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Italian Police Say Amazon Has Evaded $142 Million of Taxes (reuters.com)

Posted by BeauHD on from the I-don't-know-what-you're-talking-about-officer dept.

An anonymous reader quotes a report from Reuters: Milan tax police have told Amazon they believe the world's largest online retailer has evaded around 130 million euros ($142 million) of taxes in Italy, a source close to the matter said on Friday. The allegedly unpaid taxes refer to the period between 2011 and 2015, when Amazon made revenues of around 2.5 billion euros in Italy, the source said. The tax police's findings have been handed to Milan prosecutors, the source added. Amazon issued a statement denying it had evaded any taxes, and said its profits in Italy, on which taxes are paid, had been low due to its considerable investments in the country.

92 comments

  1. No way! by JustAnotherOldGuy · · Score: 2

    A huge multinational corporation like Amazon is dodging taxes? SAY IT ISN'T SO!

    --
    Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
    1. Re:No way! by Mr+D+from+63 · · Score: 2

      Yup, Italy would be better off without them.

    2. Re:No way! by BarbaraHudson · · Score: 4, Insightful

      If they're not paying taxes, then yes, Italy is better off without them. Let other businesses that are willing to pay taxes fill the void. Otherwise, taxpayers (individual and business) are indirectly subsidizing Amazon because they have to make up the tax revenue shortfall.

      --
      "Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
    3. Re:No way! by Mr+D+from+63 · · Score: 2

      I see you've though it through.

    4. Re:No way! by religionofpeas · · Score: 2

      Let other businesses that are willing to pay taxes fill the void.

      If they are required to pay taxes, someone just needs to collect them. What businesses are willing isn't relevant.

    5. Re: No way! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Insightful

      Italy is not a big or lucrative market anyway. It's not worth it to pay that much in taxes when the population is about to fall below the poverty line. Italians have no money left well before the end of the month and it's not getting better. Best to wait until their economy crashes again and the EU stops trying to save them. After that we can buy the country piecemeal.

    6. Re:No way! by Dogtanian · · Score: 2

      I see you've though it through.

      Looks like she thought it through better than you did with your original pat comment.

      Also looks like your response of would-be smug condescension was an attempt to obscure the fact that (contrary to the implication) you had nothing to come back with.

      --
      "Slashdot - News and Chat Sites Deviant". (Click "homepage" link above for details).
    7. Re: No way! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Italy is not a big or lucrative market anyway.

      Amazon's 2.5 billion Euros of revenue over the period suggests that you have no idea what the hell you're talking about.

    8. Re:No way! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Let other businesses that are willing to pay taxes fill the void

      Not many of those in Italy. Italy are about as much use as Greece, the only difference is that they have better food.

    9. Re: No way! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Italy hasn't received any money from the EU, unfortunately it's actually a net contributor to the EU budget. Plus, in several countries, government debt and the financial conditions of private citizens take very different trajectories, and Italy is a magnificent example of this contrast: Italians have a median net worth per adult of $142,296, the fifth-highest in the world, the third-highest in the EU, and roughly three times bigger than US citizens' ($53,352):
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

      I don't know where you're from, I guess the US, but surely there's a big chance that you're probably a beggar in comparison: are you one of those tens of millions who still have to repay the student loan...?

    10. Re: No way! by K.+S.+Kyosuke · · Score: 4, Informative

      Italy is the size of Russia when it comes to economy. Bigger recently in fact. In the US, it would be comparable to the states of Texas or New York. Which leads to the question...are you on drugs?

      --
      Ezekiel 23:20
    11. Re:No way! by Mr+D+from+63 · · Score: 2

      So you can't possibly imagine how a company can provide economic benefits (and others) beyond simply paying taxes either?

    12. Re:No way! by K.+S.+Kyosuke · · Score: 2

      And you can't possibly imagine that an environment where some companies get away with not paying taxes and other ones don't is deleterious?

