Court Rejects Fox's Attempt to Use Aereo Ruling Against Dish's Hopper

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Court Rejects Fox's Attempt to Use Aereo Ruling Against Dish's Hopper

Posted by Unknown on Tuesday July 15, 2014 @12:04AM from the spacetime-shifting-is-not-a-crime dept.

Fox and Dish have been locking horns over Dish over its streaming and PVR services for a while now, and immediately after the Aereo ruling Fox sought an injunction against Dish's services. The court rejected the request. From the article: Fox pointed out the Supremes had reflected Aereo's argument (which it said was Dish's as well) that a performance was not public under the Copyright Act if each sub watches a unique stream. Fox's lawyer, Richard Stone, argued that Aereo was also essentially about attaching a Slingbox to a DVR. But that got some pushback. One judge countered that it was "completely different technology" and said that while that was the argument, "the Supreme court has all sorts of caveats in the opinion about how this was about Aereo and nothing else and a lot of the 'nothing elses' seem to be pretty similar to Slingbox." The underlying case will continue moving forward (going to trial in early 2015).

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Need a EULA for video by paiute · 2014-07-15 00:11 · Score: 5, Interesting

The networks want to be paid every time a consumer watches a program, live, recorded, restreamed, or whatever. I am surprised that they do not insert a screen before every show reading something along the lines of 'I agree not to redirect the following content.' If the user does not agree with that, they are instructed to stop the program at that point.

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1. Re:Need a EULA for video by SJHillman · 2014-07-15 00:18 · Score: 5, Insightful
  
  " insert a screen before every show"
  Don't be silly. They'd insert the screen right over the damned show.
2. Re:Need a EULA for video by Charliemopps · 2014-07-15 01:21 · Score: 1
  
  Most EULAs have been found to be non-binding in court... and that wouldn't event count as one given that the user wouldn't have a way to accept or decline it. About the only way EULA's are helpful is in "Breach of contract" situations. If fox were providing the stream to you instead of Dish, and you violated the EULA they could use that to find you in breach of contract and end your service.
3. Re:Need a EULA for video by Aaden42 · 2014-07-15 01:34 · Score: 1
  
  We already have a EULA for video. It’s called “Fair Use.”
  If the broadcaster does not agree with that, they are instructed to stop using public airwaves to disseminate their content and go out of business.
4. Re:Need a EULA for video by Anonymous Coward · 2014-07-15 01:39 · Score: 0
  
  Greed has not limit even artists like actors, writers, musicians, directors, etc. want to be paid for each performance both recorded and live.
5. Re:Need a EULA for video by Anonymous Coward · 2014-07-15 03:33 · Score: 0
  
  Fair use is a defensive doctrine. So you have to get sued first and then clain fair use. And if it goes bad you're hosed.
  That's why I prefer laws that are clear on what your fair use rights are. But that's not how it works in the US of A.
6. Re:Need a EULA for video by gnasher719 · 2014-07-15 05:29 · Score: 1
  
  Most EULAs have been found to be non-binding in court...
  Please give an example.
  
  What's true is that if the EULA says "you may do X only if you do Y", then nobody can force you to do Y, but then you also don't have the right to do X. If you have done X already, you have the choice of deciding whether you do Y, or whether you did X without permission. Whatever is better for you.
7. Re:Need a EULA for video by lister+king+of+smeg · 2014-07-15 07:05 · Score: 1
  
  The networks want to be paid every time a consumer watches a program, live, recorded, restreamed, or whatever. I am surprised that they do not insert a screen before every show reading something along the lines of 'I agree not to redirect the following content.' If the user does not agree with that, they are instructed to stop the program at that point.
  Well if the show is being piped into my dvr and I only watch it latter then the eula would not apply as i "agreed" to it after I had recorded it.
  
  --
  ---Saying gnome 3 is better than windows 8 not so much a compliment as it is damning with light praise.
8. Re:Need a EULA for video by Anonymous Coward · 2014-07-15 09:38 · Score: 0
  
  There's no guarantee that such a thing would even be enforceable in court.
9. Re:Need a EULA for video by Mashiki · 2014-07-15 09:44 · Score: 1
  
  Depends on where you live, outside of the US ELUA's may/do directly conflict with the law to protect consumers. In turn, in several countries because it's not "understandable by a layman" it may be fully revoked. It's a full on country/province/state by place basis, and there's far too much case, statute law to even start giving examples without getting into the legal muck.
  
