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Pirate Bay Founder Launches Anonymous Domain Registration Service (torrentfreak.com)

An anonymous reader quotes a report from TorrentFreak: Former Pirate Bay spokesperson and co-founder Peter Sunde has just announced his latest venture. Keeping up his fight for privacy on the Internet, he's launching a new company called Njalla, that helps site operators to shield their identities from prying eyes. The name Njalla refers to the traditional hut that Sami people use to keep predators at bay. It's built on a tall stump of a tree or pole and is used to store food or other goods. On the Internet, Njalla helps to keep people's domain names private. While anonymizer services aren't anything new, Sunde's company takes a different approach compared to most of the competition. With Njalla, customers don't buy the domain names themselves, they let the company do it for them. This adds an extra layer of protection but also requires some trust. A separate agreement grants the customer full usage rights to the domain. This also means that people are free to transfer it elsewhere if they want to.

60 comments

  1. Thanks but no thanks. by OverlordQ · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Just means if the company gets seized, you have no rights to your domain as it's not yours, it's company assets.

    --
    Your hair look like poop, Bob! - Wanker.
    1. Re:Thanks but no thanks. by Captain+Splendid · · Score: 2

      Depends how the trust agreement is structured.

      --
      Linux, you magnificent bastard, I read the fucking manual!
    2. Re:Thanks but no thanks. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Even with an agreement, possession is 9/10 of the law.

      Look at what happened with most of the Bitcoin exchanges (MtGox, etc.) and how people trusted them to be as secure as banks...

    3. Re:Thanks but no thanks. by OrangeTide · · Score: 4, Interesting

      My government (USA) doesn't usually give a shit about contracts and agreements when seizing assets in a criminal copyright case. (most cases are civil, afaik)

      --
      “Common sense is not so common.” — Voltaire
    4. Re:Thanks but no thanks. by gravewax · · Score: 1

      yeah this is the alarm bell that rang in my head to. Basically if the company owns it then any legal or financial situation the company ends up in could result in you losing your domain (not to mention the obvious issue of he could just walk away with them all and onsell them).

    5. Re:Thanks but no thanks. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      What makes you think that the latter is an obvious issue? Do you think it's all an elaborate idea to steal domain names? What makes you think they have no safe-guards in place to transfer all domains to their customers in case it becomes necessary?

    6. Re:Thanks but no thanks. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Depends how the trust agreement is structured.

      no it doesn't. When government or law enforcement seize assets those trust agreements mean jack shit. the domain is a company asset any agreements they entered into with regards to those assets will be secondary to any orders or writs against the company.

    7. Re:Thanks but no thanks. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Now, if you're buying a domain from another entity, you get full control of the domain. Often this involves a domain trust service since you don't typically trust someone selling a domain for profit.

      This is a service for registering a new domain name fully anonymously. The value of the new domain is the (roughly) $15 or so you spend to register the name. An anonymous service like this isn't going to shaft you for the price, because the action would get around and they'd lose any potential for business game. For the sake of a few quick bucks, the whole business would collapse and the reputation of the owner would be shattered. And lest you think the creator of the Pirate Bay has no reputation to protect, be assured he does.

      Assuming this service transfers domain registration controls to you after your anonymous purchase - and not doing so would end this business quickly enough - the domain's irretrievably yours. Of course if it gets seized by a court order you'd have to prove it was yours to get it back... but that sort of thing kind of defies the whole point of registering an anonymous domain.

    8. Re:Thanks but no thanks. by rtb61 · · Score: 1

      It's a fwap. Of course various three letter agencies, around the globe, would not have the slightest qualm about setting up that service and catching all they can or ever extorting some one into setting up that service in order to catch all they can. Shh, I will tell you a secret, when you want to keep a secret, the best idea is not to tell anyone.

      If you feel the need to create an anonymous domain, then create a fake identity and take out a domain name in a lax security country, they wont really care about validating your fake identity, so it just need to be just barely good enough.

      --
      Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
    9. Re:Thanks but no thanks. by gravewax · · Score: 1

      No I don't think it is an elaborate idea to steal domains, but it is an obvious issue as you have zero protection from them doing this and you have no guarantee that even if the current owner is altruistic that some future owner or partner isn't. You are basically placing complete trust in a 3rd party to own and look after your property.

    10. Re:Thanks but no thanks. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hate to break it to you but any service that provides anonymity services owns the domain. That is according to the official rules in the RAA. So, better hope any other privacy service you use doesn't get seized either.

