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White House Voices Concerns About China Cyber Law (reuters.com)

The White House said on Thursday that it raised concerns about China's new cyber security law during a meeting with a Chinese official after the latest round of talks between the two countries on cyber crime. From a report on Reuters: U.S. National Security Adviser Susan Rice met with Chinese State Councilor Guo Shengkun to discuss the importance "of fully adhering" to an anti-hacking accord signed last year between the China and the United States, National Security Council spokesman Ned Price said. The deal, brokered during Chinese President Xi Jinping's state visit to Washington in 2015, included a pledge that neither country would knowingly carry out hacking for commercial advantages. Rice told Guo that the United States was concerned "about the potential impacts" of a law that China adopted in November aimed at combating hacking and terrorism.

48 comments

  1. commercial advantages by Errol+backfiring · · Score: 3, Insightful

    ... that neither country would knowingly carry out hacking for commercial advantages.

    So doing it for political or military advantages is fine?

    --
    Nae king! Nae laird! Nae yurrupiean pressedent! We willna be fooled again!
    1. Re:commercial advantages by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What about hacking for porn advantages?

    2. Re:commercial advantages by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It doesn't matter they're not honorable. All it means is the US won't do it, while China continues to do what they've done all along. Hopefully Trump is smart enough to see through it.

    3. Re:commercial advantages by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It doesn't matter they're not honorable. All it means is the US won't do it, while China continues to do what they've done all along. Hopefully Trump is smart enough to see through it.

      you mean a country that will hack its own systems and people but not our competitors? That is a serious problem ... no wonder Trump wins. BTW.. today's headline "Homeland Security tied to attempted hack of Georgia's election database"
       

    4. Re:commercial advantages by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Everyone sees the shit Trump says. Everyone. Trump is just the only one stupid enough flush the strategic advantage down the drain by shouting it from the rooftops before he knows the full truth or his course of action to respond. It's not a virtue. Douglas MacArthur and George Patton are spinning in their graves every time he squanders our strategic advantage so he can pander his politics to the lowest common denominator of American stupidity (you).

    5. Re:commercial advantages by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ... that neither country would knowingly carry out hacking for commercial advantages.

      So doing it for political or military advantages is fine?

      Cyber War is over... the US lost.

      If we are relying on secrets for our national security we are completely fucked.

    6. Re:commercial advantages by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      It doesn't matter they're not honorable. All it means is the US won't do it, while China continues to do what they've done all along. Hopefully Trump is smart enough to see through it.

      Maybe I am in the minority, but when I read about the congratulations call from Taiwan, I remembered why I voted for that man. Fuck China. They don't play fair, and we've been pussies about it for too long.

    7. Re:commercial advantages by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Is this like our strategic advantage in Syria? Cause if it is, I hope he flushes it for sure!

    8. Re: commercial advantages by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ah people like you foken white trash... People like you are responsible for what happens next, I hope you enjoy picking shit on your side of the wall. Time to learn Chinese for me, half way there ;)

      How did america became Nazi Germany in less than a year?

    9. Re:commercial advantages by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I guess it's to be expected that a response to this comment would come from a halfwit who only wants to argue about politics and prop up their demagogue of choice, but I'm a nice guy so I'll answer your question anyways...

      Nah, it's not like Syria. Our government has been forthright and vocal about our failed strategy in Syria from the very start. That made it very easy for our true adversary, Russia, to defeat it. You'd have to go back to the time before the "red line" was referenced to find this kind of strategic advantage over the Syrian regime

      In other words, you can be sure of succeeding in your attacks if you only attack places which are undefended. You can ensure the safety of your defense if you only hold positions that cannot be attacked. In this regard, the war of words represented by the "red line" and all the shit trump says about our enemies are one and the same.

    10. Re: commercial advantages by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      These people have always been there. They just felt marginalized and had no way to make their voices heard. The internet has given them voice, and Trump pandered to them just enough to get them all to the polls. Now, they're energized and vocal. It won't last. Just as quickly as they've drawn attention to themselves, they'll be marginalized again by their own stupidity.

    11. Re: commercial advantages by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      The same way Nazi Germany did. High unemployment, low faith in its leaders and a scapegoat to blame.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    12. Re:commercial advantages by Mashiki · · Score: 1

      So doing it for political or military advantages is fine?

      Sure. Long as it's disavowed and neither side gets caught, and with luck no gigantic wars are started. Been like that for hundreds of years. It was the standard MO of the USSR, US, UK, Canada, etc. The only difference between "hacking" a target and requiring a warm body to do the stealing is the era it's happening in.

      --
      Om, nomnomnom...
    13. Re:commercial advantages by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ... that neither country would knowingly carry out hacking for commercial advantages.

      So doing it for political or military advantages is fine?

      Yep. The agreement explicitly precludes hacking to gain economic advantages for either country's commercial business sectors while it excludes hacking for intelligence purposes.

    14. Re: commercial advantages by sinij · · Score: 1

      The same way Nazi Germany did. High unemployment, low faith in its leaders and a scapegoat to blame.