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  Om, nomnomnom...
10. Re:Need a EULA for video by RyuuzakiTetsuya · 2014-07-15 14:34 · Score: 1
  
  http://youtu.be/a4uC2H10uIo
  Actually, not new.
  The aereo case isn't about user redirection but rather if a company can redirect OTA broadcasts. Shockingly the legal answer is no.
  
  --
  Non impediti ratione cogitationus.
11. Re:Need a EULA for video by slapout · 2014-07-16 05:48 · Score: 1
  
  "Don't be silly. They'd insert the screen right over the damned show."
  Don't be silly. That'd interfere with the commercial they're already showing over the show.
  
  --
  Coder's Stone: The programming language quick ref for iPad
12. Re:Need a EULA for video by JesseMcDonald · 2014-07-16 06:08 · Score: 1
  
  What's true is that if the EULA says "you may do X only if you do Y", then nobody can force you to do Y, but then you also don't have the right to do X.
  That's only true if you needed their permission to do X in the first place. The EULA can't unilaterally revoke your existing rights. Generally the enforceability of a EULA rests on copyright; if you're not doing anything that would violate the copyright, you have no need to agree to the EULA. (And—in the US—simply using media you already have a legal copy of is not a copyright violation; the "temporary copy inside the computer's hard disk or RAM" reasoning originally used to justify most EULAs was struck down ages ago, when the copy is essential to the use of the media.)
  
  --
  "The state is that great fiction by which everyone tries to live at the expense of everyone else." - Bastiat
"The Supremes"? by Sockatume · 2014-07-15 00:19 · Score: 1

Is this a common usage that I'm just coming across?

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No kidding!!! What do you say at this point?
1. Re:"The Supremes"? by Anonymous Coward · 2014-07-15 00:31 · Score: 0
  
  Is this a common usage that I'm just coming across?
  It's nothing new. As it turns out, the popular Motown singing group also determined that it has the authority to "say what the law is" in Marbury v. Madison.
2. Re: "The Supremes"? by bill_mcgonigle · 2014-07-15 00:44 · Score: 1
  
  yes, at least in sarcastic legal circles.
  
  --
  My God, it's Full of Source!
  OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
3. Re:"The Supremes"? by Anonymous Coward · 2014-07-15 01:50 · Score: 0
  
  I've been hearing it used for years. They used it in the movie "The Pelican Brief."
4. Re:"The Supremes"? by Applehu+Akbar · 2014-07-15 02:08 · Score: 4, Funny
  
  Ever since it voted 2-1 to stop in the name of love...
5. Re:"The Supremes"? by Anonymous Coward · 2014-07-15 07:01 · Score: 0
  
  All too common, singing a different iTune now
6. Re:"The Supremes"? by AK+Marc · 2014-07-15 08:51 · Score: 1
  
  It's common usage from those who don't like SCOTUS.
  
  --
  Learn to love Alaska
Can't use duck test and rational argument by duckgod · 2014-07-15 00:20 · Score: 5, Insightful

This is complete bullshit. The argument for Aereo was always that if I can rent an apartment in the same city, hook a slingbox up to an antenna, and stream the tv to my second apartment is legal then so is Aereo. This is what I believe to be a solid legal argument. The Supreme Court decided to go with a walk like a cable company, quack like a cable company than follow the rules of a cable company. Judge Scalia had it right in the dissent "It is not the role of this Court to identify and plug loopholes. It is the role of good lawyers to identify and exploit them, and the role of Congress to eliminate them if it wishes,". This was a loophole around a bullshit law. But it was definitely logically legal loophole.

Now the Fox Lawyers are trying to use this bullshit duck test ruling backwards towards slingbox. Good for the court to quickly reject this Monty Python and the Holy Grail witch logic.
1. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by Impy+the+Impiuos+Imp · 2014-07-15 00:29 · Score: 5, Interesting
  
  Your Aero argument is indeed solid...except for one thing. Congress deliberately mucked it up by preventing cable companies from being able to rebroadcast local broadcast channels, implementing this must-carry-for-free-or-negotiate-for-dollars, tv station decides.
  Congress did it! However, Fox has no leg to stand on, with the the Aero ruling, anyway. You have your signal and shows already and are just using slingbox to transmit it around for you. This doesn't fall afoul of Congress' strange law for must-carry.
  