      --
      Ezekiel 23:20
    13. Re:No way! by religionofpeas · · Score: 1

      The whole thing would be easily solved by not requiring companies to pay taxes on top of sales and income taxes. Right now, a lot of money is wasted by businesses on finding complicated tax loopholes, and by governments to uncover them.

    14. Re: No way! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Italy is not a big or lucrative market anyway

      That's probably why Amazon has opened two gigantic fulfillment centers there, plus the biggest customer service center in the european continent.

      Plus, you're very ignorant about the Italian economy: their public debt is surely big, mostly because of high tax evasion, but Italy's private families are actually among the richest in the world (see statistics a couple of posts above). I lived there 5 years: almost everyone own the house they live in, credit card and student debts simply don't exist, and while it is true that many young people don't work, most of them simply live off high inheritances (!). Gosh, I wish I was one of them, maybe with a house on the Amalfi coast.

    15. Re:No way! by JustAnotherOldGuy · · Score: 1

      Yup, Italy would be better off without them.

      Well if they're profiting from doing business in Italy but failing to pay their taxes, then YES, I'd say Italy would be better off without this parasitic company who is taking, but not giving back. Why the hell should Amazon get a free ride to use their infrastructure to make money but not pay something back??

      --
      Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
    16. Re:No way! by JustAnotherOldGuy · · Score: 1

      I see you've though it through.

      Yes, I'd say she did. Unlike you.

      --
      Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
    17. Re:No way! by r1348 · · Score: 1

      I used to live 10km from the Amazon warehouse that serves the whole Italy (there's another one being built near Rome now). I talked to many locals who initially thought of it as a great benefit for the zone's unemployment, only to find out that they pay wages lower than what a waiter makes, constantly cheat on extra-time while imposing draconian rules on its workers (counted toilet visits, coffee machines activate only at certain hours...). Of course they actively prevent unionization through sheer mobbing.
      Yet, whenever I asked for an invoice, it came from... Luxembourg. While still applying Italian VAT on the full price (17% vs 22%).
      So yes, the beneficial impact on employment can be absorbed by other market operators (there is a market, after all), while the general public can benefit from a company that doesn't cheat on taxes, while using public infrastructure built with tax money.

    18. Re:No way! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I doubt that would work within the European single market, as Italian consumers can simply order their stuff from amazon.fr and have it shipped to Italy without having to pay import duties or any other additional taxes.

    19. Re: No way! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Italians have a median net worth per adult of $142,296, the fifth-highest in the world, the third-highest in the EU, and roughly three times bigger than US citizens' ($53,352)

      My ex girlfriend could confirm this. She worked as a private wealth manager for the Italian subsidiary of an american bank. It's the most lucrative PWM unit of that bank in europe, and the one with the highest number of clients (you need at least one million in savings to qualify as a PWM client). Most of the clients had "normal" jobs in appearance, even with salaries that would be considered mediocre in the US, and yet they had millions in savings and brokerage accounts, mostly as a result of surprisingly high inheritances.

    20. Re:No way! by Enigma2175 · · Score: 1

      So companies wouldn't have to pay property tax? If that's the case then all property will be owned by companies which then lease it to people and no property tax will be paid. Why would I pay tax if I could easily create a corporation which buys the property and leases it to me at cost? There would be no tax owed by my corporation, since it makes no money and there would be no tax owed by me since I don't own property.

      I'm just trying to point out that in the quest to simplify and remove loopholes you can complicate and create new loopholes.

      --

      Enigma

    21. Re:No way! by Mr+D+from+63 · · Score: 1

      Good points. Thanks. Glad someone at least takes time to think a bit deeper. They do pay wages, and I"m sure taxes are raised on that. How about property taxes? How many of those employees out of work if it weren't for Amazon? How many jobs does Amazon's business displace? All good things to consider. Unfortunately some here just spout stuff without any indication they even thought beyond a reaction. How about access to lower cost products and more choice by the Italian consumer?

