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Microsoft Open-Sources Visual Studio Code (visualstudio.com)

Posted by Soulskill on from the temperatures-in-hell-continue-to-drop dept.

An anonymous reader writes: Microsoft today unleashed a torrent of news at its Connect(); 2015 developer event in New York City. The company open-sourced code editing software Visual Studio Code, launched a free Visual Studio Dev Essentials program, pushed out .NET Core 5 and ASP.NET 5 release candidates, unveiled Visual Studio cloud subscriptions, debuted the Visual Studio Marketplace, and a lot more. The source for Visual Studio Code is available at GitHub under the MIT license. They've also released an extension (preview) for Visual Studio that facilitates code debugging on Linux.

160 comments

  1. This I predicted will happen by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    way back in 2007.

    1. Re:This I predicted will happen by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      [citation needed]

    2. Re:This I predicted will happen by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Citation

    3. Re:This I predicted will happen by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      .. And as I predicted waaaaaaaaay back in 1997. I remember talking to a VC right in front of the Apple campus. I told him MS have no choice but to embrace Linux. I only hope they dont do the Extend and the Extinguish. But my current apprehension is they will heap a bunch of eye candy on top of Linux, ostensibly to make Linux "as user friendly as Windows", which will be buggy as hell. This may bring a bad rap to Linux itself.

    4. Re:This I predicted will happen by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think you're *still* living in 1997...

    5. Re:This I predicted will happen by invictusvoyd · · Score: 1

      way back in 2007.

      No one needed VS Code source in 2007 , no one needs it now.

    6. Re:This I predicted will happen by morgauxo · · Score: 1

      "I only hope they dont do the Extend and the Extinguish"

      nah. RedHat is already doing a fine job of that!

  2. Linux port now by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I don't have time to do it myself, but we definitely need something better than Vim...

    1. Re:Linux port now by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

      It already runs on Linux.

    2. Re:Linux port now by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      emacs

    3. Re:Linux port now by bobbied · · Score: 1

      And the argument starts all over again..... Ah, well, this IS Slashdot...

      --
      "File to fit, pound to insert, paint to match" - Aircraft Maintenance 101
    4. Re:Linux port now by teg · · Score: 1

      emacs

      Emacs Macht Alle Computer Schön. I guess noone cares about the old "Eight Megabytes And Constantly Swapping" anymore, at eight megabytes it'd be less than one percent of a web browser.

    5. Re:Linux port now by Grishnakh · · Score: 1

      There's lots of other editors for Linux: emacs for one, but also Kate, which has a mode with vi key bindings. There's also an effort underway to do a clean rewrite of vim. Any good editor is going to have either vi or emacs-like functionality. If it doesn't, it's a crap editor because it doesn't give you the power that those editors do in navigating and editing code. The main problem vim has is that it doesn't by default have the ability to parse your source code and do things like autocomplete, but that stuff is added by various extensions like cscope and YouCompleteMe.

    6. Re:Linux port now by ClickOnThis · · Score: 2

      It already runs on Linux.

      Indeed it does.

      Color me bemused. I didn't know.

      --
      If it weren't for deadlines, nothing would be late.
    7. Re:Linux port now by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      8Mb? that's what, the size of an average java "hello world" instance?

      Oh wait, it's more like 80Mb for that, and emacs actually does something useful.

    8. Re:Linux port now by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      true, this move could kill both Emacs and Vim.

    9. Re:Linux port now by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      for me it's 65MB on a 1k C++ file.

    10. Re:Linux port now by Dr_Barnowl · · Score: 5, Insightful

      It's in the same space as other editors-made-of-browser-technology as Komodo and Atom ; it's not a full version of Visual Studio.

      My preference in that space is still Komodo Edit ; it has the benefit of maturity. Atom has that liveliness that new projects do. VSC? Not sure how it will attract the community it needs to thrive.

    11. Re:Linux port now by alva_edison · · Score: 1

      The main problem vim has is that it's modal.

      --
      He effected a bored affect.
    12. Re:Linux port now by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Most people actively using Emacs and Vim at this point are pretty entrenched. There's no way i'd go back to using some bloated IDE.

    13. Re:Linux port now by Grishnakh · · Score: 1

      I don't see that as a problem, but rather a feature. It lets me easily navigate the code without having to use a mouse, which is a big interruption.

    14. Re:Linux port now by ohnocitizen · · Score: 1

      Sublime for an amazing editor. If Jetbrains made a C# IDE it would be pretty great (not sure how good the plugin is).

    15. Re:Linux port now by bingoUV · · Score: 1

      You can remain in insert mode forever - it is still more powerful than nano. So it is modal only if you want.

      --
      Bingo Dictionary - Pragmatist, n. A myopic idealist.
    16. Re:Linux port now by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not sure about the vim mode, but I'm very happy with qtcreator. It has a fake-vim functionality I've never tested.

    17. Re:Linux port now by alva_edison · · Score: 1

      You can remain in insert mode forever - it is still more powerful than nano. So it is modal only if you want.

      So are you saying I can copy/paste/cut/save/quit in insert mode? Because those are necessary in order to stay in insert mode forever.

      --
      He effected a bored affect.
    18. Re:Linux port now by bingoUV · · Score: 1

      Yes. inoremap.

      --
      Bingo Dictionary - Pragmatist, n. A myopic idealist.
  3. Visual Studio "in name only" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Not the real Visual Studio. It's just a shitty fork of GitHub's Atom editor.

