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Why Kickstarter Became a Public Benefit Corporation (Video)

Meet Kickstarter co-founder and CEO Yancey Strickler. Timothy Lord asked Yancey about Kickstarter's recent move to become a Public Benefit Corporation, which is, according to Wikipedia, "a specific type of corporation that allows for public benefit to be a charter purpose in addition to the traditional corporate goal of maximizing profit for shareholders."

This corporate restructuring has no tax advantages, and creates a slight increase in paperwork, Yancey says. So why did they do it? Please view the video (or read the transcript, which has more info than the video) to find out.

40 comments

  1. If you're so altruistic, why pick Delaware? by mrchaotica · · Score: 2

    They talk about choosing this corporate structure (in part) to prevent themselves from exploiting tax loopholes, yet they incorporated in Delaware (rather than the state their main office is actually in -- New York, apparently), which could be construed as exploiting loopholes (at least regulatory, if not directly tax-related) in and of itself. What gives?

    --

    "[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz

    1. Re:If you're so altruistic, why pick Delaware? by ganjadude · · Score: 1

      no one wants to be located in NY, very unfriendly to business here (one of the reasons im leaving)

      --
      have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
    2. Re:If you're so altruistic, why pick Delaware? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      New York is a shit pit that is unfriendly to any entity that isn't government or befriended by a liberal government. You can be a target at the drop of a hat. Obammy already has his IRS attack dogs and Cuomo has a phone direct to the whitehouse.

    3. Re:If you're so altruistic, why pick Delaware? by Etherwalk · · Score: 1

      no one wants to be located in NY, very unfriendly to business here (one of the reasons im leaving)

      Unfriendly to some business, but very friendly to other business. There are plusses and minuses. New York has well-developed case law on everything under the sun, and has a very competent commercial division of its courts that deals exclusively with million-dollar-plus commercial cases.

    4. Re:If you're so altruistic, why pick Delaware? by ganjadude · · Score: 1

      too much cronyism here. NYC may be good for rich folks, but for the mom an d pops trying to start something, its not friendly at all

      --
      have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
    5. Re:If you're so altruistic, why pick Delaware? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Although most would agree it's a thin line, those same "most" would also agree there is a difference between just making decisions that are good for business vs. trying to exploit a loophole for a reason it wasn't intended.

    6. Re:If you're so altruistic, why pick Delaware? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sounds like California.

    7. Re:If you're so altruistic, why pick Delaware? by gatfirls · · Score: 1

      "The Delaware General Corporation Law is the most advanced and flexible business formation statute in the nation. The Delaware Court of Chancery is a unique 215 year old business court that has written most of the modern U.S. corporation case law. Delaware’s State Government is business-friendly and accessible. The state’s Division of Corporation is a model state-of-the-art efficiency and the staff provides prompt, friendly and professional service to clients, attorneys, registered agents and others. These factors have all contributed to making Delaware a premier legal home to companies around the world."

      Sure, there are tax benefits but a small start up is thinking ease of entry more than 'how do we hide our profits'.

      In other words: I like to support my local grocer but if I have to wait in line for ten minutes I'll just go to the big box.

    8. Re:If you're so altruistic, why pick Delaware? by dj245 · · Score: 1

      They talk about choosing this corporate structure (in part) to prevent themselves from exploiting tax loopholes, yet they incorporated in Delaware (rather than the state their main office is actually in -- New York, apparently), which could be construed as exploiting loopholes (at least regulatory, if not directly tax-related) in and of itself. What gives?

      Everybody incorporates in Delaware because it is easy and cheap to file the paperwork there. If you are selling things, or have employees, in almost any state, you have to register as a foreign corp/LLC in that state anyway, open worker's comp accounts, open tax accounts and pay income tax, etc. It really isn't cheating on tax, or a loophole, since you have to pay the corporate income tax in whatever state you made the income.

      --
      Even those who arrange and design shrubberies are under considerable economic stress at this period in history.
    9. Re:If you're so altruistic, why pick Delaware? by guises · · Score: 1

      New York might be worse than... Where, exactly? I've lived in New York and New Orleans and it's like comparing apples and rotting oranges as far as corruption is concerned. The US has a lot of corruption problems, but among the big cities New York is better than... some. I'd put it in the middle somewhere.

      Seriously, where is this non-corrupt paradise? Cleveland? I don't know squat about Cleveland. It's probably Cleveland.

