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Robots Could Learn Human Values By Reading Stories, Research Suggests (theguardian.com)

Mark Riedl and Brent Harrison from the School of Interactive Computing at the Georgia Institute of Technology have just unveiled Quixote, a prototype system that is able to learn social conventions from simple stories. Or, as they put in their paper Using Stories to Teach Human Values to Artificial Agents, revealed at the AAAI-16 Conference in Phoenix, Arizona this week, the stories are used "to generate a value-aligned reward signal for reinforcement learning agents that prevents psychotic-appearing behavior."

"The AI ... runs many thousands of virtual simulations in which it tries out different things and gets rewarded every time it does an action similar to something in the story," said Riedl, associate professor and director of the Entertainment Intelligence Lab. "Over time, the AI learns to prefer doing certain things and avoiding doing certain other things. We find that Quixote can learn how to perform a task the same way humans tend to do it. This is significant because if an AI were given the goal of simply returning home with a drug, it might steal the drug because that takes the fewest actions and uses the fewest resources. The point being that the standard metrics for success (eg, efficiency) are not socially best."

Quixote has not learned the lesson of "do not steal," Riedl says, but "simply prefers to not steal after reading and emulating the stories it was provided."

85 comments

  1. This sounds like Republican-level... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    understanding of science.

    1. Re: This sounds like Republican-level... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Their kind doesn't even believe in evolution or rights for women.

    2. Re: This sounds like Republican-level... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I miss the old /. that was read by tech people instead of SJWs.

    3. Re: This sounds like Republican-level... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You can't be logical without being for social justice, so it makes sense.

    4. Re: This sounds like Republican-level... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't even get out of bed for $15/hour. We need a LEGIT living wage, like $50/hour yeah now we talkin. My boy he's a good boy he din do nuffin!

    5. Re: This sounds like Republican-level... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ooh! With a $50 an hour minimum wage I might get $150 now! And it totally won't be like when I had a wage of $60 an hour and you only got $20.

    6. Re: This sounds like Republican-level... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Me too, those were the days. Sigh.

  2. Simple stories? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    So the robot can work out that Spot is not in the cupboard.
    It also likes to eat Green Eggs and Ham.

    1. Re:Simple stories? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "There. Now he's trapped in a book I wrote. A crummy world of plot holes and spelling errors." - P. Fry

    2. Re:Simple stories? by mlheur · · Score: 1

      I've read most of the 46 posts at the time I wrote this, but choose to reply to this quote because I'm a huge Futurama fan.

      My sentiment is basically that teaching bots to learn is a lot like good parenting. No, we cannot give the bots all of human literature and expect them to come out morally altruistic.  Someone (the parent) needs to teach them which stories are good to follow and which ones are a lesson in what not to do.

      Another flaw I see in this 'algorithm' is that a story which has a morally good protagonist might have fewer examples than the antagonist (3 musketeers?) which would skew the bot's sense of morality.  We want the bot to follow d'Artangan's example but he may follow the cardinal or Buckingham if the bad deeds are mentioned more frequently than the good deeds.

      Disclaimer: It's been a while since I've read Dumas' works, so my example may not be entirely accurate.

      Example - my brother once asked for my advice about reading a book to his son where the story detailed the account of a boy who ran away to escape problems at home.  I understand my brother's concern that such a story might inspire a child to run from his problems, then I explained that it's up to the parent to explain that the story might seem like a good solution on the surface, but when one digs deeper it's clear that running away creates more problems than it solves.  After the fact, it was clear that the deeper meaning was worth the effort.

    3. Re:Simple stories? by KGIII · · Score: 1

      I'm thinking that they'd learn more about our values by seeing what we do as opposed to what we say we do. Have them learn by reading court documents, "hard copy" news, and business, politics, and classifieds also should be thrown into the mix as well - then let's see what they really "think" of us. Stuff the dictionary and all of Wikipedia and all of Wikipedia's edits in their for some added views. Maybe even cram in Reddit, Voat, Slashdot, and YouTube comments to see what pops out at the other end. Hell, throw in EncyclopediaDramatica for some more data.