    1. Re:Visual Studio "in name only" by squiggleslash · · Score: 4, Informative

      No it isn't, they both share the same framework but one is not derived from the other: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

      --
      You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
  4. VS CODE ! = Visual Studio by jlp2097 · · Score: 5, Informative

    Just to avoid any confusion: VS Code is not Visual Studio, VS Code is a web-based code editor.

    1. Re:VS CODE ! = Visual Studio by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Please update mod up the parent. VIsual Studio Code is not the same thing is Visual Studio.

      However, Visual Studio Code can run as an app that looks like any fat client app on your computer. Yet, Visual Studio Code is a web app. Not sure what you call these type of apps.

    2. Re:VS CODE ! = Visual Studio by sosume · · Score: 4, Insightful

      VS Code is not a web-based, but a filesystem or git based code editor and debugger with support for .net, node.js and other language stacks. Somewhere between Sublime Text and Sharpdevelop.

    3. Re:VS CODE ! = Visual Studio by fluffernutter · · Score: 1, Insightful

      So... more news not really worth talking about.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    4. Re:VS CODE ! = Visual Studio by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Visual Studio for Apps is an appy app that can app other apps! Only LUDDITES use LUDDITE Visual Studio!

      Apps!

    5. Re:VS CODE ! = Visual Studio by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So like Chrome Apps?

      Web app seems just fine. Differentiates it from a web site.

    6. Re:VS CODE ! = Visual Studio by slashdice · · Score: -1, Troll

      I call them: "utter shit". And the people that use them: "retards"

      --
      Copyright (c) 1990 - 2014 Dice. All rights reserved. Use of this comment is subject to certain Terms and Conditions.
    7. Re:VS CODE ! = Visual Studio by macs4all · · Score: 1, Funny

      Not sure what you call these type of apps.

      Shitty.

    8. Re:VS CODE ! = Visual Studio by idontgno · · Score: 4, Informative

      I suspect the confusion arises because TFA (last link in TFS) says that

      The free and cross-platform Chromium-based code editor Visual Studio Code is being open sourced today.

      (Emphasis added)

      "Chromium-based" means it's based on a web browser engine, but that doesn't make it web-based. Its backside could easily be file- or Git-based, as you say.

      Very interesting, and maybe confusing, move by Microsoft.

      --
      Welcome to the Panopticon. Used to be a prison, now it's your home.
    9. Re:VS CODE ! = Visual Studio by gnupun · · Score: 1

      But does it support developing desktop apps? Their website suggests it's only for web development:

      "Build and debug modern web and cloud applications."

    10. Re:VS CODE ! = Visual Studio by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I knew this sounded too good to be true.

    11. Re:VS CODE ! = Visual Studio by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Haha, "We Open Sourced Visual Studio Code!" The headline adds ambiguity and we are sorry to inform you that our Visual Studio code is still as secretive and overpriced as ever, but since you're already here, let's pitch our new Visual Studio product line to you!

    12. Re:VS CODE ! = Visual Studio by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And you're objectively wrong.

    13. Re:VS CODE ! = Visual Studio by Austerity+Empowers · · Score: 1

      It would have been exciting is Microsoft Visual C was open sourced, and we can once and for all end the tyranny of that wretched piece of shit and bring it in line with other build tools used everywhere else. I am tired of all the hoops I have to jump through to make code that compiles on linux (clang and gcc), os x (clang) and cygwin (gcc) compile under msvc, and I'm not even talking about the lack of posix support. That would make me hate microsoft a little less.

      But no this is some silly editor I never heard of that doesn't have to do with the price of tea in china. This is creating a problem to a solution I did not have a problem for.

    14. Re:VS CODE ! = Visual Studio by Dr_Barnowl · · Score: 1

      It's based on Electron, the core of Atom.

      My preference in the editors-made-of-browser-tech space is still Komodo Edit, but I like the liveliness that Atom has.

    15. Re:VS CODE ! = Visual Studio by Anonymous Coward · · Score: -1

      "Crap" is the word you are looking for.

    16. Re:VS CODE ! = Visual Studio by Tough+Love · · Score: 1

      It's always news when M$ opensources something.

      --
      When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
    17. Re:VS CODE ! = Visual Studio by FatdogHaiku · · Score: 1

      Wapps...

      --
      You have the right to remain sentient. If you give up the right to remain sentient, you will be elected to public office
    18. Re:VS CODE ! = Visual Studio by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes. Slashdot is now, the new, "News for TURDS!"

    19. Re:VS CODE ! = Visual Studio by bondsbw · · Score: 1

      Eyeliner is a solution to a problem I don't have. But I don't go on makeup forums and suggest that Avon should stop making eyeliner.

      --
      All my liberal friends think I'm a conservative, all my conservative friends think I'm a liberal.
    20. Re:VS CODE ! = Visual Studio by terjeber · · Score: 1

      For desktop apps you are better off with Visual Studio Community Edition (previously known as Visual Studio Professional). The community edition is not, like the older Express editions, a paired-down version of VS, this is the full Professional edition.

    21. Re:VS CODE ! = Visual Studio by terjeber · · Score: 1

      Visual Studio Code is free. Vistual Studio Community Edition (same as Professional) is free. You need to leave the 1990s.

    22. Re:VS CODE ! = Visual Studio by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No, he's absolutely correct

    23. Re:VS CODE ! = Visual Studio by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      (same as Professional)

      Translation: "Missing all the important / interesting features"

  5. Could we quit with the stupid conf names? by xxxJonBoyxxx · · Score: 4, Insightful

    >> Connect();

    Could we please quit with the stupid punctuation in conference names? It just messes with search engines, folder structures, etc. Just call this "VScon" and everyone will get the message that this is for Microsoft developers using Visual Studio.