  --
  (-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
2. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by Anonymous Coward · 2014-07-15 01:01 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  Also, Fox is one of the most fucking restrictive content providers in that they require that you not be allowed to skip past their bullshit advertising. This is probably one of their biggest issues with Dish's Hopper DVR. It got to the point that I stopped watching any Fox shows OnDemand anymore because I can't stand being forced to watch their fucking commercials. That and the fact that if I stop halfway through and don't pick it back up within something like 6 hours, I have to start all over again from the beginning and can't even fast forward to the fucking point where I stopped the last time. That's just consumer abuse!
3. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by NotInHere · 2014-07-15 01:11 · Score: 2
  
  I'm actually happy about fox doing this, as it creates hatred for DRM and such.
4. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by Charliemopps · 2014-07-15 01:24 · Score: 1
  
  I'm actually happy about fox doing this, as it creates hatred for DRM and such.
  False hope... 99.999% of people have no idea what DRM is and don't care. Fox's goal is to squeeze more franchise fees out of Dish. "The Hopper" isn't even all that interesting of a gadget and will likely be dead and gone before this case is even settled. Once the case is settled it'll just be a matter of who's paying whom and will have virtually no impact on consumers other than the legal precedent affecting future products.
5. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by Anonymous Coward · 2014-07-15 01:29 · Score: 0
  
  Except that's not what Aereo is. You arn't renting the apartment and watching the feed from your own TV.
6. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by alen · 2014-07-15 01:36 · Score: 1
  
  why would anyone rent two apartments in the same city?
7. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by Mr+D+from+63 · 2014-07-15 01:41 · Score: 2
  
  This seems to further re-affirm the court's position (agree with it or not) that Aereo is a cable company even though they use the internet for transfer. It will be interesting to see if this opens the door for others who want to do similar. It seems that it would be quite easy to put up a few antennas and servers and create your own local cable company with PC, android and IOS apps on the client end, no need for set top boxes. If enough of these ventures sprang up, they could eventually consolidate and offer some of their own channels/content. A step toward true Ala-cart.
8. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by fuzznutz · 2014-07-15 01:46 · Score: 2
  
  You need to do like I do. Wait two hours after broadcast and pick up your cleaned up, commercial free, HD copy free of charge from the Pirate Bay.
  
  Is your local broadcast interrupted by bullshit - "it's raining outside" - emergency broadcasts?
  Is your local broadcast preempted by football or baseball games that run too long?
  Does your local broadcast shrink to half size to show the lottery results or other "important" information?
  
  No problem... Pirate bay has a clean copy.
9. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by macromorgan · 2014-07-15 01:47 · Score: 1
  
  While I wish Aereo had won, I can see the argument against them as a "re-broadcaster". If the OTA signal comes in encoded digitally as MPEG2 and is then re-encoded to MPEG4 to make it use less bandwidth, that is in a sense rebroadcasting. If they transmitted the data from the antenna down the wire using the much less efficient encoding option it might have been different in my view. I do believe, however, that Aereo acting as a re-broadcaster is entitled to the same statutory license as all cable and satellite companies, and if they pay re-transmission fees they should be allowed to run their business as they had done before. I just hope Aereo offers a package soon that includes traditional cable channels. When this happens, we'll see exactly why the cable companies have fought against common carriage laws and net neutrality laws; they seek to prevent anyone from competing with their traditional services.
10. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by odie5533 · 2014-07-15 01:50 · Score: 1
  
  If the OTA signal comes in encoded digitally as MPEG2 and is then re-encoded to MPEG4 to make it use less bandwidth, that is in a sense rebroadcasting.
  What I choose to do with my files on my rented server for my own personal use should be only my business.
11. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by mark-t · 2014-07-15 01:58 · Score: 2
  
  The biggest argument against Aero, I think, lies in that the fact that they were doing it for commercial gain... As a general principle, they weren't actually doing anything that it isn't completely legal for a private person to do for their own purposes, but as soon as you throw making any money while doing it into the mix, any recordings that you make no longer qualify simply as "private home viewing" and are thus ineligible for copyright infringement exemption.
  
