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Uber and Didi Call a Truce In China With a $35 Billion Deal (recode.net)

Kara Swisher, reporting for Recode: Uber, which has been spending hugely in China over the last two years, has folded, striking a deal in which it will merge its Chinese operations with its main rival there, Didi Chuxing. Under terms of the deal, Uber China, the ride-hailing company's Chinese subsidiary, will be part of a larger Didi company valued at $35 billion. Uber gets a 20 percent stake in that -- Didi's previous valuation was $28 billion. That's a $7 billion value for upward of $2 billion that Uber has frittered away, um, spent there. In turn, Didi will invest in Uber at a valuation of almost $70 billion. That was about the value of Uber's last round. Now, everyone owns everyone everywhere.

45 comments

  1. Frittered Away? by Diss+Champ · · Score: 4, Interesting

    If they managed to get a stake worth $7 billion from spending $2 billion, that $2 billion is arguably well spent, even if the actually places the money went look silly.

    1. Re:Frittered Away? by invictusvoyd · · Score: 0

      In Communist China stake get you !

    2. Re:Frittered Away? by fustakrakich · · Score: 2

      Yeah, but the running gag is this 35 and 70 billion dollar "valuation" scam, which is phonier than a three dollar bill. How can anybody believe this shit? It has to be just the number the taxpayers will pay out in the next set of Wall Street Bailouts... Once again we are being set up as pansies during an election year grift.

      --
      “He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
    3. Re:Frittered Away? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They LOSS $2B, not that they spent the $2B and that they still necessarily have $2B in assets there. That's not to say they didn't spend even more, and still have even more than $2B in assets there.

      The fact of the matter is that uber couldn't compete, the competition was too great by the time they tried to enter the market. This actually could be a good thing for uber, where Yahoo had sold its Yahoo China business to Alibaba, and also invested $1B into their business, turning that $1B into several billions of dollars.

    4. Re:Frittered Away? by ranton · · Score: 1

      I don't understand your argument. Uber spent $2 billion to prop up Uber China, and ultimately gained assets worth $7 billion as part of the merger. That certainly seems like a $2 billion investment just turned into $7 billion. Of course this is all based on the current valuation and their stake in Didi Chuxing is no where near as liquid as the $2 billion in cash Uber spent, but as of now it seems to be a good deal. Not as good as Uber completely winning out in that market as they would have liked, but certainly a good consolation prize.

      --
      -- All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. -- Edmund Burke
    5. Re:Frittered Away? by whoever57 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      If they managed to get a stake worth $7 billion from spending $2 billion, that $2 billion is arguably well spent, even if the actually places the money went look silly.

      The problem is that the $2B spent is cold, hard cash that came from investors, while the $7B valuation is just an estimate, based on what a few people think. It may prove to be ephemeral.

      --
      The real "Libtards" are the Libertarians!
    6. Re:Frittered Away? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The summary is misunderstood. That $2B figure was the total loss in the last few years in operation there. Uber China got significantly MORE money than a $2B investment. Baidu invested about $1B, a slew of Chinese firms invested $2B, etc. So after knowing the total amount actually invested, minus the $2B loss, perhaps that figure will equal closer to the $7B mark. Chinese firms aren't stupid. They aren't going to take $2B assets and give $7B equity back, especially when they already control 95% of the Chinese market... Didi Chuxing has also been getting significant investment from players like BABA and AAPL.

    7. Re:Frittered Away? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If they managed to get a stake worth $7 billion from spending $2 billion, that $2 billion is arguably well spent, even if the actually places the money went look silly.

      Everyone keeps saying that, but there are two mitigating factors. One, their operation in China was burning money the whole time it was up and running trying to compete against Didi. Some estimates put these losses into the multiple billions of dollars, but no one knows for sure how much. Second, that 20% stake in DiDi may be worth $7 billion in total, but as the article points out, Uber does not own all of it (although it doesn't say how much is owned by other parties).

      So we don't know for sure what fraction of that $7 billion - $2 billion Uber gets to keep, but it's certainly not all of it. It could very well be net negative.

    8. Re:Frittered Away? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Chinese firms do whatever the government tells them to. As long as the Party members get their cut they stay in the background. Chinese party members are some of the richest people on the planet. How can the Chinese government tell their citizens and the outside world they follow Communist ideology with a straight face?

      Any foreign firms only gain access to the Chinese market by agreeing to Chinese terms. One of the most stringent requirements a foreign company has to deal with is handing over any IP for tech sector firms. After all Uber was first out of the gate with this type of service before Didi had a chance to copy the idea? Google had offices in China until the Chinese Baindu search engine was able to copy Goggles technology and give it a new name. The only thing that keeps China some what reasonable is the US ability to leverage China's access to the US market.

      Putting this aside how in the hell does an Uber or similar service need to spend billions of dollars or generate the revenue required to justify an investment of 7 billion dollars?