    1. Re:Could we quit with the stupid conf names? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Cant you just search or store it as "Microsoft Connect Conference" or is that too hard?

    2. Re:Could we quit with the stupid conf names? by xxxJonBoyxxx · · Score: 4, Informative

      Try a Google search for "Connect();" and see what happens. ("Microsoft Connect Conference" ain't even on the first page.)

    3. Re:Could we quit with the stupid conf names? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Typically yes. There is plenty of information going around and most of it isn't worth your time.
      If you make things inconvenient for people just to feel special then you will be ignored.

    4. Re:Could we quit with the stupid conf names? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Or perhaps fix the search engines? When the search engines defines how we use the language, something is wrong.

    5. Re:Could we quit with the stupid conf names? by bmajik · · Score: 2

      Give us some credit for taking baby steps...

      A few years ago, this would have been called "Microsoft Active Developer Conference 2016 with Bing.com and VisualStudio.com"

      Surely you agree that "Connect();" is an improvement ?

      --
      My opinions are my own, and do not necessarily represent those of my employer.
    6. Re:Could we quit with the stupid conf names? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      A few years ago, this would have been called "Microsoft Active Developer Conference 2016 with Bing.com and VisualStudio.com"

      Surely you agree that "Connect();" is an improvement ?

      From a descriptive-yet-long name to a non-descriptive, non-googleable name? Not really an improvement.

    7. Re:Could we quit with the stupid conf names? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      Surely that's because you're searching for the wrong term. The right one is: "Connect(); // 2015" (without the quotes)

    8. Re:Could we quit with the stupid conf names? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: -1

      My wife works for Microsoft and is an admin that is forced to help with conferences. That makes her hate life and she has attempted suicide twice. Trust me, the rulers of Microsoft hate you even more than they hate her, and they do not want you to attend their conference. They do not want to deal with you. They hate you. They are so hateful. I hate them for ruining my life. Also, the only job I could find was not as a real programmer, but as a C# copy-paste moron. I hate my life almost as much as Microsoft hates their customers.

    9. Re:Could we quit with the stupid conf names? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      Doesn't even show up on Bing. Well well well.

    10. Re:Could we quit with the stupid conf names? by xxxJonBoyxxx · · Score: 1

      >> Surely that's because you're searching for the wrong term. The right one is: "Connect(); // 2015"

      Sure, that would have been my 1,455th guess. :) Someone please mod parent up as "funny". The rest of you*, go fire your marketing team.

      * = For values of "rest of you" equal to "anyone having anything to do with this conference."

    11. Re:Could we quit with the stupid conf names? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Pfft, let the Bobby Tables conference wreak havoc!

    12. Re: Could we quit with the stupid conf names? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They hate all humanity. I know I was treated like human garbage when I suffered there.

    13. Re:Could we quit with the stupid conf names? by ThatsNotPudding · · Score: 1

      Just call this "VScon" and everyone will get the message that this is for Microsoft developers using Visual Studio.

      Especially the 'con' part.

    14. Re:Could we quit with the stupid conf names? by squiggleslash · · Score: 2

      Nah, because it involves punctuation. Look, it's not hard, the way to create a post-desktop modern tech web 10.0 name is to put 'r' or 'ly' on the end of a word, like:

      connectly, voidly, mallocly
      readr, pointr, newr

      That way it'll Google, it'll be kinda unique, and it'll still look just as embarassing and hip in a "Yo young kids, I may be your granddad but I'm hip with your Rick Astleys and Madonna music and Beavis and or Butthead" way as your attempts to include punctuation.

      --
      You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
    15. Re:Could we quit with the stupid conf names? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That is not really a suprise, Bing doesn't have any search results on the first page.

    16. Re:Could we quit with the stupid conf names? by barbariccow · · Score: 1

      I went to OSCon heavily sponsored by Microsoft a few years back. Since Microsoft really doesn't have anything "Open Source", their input was basically a huge bar and a ton of crafts (like making bracelets, staining leather, etc). Pretty cool, Microsoft can actually do a really good job at things so long as it doesn't involve software.

    17. Re:Could we quit with the stupid conf names? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Maybe it's on the first page of Bing results . . .

    18. Re: Could we quit with the stupid conf names? by Ilgaz · · Score: 1

      People will remember the one and only Windows 98 C:/con/con Bug , not good for new Microsoft ;-)

      https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=...

    19. Re: Could we quit with the stupid conf names? by Ilgaz · · Score: 1

      They try to be trendy and it backfires. I really hate when they call my full feature laptop, notebook a "device" on Windows 10 too.

      They should look to IBM, they just reinvented themselves without doing such "lets look cool to these young kids" trickery. They stayed as Big Blue. For example, having complete W3C HTML valid homepage (don't know current) is way more modern than coming up with some pseudo code names.

    20. Re: Could we quit with the stupid conf names? by gmiller123456 · · Score: 1

      Conversely:

      Can we please fix search engines and file systems to work with punctuation. Altering our behavior to comply with the limitations of the tech de jour is not and end state solution.

    21. Re:Could we quit with the stupid conf names? by claytongulick · · Score: 1

      Actually, I'm giving MS a heck of a lot of credit these days. It's a different Microsoft from what we here at slashdot are used to.