  --
  File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
12. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by Anonymous Coward · 2014-07-15 02:04 · Score: 0
  
  The argument against Aereo was rooted in a practice from 40+ years ago, from a time before "cable" TV.
  Radio transmissions have always had dead zones. It wasn't until very recently that decent antennas and DSP became available to pluck any old crappy signal out of the noise. So there used to be "community antenna TV" systems (that's why it's labeled "CATV" on the back of your TV, and not "Cable"). This is where a guy that lived on a hill where the signal was good would put up a bigass antenna (or antenna farm, depending on the need), and run wires building-to-building in the area to feed the antenna signal to the community. He would usually charge a small fee to maintain this setup (and make a handy profit to put food on his table).
  Broadcasters cried foul and demanded CATV operators fork over some of the profits because, uh, reasons. They're "unfairly" profiting off the broadcasters' free signal and blah, blah, blah. It was a bullshit argument back then, too, but the broadcasters convinced (read: bribed) Congress to do something about it.
  Fast forward to the Aereo case and you have a guy in good signal range putting up an antenna farm and sending the signal over a wire (in whatever format) to someone who pays for access to the CATV system. That's why SCOTUS ruled against Aereo. It's not that someone couldn't do it for themselves. It's that they couldn't do it for themselves and turn a profit on it without sharing that profit with the broadcasters, which Congress was explicitly bribed^H^H^H^H^H^Hpetitioned to prevent by means of a law.
13. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by Anonymous Coward · 2014-07-15 02:10 · Score: 0
  
  Yeah, I've tried to explain the issue to my family more than once. They just shrug and go back to watching "American Idol."
14. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by Bill_the_Engineer · 2014-07-15 02:11 · Score: 0
  
  This seems to further re-affirm the court's position (agree with it or not) that Aereo is a cable company even though they use the internet for transfer.
  Why would we not agree? It doesn't matter what media or protocol being used to forward the television signal. What mattered was that Aereo provided a service to forward all the live broadcasts to you which seems very similar to the early cable companies. We had wireless cable companies in the 90's. The fact that they were wireless didn't diminish their ability to be a cable service.
  Slingbox is very different. It's a personal device that does nothing but forward a single channel from your own cable box (or DirectTV receiver) to your current location.
  
  --
  These comments are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of my employer or colleagues...
15. Re: Can't use duck test and rational argument by jd2112 · 2014-07-15 02:17 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  One for the wife and one for the mistress?
  
  --
  Any insufficiently advanced magic is indistinguishable from technology.
16. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by GTRacer · 2014-07-15 02:22 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  Slingbox is very different. It's a personal device that does nothing but forward a single channel from your own cable box (or DirectTV receiver) to your current location.
  Um, that's EXACTLY what Aereo was doing. A single antenna, tuned to a single broadcast, streamed to a single IN-MARKET user. My dad and I actually discussed this over the weekend. He sided with the broadcasters cos Aereo was for-profit. That was it. He agreed with me on the technical merits but disagreed Kanojia, Diller et. al. should be able to profit.
  
  --
  Defending IP by destroying access to it? That makes sense, RIAA/MPAA. Go to the corner until you can play nice!
17. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by unitron · 2014-07-15 02:39 · Score: 1
  
  why would anyone rent two apartments in the same city?
  Wife/mistress/'50s movie plot line
  or Family/Place to do kinky stuff they don't know about
  
  --
  I see even classic Slashdot is now pretty much unusable on dial up anymore.
18. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by Mr+D+from+63 · 2014-07-15 03:00 · Score: 1
  
  Some don't agree. I don't fully agree. My point was that it doesn't matter fro this discussion. But alas, we are redirected back to it anyway.
19. Re: Can't use duck test and rational argument by Anonymous Coward · 2014-07-15 03:21 · Score: 0
  
  In most cases, you would end up paying for the Ex-Wife's apartment and one for you without the hopes of having a mistress because you are broke.
20. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by stdarg · 2014-07-15 04:00 · Score: 1
  