      Germany had punitive WW1 repatriations to blame for hardships. US has what... oligarchic 1%?

      Unemployment, wealth inequality, disregard for social contract by well-off and low faith in its leaders are entirely home-made problem. Trump was entirely preventable, instead we have SJW twitter-storming outrage on largely irrelevant issues. I hope they will be happy when female labor participation rate reaches 50% in concentration camps.

    15. Re: commercial advantages by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ah people like you foken white trash... People like you are responsible for what happens next, I hope you enjoy picking shit on your side of the wall. Time to learn Chinese for me, half way there ;)

      How did america became Nazi Germany in less than a year?

      Suggesting a hard stance against China's territory expansion and economic trickery is how America became Nazi Germany? Jesus, man. Listen to yourself. Try saying these words aloud and listening to how they sound.

    16. Re:commercial advantages by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ... that neither country would knowingly carry out hacking for commercial advantages.

      So doing it for political or military advantages is fine?

      Geo-politically speaking, these three things are all the same.

    17. Re:commercial advantages by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Of course!

      Just look at all the trouble caused by that faked GS transcript from Hillary Clinton that hit the news.

    18. Re: commercial advantages by Type44Q · · Score: 1

      Time to learn Chinese

      Congratulations; it's about time you learned a language.

    19. Re:commercial advantages by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hacking defense and law industry for political and military gains end up being hacks for commercial advantages.

    20. Re: commercial advantages by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Germany had its Jews, the US has its Mexicans. With the main difference that there are rather few Mexicans you can steal a lot from.

      And yes, a lot of the German problems that led up to the rise of the Nazis could be blamed on Clemenceau and his zeal to annihilate Germany with the peace conditions, but by no means all of it. Germany also had politicians that led right up to the point where people did have the feeling that these politicians are doing a crappy job, and yes, quite a few did. Not all of them, there were a few honest, hard working men that tried their best to rebuild the country, but far too many were simply looking out for themselves, and only themselves.

      And people will follow anyone who promises an end to that.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  2. What's this worth by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Brought to you by the country who manipulates their currency to improve their global position. Yeah, sounds legit.

    1. Re:What's this worth by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And signed by the country that deployed Stuxnet but still calls it unfair that they should be hacked

  3. Pretty vague story by fustakrakich · · Score: 1

    Is somebody worried that the US, a country that is in hardly any position to complain about restrictions and censorship, might have to hold up its end of the deal?

    --
    “He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
    1. Re:Pretty vague story by currently_awake · · Score: 1

      Worrying about America upholding a treaty or deal is a reasonable concern.

    2. Re:Pretty vague story by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well, my point is that somebody in the administration is concerned that they (the administration) will have to hold up their end. Naturally, given their track record, the rest of us should be concerned. None of it matters though, the law is a facade anyway and only applies to people spreading "fake news".

      Posting AC because a bunch of whiny democrat moderators don't like hearing anything negative about their party since the election, and I don't feel like making it easy for them. Maybe I'll limit my account to laughing kittens stories from now on.

      fusta

  4. Don't expect the U.S. to adhere to any agreements by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Until the NSA is dismantled, it will continue to do what it has always done: breach and compromise the security of its adversaries (i.e. everyone in the world) for political, economical, and industrial espionage and sabotage.

    It really is this simple: until the NSA is gone, it will continue to do what it has always done.

  5. What happened to "carry a big stick"? by sinij · · Score: 2

    I think this administration is too much about speaking softly and not enough about carrying a big stick. China won't stop government-sponsored cyber espionage just because we ask them nicely.

    1. Re:What happened to "carry a big stick"? by Patent+Lover · · Score: 1

      What're you going to do? Bomb them?

    2. Re:What happened to "carry a big stick"? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think this administration is too much about speaking softly and not enough about carrying a big stick.

      Our next Secretary of Defense is named Mad Dog.

      Times are changing.

    3. Re:What happened to "carry a big stick"? by sinij · · Score: 1

      So there absolutely no intermediate steps possible between "politely ask" and "nuclear strikes"?

      Fortunately, politics are not that binary.

    4. Re:What happened to "carry a big stick"? by sinij · · Score: 1

      I am not sure if "Bull in a China shop" is any better than do nothing. However remote, potential for a nuclear war is least preferable option all around.

    5. Re:What happened to "carry a big stick"? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Something like "politely asking while silently acting against it" seems inbetween and could represent a big stick. Morons commenting on the internet would still be able to whine about the lack of a big stick if that were the case, though. Darnit.

    6. Re:What happened to "carry a big stick"? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Now that Hillary isn't going to the whitehouse, we don't need to worry about nuclear war.

      Trump is a deal maker. Part of negotiating is throwing out something extreme, like banning imports from China, and then making a deal somewhere toward the middle - something more favorable to the U.S. than it is now. Going to war isn't deal making.

      Having, as you said, "A big stick" is part of that game. Instead of a big pussy, like we have now. Or a self serving crook, like we almost had.