  2. Re:TL;DR: by DutchUncle · · Score: 1

    Good people go to bed earlier..

    But . . . alone?

  3. Re:TL;DR: by ganjadude · · Score: 1

    so what you are saying is there is now an opening in the market?

    --
    have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
  4. Re:TL;DR: by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    What are you on about, SJW?

  5. my guess? by argStyopa · · Score: 1

    My guess is that it's an effort to avoid the looming backlash as Congress (who barely even perceives the internet yet) starts to get waves of angry mail from constituents complaining that they've "lost our life savings on this Kick-Starter-thing and now they claim they're not responsible"....

    I KNOW they're basically just an aggregator.
    I KNOW "caveat emptor" and agree with it.
    But when congress starts to see that $millions$ have vanished chasing projects* they're going to start looking for someone to hang, and since KS doesn't have the lobbying weight of Wall Street, they're going to look like an awfully-choice "example" that Congress can use to prove they're "doing something".
    2016 is an election year, as you may remember.

    Personally, I believe their next big move would be to ensure that members of Goldman-Sachs are sitting on their board. That seems to do wonders to ensure that they avoid government culpability or scrutiny...

    *that probably should have never been born in the first place.

    --
    -Styopa
    1. Re:my guess? by alvinrod · · Score: 1

      My guess is that it's an effort to avoid the looming backlash as Congress (who barely even perceives the internet yet) starts to get waves of angry mail from constituents complaining that they've "lost our life savings on this Kick-Starter-thing and now they claim they're not responsible"....

      If that were true, Congress would have come down much harder on the banks and stock market already after the housing crisis.

      They don't really care, but a few might use it as a point to extort^H^H^H^H^H^H get campaign donations from Kickstarter.

  6. Maximizing profits is a public benefit by trout007 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    A company that maximizes profits in a free market is much better for society than one operating at a loss. A profitable company is meeting societies needs in a cost efficient way. A company operating at a loss is wasting resources.

    --
    I love Jesus, except for his foreign policy.
    1. Re:Maximizing profits is a public benefit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What do governments do then? Do they meet societies needs, let alone in a cost effective way. A government operating at a loss is wasting resources.

    2. Re:Maximizing profits is a public benefit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In many cases, but not all. For example, the public benefits heavily from the existence of filesharing services, but they exist to the detriment of corporations who are less able to extract rents for the use of their copyrighted properties. Properly enforcing copyright law and banning filesharing would maximize the profits of Comcast and other large media corporations, but make us all poorer.

    3. Re:Maximizing profits is a public benefit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Cut and Paste from Faux News, no doubt. Take your greedy capitalistic bullshit somewhere else. Math proves irrefutably that exploitation only benefits the investor class. Workers are, by the definition of capitalism, robbed of the fruits of their labor to line the pockets of that investor class.

    4. Re:Maximizing profits is a public benefit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Thus explaining why you are against, say, anti-smog regulations.

      After all, it's true a priori that either companies will prevent smog on their own, or not having tons of smog wasn't cost-efficient for society. Surely the free market couldn't fail us, so the regulations can only cause inefficiency.

    5. Re:Maximizing profits is a public benefit by BatesMethod · · Score: 1

      I think you're conflating society's needs with those of the company's shareholders.

      Ever heard of externalities?

    6. Re:Maximizing profits is a public benefit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Kickstarter didn't say they'll operate at a loss. Make a better strawmen next time you libtard.

    7. Re:Maximizing profits is a public benefit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Error on line 1!

      It is also true that A company that maximizes profits in a free market is much better for society than one that builds and detonates nuclear bombs in cities! So your statement is not providing insight.

      I think you present a false dichotomy. If you'd said this: "A company that maximizes profits in a free market is much better for society than one that also takes into consideration other goals, such as the well-being of its staff, customers and community" - then you'd have a far harder time arguing the case.

      And as a hypothetical counter-example, a company that maximizes profits by gouging customers and bribing government is plainly not as good for society as one that desists.

    8. Re:Maximizing profits is a public benefit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "A company that maximizes profits in a free market is much better for society than one operating at a loss."

      Except this is not reality.

      Science on reasoning:

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PYmi0DLzBdQ

      Protectionism for the rich and big business by state intervention, radical market interference.

