Robot Operating System To Officially Support ARM Processors

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Robot Operating System To Officially Support ARM Processors

Posted by Soulskill on Saturday September 13, 2014 @04:55AM from the more-cpu-options-for-your-terminator dept.

DeviceGuru writes: The Open Source Robotics Foundation (OSRF), which maintains the open source Robot Operating System (ROS), has announced its first formal support for an ARM target. The organization will add support for the Qualcomm Snapdragon 600, a smartphone-oriented, quad-core, Cortex-A15-like system-on-chip running up to 1.7GHz. The Linux version of ROS for Snapdragon 600 will be available in Q4 of this year, with the Android version due in the first half of 2015. The OSRF will test, refine, and fully integrate support for the ARM instruction set architecture into ROS development efforts. OSRF will also perform ongoing maintenance to support ROS on the Snapdragon 600.

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Linux version first? by cyber-vandal · 2014-09-13 05:06 · Score: 1

Surely the Android version would be the more appropriate.
1. Re:Linux version first? by CurryCamel · 2014-09-13 06:12 · Score: 1
  
  If ROS is the operating system (I'm assuming the userland from context, never heard of this before now) and Linux is the kernel, then what does an "android version" even mean? Its not evident from TFAs.
  And what the heck have the robots been running on up till now? x86-windows?
2. Re:Linux version first? by Anonymous Coward · 2014-09-13 06:15 · Score: 0
  
  And, whoosh! cyber-vandal's humour goes right over the head...
3. Re:Linux version first? by davester666 · 2014-09-13 06:26 · Score: 0
  
  It means the manufacturer of the hardware has skinned the OS to jazz it up a bit, then loaded it up with a bunch of apps that you try once and never use again, but you cannot delete.
  
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4. Re:Linux version first? by ArcadeMan · 2014-09-13 06:31 · Score: 0
  
  I don't see the need for a Robot Operating System anyway. Wouldn't it be more efficient to write everything in assembly since there's only one Data?
  
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5. Re:Linux version first? by WarJolt · 2014-09-13 07:38 · Score: 2
  
  Android is Java. Although ROS supports multiple language bindings the core is written in cpp.
  Google has a rosjava port. Multiple machines can run in a single ROS system, so the rosjava port is usually used to create Android UI applications to control or view information in a multi-machine ROS system.
  ROS development is tied very closely to Ubuntu. Some things work on Mac OSX, but that's because it's Unix based and the built system was easier to adapt. Windows support is practically non-existent because to build system is not well-suited for non-unix systems. You would have an easier time getting rosjava to work.
  Really the reason ARM is supported easily is because it's simply a recompilation. Most of the Ubuntu packages that are required are already available for ARM. Full Android support is significantly more difficult.
6. Re:Linux version first? by Anonymous Coward · 2014-09-13 07:53 · Score: 1
  
  ROS is not an OS, its just middleware that runs on Linux
7. Re:Linux version first? by WarJolt · 2014-09-13 08:13 · Score: 1
  
  In their introduction they use the term meta-operating system.
  ROS is an open-source, meta-operating system for your robot. It provides the services you would expect from an operating system, including hardware abstraction, low-level device control, implementation of commonly-used functionality, message-passing between processes, and package management. It also provides tools and libraries for obtaining, building, writing, and running code across multiple computers. http://wiki.ros.org/ROS/Introd...
8. Re: Linux version first? by backslashdot · 2014-09-13 08:13 · Score: 1
  
  How is that even possible? Android is essentially a Linux distribution. It's like saying you want it to work on Sprint before it works on a phone network. Though come to think of it Sprint might not be one given their spotty coverage.
9. Re:Linux version first? by Anonymous Coward · 2014-09-13 10:10 · Score: 0
  
  What do you mean by "one data"?
10. Re:Linux version first? by Anonymous Coward · 2014-09-14 03:33 · Score: 0
  
  Biggest problem with non-x86 SoCs are the GPUs(if any). They're all proprietary, release primarily for Android, and occasionally for linux IF you're LUCKY, and the OSS drivers are even in worse shape than radeon & nouveau... nVidia Tegra K1 is about the only thing contributing(semi-actively) to nouveau as far as ARM GPU drivers go, but still...
  OTOH if you go to SoClike(well they at least have integrated GPUs amongst other former chipset component onboard nowadays) x86s, e.g. kaveri, broadwell you have access to nearly continuously updated OSS GPU drivers for linux, and in the case of AMD the fglrx drivers as well.
We'll of course it will by 93+Escort+Wagon · 2014-09-13 05:10 · Score: 3, Funny

Many robots have arms - the OS needs to be able to control their processes.

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1. Re:We'll of course it will by Kozar_The_Malignant · 2014-09-13 05:18 · Score: 1
  
  What about their legs?
  
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2. Re:We'll of course it will by Anonymous Coward · 2014-09-13 05:30 · Score: 0
  
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...
3. Re:We'll of course it will by Anonymous Coward · 2014-09-13 05:47 · Score: 0
  
  Not in this case. They are talking about a smart fleshlight.
4. Re:We'll of course it will by ArcadeMan · 2014-09-13 06:32 · Score: 1
  
  A robot OS has to be able to control multiple tentacles simultaneously otherwise the Japanese won't use it.
  
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5. Re:We'll of course it will by penguinoid · 2014-09-13 07:02 · Score: 1
  
  Robots are up in ARMs about the new controllers for their arms.
  
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6. Re:We'll of course it will by 93+Escort+Wagon · 2014-09-13 08:00 · Score: 1
  
  Especially the potty tentacle.
  