    7. Re:What happened to "carry a big stick"? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Require any Chinese business that wants to import goods or sell goods in the United States to create and keep 20% of their value in the United States, then hack their companies for our advantage.

      Oh wait, that is what China has been doing for 30 years to us.

    8. Re:What happened to "carry a big stick"? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Right. That is why I went from being independent to being anti-Democrat this election. The rhetoric against Russia, a nuclear power, was too dangerous to support by electing a person wanting to escalate the Syria situation into the Whitehouse.

      Now that the election is over. I am much more at-ease.

    9. Re:What happened to "carry a big stick"? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      An actual "Bull in a China shop" is certainly much better than doing nothing.
      MythBusters to the rescue, again. That phrase has lost it's meaning, but you somehow have used it correctly.

  6. Keyword by DrYak · · Score: 3, Insightful

    ... that neither country would knowingly carry out hacking for commercial advantages.

    So doing it for political or military advantages is fine?

    No, the keyword here was knowingly,
    but you probably didn't manage to catch it over the noise of NSA and MSS both laughing their asses out together.

    --
    "Sufficiently advanced satire is indistinguishable from reality." - [Tips: 1DrYakQDKCQ6y52z6QbnkxHXAocMZJE61o ]
  7. Re:Don't expect the U.S. to adhere to any agreemen by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I know it's hard for someone like you to understand because the NSA just had their surveillance capabilities and practices exposed (hey look, turtles!), but that kind of thing has always been and still is more the CIA's domain. The sad fact of the matter is that the intelligence organizations of every developed country in the world are doing this kind of stuff, and no one expects an agreement like this to achieve full adherence from either side. So, why bother pointing a finger at one side or the other in such a general sense? Find some brass tacks to step on or crawl back under your rock, please.

  8. Will Trump winning be blamed on China too? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    We just can't get enough fake news from the New York Times and the Washington Post as they cast about looking for why Trump won.

  9. Hahahaha by houghi · · Score: 1

    Sorry, Hahahahaha, Again sorry.

    neither country would knowingly carry out hacking for commercial advantages

    WTF did they thought was going to happen? It is also nice to see that it IS allowed to hack others knowingly, only if companies are involved you should not do it. At least not on purpose to make money. Otherwise? Totes ok!

    I also like the spin "You can not hack companies for gain because terrorism" or so it sounds.

    --
    Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
  10. Time to spine up by DarkOx · · Score: 1

    I am all for Trump's get tough on China stance but 25 years after the fall of the Soviet Union we should be applying the same model, rather than exporting our wealth to them via a trade deficit.

    The Chinese economy is radically unbalanced right now much more so than our own in fact. If we suddenly deprived them of the sink for all the consumer goods the produces we could probably turn the PRC into failed state! What we ought to do is trigger that and simultaneously lay the ground work for installing a friendly government over their that by simply say "You bet we have a one China policy, the lawful government is the ROC and the capital is Taipei"

    --
    Repeal the 17th Amendment TODAY! Also Please Read http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
  11. Now write a strongly worded letter! by Idisagree · · Score: 1

    'It's totally worked for us' - UN

    1. Re:Now write a strongly worded letter! by Pinky's+Brain · · Score: 1

      Don't you mean get some papers to write an article which heavily implies they broke some agreement?

      China is requiring data for Chinese citizens to be stored in China and they wrote up some laws governing search and seizure which are nothing the US can't do with a national security letter, woopdefuckingdoo.

  12. WMDs and yellowcake by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    No, that's Russia's fault. They plan to release evidence of that... someday. I mean, a whole bunch of US organizations including things like the Coast Guard released a statement that the hacking was consistent with things Russia might like to do. So it's clearly their fault. I mean, someone used a common Russian RAT that could be gotten anywhere. And Podesta fell to a simple spear phishing email that said it was from the Ukraine. So, definitely them! The US intelligence community would definitely never mislead us to cover for the president's political goals....

  13. Laws by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Creating a Law of I will not hack U if U do not hack Me via Internet is not really going to work.
    * How about I give your politician $1.14 Million for info instead of hacking?
    ** Create laws with $1.14 Million dollars in your pocket for info to flow to my country.
    ** I put 50 spies in your country so you can put 45 spies in my country, OK?
    * Prevent hacking laws might create new products for sale that doesn't really work. Hence, reverse engineering.

    *** Create laws is a wonderful exercise. After this ecxerxise[When U read this word, was it like exercise?], we need to create laws like in Western Europe.
    ps. The word came out as exercise because of your profeincensy[Proficiency] in the language.
    OK! Enough said, Under a Federation, a spy network is more like telepathy, the good guys like jedi.
    OK. I understand, move economy forward with new laws to create new industries.

  14. Re:Don't expect the U.S. to adhere to any agreemen by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The only thing that has been definitely proven, is that the NSA is doing this, and at an unsurpassed scale where it treats all other countries as enemies. Is that hard to understand for someone like you?