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Blackberry Defeats Typo In Court, Typo To Discontinue Sales of Keyboard

Posted by timothy on from the one-way-or-another-it's-over dept.

New submitter juniorkindergarten writes: Blackberry and Typo have reached a final settlement that effectively ends Typo selling its iPhone keyboard accessory. Blackberry took Typo to court for twice for patent infringement over the copying of Blackberry's keyboard design. Blackberry and Typo first battled it out in court, with Typo losing for copying the Blackberry Q10 keyboard design. Typo redesigned its keyboard, and again Blackberry sued them for patent infringement. The final result is that Typo cannot sell keyboards for screens less than 7.9", but can still sell keyboards for the iPad and iPad air. Exact terms were not disclosed.

67 comments

  1. Copy that Floppy by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The premise of this entire article screams like a spoiled bratty kid. Shut up, Seriously...

  2. wouldn't buy a Typo Keyboard anyway... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Funny

    a normal kyeboard givs me enough trouble...

  3. Two Typos in headline by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    C'mon editors!

  4. No they didn't by drhamad · · Score: 5, Informative

    They reached a settlement agreement. BB did not defeat Typo "in court."

    --
    -Daniel
    1. Re:No they didn't by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They reached a settlement agreement. BB did not defeat Typo "in court."

      Blackberry took Typo to court for twice for patent infringement over the copying of Blackberry's keyboard design. Blackberry and Typo first battled it out in court, with Typo losing for copying the Blackberry Q10 keyboard design

      It looks like Blackberry did defeat Typo in court the first time. Typo redesigned the keyboard. Blackberry took them to court again, and this time Typo settled without the judge ruling them in patent violation.

    2. Re:No they didn't by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Maybe not in the "hand to hand combat" sense, but probably in the "ran them down until they were exhausted" sense.

  5. Typo? by thedonger · · Score: 3, Funny

    I really wanted the article title to read "Blackberry Defeats Typo In Court, Typo To Discontinue Sales of Keeboard"

    --
    Help fight poverty: Punch a poor person.
  6. Little Tiny Keyboards by Mr+D+from+63 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    So, BB has the patent on little keyboards? Who patented little buttons?

    1. Re:Little Tiny Keyboards by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's not just that. Although I consider these patents idiotic, and had the same reaction as you initially, the Typo keyboard was an exact copy of the BB. Not only that, but BBs did put some effort into making the slanted keys give you a better tactile feedback over flat keys. They were awarded the patent, they have the right to enforce it (whether you consider these patents as valid signs of innovation or and idiotic restriction is a whole new discussion).

    2. Re:Little Tiny Keyboards by Impy+the+Impiuos+Imp · · Score: 1

      There had to be more to it than just producing a tiny keyboard.

      --
      (-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
    3. Re:Little Tiny Keyboards by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ^ This

        and if you look at Typo's keyboard, it has more then a passing similarity to the blackberry keyboard, in fact it looks like they tried to duplicate it as closely as possible.

    4. Re:Little Tiny Keyboards by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      There was, Blackberry has a patent on their design, slanted keys, key layout. Well take a look for yourself.

      http://ladas.com/an-overview-of-the-blackberry-v-typo-products-case/

    5. Re:Little Tiny Keyboards by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Oh come on. It literally looks like they removed keyboards from old BB's and attached it to the phone.

    6. Re:Little Tiny Keyboards by mtippett · · Score: 1

      From TFA, it is a design patent - aka Trade Dress.

      From http://www.theglobeandmail.com... , the actual complain seems with merit. The frets (metal lines), key shape (rounded corners) and space bar seem to be pulled entirely from the Blackberry Q10. It's as blatant as the typical Chinese typo-based (Sony vs Somy) ripoffs.

      If you saw a phone with a the Typo keyboard, it would be reasonable to assume that its an extra tall Q10. That's what Blackberry has sued about.

    7. Re:Little Tiny Keyboards by odie5533 · · Score: 1

      No one would assume it's a tall Q10 because no one has ever seen a Q10 in the wild, and no one is that familiar with Blackberry anymore to be able to spot a keyboard that looks like their product. People would just assume it's some new phone or phone accessory. They might say it's like Blackberry to have a stationary keyboard, but the comparison would end there.

    8. Re:Little Tiny Keyboards by mtippett · · Score: 1

      The fact that they have a design patent aside, Blackberry has been iterating on the fret + rounded keys design since the blackberry bold. It's what makes a "modern" blackberry recognizable.

      https://www.google.com/search?...
      https://www.google.com/search?...

