-27 08:17 · Score: 2

"These same cables could be used to pull back parts of the robot, so that science instruments at the center could be exposed and used."
Ok, for the first time ever a goat.sx reference would actually be appropriate.
Potential problem not obvious in video by SuperKendall · 2013-12-27 08:33 · Score: 1

Just from experience in moving spindly legs around rubble (camera tripod), I can see one potential issue the video doesn't make clear - the support struts can easily get wedged in rocks as they move around. Hopefully it can detect this before it bends a strut.

--
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
1. Re:Potential problem not obvious in video by Immerman · 2013-12-27 09:56 · Score: 1
  
  It looks to me like, unlike a tripod, the support struts all end in 3+ cables connecting to the ends of other struts. Pretty hard to get jammed in a crack when you've got a big spindly "foot" on the end of each rod.
  
  --
  --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
2. Re:Potential problem not obvious in video by SuperKendall · 2013-12-27 11:16 · Score: 1
  
  Sure, but often the device twists in such a way that the various legs are nearly combined.
  Also I have had rocks turn over on splayed tripod legs, so the middle of the segments laying over rocky areas may not be safe.
  I'm just saying real-life rocks are a lot trickier and more treacherous than the Tron Cubes they have pitted it against thus far.
  
  --
  "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Titan for now, but think of the possibilities by Theaetetus · 2013-12-27 08:33 · Score: 1

At some point, we will be able to proudly declare that Earth has bounced its balls off Uranus.
A risky endevor. by VortexCortex · 2013-12-27 08:55 · Score: 1

One rule of engineering success is less complexity, fewer moving parts.
Another rule is redundancy.
This project pits them against each other. Where a proposed solution meets contradictory design goals you discover either disaster or elegance.
The greatest and most ancient tool employed by all self improving systems -- even life, neural networks, and science itself -- is to throw things against the wall and see if they stick. This ball bounces, plops, or rolls. I'll be interested to see if can stick, as nature's ameobic design has before.

Titan is a volatile rich, chemically active moon with a complex methane cycle. Dunes, craters, fluvial valleys, and lake shores are among the primary target sites for future Titan missions. While a tensegrity platform can potentially be used on all these sites, here we focus on lake shores since they provide a high scientific return do to the interaction between a liquid and solid surface, and the atmosphere.
Hmm. Well, then you're going to need to a covering then otherwise the bot will just be a collection of sticks in the mud. I have no doubt their genetic algorithms will emerge movement strategies; However, I noticed that all the test cases and simulations show hard surfaces. Strange if you consider the composition of the dunes and shores you're targeting. Perhaps just deploying a bunch and hoping that at least one doesn't get stuck shortly after landing is enough redundancy? I'm not so sure myself.
Amoebas have semi-permeable coverings. A covering would mean that exposing the instruments would be a complicated process prone to failure, and filling up with material. Perhaps if in a starburst configuration each instrument could use a rod as a guide? Ah, but that's not the design proposed.
1. Re:A risky endevor. by CaptainLard · 2013-12-27 10:12 · Score: 1
  
  One rule of engineering success is less complexity, fewer moving parts.
  Curiosity's sky crane showed that's more of a guideline than a rule. I think these crazy contraptions are great. I bet NASA will figure it out if congress lets them...
"I am not a number!" The Rover rover is coming! by Accordion+Noir · 2013-12-27 08:59 · Score: 1

They say in the video they could have dozens of them operating together. Did anybody else think of old TV shows, and prepare to panic?
The Rover, "a floating white ball that could coerce, and, if necessary, disable inhabitants of The Village, primarily Number Six."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rover_(The_Prisoner)
If they come back to Earth like that old Venus probe, we're in trouble.
http://bionic.wikia.com/wiki/Death_Probe
(Yeah, I remember these episodes of the Six Million Dollar Man from when they came out. I strongly suspect they were not as good as the Prisoner.)

--
"Ruthlessly pursuing the idea that the accordion is just another instrument."
Re:"I am not a number!" The Rover rover is coming! by wcrowe · 2013-12-27 09:41 · Score: 1

That is PRECISELY the first thing I thought of, and you beat me to the post. Man, that show freaked me out the first time I saw it, when I was a kid.

--
Proverbs 21:19
Re:"I am not a number!" The Rover rover is coming! by RevSpaminator · 2013-12-27 10:01 · Score: 1

"We want information...information."
Re:"I am not a number!" The Rover rover is coming! by richlv · 2013-12-27 11:28 · Score: 1

actually, that show was transported back in time. it was shot on titan

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Rich
tumbleweeds by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-27 12:04 · Score: 0

so... tumbleweeds are secretly sending data about us back to their alien overlords?
Vytas SunSpiral by taiwanjohn · 2013-12-27 23:55 · Score: 1

...is the actual name of a leading researcher in this area. He gave a rather fascinating Google TechTalk a few weeks ago. Well worth the time.

--
XML is like violence. If it doesn't solve your problem, you're not using enough of it. --AC
true... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-28 05:35 · Score: 0

...but you can't have everything...
Infornmative Sci-Fi links... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-28 05:44 · Score: 0

Read Porges' short story "The Ruum".
It tells the story of an alien robot using this kind of movement technology left to gather specimens in the age of the dinosaurs.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Ruum
http://mrcampbellrocks.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/The-Ruum-by-Arthur-Porges-Full-Text.pdf