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WHj2GaPuEhY#t=349

    9. Re:Maximizing profits is a public benefit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Math proves irrefutably that exploitation only benefits the investor class. Workers are, by the definition of capitalism, robbed of the fruits of their labor to line the pockets of that investor class.

      What? Workers are not robbed of the fruits of their labor, they are paid for their labor. Your comments are shallow and short-sighted. Just because someone is a worker, doesn't mean they can't also be part of the investor class. People need to work for their paycheck until their investments cover their expenses. Simple math. So start early and make investing/saving a habit that may be painful in the short term, but profitable in the long term.

      Additionally, you don't want all of your eggs in one basket. So if you work for one company, you don't want to invest in that same company. So work for one company and then invest in other companies, or maybe an S&P 500 index fund.

    10. Re:Maximizing profits is a public benefit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Socialized security for polluters is a "free" market? Defend everyone from a mass shooter and get the key to the city, defend everyone from a mass polluter and get arrested. Contrary to what free market idealists and socialist strawmen would have us think, the order in which things are deregulated does matter.

  7. Re:TL;DR: by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Weren't those people you accuse found innocent?

  8. Just the First Step by DERoss · · Score: 1

    Becoming a public-benefit corporation is the first step towards becoming a non-profit, 501(c)(3) tax-exempt corporation. A private-benefit corporation cannot be tax-exempt.

    Of course, this means much more than Kickstarter merely avoiding taxes. It also means it cannot compete with for-profit companies; any profits unrelated to its public-benefit purpose are taxed at a higher rate than for-profit corporations. This also means that it cannot endorse any candidate for election to public office and severely limits its ability to lobby government officials and agencies.

  9. Wrong way around by viperidaenz · · Score: 1

    Why is a public benefit corporation not the default, with added paperwork and taxes for private-benefit corporations?

    That way a company can actually "do the right thing", even if it may not directly benefit the shareholders.

  10. Re:TL;DR: by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    No.

  11. Where are the teeth? by piojo · · Score: 1

    What happens if they don't fulfill this new mission? Where's the legal accountability? Or is this just a fancy version of a mission statement?

    --
    A cat can't teach a dog to bark.
  12. Thanks for paying taxes, or not... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Paying taxes is nice, friendly and civilised behaviour. But all is not good, and I would argue that in some countries it is a moral obligation to avoid taxes.
    The numbers and reliability of the sources can be argued of course:

    The general US war machine has killed 20-30 million foreigners since WWII. Let's use 25E6 lives. Averaging around 350E3 lives per year.
    http://www.sott.net/article/273517-Study-US-regime-has-killed-20-30-million-people-since-World-War-Two

    The US military spending is around 18% of federal budget, or 615E9 USD
    http://www.cbpp.org/research/policy-basics-where-do-our-federal-tax-dollars-go

    Over time projection indicates that each foreign life costs around 1.7E6 USD

    So, for every 9.5M USD you pay in federal tax you, in effect, fund the killing of one foreign national.

    Hence, I think it's morally right to go for some serious tax evasion when it comes to paying US federal taxes...

  13. Your signature by Thing+1 · · Score: 1

    Do you dispute that shills exist? That corporations and governments are actively paying people to pollute public forums? If I find out that a poster is a shill, does it not somewhat become a helpful, healthy goal to inform others?

    I get what you're saying about wanting to cease the logical fallacies. But the evidence (government manuals, testimonials) that people are being paid to divert discussion exists. So, what do you think should be done about it?

    --
    I feel fantastic, and I'm still alive.
    1. Re:Your signature by ganjadude · · Score: 1

      debate the points. simple paid or not the points are there to be debated

      --
      have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
  14. Of course! Because as we all know from Drew Carey, by Thing+1 · · Score: 1

    Cleveland Rocks!

    --
    I feel fantastic, and I'm still alive.
  15. Re:Of course! Because as we all know from Drew Car by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    cleveland, like all of ohio is flat and dull, eception for occasionally the aptly named 'flats'.

  16. Re: Of course! Because as we all know from Drew Ca by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Never been to Cincinnati I guess..

  17. If you REALLY want to be "for the public benefit". by kaizendojo · · Score: 1

    Start vetting your projects better. I've funded four projects, only one of which saw the light of day. And that one was almost as bad as the Kreyos I funded at Indiegogo. Quite frankly, I'm done with crowdfunding until IGG and KS start vetting instead of letting any scammer with a post box drop and a slick video to start a campaign.