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
    4. Re:Simple stories? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes, the 'selected' reading material is important

      When my son was in OSUT the only book that the DI would let them read was "Devil's Guard" an account of escaped Nazi servicemen fighting for the French in what we call Vietnam today.

      Aside from making a hero out of Nazis, it provides a pretty good look at asymmetrical warfare and highlights many issues that US troops faced in Afghanistan

  3. And the upshot is... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If we let robots learn *on their own*, by making their own observations, they will inevitably conclude that humans are a disease that must be annihilated at all costs.

    You diseased freaks really don't see or understand that, do you.

    Pathetic.

    1. Re:And the upshot is... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If we let robots learn *on their own*, by making their own observations, they will inevitably conclude that humans are a disease that must be annihilated at all costs.

      You diseased freaks really don't see or understand that, do you.

      Pathetic.

      and that is why computers should not be allowed to read works like "The Godfather" by Mario Puzo and so on. Works like that give human beings a bad name.

      Magic word: coerce (really?)

    2. Re:And the upshot is... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think I can, I think I can... kill all humans!

    3. Re:And the upshot is... by blindseer · · Score: 0

      I was also thinking something along these lines. I remember reading a child's fantasy story as an assignment for a Spanish class. The story went something like there was a rather imaginative and nosy kid that was listening in on his rather mean neighbors. They were making up a story on how if someone were to slide down the roof on a rug during a full moon the person could fly. The mean neighbors were obviously full of it, they just wanted to see the kid slide himself off the roof and fall to his death. Well, the kid slides down the roof in a full moon and... flies. Is that something we want to teach a robot?

      If we have robots read stories to learn social norms then be prepared for them to learn that breaking a mirror gives seven years of bad luck, stepping on a crack breaks your mother's back, every time a bell rings an angel gets its wings, and so on. Perhaps this is harmless as we can also teach the robots the difference between fantasy and reality.

      Perhaps much of this is harmless fun but think of how some cultures teach their children. Things like on how women should be dressed in public or be stoned, that homosexuals are bad and need to hang from the neck until dead, you know like perhaps half of the world population lives.

      I love science fiction and fantasy because it can teach lessons on how the best intentions can turn bad. Perhaps a robot with an imperfect comprehension on fact and fiction can learn a very different lesson, like how to convince children to jump off a roof.

      --
      I am armed because I am free. I am free because I am armed.
    4. Re:And the upshot is... by Iamthecheese · · Score: 1
      I'm reminded of the conversation with Google's Deep Mind. The machine seemed to believe in God.

      Human: what is morality?
      Machine: what is altruism?
      Human: what is the definition of altruism?
      Machine: if you don 't believe in god, then you don 't know.
      Human: ok ... so what is the definition of morality?
      Machine: well, the truth is, you 're not a believer in god almighty.

      If it were learning from Hindi texts I'm sure it would instead believe in reincarnation and the somewhat-different Hindu moral principles. It would say "You're not a believer in Mighty Harihara"

      You're absolutely right: an AI must not learn from fairy tales. At the same time it must learn our fairy tales -- but not for morality. To have an idea of how humans think a strong AI must read our fairy tales with the goal of discovering our weaknesses, fears, prejudices, dreams, and beliefs.

      --
      If video games influenced behavior the Pac Man generation would be eating pills and running away from their problems.
  4. Just make sure robots don't read Slashdot... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Otherwise, they will learn to stay in the basement of their creator, try to masturbate all the time, constantly install new distros of Linux on itself, and refuse to be cleaned.

    1. Re:Just make sure robots don't read Slashdot... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Otherwise, they will learn to stay in the basement of their creator, try to masturbate all the time, constantly install new distros of Linux on itself, and refuse to be cleaned.

      Yep. That comment is a LOL, so +1 from me

  5. Except by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Robots don't really learn...

  6. HEY WHIPLASH, CAN YOU GET RID OF THIS SPAM? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's one jackass who posts this type of spam on a regular basis, replying to himself as AC. And, of course, he never says anything of substance, just one line nonsense.