      Of course, the structure of the EU is something that complicates matters when it comes to taxes. Luxomberg, for example, pays a lot to the EU overall.

    22. Re:No way! by religionofpeas · · Score: 1

      Get rid of property tax as well.

    23. Re: No way! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Invoice is from Luxemburg, but VAT goes to Italy.

    24. Re:No way! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Either"? So you also can't possibly imagine how a company can provide economic benefits (and others) beyond simply paying taxes? Then why the hell are you trying to argue in favor of Apple?

    25. Re: No way! by dunkelfalke · · Score: 1

      Italy has received a lot of EU money in the past. Them becoming a net payer is a relatively recent occurrence.

      --
      "It's such a fine line between stupid and clever" -- David St. Hubbins, Spinal Tap
    26. Re: No way! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Italy hasn't received any money from the EU, unfortunately it's actually a net contributor to the EU budget. Plus, in several countries, government debt and the financial conditions of private citizens take very different trajectories, and Italy is a magnificent example of this contrast: Italians have a median net worth per adult of $142,296, the fifth-highest in the world, the third-highest in the EU, and roughly three times bigger than US citizens' ($53,352):
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

      I don't know where you're from, I guess the US, but surely there's a big chance that you're probably a beggar in comparison: are you one of those tens of millions who still have to repay the student loan...?

      True, and we can add to this that the first 4 nations in the list, put together, have almost half of the Italian population. Italy is a big and lucrative market.

      And it is also true that Italy is always been a net contributor:
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budget_of_the_European_Union

    27. Re: No way! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Nope, Italy has always been a net contributor to the EU budget, despite what you might have read on some trashy tabloid for obese alcoholics like "die bild". If you can find any EU budget where Italy was a net taker, then post a link (to a credible source).

      And Trump is right on the fact that Italy, France, and others should wake up and follow the UK example and leave the EU and especially the Eurozone. The euro was created to resurrect the derelict german economy of the '90s ("The sick man of europe"), your economy was basically a dead zombie at the time, and both Italy and France could easily outplay your exporters with currency devaluations, now they cannot anymore. That's also why Eurosceptic movements are skyrocketing everywhere except in Germany. What a coincidence.

    28. Re:No way! by Dogtanian · · Score: 2

      So you can't possibly imagine how a company can provide economic benefits (and others) beyond simply paying taxes either?

      You seem to think the onus is on us to guess- and make- your point for you.

      Yes, I suspected that's what you might have been getting at. I had also suspected you might do the usual low-taxation fans' trick of parlaying this into an excuse to argue against taxation in general, using the line that- rather than X having to pay their fair share of taxes, it would- of course- be far more reasonable for their competitors to pay less.

      I've no interest in living in a country like the US, which- relative to the amount of wealth that exists there- still has (e.g.) relatively poor infrastructure and healthcare (#)- because everyone's racing to the bottom to avoid taxation to pay for the facilities they use.

      (#) Horrendously overpriced and broken before, only partially fixed with a compromise system (Obamacare) that was closer to what the Republicans had originally proposed before *they* moved further to the right and smeared it as socialism, now in the process of being broken again. Couldn't give a toss, I don't give there, not my problem.

      --
      "Slashdot - News and Chat Sites Deviant". (Click "homepage" link above for details).
    29. Re: No way! by dunkelfalke · · Score: 1

      Even in the 1990ies the German economy was by far the strongest of the European Union
      http://ec.europa.eu/environmen...
      so you are either a liar or an idiot. Since you have outed yourself as a Trump fanboi, you are probably both.
      as for Italy, here you go
      http://www.money-go-round.eu/C...
      always a net payer my arse.

      --
      "It's such a fine line between stupid and clever" -- David St. Hubbins, Spinal Tap
    30. Re:No way! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yup, Italy would be better off without them.