  If Aereo set up the same antenna, the same DVR, the same transcoding hardware, but they came out to your house and did it on your property, then I would think it's pretty clearly legal. Even if they charged you for it. Because of that, I don't think it's the money that makes it legally problematic. It's just an idiotic opinion by the Supreme Court. They happen from time to time. Their insistence that this only applies to Aereo and not the underlying technology implies that they understand the technology is fine, they just don't like Aereo for doing it for some reason.
21. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by Isca · 2014-07-15 04:16 · Score: 1
  
  And that's why the supremes very carefully tried to say this only affects aero.
22. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by spire3661 · 2014-07-15 04:51 · Score: 1
  
  The whole problem is Congress passed protectionist legislation when this was brought up in the 70s. This protectionist legislation is what stopped Aereo, not actual logical law.
  
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  Good-bye
23. Re: Can't use duck test and rational argument by frank_adrian314159 · 2014-07-15 05:10 · Score: 1
  
  The scenario here is so unlikely for the normal Slashdot reader as to render your point moot here.
  
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  That is all.
24. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by jedidiah · 2014-07-15 07:20 · Score: 1
  
  They were full of shit and they knew it.
  
  --
  A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
25. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by mark-t · 2014-07-15 11:24 · Score: 1
  
  If it is on your own property then *you* are the one doing the recording, and not aero. The private home viewing exemption to copyright infringement enables you to record programs... But if you start collecting fees fom other people to record stuff for them, then you are forgoing that exemption.
  
  --
  File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
26. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by Ichijo · 2014-07-15 13:39 · Score: 1
  
  If it is on your own property then *you* are the one doing the recording, and not aero.
  
  And if the equipment is in a colocation facility owned neither by you nor by Aereo, then the colocation facility is the one doing the recording?
  
  --
  Any sufficiently unpopular but cohesive argument is indistinguishable from trolling.
27. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by Rich0 · 2014-07-15 14:47 · Score: 1
  
  While I think that the laws around Copyright need massive reform, I do have a problem with the "not our job to plug loopholes" mentality.
  It is impossible to create a law free of loopholes. The law is static, and people are not. There will always be a way around the letter of the law, and that means that a country that forces itself to be bound by the letter of the law basically ends up not being ruled by laws at all.
  What the Supreme Court needs to do is issue a ruling that says, "We find that the tax shelter employed by Acme Corp to be completely legal and compliant with IRS guidelines. Nevertheless, we fine it $1B anyway just to prove the point that companies should pay taxes, a figure that is 3x higher than what they would have paid if they just took the marginal rate times their gross revenue without applying any deductions at all." Sure, it would be arbitrary and capricious, and that is the point. Lawyers would then realize that if they pushed things too far, they could end up getting their heads lopped off, so to speak, and that would lead to moderation, which is what makes laws work well.
  I know a judge who gave a presentation on ethics in his area of practice to a room full of lawyers. He said that the theme of 95% of the Q&A was around identifying just how much a lawyer could push the rules before they'd get sanctioned. It would be like walking up to a police officer and asking them if you'd get pulled over for going 60 in a 55 zone, then asking if 65 was ok, then if 70 was ok, and then if 69.5 was ok, and so on. There was really no interest in just doing the right thing for its own sake.
28. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by mark-t · 2014-07-15 15:14 · Score: 1
  
  Even if they do not own it, they still rent or lease it... regardless, it is their responsibility.
  The private home viewing recording exemption to copyright applies to private home recording only... not to companies or even to individuals who would seek monetary compensation by recording content for absolutely anyone else who will pay for it. That puts them squarely into the content of broadcasting, and although it's not illegal to be a broadcaster in general, being a broadcaster doesn't automatically negate copyright infringement... the licensing fees that broadcasters pay to distribute content is so that they can *GET* permission to broadcast it without infringing on copyright.
  
  --
  File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
29. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by Bill_the_Engineer · 2014-07-16 00:58 · Score: 1
  
  Except Aereo was providing the rebroadcast. With sling box you are redirecting broadcasts from your own home. The courts saw little difference between leasing an antenna and providing a subscription service and saw the former as an attempt to provide the latter without having to pay rebroadcast fees to the local affiliates.
  