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7. Re:We'll of course it will by Tablizer · 2014-09-13 08:27 · Score: 1
  
  That's boring; give them tentacles instead. Is there a TENTACLE chip?
  
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8. Re:We'll of course it will by rgbatduke · 2014-09-13 10:14 · Score: 1
  
  Hmmm, sounds like a commercial opportunity there. The LEG processor? It could be a hit!
  rgb
  
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9. Re:We'll of course it will by LifesABeach · 2014-09-15 05:06 · Score: 1
  
  And for the middle ware processing? The Finger Processor.
Linux version first? by cb88 · 2014-09-13 06:06 · Score: 0

I ran ROS on a Pandaboard running Gentoo/Linux ARM just fine over 2 years ago... the main problem was the pandaboard lacked the processing oomp for alot of things. We were looking at doing 3d SLAM but the fact is I am not sure even the latest ARM boards are up to that... in the end we scalled back our goals to more resonalbe levels. This just makes it officially supported there isn't much effort involved other than possibly actively getting more packages working as my testing was limited to most base packages and not some of the more exotic ones.

Android isn't really appropriate for robots... sure it will work but you'd be better off with Linux IMO, Android focuses on Dalvik/ART whereas Linux supports C/++ Python and Lisp natively which is what ROS runs on, and if you want an interface just write one in QT or Mono/Winforms etc.... since both are cross platform.

I think one thing that would make using ROS alot easier is a tool to develop robot models graphically... as far as can tell they still require that you write the joint transforms manually which is quite hard to get right.
Qualcomm must be funding it. by dbc · 2014-09-13 06:15 · Score: 1

ROS has had portability issues for a long time, but those issues have been getting a lot of attention for at least a couple of years. The build system is much better, for one thing. It should be acknowledged that a lot of people (hobbyists, mainly) have been putting in signficant effort on making an ARM port possible for some time, Raspian on the RasPi being the main target. So while it is a good thing, on balance, that Qualcomm is putting in some money to make it happen, I'm disappointed that the work already done on an ARM port isn't being recognized.
One interesting question that is always worth asking: Why is Qualcomm putting money in? And why are they putting money in now?
Anyway... it's finally nice to have some news for nerds.
1. Re:Qualcomm must be funding it. by Anonymous Coward · 2014-09-13 06:57 · Score: 0
  
  Why is qualcomm interested? IoT
  And that the ROS investment is cheap [really] and as a big academic community. Problem is ROS needs extensive hardening for ARM and it's really not gear for R/T robotic control systems, say used in industrial robotics. They attempted it with OROCOS, but there needs to be something better.
2. Re:Qualcomm must be funding it. by WarJolt · 2014-09-13 08:03 · Score: 4, Informative
  
  Heres the thing about R/T robotic control systems in industrial robotics. The tasks that they run are well defined repetitive tasks that don't change much. The kinds of robotics that we see in Hollywood block busters require significant more intelligence and perception that require a little looser definition of real-time computing.
  What you're talking about is hard real-time requirements. This means that if we miss some timing we have a total systems failure. ROS does not guarantee timing, so you'll have to come up with a different way to handle these. One solution is to have specialized, verifiable hardware the handles those hard real-time requirements. Usually these are things that prevent the robot from damaging itself, property or others.
  There are many applications of robotics that have firm or soft real-time requirements. These are real-time tasks that can be handled by ROS. Robotic perception is something that doesn't really fit into the hard real-time requirement, so we have to think about ways that these systems degrade and fail gracefully when deadlines are missed.
3. Re:Qualcomm must be funding it. by Snotnose · 2014-09-13 08:11 · Score: 1
  
  Qualcomm has a high end ARM attached to all sorts of radios, including 4G and GPS, and dozens if not hundreds of GPIOs. I can see lots of applications for autonomous robots (farmers checking fields or picking crops, the state checking trails, companies cleaning floors/windows, vending machines that phone home when they need a refill, etc etc etc).
  
  Qualcomm isn't necessarily in the business of making cell phones, they're in the business of selling chips.
But can you install it on.. by Anonymous Coward · 2014-09-13 06:21 · Score: 0

Your Nintendo Robotic Operating Buddy?
No legs? No problem by tepples · 2014-09-13 07:57 · Score: 1

Or perhaps Homer's being smart for once by not including unnecessary peripherals. Gus demonstrates.
Includes a decent GPU by Anonymous Coward · 2014-09-13 08:16 · Score: 0

This chip includes an Adreno 320 GPU with full hardware support for OpenGL ES 3.0 in a unified shader architecture. I hope they enable that with Linux. Heck, with Linux support it'd make a nice SoC based microcomputer in a similar form factor and be a LOT faster than a Raspberry Pi.
You insensitive clod! by PPH · 2014-09-13 12:31 · Score: 1

signed,
R2D2

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nice CPU but with what boards? by 4wdloop · 2014-09-13 13:28 · Score: 1

This is nice CPU/SoC but what board are they targetting or thinking people can use? Or are they targeting real phones w/ this SoC (assuming it will run upper layers of "cognition" leaving real-time outside of it)?

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4wdloop
Why does it need to be processor-specific? by RogueWarrior65 · 2014-09-14 02:31 · Score: 1

Why isn't that whole code base in plain C/C++? Aside from hardware layers, it would seem that the higher lever functionality shouldn't be tied to a specific processor.
I'd like to see it in systemd by badkarmadayaccount · 2014-09-14 08:24 · Score: 1

Someone call Poettering. Seriously, seems like they are doing systemd for robots.

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