      We would all be better off without Amazon. They muscle their way into an industry and suck it dry -destroying anyone not large enough to compete. Soon there will only be Amazon and Walmart.

    31. Re: No way! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's not as though Amazon is saving the environment or anything.

      You don't need to defend for-profit companies. It's easier to provide economic benefits when you cheat on tax and have more income. But it's unlikely the benefits you provide will offset the benefits of the taxes

    32. Re: No way! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You read the chart the wrong way, and you don't even know when the EU was actually born. Firstly, the red lines mean that Italy is a net contributor, not taker:
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

      According to your (unkonwn) source you need to go back to 1984 to see something different, except that the "European Union" didn't even exist, it was a simple trade deal called "European Economic Community", with a minuscule budget if compared to today. The EU was actually born in 1993 with the Maastricht Treaty. So, yes: it is demonstrated that Italy has always been a net contributor to the EU (not that this is something to be proud of, it's actually silly).

      Secondly, this is Germany in the '90s:
      http://www.economist.com/node/...

      And this is the german growth rate between 1995 and 1998, just before the eurozone was born. It's lower lower than Italy and France:
      https://www.imf.org/external/p...

      And I'll tell you more, you didn't even make up for the private wealth gap: still today, the Italians, the French, and even the Spaniards have a higher median net worth per capita than the germans:
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

      Can you read those data? You're at the same level as the Greeks! Lol!

      Basically your recent "growth" is based on 4 million, low-cost, 450-euro-per-month "minijobbers". You're basically the european version of China, what a fantastic place to live.

    33. Re:No way! by Mr+D+from+63 · · Score: 0

      You seem to 'suspect' quite a lot. That's what one does when lacking the necessary information.

    34. Re:No way! by Dogtanian · · Score: 1

      You seem to 'suspect' quite a lot. That's what one does when lacking the necessary information.

      Another smug, vaguely insinuating non-response.

      The hypocrisy is brilliant. You respond to someone's post with a snide comment that vaguely wants to suggest that you know better while actually saying nothing. When you get called out on that, you seemed to have expected me to join the dots that didn't even exist and respond to a point that you hadn't made in the first place.

      When I point out what I suspected what you might have been trying to get at, you come back with the comment above.

      Yep. If you want to play silly buggers like that, I am indeed entitled to "suspect" what you might have been getting at, but wouldn't- or rather couldn't- come out and say. That's what one does when lacking the necessary information.

      --
      "Slashdot - News and Chat Sites Deviant". (Click "homepage" link above for details).
    35. Re: No way! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You know that Italy's economy is larger than 49/50 US states, right? Only CA is bigger. They've had some economic problems, but they're in a better shape than most of the US.

    36. Re:No way! by Mr+D+from+63 · · Score: 1

      The only thing I'm 'getting at' is generalized, thoughtless responses. That you've brought completely off topic items about the US and Obamacare into the discussion shows that you can't provide one either.

    37. Re:No way! by Dogtanian · · Score: 1

      The only thing I'm 'getting at' is generalized, thoughtless responses.

      By providing the most content-free, pat answers yourself? Man, you are a satirical genius...

      --
      "Slashdot - News and Chat Sites Deviant". (Click "homepage" link above for details).
    38. Re:No way! by Mr+D+from+63 · · Score: 1

      The shallowness of the comments I was responding to allowed for a simple and obvious analysis.

    39. Re:No way! by BarbaraHudson · · Score: 1

      Well, you can't expect anything more form Mr. D

      Mr. D is a Canadian television series starring comedian Gerry Dee. The series follows the misadventures of an underqualified schoolteacher named Gerry Duncan, nicknamed Mr. D.