      They look quite similar.

    9. Re:Little Tiny Keyboards by exomondo · · Score: 1

      So, BB has the patent on little keyboards?

      I don't think so, probably a design patent on their particular design.

      Who patented little buttons?

      Nobody, there are various keyboard cases for touchscreen smartphones that don't have patent issues.

    10. Re:Little Tiny Keyboards by gl4ss · · Score: 1

      actually that would have gotten them around the patent/litigation.

      that would have been genius ;D.

      --
      world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
  7. Did Blackberry invent the QWERTY keyboard by nickweller · · Score: 1

    How does making a miniature versions of the QWERTY keyboard make Blackberry the inverter of the QWERTY keyboard?

    1. Re:Did Blackberry invent the QWERTY keyboard by l0ungeb0y · · Score: 1

      Because they bought a Patent and had better Lawyers than Typo

    2. Re:Did Blackberry invent the QWERTY keyboard by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How does making a miniature versions of the QWERTY keyboard make Blackberry the inverter of the QWERTY keyboard?

      They spent a lot of money developing a specific design that can be used for their phones. This is more than rounded corners, as it provides a functional difference. It was good enough for others to want to copy their layout, so I'd consider that a indication on how good the keyboard is for the small form factor.

      The difference in keyboards is likely more pronounced if I ask, "Would you consider an ergonomic keyboard the same as an old IBM keyboard?" That is likely the best way to indicate the difference.

    3. Re:Did Blackberry invent the QWERTY keyboard by nickweller · · Score: 1

      So .. a) Typo totally copied the Blackberry keyboard? b) No one else can ever come up with a miniature keyboard that doesn't violate Blackberrys patent?

    4. Re:Did Blackberry invent the QWERTY keyboard by gstoddart · · Score: 3, Interesting

      This page gives the best side by side comparison I can find.

      it's got a picture of one of the BBs, the patent they filed, and the Typo keyboard.

      The '964 patent, entitled "HAND-HELD ELECTRONIC DEVICE WITH A KEYBOARD OPTIMIZED FOR USE WITH THE THUMBS", was granted on December 8, 2009, and among its multiple independent claims, of particular note is independent claim 19 which claims "[a] keyboard for use with a mobile communication device". Claim 19 includes the limitations of "twenty-six letter keys and at least one other key" distributed in three rows, that are symmetrically distributed along the face of the electronic device. Furthermore, claim 19 includes the limitation of:
      "five letter keys in the upper row being disposed on each side of the vertical reference, five letter keys in the middle row being disposed on one side of the vertical reference and four letter keys in the middle row being disposed on the other side of the vertical reference, and four letter keys in the lower row being disposed on the one side of the vertical reference line and three letter keys in the lower row being disposed on the other side of the vertical reference line..."

      So, the extent to which the keys skew away from being flat for ergonomic reasons seems to be enumerated in the patent.

      Now, as to the validity of the patent, I can't say.

      But I will agree that specific design details for ergonomics are pretty much exactly copied in the Typo .. so if they said "give me a keyboard just like the BlackBerry", I can see why they'd have settled.

      But there are specific things and details in there. And it's at least slightly more specific than a small, black QWERTY keyboard. Down to quite specific curvatures.

      --
      Lost at C:>. Found at C.
    5. Re:Did Blackberry invent the QWERTY keyboard by aaron4801 · · Score: 1
      Note that while there are three patents discussed, the D'775 patent is the most heavily referenced. Design patents have a much lower bar to entry, as they act more like trademarks than patents. It's the same thing as Apple's "rounded corners" patent, D'286.

      The idea is that the form (rather than the function) is so iconic that it represents a singular entity instead of being a market standard.

      But IANAL.

    6. Re:Did Blackberry invent the QWERTY keyboard by gstoddart · · Score: 1

      Ignoring how we feel about patents ... this patent exists, the link I gave was the first one I saw which explained the way in which they were similar, and that those similarities are quite prominent on things you wouldn't do by random.

      This is more than just "someone else made a keyboard".

      And if you 100% copy someone else's design, I can see why they'd be unhappy about it.

      Now that I've read through that, I can see BB had some pretty valid points. And if you could make things which looked exactly like someone else's product, that could be misleading.

      The curvature of those keys was pretty darned specific.

      --
      Lost at C:>. Found at C.
    7. Re:Did Blackberry invent the QWERTY keyboard by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So ..

      a) Typo totally copied the Blackberry keyboard?

      b) No one else can ever come up with a miniature keyboard that doesn't violate Blackberrys patent?