  --
  These comments are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of my employer or colleagues...
30. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by Bill_the_Engineer · 2014-07-16 02:22 · Score: 1
  
  Fox is the redirecting us to this discussion by trying to apply the Aereo ruling to their case. I'm in agreement with you that despite Fox's best efforts the Aereo ruling isn't a factor in this case, since we are talking about what people do with their video once it reaches the confines of their own homes.
  
  --
  These comments are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of my employer or colleagues...
31. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by GTRacer · 2014-07-16 03:19 · Score: 1
  
  I'll be honest here - I didn't read the "Cablevision" decision validating third-party DVR operation on the behalf of a customer. But what it says to me is that Aereo is taking a legal, single OTA broadcast reception, storing it in a third-party DVR and making it available to a customer who is already entitled to that OTA broadcast by being in-market.
  
  I *still* don't see how any of what they did violated the LETTER of the law. And as Number 1.0 said, technically correct is the best kind of correct.
  
  Maybe what I need to see is this clarified: Could I, as a New Yorker, rent a rooftop in the city, put up an antenna and run a wire to my ground floor apartment several blocks over? If the answer is yes, then why can't Aereo do the same thing on my behalf? Where does it say I have to OWN the antenna and transmission medium versus RENT?
  
  --
  Defending IP by destroying access to it? That makes sense, RIAA/MPAA. Go to the corner until you can play nice!
32. Re: Can't use duck test and rational argument by gmhowell · 2014-07-16 03:39 · Score: 1
  
  In most cases, you would end up paying for the Ex-Wife's apartment and one for you without the hopes of having a mistress because you are broke.
  If you need money to get companionship, you may want to invest that same money into buying a personality.
  
  --
  Jesus was all right but his disciples were thick and ordinary. -John Lennon
33. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by Bill_the_Engineer · 2014-07-16 07:18 · Score: 1
  
  Maybe what I need to see is this clarified: Could I, as a New Yorker, rent a rooftop in the city, put up an antenna and run a wire to my ground floor apartment several blocks over? If the answer is yes, then why can't Aereo do the same thing on my behalf? Where does it say I have to OWN the antenna and transmission medium versus RENT?
  To paraphrase the SCOTUS: Because Aereo is not only an equipment provider but also a service provider, the supreme court ruled that the business model that Aereo operated under was substantially similar to a cable system that the fact that Aereo didn't constantly transmit a signal but instead was directly controlled by the customer didn't provide a significant enough technological difference to warrant not treating them as a cable system.
  The original purpose of a cable TV system was to provide reception of OTA broadcasts to areas (within the broadcast market) which may have difficulty receiving those same signals via outdoor antenna. According to SCOTUS, Aereo didn't do anything significantly different.
  
  --
  These comments are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of my employer or colleagues...
34. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by Bill_the_Engineer · 2014-07-16 07:39 · Score: 1
  
  Um, that's EXACTLY what Aereo was doing.
  Excluding the part where slingbox users are the end-to-end owners of their personal redirect service and Aereo being a for-profit company in the business of leasing access to an antenna, I can see how you can think of them being the exact same thing.
  
  --
  These comments are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of my employer or colleagues...
35. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by GTRacer · 2014-07-17 02:40 · Score: 1
  
  The original purpose of a cable TV system was to provide reception of OTA broadcasts to areas [...]
  I get this part. But the difference I see is that the CATV operator is taking a good OTA signal and MULTICASTING that signal to whomever wants to tune to that channel out of the total channels in the pipe. Aereo is NOT multicasting - they're maintaining a one-to-one relationship between a received OTA signal and the user tuned to it. Only one channel's signal is in Aereo's feed to the customer at any given time. Unicast, as it were.
  
  Again, they do the same sort of thing a CATV does, but by aggregating several discrete receptions across several discrete connections. This to my IANAL eyes is why Aereo should have been allowed to continue until someone changed laws regarding OTA reception and access.
  
  --
  Defending IP by destroying access to it? That makes sense, RIAA/MPAA. Go to the corner until you can play nice!
36. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by Bill_the_Engineer · 2014-07-17 05:59 · Score: 1
  
  Again, they do the same sort of thing a CATV does, but by aggregating several discrete receptions across several discrete connections. This to my IANAL eyes is why Aereo should have been allowed to continue until someone changed laws regarding OTA reception and access.
  The act used to define and regulate a cable system only specifies that the cable system sends video transmissions directly to the subscriber and makes no mention about the protocol or method used to send that video transmission over wire or cable. So the fact that Aereo used discrete transmissions versus multicasting isn't relevant to the act.
  