  2. Uber not so great as a whole by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    For everything that Uber is good for a rider. It's bad for the industry as a whole. It's driven down rates, but at the same time ignored regulations, driver pay, and uniform service. When you basically have a short and quick application, no significant back ground check because myself was approved to drive even before being approved by Checkr the company doing the background check. This sends up red flags in so many ways, and now Uber is raising the percentage they keep from rates all the while reducing rates. The question then becomes ,what kind of people is Uber attracting to drive for them? Like myself I am looking for some extra money but frankly I lasted a couple days with Uber and realized the benefits apply only to riders with Uber. Most drivers can't seem to even make minimum wage much of the time. We all complain about low wages until those low wages benefit us financially. I can't tell you how many Uber forum people said they hate being a Uber driver for lack of money. But will gladly use the service, even knowing how poorly drivers are paid.

    1. Re:Uber not so great as a whole by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How much was the fare (on average) per mile driven? What percentage cut of the fare does Uber get?

    2. Re:Uber not so great as a whole by AvitarX · · Score: 3, Informative

      As someone in a smaller market, the cost is a very minor part of Uber.

      There's also the fact that I can actually get a ride.

      I've waited 90 minutes for a cab, while Uber in the same location same time of night is always under 10.

      I'd happily pay 25% more than cabs for Uber (and when there's surge pricing I often pay more than that even), cabs aren't worth it (in Philadelphia outside of center city, in northern Delaware, and in New Orleans. In San Fransisco, I'd use the Uber app, but often just to hail a cab.)

      --
      Wow, sent an e-mail as suggested when clicking on "use classic" banner, and got a fast response that addressed my msg
    3. Re:Uber not so great as a whole by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Are you acting like an idiot on purpose? The medallion as a significant investment of the Taxi company brings on more oversight to drivers as the users. There are also major regulations on operations, for example in NYC, where rates are regularly restricted and safety is a huge concern for all parties with respect to traffic flow, insurance for accidents, and background checks as described here.

    4. Re:Uber not so great as a whole by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Uber is "dead man walking." The only edge Uber (ever) has is lower cost. The moment autonomous vehicles come out nobody needs Uber anymore. Uber is going to have to compete with Tesla, Google, Apple, and others. My money is definitely not on Uber.

  3. Uber by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

    If the taxi regulations are good for anything, it's keeping out slimeball business tactics like this.

    --
    Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    1. Re:Uber by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The taxi regs are good for nothing but preventing competition. Uber exists because cabs suck.

  4. A "truce" indeed by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    They surrendered and gave up control of their operations in China to a local company. Still think doing transnational business in China is a good idea?

    1. Re: A "truce" indeed by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They spent 2 billion and got 7 billion in return, so...yes?

    2. Re:A "truce" indeed by AvitarX · · Score: 1

      Absolutely.

      It looks to me like spending 2,000,000,000 got them a lot more over a couple years.

      By being credible competition they won big. They're also getting additional money at a decent valuation of their own company.

      Seems like Uber won big doing business in China.

      --
      Wow, sent an e-mail as suggested when clicking on "use classic" banner, and got a fast response that addressed my msg
    3. Re: A "truce" indeed by LynnwoodRooster · · Score: 2

      No, they spent $2 billion in hard cash - and got back paper that has a supposed value of $7 billion. Now the fun begins trying to sell pre-IPO stocks in China...

      --
      Browsing at +1 - no ACs, I ignore their posts. So refreshing!
  5. That's dealing with a Chinese company for you by Opportunist · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Whenever China finds out that something you do is profitable, they'll sure find a way to wrest it from your hands. In the end, anything that's profitable in China has to be in Chinese hands, in one way or another. If nothing else, you'll be forced into a joint-venture with a Chinese "partner". With "partner" being something akin to being married in a shotgun wedding.

    --
    We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    1. Re:That's dealing with a Chinese company for you by NotInHere · · Score: 1

      That's their business model since 40 years now and its working well.

    2. Re: That's dealing with a Chinese company for you by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yup, and when trump speaks of nationalism it's racist. Can't work for us here, nope! We have to play fair to the world that isn't playing fair.

    3. Re:That's dealing with a Chinese company for you by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I guess they took a page out of the U.S. book. They basically invented protectionism, and are fighting tooth and nail to own the markets of the world, so don't try to make China out as bad, because they're nowhere close.

    4. Re:That's dealing with a Chinese company for you by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Isn't that how the business is, or was done in Russia and other countries in the vicinity as well? If something similar happened here, we would think automatically that the authorities were bribed and extorted to play in the hands of our competition.

