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First Crowdsourced, Open Data Address List Launches In the UK

The internet is a great place to search for some kinds of information; Amazon (or L.L. Bean, or Digi-Key, or any retailer, really) do their best to connect you with all the products in their databases, and for lots of other search topics, the usual handful of general purpose search engines can ferret out answers based on your keywords. Addresses are sometimes harder to search, but in the UK at least that might soon be much easier: An anonymous reader writes The London based startup and open data advocacy organization Open Addresses UK wants to change all of that by inviting the public to collect and validate housing addresses to build the biggest UK open address dataset ever. To do so, they launched UK's first open and free address list on Wednesday, calling on individuals and companies to crowdsource information." What if you want the equivalent of an unlisted number, though?

33 comments

  1. too late by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    there are no unlisted numbers or addresses
    Look up Intellius and it's business practice

  2. UK Post Office already does this by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    http://www2.postoffice.co.uk/postcode-finder

    1. Re: UK Post Office already does this by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Right, but they charge a lot for programmatic access to, or for offline lists.

      A crowd sourced list gets around Royal Mail's intellectual property and makes this data freely available for anybody to use.

    2. Re:UK Post Office already does this by rapiddescent · · Score: 4, Informative

      The commercial arm of the Royal Mail (not PostOffice Ltd) own the intellectual property of the PAF (Postal Address File) that has a strict data structure of how to store an address for verification purposes. See the PAF Digest PDF for a full 200 page specification of how to write a postal address.

      important for orgs that process addresses and how to process data items like a "double dependent locality" and so on. many big UK companies totally fuck up addresses even though this is specified.

      The main problem with this is that the Royal Mail was privitised so this publically funded data source has now been commercialised and the IPR owned by a company thanks to the tories.

    3. Re:UK Post Office already does this by Richard_at_work · · Score: 1

      The main problem with this is that the Royal Mail was privitised so this publically funded data source has now been commercialised and the IPR owned by a company thanks to the tories.

      Thats not really any different to saying that the publicly funded infrastructure, such as the vans and physical buildings, have now been commercialised.

      Its the Royal Mail which maintains the PAF and the postcode system, so why should the government get income from licensing it?

    4. Re:UK Post Office already does this by Xest · · Score: 1

      Not to intentionally defend the Tories, but this project also only exists thanks to the Tories:

      http://alpha.openaddressesuk.o...

      "How are you funded now?

      Our current funding comes from the Cabinet Officeâ(TM)s Release of Data Fund. This fund is administered by the Open Data User Group and agreed by the Public Sector Transparency Board."

      Oh how they take with one hand and give with the other!

    5. Re:UK Post Office already does this by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The main problem with this is that the Royal Mail was privitised so this publically funded data source has now been commercialised and the IPR owned by a company thanks to the tories.

      Heh. Make jibes at the tories if you must, but hopefully you do realise that a Labour government would also have sold off Royal Mail. And they would probably have made the same mistakes.

  3. Unlisted Identity by Trachman · · Score: 1

    Addresses will be collected. In fact a lot of addresses were available albeit not in an organized manner. The next thing could be the open list of identities and professions, .... well to reduce the marketing costs, of course and target ads better. However officers in law enforecement and spy agencies will not like that and will either force to unlist some of the addresses, or will take fake names and identities.

    Somewhat similiar to google earth, where some areas are artificially blurred by the company which pledged not to make no evil.

    1. Re:Unlisted Identity by namgge · · Score: 1

      The UK also has strong personal data protection legislation, and a regulator with teeth (six figure fines are not uncommon). These protections (or obstacles depending on your PoV) will kick in soon as the addresses get linked to individuals (owners, occupiers, etc.).

    2. Re:Unlisted Identity by Xest · · Score: 1

      They're only doing addresses by the looks, not names and addresses, so professions and so forth make no sense.

      But most importantly it'd breach the Data Protection Act and be shut down with massive fines if it started bundling personal data like names of occupants along with addresses.

      This is basically just a free competitor to the likes of Experian's QuickAddress service.

  4. Web identifiers by NotInHere · · Score: 1

    Those things they plan to introduce -- web identifiers -- already exist:
    http://www.openstreetmap.org/w...

    1. Re:Web identifiers by richlv · · Score: 1

      seriously, this is different from openstreetmap... how ?
      ok, so it's more limited (addresses only) and uk only.
      adding the missing info in osm is a much better idea.

      --
      Rich
  5. Unlisted numbers... by Richard_at_work · · Score: 3, Insightful

    What if you want the equivalent of an unlisted number, though?

    Then you are thinking of something else, like the electoral role or exclusion from the phone book (which also includes addresses).

    This is the equivalent of the Royal Mails Postcode Address File - matches locations to addresses, postcodes to streets, house numbers to postcodes etc. No names or occupants involved.

    So there is no such thing as an unlisted address - its like BT releasing a list of all phone numbers without names of the people who you can call using them. Except having the address database is a damn sight more useful, as you don't deliver stuff to a phone number...

    1. Re:Unlisted numbers... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well, you could easily submit a "Right to be Forgotten" request. They'd have to take it offline then, as I understand it.

    2. Re:Unlisted numbers... by Richard_at_work · · Score: 1

      No, because there is no identifying information about you, so you have no right to tell a website to forget an address with no personal details involved.

      The "Right to be forgotten" is not all encompassing, you dont simply have the right to tell a website to remove whatever data you wish to have removed - there are boundaries to what you can accomplish with it.

