Slashdot Mirror


Ask Slashdot: Best Setups For Navigating a Programming-Focused MOOC?

theodp writes: As one works his or her way through EdX's free The Analytics Edge, one finds oneself going back-and-forth between videos and R to complete the programming exercises associated with the lectures. While this can certainly be done on a cheap-o 13" laptop with a 6mbps connection by jumping around from the web-based videos to the client-based programming environment and to the web for help (god bless Stack Overflow), have you found (or do you dream of) a better setup for the MOOC programming courses offered by the likes of EdX, Udacity, and Coursera? Are you using multiple screens, split screens, touch screens, laptops/desktops/tablets, speakers, headphones, higher-speed connections? Anything else? Do you rely solely on the class materials and web-based resources, or do you purchase complementary books? Any thoughts on how to make the experience work best for those learning at home, in a classroom setting, on the road for business/travel, or during lengthy train commutes? Do you playback videos at faster speeds (e.g., 1.5x)? Any other tips?

39 comments

  1. Video transcripts by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I bring up the transcript because I can read faster than the lecturer speaks. And most of the lecturers are god awful on MOOCs.

    1. Re:Video transcripts by plopez · · Score: 1

      Videos suck. They are a waste of time as they cannot be searched or indexed like text. I hate video training for that reason and prefer to avoid them.

      --
      putting the 'B' in LGBTQ+
  2. Dual monitor workstation + laptop to play content by ErikPeterson · · Score: 2

    I use a dual monitor workstation + a laptop to play the course content. This allows me my regular programming workspace on my computer with any reference material I need on the second monitor. Using the laptop allows me to go fullscreen without worrying about window focus and makes the material easy to pause by mashing the spacebar. My laptop also is setup to provide no notifications or interruptions so it is a distraction free workspace. I also download course material that I can listen to on drives.

    --
    The world's smartest bug zapper www.zapstats.com/kickstarter
  3. Best setup for destroying Slashdot? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Be owned by Dice.

  4. The courses shouldn't be designed for "best" by msobkow · · Score: 1

    The courses shouldn't be designed for idealized setups like multiple monitors. Most people who are going to be taking an online course are those who can't afford to go to a college or university, so they're far from likely to be in possession of multiple-monitor or other fancy-schmancy setups.

    I'd lay odds that a 1080p laptop is even pushing it; many of them probably have 720p laptops.

    --
    I do not fail; I succeed at finding out what does not work.
    1. Re:The courses shouldn't be designed for "best" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      >Most people who are going to be taking an online course are those who can't afford to go to a college or university
      Sorry, but I don't think this is true - at least not in my case. I have a Masters in Chem Eng, and a steady job (18+ years) that pays well - I can certainly afford to pay for courses at a college or university. I have, in fact, completed a programming certificate at a community college after my masters degree.

      But in the last few years, I've done multiple MOOC's, in a variety of topics - probability, differential equations (through Boston University on EdX - great courses) as a refresher, some stuff on Udemy, some on Coursera. Why? Flexibillity + value. There is still structure - particularly with EdX - but also more flexibility with respect to when I want to learn. Committing to a weekly 3 hour night class is very difficult with job demands. Being able to commit 3+ hours to watch videos and do assignments at some point during a week is much more manageable. Many of the courses on EdX are very challenging (at least in the probability and stats offerings), and are great value, even if you get an ID certified completion certificate.

      With respect to set up - I found that a dual screen is a very nice to have - one screen for the course content, one for the work in progress in R, or in a text editor for programming + terminal. A tablet for the video + computer for the assignments works OK as well. I agree that it's hard to do on a single screen. My computer is either an old Lenovo T60 or an equally old HP ProBook. Nothing fancy, and both work fine for these courses.

      I normally buy, or already have, a supplementary text book. There is a lot of good content on the web - likely here are tutorials on any topic covered in the course.

      Best of luck finishing the course.

    2. Re:The courses shouldn't be designed for "best" by Half-pint+HAL · · Score: 1

      The courses shouldn't be designed for idealized setups like multiple monitors.

      They're not -- they're just designed for a very specific course style: the one used in Andrew Ng's Machine Learning course. It works quite well for that partly because he's dealing with a complex subject that means students need a lot of input and explanation before attempting tasks, and partly because of Ng's exemplary skills as a lecturer.

