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Amazon Seeks FCC Permission To Run Wireless Tests In Washington State (csmonitor.com)

Amazon has filed an application with the U.S. federal government that details plans to experiment with wireless communications technology. The application asks the FCC for permission "to test undisclosed prototypes and their related software for five months in and around its Seattle headquarters," reports Christian Science Monitor. "The experiments will involve mobile devices and anchored stations alike, according to an FCC application made public last week and first reported by Business Insider's Eugene Kim, who noted the project could be part of Amazon's drone-delivery initiatives or something even more novel." From the report: In recent years, Google and Facebook have begun conducting wireless experiments of their own with FCC approval, pursuing a number of innovative projects, such as self-driving cars, as Mr. Kim reported. Amazon, meanwhile, has focused on its aspirations of drone delivery service for its online retail business -- a service the firm has pursued in Britain and several other countries as well. Given the company's wide-ranging interests, it is difficult to anticipate precisely what the tests entail. Last year alone, Amazon unveiled projects to change the way people grocery shop, offer drivers a voice-activated driving assistant, and ship cargo with its own branded planes, as the Monitor reported. Amazon's application to the FCC notes that the tests would begin indoors at the Seattle headquarters then later move outdoors to a customer service site more than 220 miles away, in Kennewick, Wash. The tests would last five months, beginning as early as Feb. 11, 2017, the documents state.

24 comments

  1. Not really needed for drones by Bruce+Perens · · Score: 2

    If this was a drone and was just using the mobile frequencies for communication, it would probably use an off-the-shelf cellular modem module to communicate normally over the cellular network. A special testing authority from the FCC would not be necessary.

    1. Re:Not really needed for drones by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      What Amazon wants to test is a type of short-range radar which uses a new frequency, for drone collision avoidance and precise
      delivery methods.

    2. Re: Not really needed for drones by Bruce+Perens · · Score: 1

      There are the ISM bands and other bands licensed for radar. Also, the wavelengths of the requested frequencies seem a bit long for short range, high precision radar.

    3. Re: Not really needed for drones by flatulus · · Score: 1
      The FCC application lists the desired modulation type as 4M14G7D. FCC describes this as a 4.14 MHz (maximum) bandwidth emission that transfers data over a modulated wave using Two or more digital channels signal (wow that really narrows things down).

      Best match I can find to this modulation type is WCDMA, aka UMTS (3G cellular). I didn't verify that all of the requested bands support this signal type, but several of them certainly do.

      My guess is that they are experimenting with WCDMA transmission in otherwise unused cellular channels in these bands. This implies some degree of cognitive radio capability (listen for quiet channel before transmitting), or other interference avoidance schemes (of which I cannot imagine other than cognitive radio).

      This is certainly not radar as another poster above suggests, but rather some kind of 3G-speed data communications. Drone sounds like a likely application.

      I think Amazon is working on some kind of radio link and wants to test in a variety of cellular bands for determining effective coverage/propagation based on frequency choice. But radio propagation is well understood, so it seems they're more just looking for somewhere convenient to experiment. As Bruce notes, the ISM bands are available, but they're horribly noisy (with youze allz WiFi for instance), and I agree with his point about being unsuitable for radar due to wavelength being too long.

      Opportunistic sharing of cellular channels was the basis for CDPD (developed in the early 90's), but that was not successful. I don't think its failure was due to an issue in the RF realm as much as in being able to provide an adequate quality of service for data users vis-a-vis the cost of delivering the service at that time. Cellular data has gone way beyond what CDPD could do, and therefore has supplanted this spectrum sharing approach for the most part.

    4. Re: Not really needed for drones by Bruce+Perens · · Score: 1

      It's enough for television, but there are easier ways to do that. The only other thing I can think of is Drone based cell site survey.

    5. Re: Not really needed for drones by flatulus · · Score: 1

      Yes it is, Bruce, but analog TV (NTSC) is FCC emissions type 5M75C3F and digital TV (ATSC) is FCC emissions type 6M00C7W. So I stand by my presumption that the chosen modulation is WCDMA.

    6. Re: Not really needed for drones by Bruce+Perens · · Score: 1

      Modulation designators that state the payload type don't make much sense with digital data transports. You can do digital TV or anything else with 4 MHz bandwidth. Cellular doesn't make much sense unless they have a really long hover time and drone life, in which case it could be a pop-up base station.

  2. I work at Amazon... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    and have dial-up at home, so this is awesome considering Jeff Bezos has so far stood hard against allowing faster than dial-up.