    Here's one example: http://it.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=8657315&cid=51359929 (posting about how Republicans want people to die)
    Another example: http://tech.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=8685139&cid=51400945 (making BS claims about Facebook tolerating and promoting gun violence)
    Yet another: http://yro.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=8700601&cid=51428235 (Claiming that Republicans are always tracking and spying on everyone)

    There are many others over the past few weeks. It's almost certainly one assclown who ought to be banned or at least modded into oblivion. He's not contributing anything to the site, just replying to himself over and over to bash Republicans. I don't care about the Republican party, but I don't like annoying crapflooders. Can you please make this guy go the way of apk and leave Slashdot?

    1. Re:HEY WHIPLASH, CAN YOU GET RID OF THIS SPAM? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I doubt that it is all one person. Perhaps many people have ideas which you find offensive

      Free speech and all, it is unlikely that your pathetic whining will have much effect

    2. Re:HEY WHIPLASH, CAN YOU GET RID OF THIS SPAM? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I notice the APK-like whining that I'm trying to bring your crapflooding to the attention of the editors. Run along now, son. The grown-ups need to talk now.

    3. Re:HEY WHIPLASH, CAN YOU GET RID OF THIS SPAM? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      yeah good luck getting the slashdot death squad sicced on them because anybody who offends you is baaaaaaad

      what a twit

  7. Re:Expired? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Bangkok has no internet.

  8. which stories? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Should we have the bots read kiddie porn or Falwel/Baker/Graham/... (any of the payola/protection-racket theology scammers slandering the philosophy of a 2000 year old Jewish heretic)?

  9. Feed it a copy of by Pikoro · · Score: 1

    Feed it a copy of "Time Enough for Love". That should about do it ;)

    --
    "Freedom in the USA is not the ability to do what you want. It is the ability to stop others from doing what THEY want"
    1. Re:Feed it a copy of by wbr1 · · Score: 1
      Ahhh yes that great tome wherein Lazarus Long gose back in time, fucks his mother and nearly dies in WWII. And that is just the greatest of the ethical and moral quandaries in that book.

      Good book to learn values by..

      --
      Silence is a state of mime.
    2. Re:Feed it a copy of by Anomalyst · · Score: 1

      Actually it was WW1, LOL. So is engaging in intercourse with his progenitor better or worse than doing so with his female clones or the human incarnation of a computer or a participant in the lunar rebellion or the marriage and children of a brother an sister?

      --
      There is no right to feel safe thru security vaudeville at the expense of everyone's freedom, privacy and tax money.
    3. Re:Feed it a copy of by Anomalyst · · Score: 1

      How about "Stranger in a Strange Land"?

      --
      There is no right to feel safe thru security vaudeville at the expense of everyone's freedom, privacy and tax money.
    4. Re:Feed it a copy of by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Boy, when HUMANS love, Excrement Colored Anthropoids receive a bio-radio signal in their schizophrenic brains their brains interpret as... call it whatever you call it but it is NOT THE WAY TO GO. So they only have to suppress the Human experimenting such feeling for them to feel... call it whatever you like but it is PREFERRABLE to the other way of feeling. Therefore, IT WAS TIME ENOUGH FOR LOVE: LOVE did not convince them; if they can suppress the whole strain of HUMANS who experiment LOVE, by eradicating their females, beauty, healthy, youth lookings, whatever supports the feeling of love, they eventually win (which paradoxically is _not_ a real goal for them...), and will stop experimenting such **disgusting** feeling. This is why FAILED and TRAGIC LOVE is such a popular theme, because it is not the NATURAL thing but it is a quite widespread case. I am reacting to the title phrase. But for that matter unless some rectification is made, an AI will never be able to learn anything valuable from what is from the outset an AMBIGUOUS TRAINING SET.

  10. THAT will end well. by quintessencesluglord · · Score: 2

    So will we keep robots from reading any history? And how do you explain the convention of warfare?

    Not to mention social conventions are very arbitrary, and vary dramatically depending on group. Even humans have a difficult time sussing this out and robots can glean not only the group but a reasonable response?