      "Under-qualified" is putting it mildly. The guy is a real jerk, always trying to do the least possible, take credit for others work, and is generally a jerk. He's a slacker who aspires to mediocrity. Seems this guy picked the perfect user name. :-)

      --
      "Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
    40. Re:No way! by Dogtanian · · Score: 1

      I guess he *is* a satirical genius then. ;-)

      --
      "Slashdot - News and Chat Sites Deviant". (Click "homepage" link above for details).
  2. Good For Them! by RobotRunAmok · · Score: 0

    My respect for Bezos continues to grow.

    1. Re:Good For Them! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're a moron, this continues to become more obvious.

  3. obligatory by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Mama mia! Dat's a spicey-a meat-a-ball!

    1. Re: obligatory by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Bobbity boopity, bobbity boopitdy!

      Eyah speaka Italian too!

  4. Re:BeauHD, can we get some programming subs? by BarbaraHudson · · Score: 1

    Anonymous coward wrote:

    I'd submit this news myself, but the submission system here is very broken. It says I need to create an account and log in to submit a story, which I refuse to do. I'm not going to create yet another online account just to submit content here to you for free!

    There's a reason you have to create an account - there's already enough bots using dummy accounts to submit spam. Besides, if you don't care enough about it to log in, why should we care what you say?

    --
    "Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
  5. Dear Amazon by fibonacci8 · · Score: 1

    If you're going to steal tax money, you have to have the word "police" somewhere in the name of your business.

    --
    Inheritance is the sincerest form of nepotism.
  6. policing taxes? by v1 · · Score: 1

    here in the usa we have a separate government branch that handles taxes and enforcement, the IRS. (Internal Revenue Service) And that name is usually spoken with a bit of a grind of teeth of course.

    But in Italy... do they really have their police enforcing tax codes?

    What does Amazon have in the way of a "local presence" in Italy to justify taxing them? And what sort of taxes are we talking about here? (do they have like a warehouse or distribution center there? guessing they do, but just confirming) Sales? Income? Property? Capital Gains?

    I suppose the general rule of thumb here is that anytime money changes hands, the government wants to stick their hand in and grab a bit of it, as a means of funding government and public interest in a fair way, but it seems like they go a bit overboard sometime.

    --
    I work for the Department of Redundancy Department.
    1. Re: policing taxes? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The general rule of thumb is if you have made money by trading within a country,you should pay the proper tax in that country,not ship it to Ireland and then to the Caribbean or similar operations to evade paying tax in any "normal" tax regime..

    2. Re:policing taxes? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      here in the usa we have a separate government branch that handles taxes and enforcement, the IRS. (Internal Revenue Service) And that name is usually spoken with a bit of a grind of teeth of course.

      But in Italy... do they really have their police enforcing tax codes?

      It is a dedicated branch, but yes. We have multiple branches that we sum up as "police" for outsiders because we don't want to bother with the details.

      What does Amazon have in the way of a "local presence" in Italy to justify taxing them? And what sort of taxes are we talking about here? (do they have like a warehouse or distribution center there? guessing they do, but just confirming) Sales? Income? Property? Capital Gains?

      The have multiple distribution centers at the least. In Europe you usually pay the VAT on the state where the service or goods are received. So if you sell in Italy to private people you have to pay the Italian VAT.
      If you have a business there are regional and national taxes, and it gets more complicated with online stores, so there are a ton of things they might have to pay.

      I suppose the general rule of thumb here is that anytime money changes hands, the government wants to stick their hand in and grab a bit of it, as a means of funding government and public interest in a fair way, but it seems like they go a bit overboard sometime.

      Well, if you have read the summary you have read the article. There are absolutely no details. It's a bit early to assume good or bad things.

      Reading elsewhere does not give much more details, but:
      * the police started to check because it seems that amazon suddenly registered a jump of 41% in profits in 2016.
      * Amazon seems to hide in luxemburg not to pay taxes.
      * this follows the suit for both google and apple. Apple paid 300M, was asked 900M at the beginning. Google is still in trial, will probably have to pay around 100M out of the 300M originally asked. Both were just the regional tax, probably amazon has the same problem?