      Most programming courses, on the other hand, involve lots of tiny incremental tasks that need minimal explanation, followed by several practise tasks to internalise the logic. Programming MOOCs that I've tried tend to fall into one of two camps: either they give you lots and lots of input in the videos so that you end up forgetting it all before you get to the practise tasks, or they stop the video with a message telling you to go away and try out the exercise in another window and then come back. Neither of these are efficient workflows, but the main platforms in general, and Coursera in particular, all push things in that direction.

      --
      Got them moderator blues I blieve I walk out the do', With these mod-points I been gettin', I 'most never post no mo'
    3. Re:The courses shouldn't be designed for "best" by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

      Right. Because nobody who owns a fairly recent computer ever has an obsolescent one lying around that they could just use for, say, watching videos/reading transcripts while doing stuff on the newer one (or vice versa).

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    4. Re:The courses shouldn't be designed for "best" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Right, because everybody who has an obsolescent computer lying around also has all the cables, displays, excess kilowatts-per-hour, and input devices or switching mechanisms required to operate it at the same time as their current PC.

    5. Re:The courses shouldn't be designed for "best" by Half-pint+HAL · · Score: 1

      Not to mention "desk space"...

      --
      Got them moderator blues I blieve I walk out the do', With these mod-points I been gettin', I 'most never post no mo'
    6. Re:The courses shouldn't be designed for "best" by NicBenjamin · · Score: 1

      The folks that have that kind of setup just laying around tend not to be the one these courses say they're aimed at. That guy would be fine with C for Dummies and a little help getting a CLI compiler setup, figuring out how to get it to run his programs in his GUI, etc. The courses say they're aimed at the nontraditional college student, and those folks would probably be buying their first desktop ever just to take the class..

      Even the geeks who can't code yet, but have lots of electronical shit from way back when sitting around, aren't likely to have all the cables they need for two machines at once, desk space for both, etc.

    7. Re:The courses shouldn't be designed for "best" by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

      Yes, I'd forgotten about all the people who have a decent computer and a reliable enough internet connection to participate in MOOCs but live in cardboard boxes.

      Desk space my arse.

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    8. Re:The courses shouldn't be designed for "best" by NicBenjamin · · Score: 1

      I don't know about a cardboard box.

      But I live in what you people (aka: the ones who spell it arse) would call a very small flat, basically a bedsit plus a 10 by 12 bedroom. I got one desk. It does not have room for two monitors a printer and two towers. To have the desktop space for all the electronical doohickeys and thingamabobs that people are saying I should have I'd need to get rid of a bunch of shit and acquire a much bigger desk. Which would require getting rid of something (probably a book-case).

  5. Drinking a fruit smoothie post-session helps by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Some guys swear by protein supps, but I've heard some warnings about health affects. Also, you should stagger your workouts. Maybe concentrate on the upper body Monday, Thursday, and Saturday, but hit the lower body...

    Oops, sorry, I read TFS and thought this was a dude looking to exchange gym workout tips.

  6. I prefer W3schools by Half-pint+HAL · · Score: 1
    I'm not a huge fan of MOOCs, and prefer the model used by w3schools -- webpages with links to tasks in a live coding environment as a pop-up. I wouldn't mind videos being embedded into such pages where it makes sen to do so, but most MOOCs overuse and underprepare their videos.

    When someone makes a written mistake in a slidecast/pencast-type video, there's no going back to correct it. To me that renders a lot of MOOCs frustratingly confusing. It also means that all their talk about gathering data "to improve the courses" is nonsense, because it means they've got no way to A/B test individual small changes to the course, so they have no proper comparisons whatsoever.

    --
    Got them moderator blues I blieve I walk out the do', With these mod-points I been gettin', I 'most never post no mo'
    1. Re:I prefer W3schools by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

      When someone makes a written mistake in a slidecast/pencast-type video, there's no going back to correct it.

      Are you saying there's no such thing as video editing?
      I was under the impression that there were numerous programs - even some free ones - that can do it.

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    2. Re:I prefer W3schools by Half-pint+HAL · · Score: 1

      Yes, but it gets messy and it's often beyond the creator's ability. There's lots of MOOCs out there full of ugly patched over words, or a subtitle annotation saying "Oops! I'm talking nonsense." Editing the videos would be easier if they had been planned and filmed in segments and edited tigether in the first place, but most of them just appear to be video-blogger style pieces to camera wie the visuals/slides/code-sessions recorded live with the content.

