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Gary Johnson: I'd Consider Pardoning Snowden, Chelsea Manning (vocativ.com)
An anonymous reader writes from a report via Vocativ: [Vocativ reports:] "The U.S.'s most popular third-party presidential candidate says he would 'consider' pardoning the highest profile convicts of computer-related crimes in the country, including Chelsea Manning, Ross Ulbricht, and Jeremy Hammond. Libertarian candidate Gary Johnson, a former governor of New Mexico, also reiterated his possible willingness to pardon Edward Snowden, the former National Security Agency analyst who gave a cache of agency documents to journalists in 2013." "Having actually served as a governor and administered the power to grant pardons and clemency, Gary Johnson is very conscious and respectful of the need for processes for using that authority," Joe Hunter, Johnson's communications director, told Vocativ in a statement. "However, he has made it clear on numerous occasions that he would 'look seriously at' pardoning Edward Snowden, based on public information that Snowden's actions did not cause actual harm to any U.S. intelligence personnel. Likewise, he has said he would look favorably on pardoning Ross Ulbricht, consistent with his broader and long-standing commitment to pardon nonviolent drug offenders, whistleblowers, and others imprisoned under unjust and ill-advised laws," Hunter said. When Vocativ asked specifically about Chelsea Manning, Jeremy Hammond, Barrett Brown, and Matthew Keys, Hunter responded: "The same goes for the other individuals you have mentioned -- and hundreds, if not thousands, like them. Gov. Johnson finds it to be an outrage that the U.S. has the highest incarceration rate in the developed world, and announced in 2012 that, as President, he would promptly commence the process of pardoning nonviolent offenders who have done no real harm to others." The Green Party candidate Jill Stein has also shared her thoughts on pardoning Edward Snowden and Chelsea Manning. Not only would she pardon Snowden, but she said she would appoint him to her cabinet.
Since neither is getting elected, How Nice.
Manning was a serviceman that took an oath, if that is meaning less.
Snowden is not convicted, He can't be pardoned yet.
Skip the middle man... just write in your vote for Edward Snowden.
The Green Party candidate Jill Stein has also shared her thoughts on pardoning Edward Snowden and Chelsea Manning. Not only would she pardon Snowden, but she said she would appoint him to her cabinet.
Hillary would be smart to do the same so she doesn't pull any more bonehead mistakes that will land her in more hot water...
but really apologies are in order. Doing that would really be a significant step to make America great again.
suck it, LIEbertarians!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?...
MAGA ...
MAGA Trump 2016 MAGA MAGA
MAGA
~Yeah, I can *so* see Edward Snowden getting a confirmation from the U.S. Senate.~ It is only slightly more probable than Jill Stein getting elected to President.
Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
With absolutely no legal basis.
The U.S.'s most popular third-party presidential candidate says he would 'consider' pardoning the highest profile convicts of computer-related crimes in the country, including Chelsea Manning, Ross Ulbricht, and Jeremy Hammond.
Interesting way to put it, third-party presidential candidate, since 'coming in a distant third' would have done it.
Happiness in intelligent people is the rarest thing I know.
Ernest Hemingway
... and seat belts are optional on cars ...
Sign me up!
Two more reasons why I won't be voting for him.
child labor is legal
Assuming they're not being exploited or denied education, what's the problem with that?
roads are monopolized and unmaintained (in b4 b-b-but gov't does this too!)
Roads (along with power, water, telecommunications, etc.) fall under the category of essential infrastructure that naturally is a monopoly. It makes sense for government to have a (limited) hand in these things.
seat belts are optional on cars
Natural selection. (inb4 b-b-but then people would just get badly injured and then we have to pay for it!)
Well if I get elected, I'll pardon Charles Manson!
This would have been candidacy suicide to have said something like this in past elections, but with the shit show that has been the 2016 election... it almost sounds sane.
Of course, Johnson is not going to be elected, that is not the point. Even if this is a lie, it is the best lie have been told for this entire election.
Seems to me, it was not actually capable of knowing what it was doing.
Gary Johnson is pro-TPP.
I'd pardon every single non-violent drug offender...
The idea that we put people into prison for being addicted to drugs is messed up...
We need drug treatment, not prison...
---
Of course I'd also pardon anyone convicted for prostitution as well, that is another stupid thing to make illegal, so long as it is completely voluntary on the part of everyone involved. Making it legal would also make it easier for abused women who are held against their will to go to the police for help, without fear of arrest...
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What else would I do?
I have a list, a long list, if anyone cares... Which I doubt they do! :)
Lets see... (some of these items might require I be King, not President, but lets see if anyone wants me...)
I'd change Copyright to 25 years, the current laws on that are stupid... Patents would be restricted, also set to 25 years, but no more patenting stupid things... Such as the shape of a phone... Or an icon...
I'd reset income taxes to 20%, flat across the board, no exceptions, no deductions whatsoever... To compensate poor people, I'd put into place a $500 a month food stamp benefit for adults, $200 a month per children, no exceptions, to ensure everyone has at least something to eat. Yes, I know this will push up food prices somewhat, but people eat already and that won't change much, and the poor need to eat, or they turn to crime.
Food in schools would become free, the idea that we have kids in school that go hungry is fucked up. I'd also put into place a school voucher system, you can send your kids to any school you like, schools will compete for your business.
All sales taxes nationally go away, replaced with a 10% VAT, the price posted is the price you pay, period. No exceptions to VAT whatsoever.
Al Gore was right about the Lock Box thing, SS needs to be secured against stupid Congress people who keep spending it...
This probably sounds petty, but car ads have to tell the truth... The monthly price they quote in the ad has to be the PRICE YOU PAY. As it stands now, it isn't even CLOSE... They want big downpayments, don't include TT&L, etc. They say $299 a month, but it is usually a lease with $3K-5K up front, so really it is closer to $500 a month.