      VS Code is brilliant. MS's actions embracing open source are wonderful. Azure supporting Linux is awesome. Windows 10 is a freaking amazing OS and for the first time in a long time the best consumer OS on the market (though I'm still partial to Linux on servers).

      Microsoft has embraced JavaScript and NodeJS, and they are actively pushing the open web and standards. Edge browser has better and more advanced HTML5 support and ES6 support than Chrome!

      Microsoft has a lot of history to overcome, but from what I see they are doing the right things and I think we should give credit where it's due and encourage the awesome new direction MS is taking. I never thought I'd say it, but I'm really starting to like MS, or at the very least taking a serious second look and not discarding them out of hand like I would have four or five years ago.

      --
      Drinking habits can be dangerous. You can choke on the cloth and the nuns will wonder where their clothes are.
  6. Embrace. Extend. Extinguish. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: -1, Troll

    Typical MS.

    1. Re:Embrace. Extend. Extinguish. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If that's what they're doing (again), then they're on the path of extinguishing themselves.

    2. Re:Embrace. Extend. Extinguish. by terjeber · · Score: 1

      Moron. Typical Slashdot.

  7. layoffs ahead... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This is part of Bill's strategy to cut costs. Open source the code base,
    get community bug / enhancements, layoff the developers. Simple math.

    CAP === 'disrupts'

    1. Re:layoffs ahead... by Lendrick · · Score: 1

      I don't know how much Bill has to do with the day to day goings on at Microsoft now. Seems to me like his primary focus now is doing good in the third world. (And as much as I hated him as a businessman, he's an awesome philanthropist.)

    2. Re:layoffs ahead... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Haha, this is so familiar. I once worked in a software company which new management really believed, that they could open source the development and just continue taking the code and selling it for same price as before. Not so surprisingly people were not too keen on doing work for free and give all the rights for code to the company..

    3. Re:layoffs ahead... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Giving away Microsoft licenses to get governments and NGO's hooked on their products is awesome philanthropy?

    4. Re:layoffs ahead... by Lendrick · · Score: 1

      Is Bill the one doing that?

  8. If it's not GPL by Lead+Butthead · · Score: -1, Flamebait

    If it's not GPL'ed, it's not open source. And we all know what abhorrence MS harbors for GPL...

    --
    ELOI, ELOI, LAMA SABACHTHANI!?
    1. Re:If it's not GPL by nateman1352 · · Score: 4, Informative

      If it's not GPL'ed, it's not open source. And we all know what abhorrence MS harbors for GPL...

      The Open Source Initiative has certified the MIT license as a valid open source license. Look I'm not a huge MS fan either, but they are using a real OSS license here. Just because MIT isn't copyleft doesn't mean its not OSS.

    2. Re:If it's not GPL by Jack9 · · Score: 3, Informative

      > If it's not GPL'ed, it's not open source

      Nope. Open source implies the source that comprises the entirety of the application is available to be inspected. Terms of that access are orthogonal to the phrase, although RMS would insist it must be free as in beer, philosophically or it isn't "open".

      --

      Often wrong but never in doubt.
      I am Jack9.
      Everyone knows me.
    3. Re:If it's not GPL by edtice1559 · · Score: 2

      And the MIT license is GPL compatible, so you're welcome to add your own GPL parts and release your improved version under GPL.

    4. Re:If it's not GPL by Kjella · · Score: 1

      The Open Source Initiative has certified the MIT license as a valid open source license. Look I'm not a huge MS fan either, but they are using a real OSS license here. Just because MIT isn't copyleft doesn't mean its not OSS.

      Not to mention GPL-compatible, which means it in every way has less strings attached. This is not the CDDL or MS PL or some other obscure and intentionally incompatible license, it's as open source as it gets.

      --
      Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
    5. Re:If it's not GPL by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      RMS wouldn't insist that software must be free as in beer. He always emphasizes that free software is a matter of freedom, not price.

    6. Re:If it's not GPL by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Careful: it's under the MIT license, which doesn't include a patent grant like the Apache license.

    7. Re:If it's not GPL by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I loved how you got mod-bombed and called out by at least 3 people. Now go fuck yourself and slither your way back to Stallman's cheese-encrusted cock. You evidently spend a lot of time sucking it, so get to work!

    8. Re:If it's not GPL by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Nope.

      RMS does not advocate open source software he advocates Free Software.

    9. Re:If it's not GPL by david_thornley · · Score: 1

      That's a very idiosyncratic definition, and not particularly useful. We already have "copylefted" as a word.

      The MIT license is considered Free by the Free Software Foundation, and Open Source by the Open Source Initiative. That's good enough for me.

      --
      "When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
    10. Re:If it's not GPL by terjeber · · Score: 1

      Remember, it's better to sit quietly in the corner having everyone think you are a clueless moron than to speak and remove any doubt.

  9. Why? why now? by nimbius · · Score: 1, Insightful

    If you're a developer working in a shop writing code for bethesda or valve or EA, chances are your windows site license for desktops and servers is already heavily discounted thanks to your generous interest in a visual studio license despite eclipse being right there. Chances are even better that in order to keep this generous discount your manager has started shoehorning C# into your project requirements to 'maximize the investment value' of what basically amounts to a protection racket for good customers.

    if you're a web developer chances are vim with a few extensions is working well, or there are already a myriad of alternatives that dont require purchasing an expensive license for your startup. Eclipse has always been an option for you. if you're writing games for Android and dont work on the Candy Crush team then youre almost certainly an eclipse user. If youre writing iOS apps you must have done something truly evil in a past life.