    3. Re:policing taxes? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      here in the usa we have a separate government branch that handles taxes and enforcement, the IRS. (Internal Revenue Service) And that name is usually spoken with a bit of a grind of teeth of course.

      But in Italy... do they really have their police enforcing tax codes?

      No, they have a dedicated branch, the GdF (Guardia di Finanza).

    4. Re:policing taxes? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      here in the usa...

      ... and everywhere else in the world evading taxes is supposed to be a felony instead, at least if it goes above a certain sum of money, hence tax evasion cases fall under the jurisdiction of police forces, sometimes specialized ones. That's probably why Amazon can freely evade taxes in the US, while its execs now risk to be jailed in Italy instead.
      Hopefully the US will follow the same example one day.

    5. Re:policing taxes? by K.+S.+Kyosuke · · Score: 1

      It may depend. In my country, there's the tax department under the Ministry of Finance that administers taxes and their collection and also detects irregularities, asks for corrections and optionally fines you, which I guess is similar to your IRS. But there's also a special police department whose purpose is fighting organized tax crime, since the Ministry of Finance officials are no trained crime fighters.

      --
      Ezekiel 23:20
    6. Re: policing taxes? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If the nation in question dislikes it when the law is followed, it's incumbent upon them to fix the frickin' law.

    7. Re:policing taxes? by v1 · · Score: 1

      this follows the suit for both google and apple. Apple paid 300M, was asked 900M at the beginning. Google is still in trial, will probably have to pay around 100M out of the 300M originally asked. Both were just the regional tax, probably amazon has the same problem?

      Seems to be yet another case of "We made these tax loopholes to attract foreign business. Now look at all this growth in business that's resulted! Hey wait a minute, you're not paying as much tax, that's cheating!"

      No, you wrote the law that way to attract them, and so they came exactly as you had hoped. You just didn't think about the consequences.

      It's like those idiots that want their taxes lowered, and then complain about the drop in social services that result in the drop in taxes. You made your own bed, now time to shut up and lie in it.

      --
      I work for the Department of Redundancy Department.
  7. Avoidance vs. Evasion by gnasher719 · · Score: 4, Informative

    Just so that everyone knows: "Tax avoidance" is anything that allows you to pay less taxes that is _legal_. "Tax evasion" is anything that allows you to pay less taxes that is _illegal_.

    With tax avoidance, the worst that can happen is that the tax office changes what you have to pay. You cannot be prosecuted for tax avoidance. With tax evasion, you can go to jail. Here the claim is "tax evasion".

    Well, that is assuming that whoever translated it from Italian got it right. There have been plenty of cases where things just get reported wrong.

    1. Re:Avoidance vs. Evasion by bsolar · · Score: 1

      With tax avoidance, the worst that can happen is that the tax office changes what you have to pay. You cannot be prosecuted for tax avoidance. With tax evasion, you can go to jail.

      In Italy you cannot have a penal prosecution for tax avoidance, but you can incur in administrative sanctions on top of having to pay back the "avoided" taxes.

      The accusation is of tax evasion, not avoidance.

      Well, that is assuming that whoever translated it from Italian got it right. There have been plenty of cases where things just get reported wrong.

      Reports are correct. Note that in Italy in the recent past there has been a crack down on big companies allegedly evading taxes, with similar accusations to Google and Apple. The accusation is basically to having omitted to report revenues to the tax authority.

      Not sure about the case against Google, but Apple was on the hook for about 800 millions and after a negotiation settled the case by paying around 320 millions.

    2. Re:Avoidance vs. Evasion by dryeo · · Score: 1

      The problem is that the line between tax avoidance and tax evasion is fuzzy and often takes a court ruling to decide along with appeals etc. It becomes easier and safer for both the government and business to compromise with the business, for example, just paying a third.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
  8. Re:BeauHD, can we get some programming subs? by PopeRatzo · · Score: 1

    I'm not going to create yet another online account just to submit content here to you for free!