Government gets the hell out of the marriage business, you can marry whoever you want, in whatever service you want. Civil unions will be handled by the government by anyone who wants one, under simple contract law. Want to marry your dog, good for you, it just isn't a civil union. Want to marry 5 guys? Go for it, if they are consenting adults, you can even get a civil union, knock yourself out. Now you have health care rights and survivorship rights.
I would abolish the death penalty, the government has killed too many innocent people and shouldn't be in the murder business.
I would abolish abortion beyond the first trimester. If you get pregnant and you find out within the first month, that's fine, but if you're 6 months into it, you're having a baby...
I would triple the gas tax, that hasn't been raised in a long time and we need the funds to improve our roads. I would abolish toll roads, they hurt poor people and roads should be paid for by everyone.
I would tax carbon... Not much, small to start, but with a 50 year schedule to slowly increase it each year, to make it clear that we have to cut that back, but understanding that it won't happen tomorrow. This gives everyone time to adjust and for new technology to come out to deal with that problem...
I would build a HUGE wall on the Mexican Border... yes, I really would, and no, Mexico wouldn't pay for it... :) I would, however, deploy the Army to the southern border, if we don't have a secure border, we don't have a country...
I would not attempt to throw out 11 million illegals, that isn't reasonable and would cause riots in the streets. I would create a path to citizenship for those who want it, but they would pay
The news media reinforces the two party system. Not only do they allow candidates to portray the sheeple as having only two options, but repeating the mantra. They say that a vote for Jill Stein is a vote for Donald Trump, or a vote for Gary Johnson is a vote for Hillary Clinton and the sheeple follow.
Who the hell gave them the power of the king-maker? Why do they provide two weeks of coverage for the major parties, and no coverage for anyone else? They are in on the game.
This is the age of the Internet, and it is time for the masses to disenfranchise the major political parties. It is time to turn off the TV and the radio, and utilize social media to make our political stand. When the ballots are finalized, I want to read about each candidate, their voting record, their political donors (and supporting superpacs), their political leanings (for judges), etc. We need to make an informed decision easy.
I would readily vote for any candidate who is willing to reform Gerrymandering (Lawrence Lessig), change elections to First-Past-the-Post, and reverse Citizens United. Until I see that, I will vote for Gary Johnson because pardoning our national heros is also a worthy cause.
Just so he can stop being a political pawn of Putin.
Your analysis is correct - ONLY for those in a swing state. Most states are NOT swing states.
For most of us, there is 0% chance that our vote could possibly tilt the balance between jackass and crook. Er, Trump amd Clinton. In this particular election, we already know which way our state and its electoral votes will go. For example, my state will go to Trump, regardless of how I vote. The best we can hope for is to have some effect on his policies and on future elections.
The major parties are trying to pick up another 1% or 2% for themselves, if they see 12% of the vote go Libertarian, the majors will very much want a piece of that 12%. It's then in their self-interest to look at the Libertarian platform and think about which ideas they can adopt. The same goes for elected officials. Suppose the results are 45% Trump, 44% Clinton, 11% Johnson. Considering they want to get re-elected, president Trump or Clinton should look at that 11% who voted Johnson and do things to try to get those voters to vote for them next time.
If only 1% vote Libertarian, the major parties would have no reason to adopt some Libertarian udeas.
Oh, right. Of course he is.
$500 seems pretty damned insufficient when you've basically taken away a large portion of the working poor's discretionary income. No matter how you try to force it, flat taxes are fundamentally unfair.
Elected SCOTUS judges is even worse. There are enough politicians without making what amounts to a constitutional court effectively a third legislature with the power to veto the others.
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
The idea that we put people into prison for being addicted to drugs is messed up...
Nobody is put into prison for being an addict. Nor is anybody put in prison for being an asshole. But we sure do put some of each into prison for the things they do. If you steal somebody else's stuff, it really doesn't matter if you did it because you're a drug addict or just a lazy asshole. If you are caught peddling heroin to kids, it doesn't matter if you did it because you're an addict or just an asshole.
Don't disappoint your bird dog. Go to the range.
Of course it doesn't have an impact. Neither does voting for Trump or Clinton. Your vote means *nothing* in terms of electing someone. EVEN IN A SWING STATE. If you're so lucky, your odds go from about 1 in 10,000,000,000 to 1 in 10,000,000.
Local elections are the most important to vote in. Then it might matter.
Addicts are put in jail all the time, because most of the drugs people are addicted to are illegal to buy or possess. So yes, being an addict in many cases is illegal.
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
Couple of points for you to consider,
* I would abolish abortion beyond the first trimester. The Neucal fold test to test for chromosomal abnormalities occurs at 12 weeks. If you get a bad result you then have an amniocentesis which is usually around 20 weeks. It is at this point that the parents have the information about whether their child has downs or other chromosomal abnormality. Your law would prevent an abortion of that child. You would get a lot of push back on that.
*I would setup universal healthcare and kick the private insurance companies out of health care. - Why remove them from the healthcare system? Personally I see that a parallel system is not actually a bad thing as long as the base tier provides excellent health care. A private healthcare system can provide services such a child birthing, day surgery, electives etc and that would only work to lower the load on the wider public system.
*The 2nd amendment says exactly what the fuck it says, you can own guns, any type of guns, that you want. - And see I would be right at the other end of the spectrum to this one. My first thing would be the removal of the second amendment and the immediate and strict control of firearms.
*The Corporate Tax would be abolished, instead companies would pay a 5% gross receipts tax on anything sold in the US that was 51% made here, and a 10% gross receipts tax on anything that was 51% made overseas. - You have just pushed the price up on a huge number of products. And most of those products are the low value items which will effect the most people. 10% margin is a target for many business to achieve before costs. This simply wouldn't work. Also your regulatory load on this would be insane. Is it 50% by weight, part count, volume or value? Will it make my package 5% cheaper by making sure it contains 51% american air? You would have created a monster just on the compliance side.