  --
  These comments are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of my employer or colleagues...
37. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by GTRacer · 2014-07-17 07:12 · Score: 1
  
  Hi Bill! First, I want to thank you for taking the time to discuss this with me! Second, I promise I'm not trying to be thick. I believe in my position and am using this back-and-to to clarify and refine my thoughts.
  
  As to Aereo, I thought the core issue came down to the public performance threshold. Multicasting is in effect, a public performance, right? Requiring cumpulsory licensing?
  
  If Aereo truly is private performance, bolstered by previously-approved technical measures like remote DVR, I don't get the issue other than the broadcasters aren't getting paid for something they have to give away already.
  
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  Defending IP by destroying access to it? That makes sense, RIAA/MPAA. Go to the corner until you can play nice!
38. Re:Can't use duck test and rational argument by stdarg · 2014-07-21 01:56 · Score: 1
  
  You're contradicting yourself.. if you're saying whoever rents or leases it is responsible, then if you're renting an antenna from Aereo, you are the one using the equipment and its use falls under your responsibilities and rights.
Dish has 2 different services by Anonymous Coward · 2014-07-15 01:58 · Score: 0

Dish has movie streaming ala Blockbuster@Home just like Netflix.
Dish has satellite feeds to their customers homes.
Period. That's all they have.
Slingbox is a tech that lets the consumer "sling" or "stream" content from their house to any of their devices that they'd like to watch from.
Only one device can watch content per slingbox. One slingbox, one viewer.
Stupid f'ing FOX is just pissed because they can't find a way to sue Dish out of offering auto-hop - a technology that allows shows recorded on the Dish unit with commercials to skip over the commercials.
And of course... by unitron · 2014-07-15 02:43 · Score: 1

...now that they've been told that they're not what they said they were, but actually a cable company, Aereo is looking to stay in business by paying the same money per channel to the broadcasters (who were happy about the ruling right up to this point) as the actual cable companies do, and the broadcasters are having a cow and claiming Aereo isn't a cable company.

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I see even classic Slashdot is now pretty much unusable on dial up anymore.
Study first, then appeal by fibonacci8 · 2014-07-15 03:13 · Score: 1

Essentially the judge points out that a different case requires a different trial. This also means more arguments to study for appealing the Aereo ruling. If Dish's lawyers poke holes in Fox's arguments that led to the Aereo ruling, those arguments are fair game for Aereo's lawyers to use if they're applicable.

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Inheritance is the sincerest form of nepotism.
1. Re:Study first, then appeal by Zordak · 2014-07-15 03:53 · Score: 1
  
  Essentially the judge points out that a different case requires a different trial. This also means more arguments to study for appealing the Aereo ruling. If Dish's lawyers poke holes in Fox's arguments that led to the Aereo ruling, those arguments are fair game for Aereo's lawyers to use if they're applicable.
  I think you misunderstand the "Supreme" part of the "Supreme Court," and the legal doctrine of res judicata.
  
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  Today's Sesame Street was brought to you by the number e.
2. Re:Study first, then appeal by stdarg · 2014-07-15 04:01 · Score: 1
  
  Aereo lost at the Supreme Court, there's nowhere else to appeal. They could change their business model/technology slightly, re-open, and wait to get sued again though.
3. Re:Study first, then appeal by spire3661 · 2014-07-15 04:53 · Score: 1
  
  All that needs to be done is for Congress to repeal their protectionist law on the subject. We are in this mess because of case law from the 70s.
  
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  Good-bye
4. Re:Study first, then appeal by stdarg · 2014-07-15 05:18 · Score: 1
  
  True, it's silly that cable companies have to pay rebroadcast fees either. The content is available free to the subscriber, it shouldn't matter which middle men are involved. I would, however, distinguish between middle men who edit the broadcast (such as cable companies inserting their own commercials into a show, or even minor things like adding an overlay) versus those who simply retransmit it (even including things like transcoding or changing mediums).
Fine by Anonymous Coward · 2014-07-15 03:56 · Score: 0

I'll just torrent the shit.