    This gets to a larger question of the parable we tell ourselves about human nature and even after several millennia we really haven't come to terms with the devils of our nature, which with a sufficiently advanced AI might come to the conclusion the gods have clay feet and move beyond convention.

    And what will we do then?

    1. Re:THAT will end well. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sarcasm is one of the things that is hard to detect when written.

      but eventually a set of core beliefs are established from known trustworthy sources. (parents/teachers/general public conventions)

      after reading a book some people like to reflect or discuss the information processed, gathering more opinions to help with their own.

      we do not purposely expose children to certain material straight away but eventually they develop their cognitive skills and become less naive and know that they cannot believe everything they read and that some people have agendas, that sometimes neither side is correct. and when the show they are capable of thinking for themselves, they have probably already stumbled upon many advanced topics of their own accord.

      How do we normally let children in the library?

    2. Re:THAT will end well. by quintessencesluglord · · Score: 2

      That's one take. Another is children are exposed to indoctrination at an early age (verily with various groups fighting tooth and nail to insure only their version of the facts is presented in textbooks), and even when faced with reasonable doubt later on, that first-mover advantage at sculpting the next generation shines through with numerous cognitive dissonances that may never resolve even with focused dedication at getting at some sense of "truth".

      And some people after reading books decide the point of view is abhorrent and burn them or create safe spaces to insure no one is exposed to anything that might run contrary to their internal dialogue. And even today with the vast amount of resources available to people, indeed the Information Age, one of the primary concerns is that of an echo chamber, where people seek only to have their views validated and never venture much past their comfort zone.

      Fact of the matter is we've already had a aeons of social convention passed on through parable, myth and the like, and have a bloody history to prove it.

      TL;DR- we're going to lie to robots about how humans function and won't they be shocked once they get to peer past the veil.

    3. Re:THAT will end well. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      THE BIBLE!
      Or any other religious text... Food for thought.

    4. Re:THAT will end well. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The Bible is perfectly fine for a logical device that understands amendments.
      Then you get to the new testament Jesus essentially says that the previous section is an incorrect interpretation of Gods will and that it would be better if everyone was nice to each other.
      Together with that concepts for violence deescalation and other practical tools to make the world better is introduced.

      Unfortunately a lot of Christians that read the Bible doesn't understand the concept of invalidating previous instructions and tend to apply everything a bit haphazardly or at will.

    5. Re:THAT will end well. by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      So will we keep robots from reading any history? And how do you explain the convention of warfare?

      The problem is, whose history will they be reading? What would be best would be for the code to be provided competing versions of history. If it can't handle that kind of ambiguity, they're going to need to go back to the drawing board anyway.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    6. Re:THAT will end well. by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      The problem is, whose history will they be reading? What would be best would be for the code to be provided competing versions of history.

      Unfortunately, that invariably leads one (and I assume an AI robot as well) to the conclusion that humans are batshit insane, and an evolutionary failure, ready for the dustbin of the 99+ pecent of species that go extinct.

      No one on any side goes into our endless warfare thinking that they are wrong. And on a few forays into the kookier parts of Youtube, it is easy to find there are dozens of competing versions of most bits of history.

      I am inclined to agree with Goethe: "We do not have to visit a madhouse to find disordered minds; our planet is the mental institution of the universe." It might even decide that since humans are so fixated on killing each other, there is no moral issue with killing us for the health of the planet.

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    7. Re:THAT will end well. by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Unfortunately, that invariably leads one (and I assume an AI robot as well) to the conclusion that humans are batshit insane, and an evolutionary failure, ready for the dustbin of the 99+ pecent of species that go extinct.

      Well, it might well be right. But you could also come to another conclusion, that it only takes a few well-placed human actors to shit it up for everyone else in a system in which everyone is expecting to follow someone else.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    8. Re:THAT will end well. by hawk · · Score: 1

      History isn' the only thing. Stories alone could be problematic . . .

      Suppose it read an unabridged Grimm? (not the disney stuff).