*You must have the right to challenge a warrant in court - Not sure how this would work. We have a warrant to search your house. Nope you are going to have to wait while I challenge this in court. The hearing is in 11 weeks? You could challenge the warrant wasn't valid and hence any evidence obtained is unable to be used, but can't you do that anyway?
* Not with you on toll roads as I have no objection to private enterprise building infrastructure. They wont do it if there isn't a return. That said infrastructure should also be built by the govt.
I'm not with you that flat taxes are fundamentally unfair. Personally I would have a flat tax with a high tax free threshold.
This would reduce the tax load significantly on the lower income earners and increase their discretionary income, I don't like the idea of food stamps at all.
But with regards to fairness, I have never understood how, if I am making widgets, I will get paid $5 for the first widget I make but then get paid $3 for the 20th widget I make. Are my widgets now worth less than they were? Is my labor not as valuable?
A progressive tax system acts as a disincentive to work harder.
Also being homeless is illegal. Newly graduated police cadets are trained to go after the homeless as easy targets - at least in Las Vegas. Of course in Las Vegas, it is also a crime to deface a hamburger and interrupt the flight path of a pigeon. Look it up in the NRS.
The Libertarian Party is obsessed with legalizing pot and pardoning criminals that divulge national security secrets. These might be valid things to do, but are about 9,743rd on the list of barriers to living in a country that fully embraces freedom. What is a small-L libertarian supposed to do these days? Do I really have to bet all my chips on seasteading?!
" Do or do not. There is no try. "
You don't consider such things. Quit being wishy-washy about it, make a damn decision and stand behind it.
You're either going to pardon someone, or you're not.
Two extremist losers who have the potential to get Trump elected; they just blew a lot of votes from people on the fence. Although I support much (not all) what the people they defend did, the American public is so misinformed that these pardon announcements will come off as ridiculous and unpatriotic. I hope the latter is the case, and both Johnson and Stein lose votes that go to Clinton.
Electing Trump is a nightmare in waiting. His whole goddamn family is corrupt. How could any honest person - even a family member - support this fraud and clown?
Given that the current two candidates are basically unappointable [1], third party candidates should be looked at more seriously.
The promise of pardoning heroic men like Snowden and Manning can be a major point for some voters.
[1] Insofar as any US citizen would have to be batshit insane to vote for either of them.
"Nine times out of ten, starting a fire is not the best way to solve the problem." - my wife
You people are fucking lost in a maze. Maybe they would ask the public what to do since America is a REPUBLIC?
Guess why your country is broke? Because you believe what the fuck politicians tell you. If anything, Ed Snowden should be telling gary and jill to go suck 1000 dicks. That is right. It is not right for two backup politician clowns to ponder in the mass media what they would do if they were President as if it's their RULE.
Democracy is MOB RULE. Republic is SELF-GOVERNED BY THE PEOPLE.
Any wonder why it's fucked up? Ready to be prostitutes because politicians sold you out? Bend over.
Snowden & Manning are whistle-blowers. They were motivated by correcting what the perceived as illegal or immoral actions by the government. They had little to personally gain (and a lot to lose) by their actions. Ulbricht, on the other hand was motivated by greed. His willingness to commission murder-for-hire in order to keep his cash machine going justifies his conviction.
You ever wonder if Gary Johnson and Jill Stein are getting internet traction this election as a way to divide the pissed off Trump voter vote? Especially since Hillary is in bed with Silicon Valley?
Most states are not contested in presidential elections -- hence the term "swing state" for the rare few that are. Thus if you vote in a non-swing state, then voting for a 3rd party comes with little risk, and is a reasonable way to cast a protest vote.
You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it dissolve.
It's not hard. 10,000 widgets x 20% = 2,000 widgets, leaving you 8,000 widgets. 1,000 widgets x 20% = 200 widgets, leaving you 800 widgets. Which person has more widgets at the end of the day?
And your solution of an income exemption level clearly signals that you understand this, and that to make sure the tax is not so regressive that it damages the poorest, you end up having to excuse some or all of their taxes. In other words, you've just made a non-flat tax.
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
I would leave that up to the experts and the women involved instead of extra red tape imposed by lawyers and congresscritters who really have no clue and care even less. Making it illegal to save the mother in a difficult birth where the odds of the child surviving are very low anyway is the sort of nightmare that would come out of such nanny-statism.
For a lot of things there is no silver bullet that fits every situation.
I'd declare a national Guinness day, when all bars and restaurants that serve Guinness would be required to give away free pints to anyone who asked. But I'm not getting elected either (yet), so this whole damn topic is irrelevant. Love him or hate him, Gary Johnson has the same chance of being elected as my dead grandmother, so why not talk about something more realistic, like the pyramids on Mars or the possibility of there already being buildings on the moon, or plasma TVs making a comeback.
This is a hacked account, for which the owner can not be held responsible.
"Yeah, I'm going to totally let you search for the guns, drugs and bodies, after I try to challenge it in court. Oh, and of course I'm totally not going to tamper with or dispose evidence. No sirreee! See you in court, Mr. Swat Team."
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
I agree completely. I'm also surprised nobody else has commented on this as well.
Of course it doesn't have an impact. Neither does voting for Trump or Clinton. Your vote means *nothing* in terms of electing someone. EVEN IN A SWING STATE.
Except EVERY vote not for the Republicrats is a statement. Just like Brexit. So if your vote don't effect the outcome, at least it it means *something*.
And with about half of the people seeming to be dissatisfied with the two "top" choices, I'm damned if I can explain the status quo. Feels like americans are just stupid, en masse?
Manning didn't blow any whistles. It was falsely claimed that he revealed war crimes, but once the legitimate combat actions were revealed and analyzed by people who actually know what constitutes a war crime no crimes were found. Manning simply applied a hoover to the classified network and then dumped it to WikiLeaks out of spite because he was mad at the Army. He committed espionage and is rightly serving a nice long term as a result. We the tax payers should not be paying one cent towards gender association treatments. He's doing hard time.