      --
      Got them moderator blues I blieve I walk out the do', With these mod-points I been gettin', I 'most never post no mo'
    3. Re:I prefer W3schools by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes but they hardly ever edit their videos to correct a mistake, and when they do it is by adding a flashing overlay to the effect of "disregard what in saying right now, for the correction see the pdf/the forum" instead of just rerecording the sentence. It's confusing as hell. Often the written material is not consistent with the video either. These are university professors, not pro video editors and it shows.

  7. Whatever you already have is most likely fine by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If you're simply looking for an excuse to spend money, MOOC class requirements aren't it. These MOOC courses are designed to reach the largest possible audience and that, in turns, means pretty minimal system requirements. Any consumer computer made within the last five years or so is more than capable enough for these courses.

  8. The Clinton Killers Have Been Caught! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Tune in to CNN. Wolf is SPECIAL Reporting it.

  9. Learn to read by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Get a few programming books, which you can keep in any convenient position near your 13" laptop.
    Use the laptop screen for doing the exercises in the books.
    Get a notebook for handwritten notes and tries.

    Here, your screen real estate problem is solved.

    Also, if you need videos to learn programming, which is an essentially text based activity, I'm going to doubt your competence when considering hiring you.

    1. Re:Learn to read by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This post exemplifies the levels of Ignorant Motherfuckery in business these days. I urge anyone working for this fuck to tell him to take his job and shove it.

  10. what works by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    I could get into the minutiae of setups but on that front by far the most important physical thing is having either a dual (or more) screen setup or having two physical systems. The rest of it really isn't that important (unless you specifically need some HID to do your job).

    To that, the I would say the most beneficial trait I've seen in any successful worker or learner is the drive to actually go out, start a project, and finish it. The finishing an external project is key.

    That being said, you have to understand that you only get out what you put in. If your "project" is some podunk little piece of crap that calculates some window filter on R, obviously you're shorting yourself. If you take that extra day or two to figure out how to setup a SQL or w/e server at home and pull / push data to it using something else (LUA / python w/e), then grab that data and modify it with R the understanding you get for the whole system increases dramatically. In addition, you now have a whole stack you can show to people, which massively increases hiring value (if that's your goal) or ability for other people to help you because you can more accurately show where the problem is.

    To that end, buying extra books really isn't going to help you. The boxed problems are really not indicative of the functional problems you will encounter in reality, since the people writing them are usually pretty well versed in said activity; so they're going to avoid base level mistakes (i.e. type conversions / memory usually) or structural / approach problems just from experience.

    The other aspect is, you have to set yourself up for success. Doing anything on a commute is a pretty terrible way of learning, you'll never remember it or if you do it will be on a train, not where it matters. Set up some triggers: specific music (genre / artist etc), visual (background / things on desk etc), place ( this one is a bit more tricky, but somewhere you don't associate with "relax"), or smell while you're doing it. Then later on, when you're actually working on that project, put that music on / change the visual / place and you'll have a much easier time remembering what you did previously. This is readily apparent with people who drink coffee, after a few days / weeks the caffeine in your coffee doesn't work as a stimulant, it's the smell / taste / sight that triggers your brain to enter "awake" mode. (not exactly true, but true enough)

  11. The solution from the anals of history by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    > one finds oneself going back-and-forth between videos and R to complete the programming exercises associated with the lectures.

    TAKE NOTES.

  12. Re:Dual monitor workstation + laptop to play conte by Cr0wsCa11ing · · Score: 2

    I use my iPad to run content, my loaner MacPro to do the coursework, and my mobile to procrastinate with.

  13. Good monitor by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    1 - 28"-30" 4k monitor.

  14. OMG! You mean MOOC is real! by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 1

    When did Master of Orion for the Cloud (MOOC) get announced?

    I had a roommate who would play MOO2 by keeping everyone at bay long enough to build out 36 Death Stars and then systematically wipe out every enemy planet one by one. Now that's shock and awe.

  15. Beware of stackoverflow by Darinbob · · Score: 1

    Stackoverflow started off very well. Intelligent questions and intelligent answers. But over time it declined. Now there are some really dumb quests that have absolutely wrong answer being given and voted up. You've got to spend a lot of time there to get the ability to answer a question or upgrade/downgrade answers, so if you see a wrong answer you may be disallowed from pointing this out.