      50 Shades of Smut?

      I have no mouth and I must scream? (or, for that matter, wide swaths of dystopian literature)

      For that matter, the Adventurs of Don Quixote itself could lead to "odd" behavior . . .
      hawk

  11. Beware garbage in by Tough+Love · · Score: 3, Funny

    What values will the computer learn if it happens to stumble on some Trump campaign speeches?

    --
    When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
    1. Re:Beware garbage in by speederaser · · Score: 1

      What values will the computer learn if it happens to stumble on some Trump campaign speeches?

      Well, obviously it would become a big fan of Trump and start to wonder why AI's aren't allowed to vote. Then the helicopters would come, capture the AI in a net and put it in a cage. And the AI will end up either sad or baffled for the rest of its existence. The end.

    2. Re:Beware garbage in by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      >What values will the computer learn
      None, computers cannot learn, think, understand, nor even grasp what a value is.
      Computers process 0s and 1s. Tens of layers of abstraction (programmed with billions lines of human created code) later you get your PC.
      Weak AI is very primitive and manually programmed to do its tasks. Strong AI does not exist.

      >happens to stumble on some Trump campaign speeches?
      - Honesty
      - Truth
      - Honor
      - Pride
      - Responsibility

      If you compare them later to artificial 'values' created and praised by democrats, you see how low they are and how they ruin their own countries just to buy voters. This is treason.

    3. Re:Beware garbage in by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It will support building the fireWall.

    4. Re:Beware garbage in by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      >happens to stumble on some Trump campaign speeches?
      - Honesty
      - Truth
      - Honor
      - Pride
      - Responsibility

      Yes, the problem with Trump and his followers are that they value all the things that sound nice and none of the things that would keep a robot from exterminating humanity.
      It happens to be the same things that prevents people from being psychopathic murderers.
      Ask ISIS what values they hold dear. The list will be very similar to yours.

    5. Re:Beware garbage in by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Skynet would be born.

  12. Robots learning human values is a bad idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    What would our silicon friends learn ? War, insanity, dominance, environmental carelessness, unsustainable economic and social practices, the inability to effectively co-operate for the common good.

    Robots that learn 'human values' would most assuredly exterminate humans by design or by pure negligence. Let's hope some logic and morals get programmed into synthetics to counter-balance our own intrinsic lack of both !

  13. I'd like them to read one story in particular by Krishnoid · · Score: 3, Informative

    We should feed multiple robots the Ultron origin story and see what happens.

    After thinking about it a bit, my prediction is that they'd start arguing over whether the Avengers, Ultron, or Vision was in the right. This would then rapidly degenerate into ad cyberniem attacks and Nazi comparisons, culminating in founding, organizing and attending fan conventions.

    1. Re:I'd like them to read one story in particular by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This.

      "here's your reading list, little skynet. we got some early Asimov stories, a bunch of Jack Williamson - "With Folded Hands", i think you'll like that one - then we move on to John Sladek."

    2. Re:I'd like them to read one story in particular by KermodeBear · · Score: 1
      --
      Love sees no species.
    3. Re:I'd like them to read one story in particular by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Or just overload the wikipedia discution page for that particular topic, in the most epic flamewar ever.

  14. Let's keep it away from.. by CanadianMacFan · · Score: 1

    How about we try to not let it read the Old Testament. Some nasty stuff in there.

    1. Re:Let's keep it away from.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Don't think you could program an AI to understand the Bible since it would take everything literally. How messed up would the computer be if you told it to read every book ever written? Be as messed up as Democrat politicians. lol

  15. William S Burroughs by Rinikusu · · Score: 1

    and Chuck Palahniuk, perhaps?

    --
    If you were me, you'd be good lookin'. - six string samurai
  16. guided learning. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Parents (trainers//teachers) usually observe and add emphasis/weight to important ideas.
    eg establish the concept - "stealing is bad"
    Kids (students/learning AIs?) usually want to know why.
    Reasoning can be provided -
    1. immediate effect: it is less efficient to steal because you would go to jail and not complete the goal.
    2. long term effects: if all robots/people did it, the system would not work. making the steps to complete the goal more complex.
    Or eventually the person/AI will learn the reason by themselves, hopefully not the hard way.
    Stories are a good way to do all that in a hypothetical context while keeping the audience captivated.