Snowden was a whistleblower on the NSA Surveillance. He committed espionage on the rest of the Classified information regarding international intelligence operations that he stole and revealed. If we get our hands on him, he will be convicted and also spend many years behind bars. He would have gotten a pass had he just stopped at the surveillance program.
I'm too lazy to compose a creative sig.
He tried to have competitors assassinated by contract killers but apart from that...
But in your example your widgets remain the same value to you as a worker. If each was $1 before tax, they are worth 80c to you after tax.
But a tax that takes 20c on the first widget but then takes 50c on the 10th widget is decreasing the incentive to work more. So it's more like 1000 widgets @ 20% leaves 800. 10000 widgets at 42% leaving 5800 widgets. Yes the person who made 10,000 widgets is better off, by more than a factor of 7. But their productivity was higher by a factor of 10.
I'd consider pardoning Snowden, Manning, and Clinton.... LOL
Hmm..... a 1,000 Armed Americans, the largest militia formed in probably over a hundred years. And the Feds backed down....cause they were sure to get their butts kicked. Or forced it to escalate into a military confrontation which could have started a civil war.
As for the U.S. being undefeatable by it's citizens. Goat farmers with hand made AKs and improvised bombs defeated the mighty U.S. in two wars. So I wager a nation in which civilians have far better arms would do quite well against the government if it mobilized. Furthermore, much of the military would fracture when ordered to bomb U.S. cities and civilians.
The incentive still exists because you still keep a significant portion of the value.
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
I'm damned if I can explain the status quo. Feels like americans are just stupid, en masse?
Fear.
https://www.hillaryclinton.com...
There's no question that this election features the two most unliked candidates. This should be an election where 3rd parties make significant inroads. On both sides they're using the retiring or passing justices as a bludgeon of fear to beat voters to fall in line and vote for the party because, "They can't let Trump/Hillary nominate that many justices".
"Lack of speed can be overcome. In the worst case by patience." --Znork
If I were elected President, I would consider eliminating all student debt! I would consider ending the ISIS threat! I would consider stopping all gun crime while allowing every innocent citizen's second amendment rights! I would consider putting a chicken in every pot and some pot for everybody who is chicken!
Aside from my being unelectable in any event, "Considering" doing something is less than even a campaign promise. This is the very problem with our political system: People do not have the balls (or ovaries) to actually state what they will do and then do it, out of fear that they aren't electable if they do that.
Captcha: commute!
In other words, he will pander for votes like every other politician. You don't make wishy washy statements about these things, you either believe it is the right thing to do or you don't.
Sorry, teleporters just kill you and then make a copy. A perfect, soul-less copy.
Yes the US has far too many people in jails and prisons and it is largely race based. Then, what must we do about it? But the problem rests in what really are the worst crimes. Every now and then we catch some lunatic who is a serial killer who has taken several lives. But a drug seller can take far more lives than the lunatic with that big, bad life. Ad not only that, casual drug users, by being an example encourage others to use illegal drugs. For example we have Prince, who will be considered a role model by many young people and they will think that if Prince used dope it must be a first rate way to live and behave. So who should rot in a prison for life? I'll bet that Prince's use of drugs will cost more people their lives than any serial killer in American history. And Prince was only a drug user. Considering how few people truly recover from drug addictions maybe we should consider life without hope of parole for any use of any illegal drugs, even on the first offense. I know it sounds crazy to post that but drugs are destroying lives by the millions.
Thus the party we least liked, A, is the winner.
So? I consider destruction of the two party system more important than voting for someone I dislike a little less.
If you want to break up the/a two-party system, start agitating for a non-first-past-the-post (FPTP) electoral system.
Start with your municipal or county elections, as state- or federal-level stuff is going to be really difficult. But if your mayor, local councillors, or school board trustees can be elected it will move the ball forward and raise consciousness of the issue. It was an obscure topic in (Ontario) Canada not too long ago, but now both Toronto (Canada's largest city) and even the federal government are looking in different systems.
Go to your local political debates and ask the candidates if they have policies. E-mail them asking their position/s. Hand out pamphlets.
The only way to change the party structure is to change how the candidates are selected IMHO.
I am not familiar with Chelsea, but I am with Snowden. I would be for a pardon and here is why. I believe there is a difference between being a traitor to your government and being a traitor to your country. I see his actions as treasonous to the government but patriotic to the country. Also, by charging him with treason, the US government declared all the US citizens as the enemy. IMO
I agree as well. I am not familiar with Chelsea, but I am with Snowden. I would be for a pardon and here is why. I believe there is a difference between being a traitor to your government and being a traitor to your country. I see his actions as treasonous to the government but patriotic to the country.
$500 seems pretty damned insufficient when you've basically taken away a large portion of the working poor's discretionary income. No matter how you try to force it, flat taxes are fundamentally unfair.
You might have forgotten to take into account universal health care...
And frankly $500 buys a LOT of food, if you aren't eating steaks and junk...
But as I said at the bottom, all the numbers are subject to adjustment, of course if I were really King, I'd do detailed studies on each to make sure they made sense...
The Neucal fold test to test for chromosomal abnormalities occurs at 12 weeks. If you get a bad result you then have an amniocentesis which is usually around 20 weeks. It is at this point that the parents have the information about whether their child has downs or other chromosomal abnormality. Your law would prevent an abortion of that child. You would get a lot of push back on that.
I don't consider downs syndrome to be a justification for the murder of a child.
If it is, then why can't you kill them when they are 1 year old and have downs?
I get that not everyone believes that life begins at conception, some do, some don't... Since everyone seems to agree on not murdering 1 year old children, clearly the line is SOMEWHERE between conception and that... The end of the first trimester strikes me as a reasonable point to draw that line that most people can live with. It is also worth noting that some doctors will fudge and go beyond that a bit and call it "well, the 11th week", regardless of when it really is... So some will happen at 13 or 14 weeks, depends on the doctor... You have to allow some fudge, since the real world happens...