      The Blackberry keyboard has a certain button size and positioning of the keys. More importantly, I'd say that the tactile feedback from the buttons are the real problem for Typo. The keyboards have the same button design.

      Image for comparison

      The buttons have the same wave shaped nub on them. Typo has since redesigned their keyboards to have the wave nub on the bottom right / left instead of the Blackberry top right / left with their version 2. It isn't that the keyboards are qwerty that is the issue, but the shape of the buttons. If you don't understand this, then you are dragging it out for some unknown reason.

  8. Re:Swedes now a minority in Malmö. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Insightful

    It's inevitable that the "races" will blend. Evil white supremacists like you see this as a problem. We see you as stupid, awful people.

  9. Come on editors... by EmeraldBot · · Score: 1

    The summary is full of Typos!

    --
    "Set a man a fire, he'll be warm for the rest of the night. Set a man afire, he'll be warm for the rest of his life."
  10. I dodn't know by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I dodn't know typos could sell keybroads! I hope theyr'e of good qualtiy.

    - Sent from a Typo keybroad

  11. Pointless? by sycodon · · Score: 5, Funny

    Isn't this kind of like the First Officer on the Titanic winning an argument with a passenger over a deck chair.

    --
    When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
    1. Re:Pointless? by Applehu+Akbar · · Score: 1

      No, it's like a crippled, alcoholic deck swabber on the Titanic winning an argument with a passenger over a deck chair.

    2. Re:Pointless? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      No, it's like a crippled, alcoholic deck swabber on the Titanic winning an argument with a deck chair.

  12. How you know a company is done by bulled · · Score: 1, Insightful

    When their biggest revenue stream is patent infringement cases.

    1. Re:How you know a company is done by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      When their biggest revenue stream is patent infringement cases.

      Their biggest revenue stream by far is QNX. They OWN the medical device segment, and there's a 60% chance that any new car you buy today is going to be powered by a BlackBerry real time OS, with an Android or Apple virtual machine running the in-dash infotainment system.

  13. Blackberry will be gone soon, patents for sale by caseih · · Score: 0

    Yes the idea that a mini physical keyboard on a phone device could be patented is ridiculous. But you can rest easy knowing that Blackberry is in its death throws anyway. Unfortunately that means its patents will be soon up for sale and will be bought up by other greedy companies who will continue to "leverage" them.

    1. Re:Blackberry will be gone soon, patents for sale by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Nope.

    2. Re:Blackberry will be gone soon, patents for sale by stongef · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Have you seen the Blackberry Passport? It has more business-oriented innovation per square inch than any Apple product I have seen. This is the first time I am considering buying a product from them. I always hated their closed platform, but they responded by making Android apps work on their phones. I have seen their "little keyboard" in action, and it is impressive. It does make you type a lot faster. Someone obviously sat down and engineered this correctly. I would not call them dead yet, they always manage to surprise ...

    3. Re:Blackberry will be gone soon, patents for sale by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah, they only have their operating system running 60% of all new cars sold.

      60%.
      Of all new cars sold.
      And this isn't considering that Ford just dumped Microsoft SYNC (or at least, the Windows Kernel) for BlackBerry.

      It powers Apple CarPlay for fuck's sake.

      BlackBerry may not be in the mobile phone space anymore, but they aren't going anywhere.

  14. When does that patent expire? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I have a tiny keyboard I bought for my Palm IIIx about 15 years ago in early 2000, and I seem to recall that Handspring had to license a keyboard patent from RIM back in 2002. So it must be older than 2000 or it's prior art, and the patent is at most 2002.

  15. Canadian patents, we're learning by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    seems like Canadian companies are just as eager any big business to stifle competition

    lousy lawyers are laughing, all the way to the bank

  16. Re:Swedes now a minority in Malmö. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    That's because you're a negro.

  17. BB should patent how to run a company into ground by JoeyRox · · Score: 2

    Since they did such a great job of self-immolation.

  18. Re:If you buy Blackberry, Fuck You by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Who the hell is still buying Blackberry phones???

  19. Less about patents than lackluster sales? by swb · · Score: 1

    Typo actually made an effort to defeat the patent in court, but what seems telling is that they weren't attempting to redesign their product to avoid the patents.

    It doesn't seem likely that BB has enough patents to remove all keyboarded phones from the market. There have been too many released by other vendors which weren't challenged.