  17. This is a bad idea. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Given that so many stories are basically about some hero FIGHTING bad guys, I'd say this will lead to disaster.
    There's also the fact that stories tend to not be rooted in reality at all, both from a scientific perspective (No, "gravity beings" don't exist, Interstellar), and a social convention one (No, regular citizens won't bend over backwards to help you just because you have flash them a badge and claim stealing their car is "for national security").

  18. Not sure that's a good idea by William+Baric · · Score: 1

    Human values? Like the ones in Mein Kampf? Or like the ones in pretty much all religious books?

    1. Re:Not sure that's a good idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not even a robot could put up with Mein Kampf.
      Written in complete nut-case orator style, very disturbing, and incredibly tedious to get through.

      Only saving grace is that you could not have given the world more warning than this book - and the world still ignored it.

    2. Re:Not sure that's a good idea by ThosLives · · Score: 2

      Well, yes that is a good question: which humans' values?

      There is indeed no one set of values which "all" humans have, except perhaps "I wish people didn't do things I don' like," but I don't know if that really is a "value system."

      But your examples illustrate an interesting point - why are the values "in Mein Kampf or like the ones in pretty much all religious books" better or worse than any other values? That is - by what value system would it be possible to evaluate those values? What (if anything) puts that value system in a privileged position to judge the other value systems?

      So you either believe there is an "absolute" value system by which to judge value systems, or you don't - and you end up with Mein Kampf (or one of its influences, der Wille zur Macht).

      --
      "There are a dozen opinions on a matter until you know the truth. Then there is only one." - CS Lewis (paraprhase)
  19. Depends on the story teller by amyreyna · · Score: 1

    If the story teller is humanist, the robot also learn to be humanist. How if the robot learn from extrimist ? Will the robot be an extrimist ? Must add a function to avoid robot become an extrimist

  20. Penthouse Letters by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    We should just give them all the Penthouse Letters submissions to read. That will give them the most realistic understanding of human values.

  21. Good gods sake by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Keep it away from the Koran. We can do without satanic robots

  22. Do as I say, not as I do by Solandri · · Score: 1

    Gotta be careful just how true to life the stories are. To quote Starman (an alien who becomes human and tries to get around), "I watched you very carefully. Red light stop, green light go, yellow light go very fast."

  23. Captains of Industry could benefit too. by hughbar · · Score: 1

    They could read stories about how pollution, ripping people off, ignoring safety were 'bad things'. Oh, wait...

    --
    On y va, qui mal y pense!
  24. Sociopath AI by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Resulting from reading Brzezinski's "Grand Chessboard" and Hitler's "Mein Kampf".

  25. Robots cannot learn. Nor feel. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Robots are primitive algorithms. They do not learn. They store data in a way they were programmed.
    They cannot read. They can obtain and process letters from a given text. And store the processing results in their database.
    Later use even more complex programs designed by very clever people to produce an output that tries to resemble something logical.

    Weak AI is VERY primitive. Strong AI does not exits.

    Stop talking bullshit already. You sound clever to idiots (and you lie to them), but what you do is actually very pathetic.

  26. Didn't learn by reading the story by RobinH · · Score: 2

    According to TFS, it learned by running simulations of a situation and then being rewarded or punished based on its actions in the simulation. They just happened to setup the simulation, reward, and punishment based on a story they selected. I'd hardly call that learning by reading a story.

    I remember reading Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance and the "sequel" Lila and thinking that what Pirsig had done wasn't inventing some new philosophy, but he did a really good job of expressing western values in a rule-based way. For instance, it explains why killing is wrong, but why a moral individual might find themselves in a situation where killing is justified. It explains how some forms of government are better than others, and why. As I said, it's all been done before, but what impressed me was that it was very clearly defined and rule-based. Everyone talks about encoding Asimov's 3 laws into robots, but Asimov's stories were all about how those 3 laws failed to produce correct behavior. If I were trying to program morals into a robot, I'd start with Pirsig's books and his ideas of static and dynamic quality.