    3 years in and No one outside redmond is writing shit for the windows app store. unless you run excel on your phablet, and that comes from the same team that writes excel for your laptop. maybe redmond thinks the reason for this to be a lack of competent IDE for windows? If its looking to gain traction in the 'hot' web languages its about 10 years too late. PHP, python, ruby, and a bunch more shops for these languages made money because they exclusively refused to participate in microsofts cash cow scheme. They already had their desktop and laptop licenses, assuming the devs didnt opt for a macbook, and by the time microsoft dropped the license fees to a few hundred dollars for a group no one was left interested. Maybe microsoft sees this as an opportunity to get a foot in the door at small startups?

    --
    Good people go to bed earlier.
    1. Re:Why? why now? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Not one statement in the above rant is true or apropos the actual fucking subject.

    2. Re:Why? why now? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Say what you want about MS business tactics, but Visual Studio is the best code editor currently available.

      And despite the growth of smart phones and tablets, the desktop application market is still a huge market. Not everyone wants to make app store crap.

      because they exclusively refused to participate in microsofts cash cow scheme.

      Who gives a fuck? The released it under the MIT license. Fork it and do whatever you want with it now.

    3. Re:Why? why now? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sure I can use eclipse. But I got tired of waiting for it to start up. Or I can fire up VS and get some work done.

    4. Re:Why? why now? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Visual Studio Code != Visual Studio dickface.

    5. Re:Why? why now? by UnknownSoldier · · Score: 1

      Ironically I was reading this article yesterday which goes into more detail how Microsoft lost momentum to web clients:

      How Microsoft Lost the API War

    6. Re:Why? why now? by UnknownSoldier · · Score: 0

      > but Visual Studio is the best code editor currently available.

      Define "best" ... ? ... for "what" exactly ?

      Because while VS is fine for Windows debugging its text editor has sucked for years. Windows only, closed source, slow, etc. I'd rather use Vim or Emacs which works across multiple platforms (I use the same .vimrc config file across Windows, OSX, and Linux), is fast, has tons of features and plugins, and isn't interested in putting the menu in ALL CAPS because some retard UI designer doesn't have a fucking clue about _good_ UI design.

      But since the article was talking about VS Code and not Visual Studio, here's the roadmap for VS Code Oh look, VS Code _still_ doesn't support:

      * code folding.
      * Global search and replace

      I'll just an editor that _already_ works, not some buggy, incomplete, PoS.

    7. Re:Why? why now? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're in the wrong thread!

    8. Re:Why? why now? by SirSlud · · Score: 1

      If you're a developer working in a shop writing code for bethesda or valve or EA, chances are your windows site license for desktops and servers is already heavily discounted thanks to your generous interest in a visual studio license despite eclipse being right there. Chances are even better that in order to keep this generous discount your manager has started shoehorning C# into your project requirements to 'maximize the investment value' of what basically amounts to a protection racket for good customers.

      This is one of the dumbest things I've read on /. for a long while.

      --
      "Old man yells at systemd"
    9. Re:Why? why now? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      VS is not that bad... once you invest in some proprietary, third-party extensions to provide things that are provided out of the box with other editors.

    10. Re:Why? why now? by lister+king+of+smeg · · Score: 1

      I'll just an editor that _already_ works, not some buggy, incomplete, PoS.

      Why are you coding on a Point of Sales system incomplete or not.

      --
      ---Saying gnome 3 is better than windows 8 not so much a compliment as it is damning with light praise.
    11. Re:Why? why now? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I wouldn't write off Microsoft yet.

      While we are not there quite yet, we will approach a point where your phone has enough memory and processor capability to replace the average corporate desktop, at which point your work phone will also be your computer - simply plug it into a docking station which Microsoft already has to get a larger screen, physical keyboard, etc.

      Google Android really has no answer to this, and the one thing you can tell about Apple's denial this week about merging the desktop with the portable is that they are working on it but it is not yet ready.

      The big breakthrough will come when people accept that developers will have to develop 2 GUI's for their software, a phone/tablet touch interface and a traditional desktop interface where they can assume a bigger screen and physical keyboard/mouse.

    12. Re:Why? why now? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I would and so have the general public. They can't even give away Windows 10 and no one wants their phones or tablets. To think people are going to plug their phones into a dock is just more stupidity from this company. Motorola did it in 2011 and no one wanted it.

    13. Re:Why? why now? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Define "best" ... ? ... for "what" exactly ?

      The 'what' is implied by the functionality of the product itself. It's the best C++, C#, VB, etc IDE.

      Vim, Emacs? Dude. Just no. They are useless on their own, and are only barely comparable to VS after you install a shit ton of addons The addon infrastructure is so brittle that they never work right all the time anyway. Nobody on this planet is ever going to recover the time spent learning those commands (**hundreds** of hours of lost productivity) with microsecond "gains" in typing out code.

      Also nobody sane types out reams of code without stopping to think, run, debug or test. There is simply no boost in productivity, and never was.

    14. Re:Why? why now? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      its text editor has sucked for years

      It can be configured to function exactly like VIM or Emacs.

      which works across multiple platforms

      I can actually use Visual Studio to build for multiple platforms as well. I just set it to use Intel's compiler and point it to a mapped drive containing various platform toolsets. You could also set it to use GCC.

      and isn't interested in putting the menu in ALL CAPS because some retard UI designer doesn't have a fucking clue about _good_ UI design.