Why remove them from the healthcare system? Personally I see that a parallel system is not actually a bad thing as long as the base tier provides excellent health care. A private healthcare system can provide services such a child birthing, day surgery, electives etc and that would only work to lower the load on the wider public system.
Because all the things you need health insurance for are the really big stuff... Smaller things can be paid for yourself, and frankly electives aren't covered by insurance in many cases anyway (boob jobs for example)...
I would simply hire doctors directly and pay them a salary and tell them to serve all who come, no charge. Over time the average level of health will go up because people will get help sooner without picking between food and health.
No, it isn't perfect, but it is better than what we have... And consider that my wife is a doctor, I see the flaws in the system, and yes, I have thought this one through a lot more than I can really type here. What I will say is that it is a highly complex issue that needs a new approach, you only need to look at what we spend vs what we get to see the problem.
And see I would be right at the other end of the spectrum to this one. My first thing would be the removal of the second amendment and the immediate and strict control of firearms.
Good for you, you're wrong, that viewpoint is evil, and I suspect that is all I need to say, since you aren't going to listen to reason, history, or logic. :)
The irony is that this isn't even an "opinion", the facts are on my side, you're badly on the wrong side of history, but you and those like you will never listen to any of it. :(
You have just pushed the price up on a huge number of products. And most of those products are the low value items which will effect the most people. 10% margin is a target for many business to achieve before costs. This simply wouldn't work. Also your regulatory load on this would be insane. Is it 50% by weight, part count, volume or value? Will it make my package 5% cheaper by making sure it contains 51% american air? You would have created a monster just on the compliance side.
No, I didn't, but thanks for playing... What I did is make the whole damm system a lot simpler and drive prices down. But your viewpoint is why the system doesn't change, because too many people can't think 12 moves ahead.
Not sure how this would work. We have a warrant to search your house. Nope you are going to have to wait while I challenge this in court. The hearing is in 11 weeks? You could challenge the warrant wasn't valid and hence any evidence obtained is unable to be used, but can't you do that anyway?
Again, you can't
Hell I would like to see a 27%, 25%, 24%, 24% split or something similar with the Greens and the Libertarians thrown in there. Really make the 2 major parties realize that they suck and people don't want what they are selling. while I know this won't happen one can dream.
Time to offend someone
I would leave that up to the experts and the women involved instead of extra red tape imposed by lawyers and congresscritters who really have no clue and care even less. Making it illegal to save the mother in a difficult birth where the odds of the child surviving are very low anyway is the sort of nightmare that would come out of such nanny-statism.
You don't murder children...
A 6 month old fetus is a child... it has a heartbeat, a nervous system, its brain is working...
I get the argument that at 3 weeks, those don't exist, but there is no dispute that they exist at 6 months...
You do not murder children, not even to save the life of the mother... This shouldn't even have to be said out loud, and the fact that it does shows how far down the fucked rabbit hole our society has gone...
Nobody is put into prison for being an addict.
You are not correct... It is illegal to simply smoke Pot in most states, or snort coke, or use LSD...
Either way, putting someone in prison who is an addict is messed up... They have a problem, they are not a criminal...
The 2-party system is a meme, and "wasted vote" people are sheeple following it. It is a meme in that lots of people believe that the 2-party system is unbreakable (based solely on the results of many 2-party-rigged election cycles), and it is self-perpetuating because people are willing to ignorantly claim-- as fact-- that a vote for a 3rd party is a wasted vote.
Not only that, but participants in/members of the 2-party system have rigged elections such that it is rare for people to gain exposure to 3rd-party viewpoints, because exposure is tied directlly to national polls, which traditionally don't even include 3rd parties to begin with.
If you really want to look at what a wasted vote is, voting for a "loser" in your district is a "wasted vote" because of the electoral college. But who can know who will win or lose to begin with?
It is damaging to US politics to continue perpetuating this meme. Decide what your issues are, and vote for the candidate you truly believe in. We should all cross our fingers that a 3rd party candidate (I support Johnson) can participate in televised debates this year so that we can see some common-sense, intelligently presented issues and viewpoints outside the scope of a "soundbyte."
I not only reject the notion of voting for the lesser of two evils (which is what I suppose I would do if I believed a 3rd party vote were a waste), but I also think that it is a short-sighted and unintelligent approach to democracy in general. In the worst case scenario, your 3rd party vote will bolster a statistic that can demonstrate the growth of a general discontent with binary politics; and, possibly, increase support for whichever party you believe in.
While I could agree with you on one level, the House of Representatives votes on the Presidency if there's not a majority. That sounds to me like all kinds of gerrymander-influenced crazy will result.
"Yeah, I'm going to totally let you search for the guns, drugs and bodies, after I try to challenge it in court. Oh, and of course I'm totally not going to tamper with or dispose evidence. No sirreee! See you in court, Mr. Swat Team."
Hey look, an idiot who can't understand basic, simple concepts...
People like you voting is why we have the political system that we do... The irony is that you can't see it, thus you'll dismiss this comment...
But I'm right... and that is actually rather sad...
Hillary pardon as well?
If done in non swing states, like Minnesota or California are going republican, you could have a breakdown like that (maybe not quite like that) but still end up with a clear electoral college victory. An election like that would also make it very clear that people are unhappy with things and we would likely see some real change.
Time to offend someone
Let's have a presidential debate between Libertarians and Greens. Broadcast it on youtube. They both need the exposure. They can work together to highlight their common interests against the Dems and Reps, and they can also discuss there differences with each other.
who wants me to be King?
Well not me.
But I LOVE shooting holes in ideas. Let's see:
I'd reset income taxes to 20%, flat across the board [with a ton of foodstamps]
HOOOOOOOOLLY SHIIIIIIT! Where are you going to get all your money from? Our effective tax rate is around 27%, so you're in deep financial shit. But, oh, okay, "all numbers are subject to change". So let's just assume that it's a flat tax at $(ENOUGH) to have the same income as today. Why do you want to give so much money to rich people? Historically, they've been getting hella wealthier while the bulk of people have lagged behind.