    I wonder if Typo just figured that:

    * The vast majority of smartphone owners at this point in time have adapted to the idea of touchscreen keyboards, shrinking the potential market for an add-on device

    * Redesigning the device to avoid patents would be hard, especially for a small company like Typo that may not have the resources for a thorough patent/design review, not to mention paying to retool the manufacturing of this device.

    Given the small market and costs, better to just give up both the legal fight and the headaches.

  20. Screw everybody by AndyKron · · Score: 1

    I'm going to patent air, and sue every mother fucker on Earth

    1. Re:Screw everybody by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      Air is almost certainly prior art, but you might want to have a go at patenting 'method of air delivery to lungs'.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
  21. This makes more sense then the Apple suit by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

    I have bought devices in the past because they have had a physical keyboard, but I don't buy devices because their corners are rounded a certain way.

    --
    Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
  22. Re:If you buy Blackberry, Fuck You by narcc · · Score: 1

    Why?

    --
    Required reading for internet skeptics
  23. I see what they did there. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    So you can patent curves.

  24. No wonder there are so few phones with keyboards. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    How long has Blackberry been suing companies that make phones and cases with keyboards? Is THIS why most of us have suffered with touchscreen keyboards for years now? Better yet, how is a two-way pager with a particular arrangement of keys patentable or relevant? Haven't we had pocketable/wearable devices with buttons intended for thumbs since before the Gameboy? https://www.google.com/patents...

  25. Wait - you can patent design? by ripvlan · · Score: 1

    I thought Apple just lost out that you can't patent the basic shape of the phone?! Yet in this case Typo can't copy the look of a keyboard?

    1. Re:Wait - you can patent design? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      When there is a functional difference (tactile feedback for meat-popsicles), I'd say it is important enough.

      Would you expect a car company to sue for another company copying their body design for better aerodynamics and aesthetics? I would. Otherwise, I'd expect to see a lot more knockoff Mustangs or Porsches around with civic engines.

    2. Re:Wait - you can patent design? by HornWumpus · · Score: 1

      50% of sports cars a 'knock offs' of a Ferrari Daytona. Which is itself a knockoff of a Jaguar E type.

      All Camaros, Firebirds and 'cudas are knockoff rustangs. That is simply history.

      The Frogs shipped an inferior copy of the 911 for a solid decade.

      --
      John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
  26. Re:If you buy Blackberry, Fuck You by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'll tell them to stop. Both of them.

  27. Re:If you buy Blackberry, Fuck You by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Canadians. Though mostly businesses.

    Also, they had every rights to pursue this patent case, considering they had made an exact copy of the BB keyboard (no it's not just a "tiny keyboard".. the shape of it, slanted keys and all that look up pictures of it you lazy b-tard before jumping to conclusions.

  28. QNX by tepples · · Score: 3, Informative

    How is one supposed to boycott BlackBerry's QNX operating system? Not buy a car?

  29. Is BB making keyboards as addons for other devices by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Are they making keyboards for the iPhone/etc? If the answer is no, then their patent should not apply in my opinion. If you're not in the market and someone else is and they use your idea.. tough shit? With of course the caveat that you can prove you were working on entering that market and using your IP. Just more proof of how asinine patent law and its analogues are.. Sorry, but if you aren't using something and someone else is able/willing to.. you should either be forced to license that patent at a lower amount or lose it, or your patent shouldn't apply -at all-.

  30. Man on Internet points out: I don't even own a car by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Man on Internet points out: I don't even own a car!

    Seriously, it is quite possible to avoid owning a car in many situations, buy fewer, fix up older cars, and so on.

    Even your link points out it is 60% of cars sold. So - which ones don't support BB?

  31. Re: Swedes now a minority in Malmö. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Just sit back, relax and wait for the shit to hit the fan. I'm sure another Hitler will rise from the ashes. And this time most of the US would actually agree with him. Besides, I'm curious as to how much more efficient we can automate the genocide process. Google's new Boston dynamics dog bot can sniff out Muslims, kill and burn them in one go. Bonus points for being powered by said burning Jews... er I mean Muslims. Automated genocide factories will be green and powered by burning Muslims. The future will be glorious!

  32. Re:Man on Internet points out: I don't even own a by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Man on Internet points out: I don't even own a car!

    Seriously, it is quite possible to avoid owning a car in many situations, buy fewer, fix up older cars, and so on.

    Even your link points out it is 60% of cars sold. So - which ones don't support BB?

    Ok, you're cooler than everybody else.

    But when you are at the hospital, are you going to avoid all of the medical devices that run QNX?

    Would you force a loved one to do the same?