    So when you go there beware. Read ALL of the answers and the comments.

    1. Re:Beware of stackoverflow by neminem · · Score: 1

      > "You've got to spend a lot of time there to get the ability to answer a question or upgrade/downgrade answers."

      You really don't. You need 15 rep to vote up an answer, which entails posting one good question or one good answer (you need more rep, 125, to vote down, but you also lose rep by voting down answers, so people worried about their rep don't do that very often anyway). Anyway, just downvoting isn't very useful - a much more useful contribution, if you see an answer that's incorrect, would be to post your own, more correct answer and/or post a comment on the incorrect answer indicating why it's incorrect. Of course, you do need 50 rep to comment, which is sort of annoying, as commenting is very useful (though not *essential*), and 50 rep isn't that much, but it's not nothing.

      You don't need any rep to post answers, as that's sort of the whole point of the site, and the main way to *acquire* rep in the first place.

      Yes, I absolutely agree that as SO got increasingly popular, it also got increasingly deluged with terrible questions, but you can absolutely help with that once you have just a little bit of rep (downvoting them and/or, if they don't follow the rules of the site, flagging them for closure). (I like taking short breaks at work to clear my head by looking through the front page for such questions - there's almost invariably at least one such.) The existence of crap questions does not make it any less invaluable a resource for *good* questions, though - I remember the awful days when you had to find answers on *shiver* ExpertsExchange. Ugh.

  16. download all of the things by citizenr · · Score: 2

    https://github.com/coursera-dl...

    Its a lot easier when you have whole course material on the hdd and play video clips in mplayer window.

    --
    Who logs in to gdm? Not I, said the duck.
    1. Re:download all of the things by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes because the online players suck. Mostly Flash, very basic controls, nonstandard key bindings. If at least they would provide html video without a custom UI, then I could use the browser's built-in player (+ extensions) for playback speed control etc. The problem is, when you view videos offline you lose the embedded quizzes. And Coursera stupidly marks a video as seen as soon as I download it, and if I circumvent that by downloading from coursera-dl, coursera keeps nagging me about unseen videos.

  17. Some things I do, who gets the most from MOOCs by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    For me, the real breakthrough was getting a cloud server to host my development workbench (R Studio). My corporate is loaded with resource hogging applications. Offloading the resources for the development workbench was a godsend. Also, even though I'm typically reviewing some course material in a primary browser window, I'm usually surfing many supplemental websites such as discussion forums, help documentation, and related how to sites. Two monitors (PC & extra monitor) is extremely helpful. I'm strongly considering a third monitor to support my MOOC lifestyle. I would argue that while these MOOCs offer a promise of affordable education for the poor, the bigger audience is already educated career dedicated engineers and professionals, who already know how to learn and study, and are simply buffing their skills. We'll always trounce kids who are still learning how to study, because we've mostly already mastered study and research.

  18. Re:Dual monitor workstation + laptop to play conte by juanfgs · · Score: 1

    That's basically all MOOCs are: a way for third-worlders to try to acquire meaningless certificates without actually doing anything to earn them

    Ouch as a third worlder(argentinian) this hits very near home, but I guess it's true for many people but not for me (and I bet for many others). For me personally it's about learning, I started one on cryptography and couldn't actually finish , but I downloaded every class video and I'm going to complete it on the next term ( I was doing quite good on the homeworks but the pace was too fast for someone who also works full time).

    When I started I assumed the certificate is not the most important thing to get out of it but the actual knowledge, which IMHO is pretty good and almost impossible to access for most people outside from a college campus (which is also a way for senior professionals or dropouts who can't go back to college to update their knowledge) . Right now I started one on Machine Learning ( while I study the notes I took for crypto for the next term) which I always wanted to learn because of the sheer coolness of it.

    Conclusion: if you only care about the certificate (whether you're a first world or a third world citizen), it sucks, if you care about the knowledge, MOOCs are a pretty good way to update your knowledge.

  19. dual monitors / textbook / get off my lawn etc. by r-diddly · · Score: 1

    Dual monitors are pretty essential. You don't want to be studying on the bus anyway. A consistent, quiet place where Learning takes place every day, that's the ticket. Also get a sturdy music stand, preferably with spring-loaded clips to hold the pages (or make your own, hacker), and put the inevitable, paper textbook on it. Maybe it's just a holdover from my years in public school but there's something about a book.