      Ahahahahahhaa... good UI design... that's funny. *nix world if full of crap UI. OSX has some nice design but I don't like their practice of breaking compatibility every few years.

      Anyway, you are clearly an Anti-MS nutjob. Keep popping that vein in your forehead and venting all your fake anger at MS, I'm sure you make a difference someday.

    15. Re:Why? why now? by UnknownSoldier · · Score: 1

      +1 for lame attempt at humor :-)

    16. Re:Why? why now? by claytongulick · · Score: 1

      Actually, I'll probably be switching my whole team over to this once they add two things, 1) vim keybindings and 2) support for debugging node clusters

      Why? Because it's lightweight, runs everywhere, is open source and works great. It supports node debugging well. It's a heck of a lot better than Webstorm, which we're currently using. Webstorm is nice but so full of feature bloat that all I see all day as I code is the little mac spinning rainbow as java slowly executes.

      There are plenty of other editors out there, and other IDE options, but one thing that MS has always done well is focus on developer tools and ease of use. This seems to be the next iteration of that, but aiming for a minimalist approach with filesystem based "projects" and drastically simplified UI that works with most web developer's workflow.

      I like it. Once it grows up a bit my whole team will probably switch over, and we're a mac/linux shop primarily.

      --
      Drinking habits can be dangerous. You can choke on the cloth and the nuns will wonder where their clothes are.
    17. Re:Why? why now? by terjeber · · Score: 1

      despite eclipse being right there

      Having a root canal in all my teeth with no sedation would be FAR more comfortable than switching back to using Eclipse as my main development environment. Seriously. Visual Studio is that much better. The reality is that VS is what Eclipse could have been if Eclipse developers knew anything about usability. C# is what Java could have been if it wasn't (both now and before) managed by a moronic committee. The fact that I can now deploy on Linux is a huge plus, but I would not give up Visual Studio as my dev environment. Nothing comes close.

  10. Finally, poettering will by Anonymous Coward · · Score: -1

    have his favorite editor to work on his userland kernel/registry.

  11. attention whores by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    compiler source or gtfo.

    1. Re: attention whores by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      https://github.com/dotnet/roslyn

      There you go, shit head

    2. Re: attention whores by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      it's not like they know what to do with the link you gave them anyways

  12. .NET 5 is just what we need. by PsychoSlashDot · · Score: 3, Informative

    Now we can have/need the .NET 3, 4, 4.5 and 5 runtimes all on the same machine, meaning monthly patches will take another half-hour.

    I get it. .NET runtimes recompile and optimize for the environment they're installed on and that's a Good Thing, but as someone who supports a lot of small & medium business who can't justify WSUS or similar, .NET is - by far - the thing I dread seeing not yet applied to a customer's machine. One new runtime a decade would be just fine by me.

    Yes, there's supposed to be a certain degree of backwards-compatibility, but in practice that degree is "not enough that installing Product X doesn't frequently force you to install runtime Y".

    --
    "Oh no... he found the .sig setting."
    1. Re:.NET 5 is just what we need. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      you can install only the latest version... no need to keep them all.

    2. Re:.NET 5 is just what we need. by bmajik · · Score: 2

      I'd be interested in learning more about the compatibility problems you're having with real apps and .net framework versions.

      We know that there are ocassionally compat issues because we have large customers we work with to try and mitigate them.

      There are already mechanisms built into .net for rebinding apps to use specific framework and assembly versions, e.g. the .exe.config file that you can modify without access to the application's source code.

      In general, .NET 2.0 and .NET 4.0 are the two separate runtimes that you would currently need to have installed. .NET 3.5 is the newest iteration of the .net 2.0 runtime, and .NET 4.6.x is the newest iteration of the 4.0 runtime.

      If you're trying to install an app and it says "i need .net 4", and you don't have .net 4 yet, I think that's working as intended. If updates to .net are breaking your apps, that's something we'd like to know about and help with.

      If you have problems of the latter sort - .net updates are breaking your apps, feel free to contact me at this address and I'll see about putting you in touch with someone who can help.

      --
      My opinions are my own, and do not necessarily represent those of my employer.
    3. Re:.NET 5 is just what we need. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Only for .NET 4 and above. .NET 3.5 and below is still separate, and .NET 2.0 is still industry standard in a lot of places.

    4. Re:.NET 5 is just what we need. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      There is no such thing as .Net 3 or 4.5 runtimes. .Net Framework 3.0 uses .Net CLR 2.0. .Net Framework 4.5 uses .Net CLR 4.0.

      The .Net CLR (the runtime component) has the following available versions: 1.0, 1.1, 2.0, 4.0 (Source)

      There is also a stripped-down, cross-platform version of the CLR called CoreCLR that is new with .Net 5. This is not the same as the .Net CLR. It's an alternative to it. The fully backward-compatible .Net CLR will not be available on Mac or Linux. Only CoreCLR will, for the purpose of running ASP.Net 5 on a web server that isn't as "heavy" as IIS.

    5. Re:.NET 5 is just what we need. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You can't run programs made for .NET older than 3.5 on .NET 4. So yes, if you have older software or software that are not ported to the newer framework, you need to keep both runtimes.

    6. Re:.NET 5 is just what we need. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You really have that many problems with that? I never even notice that there are .NET updates.