    Wait a minute. You're complaint is that you don't want to submit content for free but you want more articles about an open source programming language?

    You might want to think that through.

    --
    You are welcome on my lawn.
  9. Pay up, 2nd-richest-man-in-the-world Bezos. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    No wonder he's almost the richest man in the world -- he steals money that might have gone to roads, schools, hospitals, all the things that might improve society.

    In every fortune is a story of a thief.

    1. Re:Pay up, 2nd-richest-man-in-the-world Bezos. by K.+S.+Kyosuke · · Score: 1

      he steals money that might have gone to roads

      "What have the Americans ever done to us?"

      "Uh...roads?"

      "No, we built those.

      --
      Ezekiel 23:20
  10. Fuck Bozos by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Think of all the small book stores in remote locations just barely able to pay their bills. Bezos Amazon like Jobs Apple are ruining the economy. Abusing robot and automation virtues on the side, they dont push payroll like a homegrown American business but saccerate and leach like an alien race.

    How long before is cheaper to buy books delivered by gravity from manufacture in outer space because that is what will shutdown the drone developments: celestial bombardment of products not even Cina can tolerate.

    It isnt just Amazon being a problem: it is the United States Postal Service and the Postmaster General misusing the Post Office and not asserting Customs and Tariffs.

    Amazon needs to be put in a bag and thrown back in the river from a bridge.

    1. Re:Fuck Bozos by hughbar · · Score: 1

      Agree mainly. I try to minimise my purchases from Amazon now and use: http://www.hive.co.uk/ as I'm in the UK. But since I'm a Londoner and a mature student, I use Foyles and Waterstones, big central London bookshops and some of the smaller independents.

      What people forget is that taxes pay for roads, a legal system, education etc. all the things that make Amazon viable. Also, we'll all be very sad when the word 'store' drops from our vocabularies and is replaced with 'Amazon'. They are already gaming prices: https://www.propublica.org/art... suggesting that something called 'abuse of dominant position' is probably operating.

      As Nancy Reagan said 'Just say no'.

      --
      On y va, qui mal y pense!
  11. Silly Italy by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Corporations dont pay taxes!

  12. Shutup Jeff! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    There are non-taxable events and taxable events.

    If there is no tax then it isnt an avertion.

  13. Credibility flag by paiute · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Any story which begins "The Italian Police say..." is off to a bad start.

    --
    If Slashdot were chemistry it would look like this:Cadaverine
    1. Re:Credibility flag by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes, and why are the police responsible for collecting taxes? I would have expected to read that the Italian government says Amazon is evading not taxes.

    2. Re:Credibility flag by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah, it's a mistranslation, police in this case it's a broad word, specifically it was "Guardia di Finanza", the armed branch of the Economy and Finance's Ministry.

    3. Re:Credibility flag by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Said somebody from the very country whose LEAs are universally considered a laughing stock worldwide (e.g., the OJ Simpson case, no bankers jailed after Lehman, etc...).

    4. Re:Credibility flag by bsolar · · Score: 2

      In Italy, that's the whole point of the Guardia di Finanza, which is a military police force working under the Minister of Economy and Finance with the specific goal of dealing with financial crimes. They are not responsible for tax collection, but definitely for tax evasion investigations.

      Not to be confused with the Polizia di Stato (State Police), which is the Italian civil police force working under the Minister of Interior dealing with law enforcement in general.

    5. Re:Credibility flag by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You know, in civilized countries tax evasion, when above a certain sum, is supposed to be a felony, hence it (also) falls under the jurisdiction of police forces. That's pretty normal everywhere in the world except where you live.

    6. Re:Credibility flag by K.+S.+Kyosuke · · Score: 1

      It's not actually the police; it's the gendarmerie, if I'm not mistaken.

      --
      Ezekiel 23:20
    7. Re:Credibility flag by Frosty+Piss · · Score: 1

      That's France.