    11. Re:Thanks but no thanks. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      MtGox had nothing to do with the "possession is 9/10" rule. In that case MtGox didn't have possession. The coins were stolen.

    12. Re:Thanks but no thanks. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How can a company get 'seized' in a state of law?

    13. Re:Thanks but no thanks. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      My government (USA) doesn't usually give a shit about contracts and agreements

      FTFY.

    14. Re: Thanks but no thanks. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      But some countries provide better legal protection than others...

    15. Re:Thanks but no thanks. by OrangeTide · · Score: 1

      They seem to care when I violate them.

      --
      “Common sense is not so common.” — Voltaire
    16. Re: Thanks but no thanks. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      NO, very few provide any additional protection for a companies assets, if it was the actual users assets in trust with the company then sure, but that is not the case with the setup they are looking at.

    17. Re:Thanks but no thanks. by somebdy · · Score: 1

      It's possible to own the domain yourself within Njalla. They are mention that on their Twitter https://twitter.com/njal_la/st...

  2. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  3. Not a Bad Idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    Your so-called "argument" could be applied to just about any/every tool or service ever invented that someone somewhere decided to exploit for nefarious reasons.

    1. Re:Not a Bad Idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      OK, so since people are already doing it this new service won't really enable them to do it.

    2. Re:Not a Bad Idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you have a beef with the laws of your government, please address them with your government, but please stop fucking up the internet for the rest of us.

      Thank you :)

    3. Re:Not a Bad Idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Blow a goat.

      Hugs and kisses,

      Juan Epstein

    4. Re: Not a Bad Idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You are saying DNS needs to shut down?

  4. I thought this was what all domain anonymizers did by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Whoever is in the WHOIS is the owner of the domain, per ICANN.

  5. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 1

    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  6. Doesn't matter how the trust agreement is... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    structured, since in order to reclaim your domain you have to deanonymize yourself anyway, defeating the purpose of the whole service.

    Additionally, if your name isn't already tied to the service, you're going to have to tie whatever alias you used to pay and register on their site to your RL name, which might have interesting connotations for either your local penal code, or financial (tax) laws.

    1. Re:Doesn't matter how the trust agreement is... by tattood · · Score: 2

      Legitimate people/companies are not likely going to use this service. The only people that would likely use this are people doing things that are shady, and they don't want it to be traced back to them. If the company (and your domain) gets seized, you would probably rather just let the domain go, and find another way to get a new domain than try to fight to get your domain back and expose your identity.

      --
      WTB [sig], PST!!!
  7. seems rather naive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    As co-founder of The Pirate Bay, Njalla might also get some pirate sites as customers. Since Njalla owns the domain names, this could lead to some pressure from rightsholders, but Sunde isn’t really worried about this.

    “The domain name itself is not really what they’re after. They’re after the content that the domain name points to. So we’re never helping with anything that might infringe on anything anyhow, so it’s a non-question for us,” Sunde says

    Well, except for giving the owners privacy and shielding them from the legal consequences of running a piracy site. If Njalla were taken down by, say, ICE (yeah, yeah US isn't the world police but they've done it before), would all the domains it "owns" be taken down as well?

  8. Same everywhere, nothing new by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Part of ICANN regulations state the person or company who it is registered under owns the domain, so every anonymous domain name registrar operates under same principle.

    It's nice that a recognized person is doing it though who has earned respect and trust by at least me :)

    Also I registered my domain under a fake name, though if you track payments it can be linked to me.

    But still no one really checks for fake names.

  9. The corporate shell and registration requirements by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The problem with public registration requirements is that it puts people at a significant disadvantage compared to corporations. A person is much more exposed by having all the required information from a domain registration accessible in a public database. The only requirements should be that the domain owner can be contacted through the registrar, and that an address where legal documents can be served must be on file and handed over to authorities with a warrant, but none of the information needs to be public. It's not right that I can't have my own email address without also giving everybody my home address if I give them my email address.

  10. Re:Bad Idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    something that would be nice for torrent too:
    a torrent where you can add file after starting to share it.

  11. Re:Bad Idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    en masse

  12. Re:Better Idea :) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    Let me break it down for you...

    1) The MAFIAA has won the clearnet. It is nothing more than whack a mole now. This constant disruption prevents the building of great things. Such as The Pirate Bay index, and the trackers, of old heyday. It's too hard to hide long term on clearnet, and the risks are too high, and it's all about the advertising money now.