Also with no exceptions, most non-profits go away. Which is a real kick in the pants to the poor and anyone hoping for a scholarship.
Finally, food is cheap. Starving isn't really that big of an issue in America. Housing though, housing is expensive as hell. Unless these food stamps can be given to a landlord, you're looking at a massive homeless issue. The problem is not having enough homes. There are something like 3-5 empty homes for each homeless person. The problem is they don't have money for a home.
The Corporate Tax would be abolished, instead companies would pay a 5% gross receipts tax
...Noooooooo you just said "no exceptions" to the income tax. Corporations as separate people with special tax rules is a pretty big exception. "Business expenses" and all that. If you tax revenue rather than profit, you're going to see a diaspora of business interest from the USA. That's a brutally massive change.
Marry who[m]ever you want... Now you have health care rights
What are you talking about? You just have everyone universal healthcare.
All sales taxes nationally go away, replaced with a 10% VAT,
Replacing a sales tax with a sales tax. Got it. But did you mean national sales tax or all sales taxes across the nation? It sounds like the latter, primarily because there really isn't a national sales tax. But in that case, how do states and cities get money?
I would build a HUGE wall on the Mexican Border ... I would not attempt to throw out 11 million illegals, that isn't reasonable
I find it humorous that you stated these two thing next to each other. Do you have ANY idea how unreasonable a big-ass wall is? Do you have any idea how much it would cost? Do you think it would actually be effective? I mean, a 20' rope is pretty cheap. And if you want it to be patrolled by the military... holy shit dude, that cost makes the construction look like chump change.
if we don't have a secure border, we don't have a country
Stop drinking the kool-aid from the crazy guy. Take a look at the border between Germany and France. It's open. With agreements that people can walk or drive through whenever they want. Do you think Germany and France are no longer countries? Are the USA and Canada no longer countries? That one's pretty insecure.
If you REALLY want to do something about illegal immigrants, just start prosecuting the companies that are hiring them. Send CEOs and mid-level bosses to prison.
The 2nd amendment says exactly what the fuck it says, you can own guns, any type of guns, that you want.
Really? I want a recoiless nuclear-ordinance launcher. Unless you're going to magically restrict the sales of bullets. I think it'd be nice to be a nuclear power.
I also want to own, manufacture, and sell 30 mm GAU-8/A Avenger Gatling-type cannons. I'm pretty sure I could find a market willing to buy them. Maybe those Mexican cartels. I'm sure I could find someone across the border that would pass a background check. Or I could just lose them conveniently some where. You're not going to audit which guns I currently possess, right?
Can I get a gun if I'm a convict? How about a con
Only a majority wins, as in greater than 50%. With three or more candidates, the most votes plurality does not win.
Imagine this: Hillary 49%, Trump 48%, Johnson 3%
No winner! It goes to the House to select from the top 3 candidates.
Too much in-party hate to push along party lines, compromise on Johnson. Johnson wins!
But with regards to fairness, I have never understood how, if I am making widgets, I will get paid $5 for the first widget I make but then get paid $3 for the 20th widget I make. Are my widgets now worth less than they were? Is my labor not as valuable?
...Yes. Yes, that's exactly how it works. The first one is the hardest to make, it's one of a kind, rare, and whoever paid for it obviously needs it. Piecemeal work has no economy of scale and is labor intensive. It's expensive as fuck and operates like it's back from the medieval period with their cottage industry.
If you make widgets en'mass then the value of the widgets plummets. If the world needed 5 widgets and you only made one, then the world is going to fight over that one widget, and it's going to be valuable. If you make 10 widgets, the world will take 5 and maybe a couple more as backups, and you'll be left with 2 widgets with a value of $0, because nobody wants them. Now, your overhead remains the same, and you can distribute it over multiple widgets, so you can sell them at a lower cost and still come out ahead.
If you're making something so common and standard that it's a commodity then the profit margins are going to be razor thin. Which is a good thing for society. Not great for you personally, I guess. I too would love if I could command a paycheck of a million dollars for what I do. Great for me, but a kick in the pants to society. And that's capitalism. It works better than the other systems we've tried, usually.
Ideally, nobody owes you jack shit for widgets or your labor. It's up to you to get as much as you can for it. Let me put that other way: Widgets have no inherent worth or value past their utility to others. If you spend a year building worthless widgets that nobody wants, that's bloody stupid of you. Now, that's ideally. We've had a history of labor disputes and really horrible abuses, so now we've got some laws about minimum wage. At least when it comes to big companies. If they can't afford to pay someone a minimum wage to do something, then it's not worth it to society to have them do it. But those sort of labor dispute solutions are a little long in the tooth now that robots are doing a lot of the work.
Oh, wait, you were bitching about progressive taxes.
Listen, if you can somehow make 20 widgets while everyone else around you works just as hard and only makes 2, and all widgets are currently sold at the same price, then you've got plenty of cash to afford the higher tax. If we didn't do this, historically you'd undercut those around you, dominate the market, form a monopoly, and generally be abusing to everyone. Progressive taxes are part of the solution to stop that.
You're rich. Quite bitching.
You do not murder children, not even to save the life of the mother... This shouldn't even have to be said out loud, and the fact that it does shows how far down the fucked rabbit hole our society has gone...
You keep using the word murder. You're doing that so you can feel justified about your actions and ignore any debate or discussion.
That's the problem. You're clearly not used to medical experience, where one person can die because of a choice you make, whether it be for an organ donation, emergency medical care, or whether or not to continue a pregnancy. Or even separating conjoined twins.
This is what results from somebody sitting on a gilded throne, where they don't know what's going on in people's lives, feels fit to make sublime pronouncements rather than listen and understand.
You can wax eloquent all you want about Down's Syndrome, or other more or less manageable defects. Screening for them is one thing, but meanwhile, doctors have to deal with actually terminal ones. Undeveloped lungs. Malformed hearts. Collapsing placentas.