    1. Re: I work at Amazon... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Bezos believes in dangling carrots like a Republican so he wants us to all have slow access.

  3. Help me Amazon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Nobody in Seattle should have to chose between ISDN and their medication.

    1. Re:Help me Amazon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Nobody in Seattle should have to chose between ISDN and their medication.

      Put the bong down, buddy. I think you've had enough 'medication' for today.

  4. Kennewick Site by MountainLogic · · Score: 2

    If you check out the Kennewick address in the FCC application in Google maps you will find a dumpy strip mall and in the back is a small sign labeled Amazon and a big back-up gennerator.

    The address is:
    7011 West Canal Dr
    Kennewick, WA 99336
    Coordinates (NAD83):
    4613'27"N; 11912'54"W

    Maps Image

    Kennewick is notable for having many more sunny days than Seattle. Perfect for drone flights, has access to PNNL National Labs and the open spaces of the Hanford nuclear reservation in case you drone goes rogue (or are all those plutonium storage takes a bad thing to crash into???).

    1. Re:Kennewick Site by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ah, but what secrets are in the "Wok King"? My browser crashed in the same place twice as I rounded the corner.

    2. Re:Kennewick Site by xlsior · · Score: 2

      If you check out the Kennewick address in the FCC application in Google maps you will find a dumpy strip mall and in the back is a small sign labeled Amazon and a big back-up gennerator.

      It's actually pretty big -- they took over the bulk of an empty Walmart store, and converted it to an Amazon tech support call center.

    3. Re:Kennewick Site by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If your drone goes onto the Nuclear Reservation you're going to be in trouble. They take security very seriously.

  5. Regarding frequencies in the application by MountainLogic · · Score: 4, Informative

    APPENDIX A - PROPOSED FREQUENCY BANDS
    Base / Downlink (MHz) * Mobile / Uplink (MHz)
    734-746 704-716
    746-756 777-787
    791-821 832-862
    869-894 824-849
    1805-1880 1710-1785
    1930-1990 1850-1910
    1930-1995 1850-1915
    2110-2155 1710-1755
    2110-2170 1920-1980

    * A limited number of channels would be used within the bands specified above, and applicant will change channels when necessary to avoid interference. Amazon will not operate on channels deployed by licensees in the public safety, aeronautical, or public coast radio services. In addition, the company will monitor the operations of other licensees and users before commencing transmissions to avoid interference.

  6. DGPS-like and telemetry ? by thygate · · Score: 2

    like some sort of local positioning - and telemetry system maybe ?

  7. Re: NSA and Amazin join forces to track the return by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Carmack will sue amazon for stealing virtual reality.

  8. That sounds EXACTLY like it's for drones by drinkypoo · · Score: 3, Informative

    Why else would you need so many different frequency bands, to use multiple channels ("a limited number") among them at once, and to change channels to avoid interference? This is almost certainly intended for drone control and telemetry. Of course, they could buy an off-the-shelf solution, but it would look like a whole bunch of little boxes connected by wires, and it would introduce many potential points of failure. They need to logically have a separate radio module for each RX, because the 3-in-1 or 4-in-1 radio modules which can be used to implement multiple protocols only let you activate one radio module at a time. You might be able to switch between them rapidly enough to send messages with lots of different protocols, I don't know about that, but receiving is a different story.

    Background for the uninitiated follows: As it is, right now you can buy a diversity receiver off the shelf, and plug multiple receivers into it. Although this is normally used to use multiple receivers which are all receiving the same signal, simply to get more antennas receiving it to mitigate orientation and blocking issues, there's no reason why it couldn't be different signals even with an off-the-shelf diversity RX as long as your replacements still spoke the same serial protocol. Then you'd put multiple transmit modules into your TX, probably connected to the PPM output if again this is all off-the-shelf, and then you'd bind each RX to a different TX module. In this way you could have e.g. 900 MHz and 2.4 GHz at the same time, and if one band dropped out, the RX would use the other automagically.

    What else could Amazon possibly be doing with this? It's not for providing people with internet access.

    --
    "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
  9. What else and why not? by hackwrench · · Score: 1

    Maybe an enhancement to Wi-Fi, bridging the gap between cellularÂand Wi-Fi.ÂAny sort of trafficÂcan beÂrun over these frequencies, same as any other set of frequencies.

    1. Re:What else and why not? by hackwrench · · Score: 1

      Corrupted spaces brought to you courtesy of Slashdot not handling Unicode properly and the Edge browser.