    3. Re:Unlisted numbers... by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      I'm glad BT don't list all working phone numbers, otherwise they would be getting spammed a lot more.

      I expect we will see legal action from Royal Mail soon enough. Can't have competition for their post code database subscription service.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
  6. Absolutely not by mccalli · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I already opted out of this via the Electoral Register, I do not want some random startup faffing about with it. They have not got a single convincing reason for doing this. Have a look:

    "Open Addresses UK Director Jeni Tennison states that addresses are an essential part of a national infrastructure. “They connect us to wider society and help us to access services. Everyone needs to be able to use addresses freely, which means they need to be open.”

    No, not everyone does need to be able to use my address freely. In fact, they are explicitely restricted from doing so by various laws. My address is used and disclosed at a point of my choosing.

    "On a more serious note, Wells explains that address data links together the digital world with the virtual, and by connecting these two worlds, better services can be given to everybody. When combined with and linked to other open data sets, allowing startup companies and developers access to this data will encourage the development of new goods and services, the organization states. When combined with and linked to other open data sets, allowing startup companies and developers access to this data will encourage the development of new goods and services, the organization states."

    'Better' by who's definition? Startup companies - who on earth said I wanted to help them out?

    Wells says that Google Maps could also use the open address data to improve the quality of their services. The open data can also inform devices to perform tasks with the data collected. Wells further explains that they keep the quality of the data high by using existing open, clean data sets that can help corroborate new data coming in.

    Why should my life be lived in order to 'help out' the multi-billion dollar corporation that is Google? I already use as few of their services as possible. 'Inform devices' - which devices, and who says I want them to be informed?

    The idea has no use cases put forward which benefit me, which allow for my consent, and in fact I believe an amount of this form of collection could actually be covered by Crown copyright laws as it is essentially duplicating the Electoral Roll.

    Not with fourteen barge poles tied together would I touch this.

    1. Re:Absolutely not by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Calm down. From their FAQ:

      Do Open Addresses create a new privacy risk?

      No. We will only be capturing and storing addresses. The addresses where people live are already available through other closed address products. No names, other than those company names that form part of the address, will be associated with addresses.

      This is for validating addresses, matching addresses to postcodes etc.

    2. Re:Absolutely not by jabuzz · · Score: 4, Insightful

      You seem to fail to understand the difference between a street address for a building and it's physical location (probably in OSGB36 coordinates) and that address being associated with one or more individuals.

      In fact the Royal Mail already maintain such a database known as the Postcode Address File

      http://www.poweredbypaf.com/en...

      An epic failure to understand what is being proposed on your behalf.

    3. Re:Absolutely not by Bazman · · Score: 1

      And for creating junk mail addressed to "The Occupier".

    4. Re:Absolutely not by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      The junk mailers already have that ability though.

    5. Re:Absolutely not by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Let them continue to send me junk mail, throughout the year i receive lbs/kgs of the stuff. By soaking shreded junk mail i can then use a cheap briquette press to give me free winter fuel. The trick is to sign up for every shitty ad, customer feedback form, warranty card, etc that i can get my hands on and using my appartments previous tennant's name instead of my own is just the icing on the cake for me.

    6. Re:Absolutely not by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No they don't. The junk mail gets delivered to every letterbox, unaddressed. It's only some companies that you may have previously engaged with like Readers Digest, Time magazine etc that would still have your address.

  7. Owning One's Own Information by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This is a perfect illustration of why individuals need to have the right to control their own personal information. There are many judges, prosecutors, celebrities, and other public figures who have a safety interest in not having their address published. Regular, everyday people also may have many legitimate reasons for keeping their address secret. Maybe they have a homicidal ex, or they are hiding from someone with a restraining order. Who knows? Our society is going to have to address the issue of other people choosing to "out" your personal information for you and against your will. Should they be liable for the consequence? Shit yes.

    1. Re:Owning One's Own Information by jabuzz · · Score: 2

      Another epic fail. The street address of a house say

      29 Acacia Road
      Nuttytown
      NU5 5PD

      and it's location either in lat/log or OSGB36 grid coordinates is not and never has been personal information.

    2. Re:Owning One's Own Information by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      But but but BANANAMAN!

  8. Unreadable website at geektime by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Seriously what is it with people whose websites can't handle non-full-screen browsing? And why TF does everyone have to have these 'subscribe now' layers everywhere that you have to keep clearing away?
    Yes, I know, I should stfu and subscribe to all their mailing lists and it's my fault for not being on the latest ipad because 'best viewed with this browser' and 'at that resolution' are making a comeback because they are retro and therefore cool and not at all retarded.

    1. Re:Unreadable website at geektime by orgelspieler · · Score: 1

      This. Bad text re-flow is simply inexcusable. The stupid subscribe ads make the site completely unusable, to boot.

  9. No reason for this by Pope · · Score: 3, Interesting

    What possible reason is there for such a list, other than spam?

    --
    It doesn't mean much now, it's built for the future.
    1. Re:No reason for this by Mprx · · Score: 1

      Navigation/route finding.

    2. Re:No reason for this by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      What possible reason is there for such a list, other than spam?

      Address lookup by postcode on a web form. This is a very common use-case, but currently requires the site owner to pay for the Royal Mail address database.

      I guess the idea with this is to reduce that cost involved, particularly for small businesses.