Especially since you're concerning yourself with what is a very small fraction of abortions. You'd get more accomplished by spending the exactly same amount of effort you'd need to exert to track down the mere 1 to 2 percent of abortions by investing in birth control and sex education.
So your highness, pardon me for offending your majesty, but I suggest you take more time to ponder on this matter.
Well not me.
Why not? Do you honestly think I'd do a WORSE job than either Trump or Clinton? :)
HOOOOOOOOLLY SHIIIIIIT! Where are you going to get all your money from? Our effective tax rate is around 27%, so you're in deep financial shit.
You're assuming the Federal Government needs to stay its current size. I'd fix that! :)
But, oh, okay, "all numbers are subject to change". So let's just assume that it's a flat tax at $(ENOUGH) to have the same income as today.
Thank you for bothering to read what I wrote, everyone else seems to not want to read it. :)
Why do you want to give so much money to rich people? Historically, they've been getting hella wealthier while the bulk of people have lagged behind.
I don't, that is a HUGE tax increase on the rich... or do you think the rich are actually paying 39.6% marginal tax rates? Why do you think Trump isn't releasing his returns? He probably pays less than 10% tax rate overall, better to just not release them.
Want to know how to fix the tax code? Ask a rich person who is willing to pay more. My wife and I made into a comfortable 6 figures last year, yet paid hardly any income tax. All legally, every single penny was reported, but thanks to our insane tax code, we avoided paying much tax. Compare this to normal working people who pay out the nose.
In 2012 it was reported that Mitt Romney paid 14% effective tax rate, and that he probably would refile after the election to lower it even more (he didn't take all the deductions that he could). My plan would raise taxes on people like him and Trump.
Also with no exceptions, most non-profits go away. Which is a real kick in the pants to the poor and anyone hoping for a scholarship.
Meh, people aren't going to stop caring about their fellow human beings over it, what it will do is remove a ton of fraud and cheating... Non-Profits live in society, they need to help pay for it...
Finally, food is cheap. Starving isn't really that big of an issue in America.
http://www.feedingamerica.org/...
Don't be too sure...
48 million Americans live in "food insecure household" - That is unacceptable if we can afford to maintain a trillion dollar military...
...Noooooooo you just said "no exceptions" to the income tax. Corporations as separate people with special tax rules is a pretty big exception.
Corporations don't pay taxes, people do... The other option is to either set it to zero, or set it to 20% of gross receipts, but that would be regressive on the poor...
It can't be based on "profit", that is too easy to make say whatever they want it to say.
Replacing a sales tax with a sales tax. Got it. But did you mean national sales tax or all sales taxes across the nation? It sounds like the latter, primarily because there really isn't a national sales tax. But in that case, how do states and cities get money?
10% national VAT, collected by the federal government, 7% goes to the states, 3% goes to the federal government. If online purchase, then split the 7% to 3.5% for each state, buyer and seller. The states can spend the money on anything they want, no strings attached. The 3% to the feds covers the cost of running the single program (making it easy for all companies to comply) and provides minor income to the government. The 7% to the states is free of cost, so most states will actually get more money this way.
Do you have ANY idea how unreasonable a big-ass wall is? Do you have any idea how much it would cost?
It is totally reasonable... Th
And I see some of Snowden's actions as heroic and others as treacherous.
"When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
yeah, I would pardon Snowden and even vote for him if he ran for public office. But there is no way that Manning should be pardoned. In fact, that degenerate should be put out of its misery.
Listen, if you can somehow make 20 widgets while everyone else around you works just as hard and only makes 2, and all widgets are currently sold at the same price, then you've got plenty of cash to afford the higher tax.
It doesn't matter if he can afford it or not, people generally aren't going to turn over 40% of their labors to anyone...
It doesn't matter what you set the tax rates to, people will find a way to avoid such absurd rates.
The current top rate is 39.6%, which is silly... no one making that kind of money is paying that rate...
I'm in the 33% tax bracket and I don't pay that rate either, not even close.
Having it is a lie to tell uninformed people that the rich are paying more taxes... It is dishonest and a bad system...
My entire point here is it should not be up to pen pushers in Washington or some lay preacher of the church of the dollar to decide this but someone on the spot with a lot of years of experience to develop more of a clue.
Putting down hard and fast rules based on what a layman sees as the norm really fucks people around in general.
See also how self defence or defence of others is a reason not to have mandatory sentences for someone who kills someone else. You carry a gun for defence don't you? Do you want a system so fucked up that if you shoot someone who has killed a dozen people in a mall and you are next that you are going to get the gas chamber for putting them down?
It's not murder and that's seriously fucked up medieval shit right there. The life of a potential son being worth more than that of a mother and all that shit we've left behind.
It's not murder and that's seriously fucked up medieval shit right there. The life of a potential son being worth more than that of a mother and all that shit we've left behind.
You're wrong, yes it is, and the fact that your viewpoint exists again shows how far down society has gone...
Maybe one day you'll grow up and discover how wrong you were, or perhaps you'll live in ignorance your whole life...
Either way, you support murder, and you even post about it...
You're a sick human being...
On the medical system
You see I'm not American. I live in a country where a private medical system and a public full care medical system work hand in hand to the benefit of all. I've actually seen it work.
There are lots of things that are electives that doesn't include cosmetic survery. These things are the sorts of things that improve quality of life but aren't necessarily something that is essential. Things like foot surgery for bunions is one example. Corrective shoulder reconstruction. In both cases the joints work, your are in some discomfort true but it's not essential to have it repaired. This is where a private system helps, and my insurance does cover that.
On the guns, again not american, and it works real real well where I am. I look at the American system of mass gun deaths every year and I just can't understand it. History is on my side when you look outside of your country.
How about looking at it a little differently rather than getting your knickers in a bunch.
I work 8 hours, and make 8 widgets. Someone else works 1 hour makes 1 widget. I pay more tax, both as a gross number and as a % than the other person.