    2) The FUTURE of principled p2p filesharing is now moving onto the anonymous encrypted overlay networks (darknets). You can share all your stuff therein 24x365 forever without fear of ever being shutdown. Here's what you need...

    Reliable Storage - ZFS raidz checksums compression etc
    Reliable Computer - ECC memory, you can use Ryzen or Intel Xeon and even some i3's. The Xeons such as E3-127x are very perfomant full featured chips, look them up.
    Reliable OS - FreeBSD, Linux
    Darknet Software - I2P, Phantom, CJDNS, Tor, OnionCat, IPFS, Pond, Ricochet, Zcash, Tox... so many more cool systems out there for you to discover... start your research and usage, build the next great darknet index.
    Ripping Software - cdparanoia, cdda2wav, flac, ffmpeg, etc. Policy: must always share lossless original, except for huge bluray which can be downconverted to dvd-9, then add lossy versions of the original if you have time/space.
    Network Connection - Carve the your one physical pipe into two logical rate limited bandwidth pools, one that you do not use yourself as a user but do dedicate to giving back to the darknet by running a node on it, the other that you use to fileshare on (both upload and download). The giveback pool must be at least 3 times larger than the usage pool, but you can flex into it when it is quiet, use your packet filter qos for that.

    The Darknets await you... :-)

  13. Sorry, not gonna work by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    All the reasons have already been stated. Leave it to say the only real solution is the replacement of DNS with something more peer to peer. The next best thing is to keep a local cache. Trust no one.

    1. Re:Sorry, not gonna work by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is not "insightful", it's just more of the same losing position and fatal games on clearnet.
      Any retarded investigator is going to watch their stack for the IP, and then bust you.

      As the poster said above, the *only* real solution is to *move completely and entirely off of clearnet* and onto the "darknets".

    2. Re:Sorry, not gonna work by Szeraax · · Score: 1

      What about dns that uses a web of trust? For both DNS and ssl validation actually. All you need is a way to seed your cert / dns info and let it get picked up by a few parties. I'm just throwing stuff out here, but is there any way that that could be useful to us in avoiding problems like we have from malicious CA's? I'm looking at you symantec, china, etc.

    3. Re:Sorry, not gonna work by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      NO. If your filesharing scheme resides on clearnet, it's not secure against the MAFIAA. Nothing you dream up with "DNS" "TLS" "web of trust" whatever else will help. Get off clearnet and onto the darknets.

    4. Re:Sorry, not gonna work by Filaar · · Score: 1

      100 % true!

    5. Re:Sorry, not gonna work by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sure would be nice if you posted a journal with instructions on setting up an I2P network

  14. Re:Bad Idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I was thinking of my command and control domains for new ransomware.

  15. Re:The corporate shell and registration requiremen by corychristison · · Score: 2

    The Canadian TLD (.CA) masks personal domain registration information.

    When you register a .CA, you define if you are a business or individual. If it's a business, the information is available to the public via WHOIS, if you register as Personal, the information is not available to the public to search. In the event the domain holder needs to be contacted for legal reasons, the CIRA (Canadian Internet Registration Authority) will hand over the info in compliance with the law.

    This is how all TLD's should be run.

    As a business owner, and Domain Reseller, I have a lot of domain names under my business. The biggest issue I have with it being on public record, is the SPAM e-mails. I get so many SPAM e-mails, I created a special e-mailbox just for my domain names (domains@mybusinessname).

    I'm actually in the process of setting up a special service for my own clients to "mask" just the e-mail addresses on their domain registrations, where I pass it through a spam filter and flag messages before sending them over to the client where it's clear as day that the messages are probably spam. Think of it as an inbound spam filter, but only for domain registrations.

    The worst SPAM is where the spammers claim that your domain name has expired (even if expiration is weeks or months away) and send out fake renewal invoices. I get so many calls from clients wondering why they've received a bill for $200 for a domain name, when they already paid for the registration.

    My goal with this filtering is that anytime something looks like an invoice, I'll inject a big red banner to the email saying this is probably a scam and should simply be discarded.

    Now, you may be thinking "Why not just trash the spam?" Well, according to ICANN and the CIRA (and friends), if you provide an e-mail masking service, ALL messages must be delivered. The whole point of the WHOIS is for users to get in touch with domain owners, and a single false positive would be in violation of the domain registration agreements I am a part of.