    7. Re:.NET 5 is just what we need. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is incorrect.

      The only time a CLR update broke compatibility across-the-board was during the 1.0-to-1.1 transition. .Net 1.0 code doesn't really run anywhere anymore, since you literally can't get the CLR for it anymore. Other than that, things generally will run happily on newer versions of the CLR than they were compiled against without issue. To mess that up, you have to have used some really sketchy hacks.

    8. Re:.NET 5 is just what we need. by PsychoSlashDot · · Score: 1

      I'd be interested in learning more about the compatibility problems you're having with real apps and .net framework versions.

      We know that there are ocassionally compat issues because we have large customers we work with to try and mitigate them.

      Typically it's an issue with installers, not necessarily products themselves. When installing various utilities, especially products that haven't been - or needed to be - updated in a while, I've encountered installers that simply won't proceed until a legacy .NET framework is installed. They're not checking for higher versions, they're not checking for equivalent versions, they're checking for precisely the version they were written for. Sometimes you can ignore that and proceed. Sometimes you can't.

      I admit I don't have specific examples of product vendors and names to provide you. I honestly haven't bothered to keep track over the last decade. I do however know that I've prepped many a server and had to install up to three different frameworks to satisfy installers so I could get everything from anti-spam tools to disk-space monitoring tools to random things like (but not necessarily identical to) MAPI exploration tools to install.

      Last comment on this, there's clearly a reason why installing framework 4.5 doesn't remote everything older.

      --
      "Oh no... he found the .sig setting."
    9. Re:.NET 5 is just what we need. by PsychoSlashDot · · Score: 1

      You really have that many problems with that? I never even notice that there are .NET updates.

      I wouldn't necessarily say "problem", Anecdotal Coward. I'd reserve "problem" for things that prevent function and require resolution. This is an annoyance, requiring nothing more than the investment of time.

      The annoyance stems from that in the SMB market, where there are a lot of factors that interfere with best-practices (meaning I understand how to do things right but sometimes can't), I can't always (successfully) arrange for server patching every month, and I can't always arrange for automatic patching. As such, we have several machines ranging from Windows Pro machines acting as P2P file sharing "servers" on tiny four-user networks to small servers that have odd uptime schedule requirements that preclude use of WSUS for patch management. Point is, I've got machines that for various reasons I need to patch manually, say every three months. It's annoying to see a list of around 40 patches, and six of them are .NET, and I know that the other 34 will apply in under 60 seconds each, while those six will each kill off five minutes of my life.

      Sure, I can often alt-tab out and do something else at the same time. Doesn't change that it's annoying. It's just annoying in the same sense that the Adobe-Reader-of-the-week is annoying when it requires local admin rights to install. If you can't justify centralized patch management software, or can't use Group Policy to publish them, it's annoying.

      --
      "Oh no... he found the .sig setting."
    10. Re: .NET 5 is just what we need. by Ilgaz · · Score: 1

      You just provided an answer to people whining about "Why business people, enterprise insist on relying to MS solutions (.NET etc) rather than Linux/OSX?"

      Business wants long term support and dependability. When couple of nerds in a IRC channel or Starbucks decide the fate of their multi million dollar applications future because "nobody uses it", it doesn't work.

      Windows 10 can still run software coded in 1995.

    11. Re:.NET 5 is just what we need. by terjeber · · Score: 1

      For .Net 3.5 and above. No 2.0. 2.0 is from the Stone Age. Upgrade.

  13. It's FREE and Open Source by barlevg · · Score: 1, Informative

    It's released under the MIT License.

  14. so disappointing! by postmortem · · Score: 4, Funny

    They use tabs instead of spaces!

    1. Re:so disappointing! by Psychotria · · Score: 1

      So does Linux!

  15. Can we all go back to ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Can we all go back to writing client/server apps. This web thing is so passé.

  16. Eclipse and Power of Java by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Ah, eclipse, with the [garbage collection] power of [garbage collection] java which [garbage collection] [garbage collection] [garbage collection] enables rich [garbage collection] code [garbage collection] [garbage collection] editing and tight integration with [garbage collection] [garbage collection] [garbage collection] java frame [garbage collection]works.

    And to run it comfortably, you only need 16gb of ram, and a very fast ssd that it can [garbage collection] [garbage collection] [garbage collection] [garbage collection] [garbage collection] swap [garbage collection] [garbage collection] [garbage collection] [garbage collection] to.

    1. Re:Eclipse and Power of Java by kervin · · Score: 2

      First, you do realize .Net is also garbage collected right? Secondly Elipse and Netbeans are excellent and mature IDEs that support dozens of languages and platforms.

      The whole 'Java is slow' meme is at least a 15 years passe, try something new.

    2. Re:Eclipse and Power of Java by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      .NET garbage collection actually works, and doesn't bog down my 4Ghz to a 4Mhz machine. .NET also doesn't thrash my disk, has excellent error messages, unlike java, and doesn't [garbage collection] [garbage collection] [garbage collection] dr [garbage collection]op inp [garbage collection]ut like [garbage collection] j [garbage collection] a [garbage collection] v [garbage collection] a.

      Java IS slow, interpreted languages ARE slow. That is like saying Tokenized basic can be as fast as C or Java can be as fast as hand-optimized assembler.

      It's like saying a 33Mhz 80386 has the same performance as a 33Mhz 80486, it's comparing crap to apples.

      indirection and virtualization do not make things faster, they make things safer for inexperienced and lower skilled programmers, but they certainly don't make things faster.

    3. Re:Eclipse and Power of Java by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      But it *is* true that Eclipse tends to freeze quite regularly just like the grandparent post said. But hey, it's free. If you want better, you'd have to shell out for JetBrains IntelliJ.