Surely if you look at that it is obvious that a progressive tax system acts as a disincentive for me to work longer.
History says that you're just a slave to your government in the long run.
History is not on your side, which you'd know if you actually knew anything about history.
Actually no - I support a medical opinion over lawyers who don't have a clue and find it very interesting that people who call themselves small government conservatives not only attempt to do something as radical as redefine what a human being is but want to go full nanny state on reproductive health.
We've already had former drug addicts jailed for murder when they miscarried, how long before this nanny state bullshit locks up women who smoked beyond six weeks and miscarried?
You've been a victim of propaganda that a complex issue is simple. Propaganda crafted by people who did it merely to create a "brand" to distinguish them from another party - those are the pricks who are sick.
Murder is very well defined in law. Difficult medical decisions over who to save when no magical quick fix exists are not covered by that. You will be turning every doctor who has not been able to successfully deliver a baby alive into a convicted murderer as collatoral damage of going after the ones performing abortions.
Dumb is not good. You've been so blinded by years of expensive taxpayer funded propaganda from supposedly "small government" types that you didn't even pick up that none of my examples were actually about abortions. How about instead of taking the dumb approach use some of that mental ability that you have and understand that something complex has been dumbed down into a nanny-state slogan?
Why not? Do you honestly think I'd do a WORSE job than either Trump or Clinton?
Worse than Hilary, if this is your plan.
You're assuming the Federal Government needs to stay its current size. I'd fix that
Yeah, so far you'd expand it a lot: You'd have it take over healthcare, run an active military campaign to "secure the border", and called $30 Billion "chump change". Disarming nuclear capabilities kind of makes it smaller. Otherwise you haven't actually stated how you'd make it any smaller. I mean, if you plan on axing the bulk of the military, that's a pretty major change you probably want to tell people about.
And dear god, your sense of economics is laughable. You're really comparing the wall construction to the great wall of china? That took centuries to build.
48 million Americans live in "food insecure household"
Wow. That's terrible. If only we had a number of programs to feed them.... Like 61% of those 48 million partake of. The rest have some sort of trouble taking the hand out.
speaking of which
better mental health systems will go a ways towards fixing some of that...
Truth.
Meh, people aren't going to stop caring about their fellow human beings over it, what it will do is remove a ton of fraud and cheating... Non-Profits live in society, they need to help pay for it...
You fucking monster. Sure, they might still care. But the organizations will have a hell of a lot less cash to help.
Stop giving bottled water to people crossing the border and shoot them instead...
You fucking monster. You want to abolish the death penalty, but shoot people on US soil without any trial or identification. Sweet Jesus, have you thought this one through at all? You're telling me I can grab a motherfucker, drive down to Arizona, push him into this no-man's-zone, and have my buddy in the national guard gun him down without any other due-process? You're gonna need TWO walls on either side of that clusterfuck.
you would not be walking free if I was King... If you believe in jihad, then your beliefs are not compatible with civilization...
Let's say the guy giving the talk was a believer in Jihad, and was giving talks to the mosques around the US about how it's supposed to be non-violent. Typically you only "put down the dog" when people perform an illegal activity. Or did you want to outlaw a religion or something?
Are you proposing some sort of thought-crime?
If you're raped, then getting an abortion during the first three months shouldn't be hard...
Sure. Probably not. But it happened. Now what? Is it illegal?
If an unborn child is 6 months old and is at risk of killing the mother, I'm ok with that...
You fucking monster. How about if the child is given a 10% chance of living? Yeah, this shit gets tricky doesn't it?
Have you been lawfully released? Did you serve your time?
I have the same problem with sex offender registration, that shit is stupid... If you can't trust the person released, why are they OUT OF PRISON?
Because they were lawfully released after having served their time. That doesn't mean JACK SHIT for trusting them with a gun. Right now, we DON'T trust them with a gun. You're proposing that we just don't release people because "we don't trust them".
I don't want ANYONE to have nuclear weapons, including governments!
Yeah, they're scary. But so far they've kept the prats from going at it. And frankly, you can't disarm them. It would require you to not only be king of the world, but an omniscient GOD. It'd be too easy for one player to just keep a few secretly and POOF, next conflict they just declare their milit
Wow. I can't believe someone would try to argue about tax rates when they don't know the difference between marginal tax rates and effective tax rates.
The tax bracket you're in is the marginal rate. That's how much you pay in taxes for additional money you make from that point on. You're ALSO in the all the lower tax brackets and paying those rates for those sums of income.
The top bracket had marginal tax rate of the 1940's and 50's was 90-some percent. And they paid it, for the war effort. Soooo, yeah, people WILL pay it, if need be.
Soooo... You have 8 times as much income as that other guy.... And after taxes you'd have 5-7 times as much as that other guy. And you've got your panties in a twist over this?
If that guy can get by on one widget, and you've got SEVEN times as much.... how much do you care if you don't have 8?
Surely if you look at that it is obvious that a progressive tax system acts as a disincentive for me to work longer.
That's the MAGIC of capitalism. If you want more, you have to work more.
You are STILL incentiveized to work longer and make more money. There are diminishing returns, but there ARE returns. And the bulk of people are greedy little monsters that'll chase after that. Because no matter how much they have, they'll see someone with more than themselves and they'll want it.
You can either say people are greedy and they'll work for more regardless of the diminishing returns, or that people aren't that greedy and shouldn't care about the taxes since they've already got plenty to cover their needs.
The irony is that you think you're so smart with your comment, but you're actually an idiot.
Of course I understand the difference, it is all the poor stupid people who do not.
No one paid the 90% rate either, people aren't paying the current 75% top rate in France either.
One way or another, they will avoid it.
The reason you are an idiot is that you missed the forest for the trees. The rich are actually paying a lower rate than the middle class, because of the various tax laws.
My 20% flat tax would have the rich paying more, not less. If you think Donald Trump and Mitt Romney are paying 20% of their income in tax, you're insane.