    I am currently working to automate this process for my own customers, and may open it up to the public if there is any interest in it from outside users. Depending on message volume, it will be free, or really cheap. Ideally I'd like to offer it to other registrars/resellers to utilize and I would charge them a minuscule fee just to cover my costs.

  16. Re:The corporate shell and registration requiremen by mrbester · · Score: 2

    That's called WHOIS privacy. Shitty registrars charge you through the nose for it. Unreasonable ones charge you once. Good ones don't charge you at all. Excellent ones have it set on as a default. I'm with the latter.

    --
    "Wait. Something's happening. It's opening up! My God, it's full of apricots!"
  17. So, your domain is secret? by OneHundredAndTen · · Score: 1

    That will do wonders to turn your company into an instantly recognizable one.

    1. Re:So, your domain is secret? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Where did you get that from?

  18. Re:Bad Idea by chispito · · Score: 1

    That was my first thought, too, but I'm not sure this will be any easier than using the current slimy registrars.

    --
    The Daddy casts sleep on the Baby. The Baby resists!
  19. Re:Better Idea :) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    And enjoy your no-knock warrant.

  20. Re: I thought this was what all domain anonymizers by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Ya, there's really nothing special here at all. I can sign up for a domain at many legit places, and set my whois to whatever I want. Usually I use "Zoidberg, Phd." and the address of a homeless shelter in a large city where I don't live.

    If I wanted to truly detach myself I'd sign up with a fake name, burner phone number, and prepaid card.

  21. Re:Better Idea :) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Besides that being *exactly* what you get these days for filesharing on clearnet, plus time in solitary and a lifelong sentence and fine,
    You're a useless jackass troll, so get lost.

  22. Re:The corporate shell and registration requiremen by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Watch out for those though. The big catch is that whatever info appears in WHOIS is the official owner of the domain. So by protecting your privacy, you are giving away the official ownership of the domain. This is even the case of the .CA domains given above.

  23. Re:Bad Idea by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You know who would love an anonymous domain service? People who run botnets.

    Also the people who send fraudulent bills, run questionable investment schemes, or other organized all around criminal activity using a web front.

  24. Re:The corporate shell and registration requiremen by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    That's a cute bit of legal trivia, but I wouldn't lose sleep over it. It has no legal basis in the real world. If there is ever any dispute a court will decide who owns what.

  25. Re:The corporate shell and registration requiremen by mrbester · · Score: 1

    Nope. My name is not obfuscated, making me the owner, but my address is and says so on every line. As that results in an invalid address, it cannot be used as proof of any ownership other than mine.

    --
    "Wait. Something's happening. It's opening up! My God, it's full of apricots!"
  26. Re:Bad Idea by infolation · · Score: 1

    Which will result in 'tainted domains' that may not be being used for criminal purposes, but are tainted by association with such a registrar.

    I also wonder when search rankings and suchlike will start to take registrar reputation into account.

  27. Re:Better Idea :) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You did this from your house? What are you? Stoned or stupid? Where are your brains? In your ass? Don't you know anything? It's stupid, man. It's universally stupid.

  28. Re: Venezuela by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Look em up.

  29. Re:The corporate shell and registration requiremen by corychristison · · Score: 1

    This is not true. The Registry still receives your information you submit at the time of registration from the Registrar, to be held in escrow (for law enforcement, or proving who the legal owner of the domain is). They then submit their own information to be placed in the WHOIS database.

    So you are still the real owner, and only the public record (WHOIS database) of the domain is masked with the WHOIS Privacy companies information.

  30. Re:The corporate shell and registration requiremen by corychristison · · Score: 1

    Providing false information on your domain registration is against the registration agreement, and they have every right to terminate your domain name without notice.

    WHOIS privacy services cost what they do for two reasons:
    1) They have a list a mile long of compliance crap they have to keep up on
    2) They are required to forward any messages they receive to the domain owner. This means e-mail, telephone, and postal mail.

    One trick they use to get around this: They set up a shell company in a small foreign country that would cost a lot to call or send postal mail to. E-mail forwarding is easy, and really low cost. This heightens the bar for people to actually try and contact the company behind the domain name to a point where most people and scammers will simply not try.

    They also have to submit your real information to the Registry, where it is held in escrow for situations where law enforcement needs to be involved and only the public WHOIS database receives the privacy protection companies information.

  31. Re:Better Idea :) by somebdy · · Score: 1

    Explains why they have manage to keep thepiratebay.org for 15 years now.