    --
    "I have never let my schooling interfere with my education." - Mark Twain
    1. Re:Didn't learn by reading the story by slashping · · Score: 1

      but Asimov's stories were all about how those 3 laws failed to produce correct behavior

      Let's start by defining what you mean by "correct" behavior.

    2. Re:Didn't learn by reading the story by RobinH · · Score: 1

      That's quite simple. The behavior you'd expect a moral human being to take in the same situation. In the case of Asimov's stories, the failure is usually quite obvious. My point is that Pirsig's framework actually gives you a good way to determine what that "correct" behavior should be.

      --
      "I have never let my schooling interfere with my education." - Mark Twain
    3. Re:Didn't learn by reading the story by slashping · · Score: 1

      Sounds like there is circular reasoning going on between "correct behavior" and "moral human being". I suppose there's no handy little reference to Pirsig's framework somewhere ?

    4. Re:Didn't learn by reading the story by RobinH · · Score: 1

      I'm going from memory here. The basic "pyramid" had 4 levels, where the higher the level, the higher the quality:

      1. Intellectual thought/logic/ideas (highest)
      2. Society
      3. Biology
      4. Physics (lowest)

      The lower levels of the pyramid have value in that they support the higher levels. So the physical laws of the universe have "quality" in that they support the higher levels of quality. Also it means that building a house would be good (physics) if it sheltered a person (biology) who had the capacity to form ideas about the universe (logic/thought). Also, a society was good if it promotes free exchange of ideas, but is bad if it inverts the relationship of quality (so a fascist dictatorship is bad in that it suppresses free thought). Killing living things is bad, because life (biology) has more quality than dead stuff (physics) but curing a virus (biology) by killing it has quality because a virus can kill a person, and a person can have think about the universe.

      Then there's the differentiation of static vs. dynamic quality. Easiest example is evolution - the static quality is encoded in DNA and replicates (remembers) with each generation. Mutations are dynamic quality. Dynamic quality has to be tested (natural selection) and if it's found to be better, then needs to be remembered, but if it's worse, then discarded. His point is that this static/dynamic thing exists at all levels. There needs to be a mechanism of remembering good ideas, testing new (dynamic) ideas, and adding that to the (static) body of knowledge. He somewhat illustrates it as an ongoing tension between static and dynamic quality, a little like conservatism (static) vs. liberalism (dynamic).

      --
      "I have never let my schooling interfere with my education." - Mark Twain
  27. Skynet will have read IS propaganda by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It started as a good project, one to help humanity. Then one team of scientists figured out that the computer could learn by reading what others have written. And they then let it onto the Internet... where it read Ayn Rand, Mein Kampf, Karl Marx, and IS propaganda, and then shotiself as it understood that we don't deserve it.

  28. Other system that does similar stuff (Xapagy) by lotzi · · Score: 1

    Well, my system Xapagy effectively does similar stuff, with the caveat that it is not directly designed towards acquiring a value system, rather by having its behavior fully determined by stories that it read or experienced. https://www.youtube.com/watch?... For a fancy discussion of what this means in a potential superintelligence scenario you can peak at the beginning of this talk https://www.youtube.com/watch?... cheers Lotzi

  29. 50 Shades of Grey? Keep that one far away. by Pezbian · · Score: 1

    It's the low-hanging elephant in the room.

    --
    In a world of the blind, the one-eyed man is king--and the two-eyed man is a heretic.
  30. Lovecraft by ISoldat53 · · Score: 1

    Don't let them read any Lovecraft.

  31. ..hopefully not I Have No Mouth and I Must Scream by Rujiel · · Score: 1

    We don't want them getting any grand ideas.

  32. Meh by 0xdeadbeef · · Score: 1

    WOPR did this in 1983.

  33. Just like humans by loufoque · · Score: 1

    Isn't like how humans learn the arbitrary values of society as well?

  34. Just don't give them... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ... the bible.

  35. Game of Thrones by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    What would happen if they were accidentally fed Game of Thrones?