    4. Re:Eclipse and Power of Java by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Minecraft, 400KB file, nets the creator $2.5 Billion USD, written in all Java. Case closed.

    5. Re:Eclipse and Power of Java by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      A fool and his money are soon parted.

      If java was that great, we would be running JavaOS, JavaPS3, JavaXBOX, JavaWindows.

      But, I can't wait 3 weeks for my computer to boot, or 3 hours for an application to load.

      Maybe we can have Minecraft, running on a Java Interpreter, running on a java interpreter written in java, running on a a java interpreter written in java.

      More indirection == more speed!

      Sure, it would take a few weeks for the application to load, but wow, when it runs, as fast as native, faster in some cases!

    6. Re:Eclipse and Power of Java by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Please provide references. Something like this: Java vs C#

    7. Re:Eclipse and Power of Java by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Umm..C# is interpreted.

      From site:

      C# programs run on the .NET Framework, an integral component of Windows that includes a virtual execution system called the common language runtime (CLR) and a unified set of class libraries. The CLR is the commercial implementation by Microsoft of the common language infrastructure (CLI), an international standard that is the basis for creating execution and development environments in which languages and libraries work together seamlessly.

      Source code written in C# is compiled into an intermediate language (IL) that conforms to the CLI specification.

    8. Re:Eclipse and Power of Java by mark-t · · Score: 1

      Thirdly, what serious developer is still using fewer than 16gigabytes of RAM as we approach the end of 2015? (insert tongue-in-cheek emoji here).

      --
      File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
    9. Re:Eclipse and Power of Java by Dr_Barnowl · · Score: 1

      No, it's JIT or AOT compiled.

      Intermediate is the key word ; it's compiled to an assembly language for a virtual machine, not al all unlike Java bytecode.

      That is then subsequently compiled to machine code best matching the capability of the platform it's running on, just like Java.

    10. Re:Eclipse and Power of Java by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      C# and Java are, in the scheme of things, two versions of the same basic technology. With Just In Time compilation, Java performance for typical workloads is about half what a good C or assembly language program can achieve. That's not bad at all for the productivity gains the language offers. I'd imagine C# performs the same. The biggest performance bugbear is still getting the garbage collector's performance to scale with increasing RAM size. Up until now, you effectively had to limit your Java memory size to a certain size or less to get good performance. The latest Java GC claims this isn't as bad a problem as before, but we shall see. C#'s GC doesn't have any magic algorithms that Java's doesn't, so again, the situation there.

    11. Re:Eclipse and Power of Java by JebusIsLord · · Score: 1

      Garbage collection and bytecode are two entirely different concepts. .NET has GC, so does Java.

      Both also compile to bytecode, but .NET libraries can also be compiled to native code at installation time when installed in the GAC. This has no bearing whatsoever on whether or not it is garbage collected. It always is.

      --
      Jeremy
    12. Re:Eclipse and Power of Java by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The ones who want their software to work on consumer computers.

    13. Re:Eclipse and Power of Java by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You must be a dumb fuck to not know C-Shit code is compiled to IL code.

  17. And how many patents will I infringe... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ... by looking at that code?

  18. They ran out of their own? by chmod+a+x+mojo · · Score: 3, Insightful

    You can now contribute to VS Code:
    Submit bugs and help us verify fixes as they are checked in.
    Review the source code changes.
    Contribute bug fixes through pull requests.
    Update and add to the documentation.

    Anyways, joking aside, it's cool that stuff is being released in a more open way than it was traditionally with Microsoft. Hopefully they will keep up the trend and not revert to their old ways.

    --
    To err is human; effective mayhem requires the root password!
  19. Great! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Great!

  20. So terrible Google dumped it for Android Studio by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Ah Eclipse, the IDE so terrible and slow that Google stopped using it and released Android Studio.

    1. Re:So terrible Google dumped it for Android Studio by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well, Android Studio is just IntelliJ IDEA with some extra Android bits. Still good, but let's not overemphasize what Google did there.

  21. Yes. It's A Dumb Move By Microsoft by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    By not having "con" in the name, which everyone knows is short for "convention", they are keeping the hookers away. This will negatively affect attendance.

  22. When will M'soft ever show real openness? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Microsoft, when will you drop that silly closed MOOXML and switch your office software default to ODF?

    Until that happens, noone will ever trust that Microsoft has changed and improved.

  23. In other news... by ClickOnThis · · Score: 1

    ...Hell's temperature dropped to that of liquid nitrogen.

    --
    If it weren't for deadlines, nothing would be late.
  24. Swell. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Just great... just when it appeared .NET was going to slowly die off and leave us alone, now they're trying to ensure it sticks around to poison another generation.

  25. ISO/IEC 29500 by tepples · · Score: 1

    silly closed MOOXML

    OOXML is described in ECMA-376 and ISO/IEC 29500. How exactly is it "closed"?

    1. Re:ISO/IEC 29500 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Microsoft office uses binary blobs embedded in their OOXML that conform to the standard, but not the *spirit* of the standard.

  26. No True Scotsman by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    No True Scotsman is using less than 16 GB of RAM.

  27. Oh sorry what? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I can't hear you over the sound of Windows Global Mother Fucking Spyware.

  28. it's a trap! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's a trap!

    Embrace .... extend.

  29. They're so incompetent... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    that they needed to steal Google's chromium code. Oh, and those shitheads open sourced it. How nice of MS to open source code based on code you lifted from Google.