      --
      If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
    8. Re:Credibility flag by K.+S.+Kyosuke · · Score: 1

      Italy has its own gendarmerie.

      --
      Ezekiel 23:20
    9. Re:Credibility flag by bongey · · Score: 0

      Yep there was that whole Amanda Knox case that turned out just to be wanting to get the evil American.

    10. Re:Credibility flag by bsolar · · Score: 1

      Amanda Knox was only one of the suspects, together with Raffaele Sollecito (Italian, acquitted) and Rudy Guede (Ivorian, convicted). A judicial mess might have been, but it doesn't seem "wanting to get the evil American" to me.

    11. Re:Credibility flag by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      Yes but a story ending with "a corporation dodged taxes" is instantly a credible conclusion. Really I don't know what to believe right now. I'm so conflicted.

    12. Re:Credibility flag by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You mean: the girl who falsely accused somebody else of killing the person that she was accused of murdering? And who was later acquitted because of a report by a technical consultant who had previously worked for several US organizations? She should thank the Italian judicial system for being too lenient and pedant in requiring excessive evidence for an obvious conviction. In the US she would have probably already been executed.

    13. Re:Credibility flag by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Leave big corps alone, you Italian bullies! They can't defend themselves without Slashdot commentators taking their side.

  14. Read between the lines by Harold+Halloway · · Score: 1, Troll

    What the Italian police actually meant to say is, "Amazon have evaded $142m of taxes and failed to pay the necessary sweeteners, backhanders and protection money that is traditional in Italy."

    1. Re:Read between the lines by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well the Jeffster and his cronies want to live in a socialist paradise, they have to pay for it. EU countries have no problem destroying companies who don't pay up.

      Until the money runs out and the demographics shift in the next few decades. The punishments will get more severe.

    2. Re: Read between the lines by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It sounds like the Italians made an offer that Amazon COULD refuse.

    3. Re:Read between the lines by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Somebody from the US tries to lecture other countries on ethics. You're probably too stupid to realize that this, by itself, without (further) punchlines, would be a successful joke in any stand-up comedy show outside the US.

  15. This is how you make money by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Yep, this is how you make money these days as a company. You find ways to avoid taxes, no matter if its cooking the books, using tax evasion or simply finding ways to hide profits. Whats funny about a Amazon or Apple doing this, is they both appear to make huge piles of money so its not like they cannot pay the taxes. They just choose not to.

  16. Think before you deal by Neuronwelder · · Score: 1

    If Italy was smart, it would have gotten a percentage of the shipping and handling charges.

  17. revenues are not profits by udachny · · Score: 0

    I am 100% against every form of income and wealth taxation and redistribution, but if we set that aside this so called 'article' claims that Amazon "made revenues of around 2.5 billion euros in Italy", well revenues are *not profits*. The taxes are not paid on revenues (revenues are income before covering the expenses). What were the *profits*?

    --
    MY OTHER COMMENTS
  18. Government wants to steal more money, film at 11 by zephvark · · Score: 1

    Seriously. The Government is whining again that it doesn't get enough taxes through tariffs, income, sales taxes, property taxes, death taxes... any money you've ever made has already been taxed a dozen times over, and they'll tax you again when you try to spend it.

    Fuck the government and the airhead assholes who support this bullshit. Fuck them with a corkscrew. Never say "we". "We" are not a people, not a country, and "we" don't appreciate having our wages stolen for random bullshit. Fuck off.

    Don't fuck Trump supporters. I expect they're easy, but dudes. condoms on and run away.

  19. STFU Jeff by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    thatisright, stfu you!

    there needstobe a tax owed first. if an activity or event is taxable then I dont do it! Nothing owed isnot avoided.

  20. Dguss essay Gnu? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    bnoo. bn. bnooo. gnooo. ah! GNoo! ..!

    GNU!
    jus shay GNU. GNU.