    5. Re: That's dealing with a Chinese company for you by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ignorant faggot

    6. Re: That's dealing with a Chinese company for you by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      You have to be in the position to pull it off, though. The US isn't. Unless I can get your workslaves for a buck a day, you have nothing to bargain with.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    7. Re: That's dealing with a Chinese company for you by ranton · · Score: 1

      Yup, and when trump speaks of nationalism it's racist. Can't work for us here, nope! We have to play fair to the world that isn't playing fair.

      Beware what you wish for. Its much easier to be protectionist when your population is happy with a $13400 GDP/capita (PPP). If the Chinese ever want to reach a level of prosperity similar to the US ($52,550 GDP/capita (PPP)) they will not be able to continue these practices. The world only puts up with it now to access their cheap labor, but China's trade agreements will become far less favorable once their factory workers start demanding $20/hr.

      China's practices are certainly working for them as they catch up to the developed world, but no developed country should start mimicking these practices.

      --
      -- All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. -- Edmund Burke
    8. Re: That's dealing with a Chinese company for you by NotInHere · · Score: 1

      but China's trade agreements will become far less favorable once their factory workers start demanding $20/hr.

      Which is why china is colonizing Africa at the moment. There the workers are still cheap. Lots of businessmen in china are now having these problems that the workers demand more pay and will have to close their businesses unless they find a place where they can still treat their workers like shit.

  6. same china that where helping some makes you lieab by Joe_Dragon · · Score: 1

    same china that where helping some makes you liable so people just keep running the same person over.

    Uber will work good there

  7. Ride-hailing company? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

    In a different article it was called "ride-sharing".

    Why don't you just call it what it really is - an unlicensed, unregulated taxi company.

    1. Re:Ride-hailing company? by Mr+D+from+63 · · Score: 1

      In a different article it was called "ride-sharing".

      Why don't you just call it what it really is - an unlicensed, unregulated taxi company.

      That would be a better description. The passenger hails the ride, the company responds to the hail with a driver. So its neither a ride-hailing nor a ride-sharing company, it is a ride-selling company.

  8. Re: same china that where helping some makes you l by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    China doesn't have 1% of the lawyers the US has (to China's detriment). Civil lawsuits just aren't even a consideration in everyday life.

  9. Trump is right China forces you have to have them by Joe_Dragon · · Score: 1

    Trump is right China forces you have to have them own parts of your company to be able to sell there. But we can't do the same hear.

  10. What the world needs is non-profit version of Uber by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The software behind the app is not that complex. An industry sponsored non-profit Uber where all the profits go to the drivers is what is called for. Paying these rent seeking leeches so much money that they have a $70 billion valuation is criminal. They software has driven down rates -- awesome for consumers of cab services. But its hurt drivers who now make less money. The solution isn't higher rates but removing the rent seeking middle man in between -- a non-profit Uber owned by the drivers.

  11. Re:Trump is right China forces you have to have th by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    you are a fucking retard

  12. Re:What the world needs is non-profit version of U by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
  13. Enough by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    That's a $7 billion value for upward of $2 billion that Uber has frittered away, um, spent there

    Dear Editors,

    Please keep your personal opinions out of the summaries you're writing. It degrades the quality of the experience here and interferes with rational discussion.

    Thank you,
    The Slashdot Readership

    1. Re:Enough by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's in the article faggot, click through.

  14. Re:What the world needs is non-profit version of U by rockmuelle · · Score: 1

    When Uber and Lyft stomped out of Austin like whiney, spoiled brats, the free market stepped in a started creating alternatives. One of them is a non-profit:

    http://www.austinchronicle.com...

    I haven't used it yet, but I like the idea of non-profit or B-Corps competing side by side with the for-profit companies.

    -Chris

  15. Re:What the world needs is non-profit version of U by SvnLyrBrto · · Score: 1

    Oh, knock off that BS and read the actual ordinance and understand the circumstances under which it was passed.

    1) Uber and Lyft did not move into Austin, demand to be exempt from existing law, and leave in a snit when they were told no. They were already operating in Austin for quite some time when this brand NEW law was imposed for the specific purpose of running them out of town.

    2) There was a lot more in there than just the background check people were making a big deal about. They were restricted in providing service to "special events", required to conduct and report on vaguely defined "community outreach" events outside the scope of a for-profit business, and surrender access to their data to the city. There was also a cash grab.

    3) The ordinance was specifically crafted NOT to apply equally to the legacy taxi corporations. It applied only to "Transportation Network Companies,", ie. Lyft and Uber only.

    It was political corruption and regulatory capture at its worst. Uber and Lyft were not being "spoiled brats" in exiting the market. When their attempt to fight the legislation failed, exiting the market was the only rational choice. The bought-and-paid-for city council had picked the winner in that marketplace and even if the ridesharing companies had complied, all that would mean is that even more onerous legislation would be in the pipeline until they departed anyway.

    --
    Imagine all the people...
  16. Re:What the world needs is non-profit version of U by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    can tell you're a deluded Hillary voter.