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Dozens of Recent Clinical Trials May Contain Wrong or Falsified Data, Claims Study (theguardian.com)

John Carlisle, a consultant anesthetist at Torbay Hospital, used statistical tools to conduct a review of thousands of papers published in leading medical journals. While a vast majority of the clinical trials he reviewed were accurate, 90 of the 5,067 published trials had underlying patterns that were unlikely to appear by chance in a credible dataset. The Guardian reports: The tool works by comparing the baseline data, such as the height, sex, weight and blood pressure of trial participants, to known distributions of these variables in a random sample of the populations. If the baseline data differs significantly from expectation, this could be a sign of errors or data tampering on the part of the researcher, since if datasets have been fabricated they are unlikely to have the right pattern of random variation. In the case of Japanese scientist, Yoshitaka Fuji, the detection of such anomalies triggered an investigation that concluded more than 100 of his papers had been entirely fabricated. The latest study identified 90 trials that had skewed baseline statistics, 43 of which with measurements that had about a one in a quadrillion probability of occurring by chance. The review includes a full list of the trials in question, allowing Carlisle's methods to be checked but also potentially exposing the authors to criticism. Previous large scale studies of erroneous results have avoided singling out authors. Relevant journal editors were informed last month, and the editors of the six anesthesiology journals named in the study said they plan to approach the authors of the trials in question, and raised the prospect of triggering in-depth investigations in cases that could not be explained.

66 comments

  1. Study May Contain Wrong or Falsified Data, by fustakrakich · · Score: 1

    claims another study

    Authors of the first study were promptly sacked

    --
    “He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
    1. Re: Study May Contain Wrong or Falsified Data, by KGIII · · Score: 1

      I have been out of academia since the very early 1990s. My publications, those that went on to peer review and journal publications, are not nearly as numerous as the guy listed. No, he's a whole order of magnitude more prolific than I.

      Which makes me kinda giggle. How the hell does he even have that many publications?!?

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
    2. Re: Study May Contain Wrong or Falsified Data, by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think that when someone has too many publications, that is a red flag.

    3. Re: Study May Contain Wrong or Falsified Data, by fustakrakich · · Score: 2

      How the hell does he even have that many publications?!?

      Probably doing a study on the effects of amphetamines.

      --
      “He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
  2. Is anyone surprised? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    There are lots of TV commercials from law firms advertising class action lawsuit settlements from the side effects of drugs. Is it surprising to see so many dangerous drugs and treatments if there's so much dishonesty in the testing process?

    1. Re:Is anyone surprised? by breagerey · · Score: 1

      1.7% is "so much dishonesty" ?

    2. Re:Is anyone surprised? by Dunbal · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Those are only the ones that are easy to prove fake. There has been a lot of research over the years whose results simply cannot be reproduced even in an identical experiment. Big Pharma has been caught red handed several times now - at one point even publishing their studies in their own "peer review" magazine.

      --
      Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
  3. Thanks for that! by ls671 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Thanks for that! Now I can use that tool to generate data for my upcoming fabricated studies.

    --
    Everything I write is lies, read between the lines.
    1. Re:Thanks for that! by digitig · · Score: 1

      Well, JBS Haldane showed this technique for exposing fraud in 1939, so it's not revealing anything smart fraudsters wouldn't already know. A lot of the anomalies (though not necessarily all) are probably down to carelessness rather than fraud.

      --
      Quidnam Latine loqui modo coepi?
    2. Re: Thanks for that! by KGIII · · Score: 1

      LOL If you're gonna put that much effort into it, you might just as well do the damned study.

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
    3. Re: Thanks for that! by DickBreath · · Score: 1

      Using a tool to generate fake test subject stats is not a lot of effort. Therefore it must be innovation. A computer saving human labor. Something to be encouraged.

      --

      I'll see your senator, and I'll raise you two judges.
  4. "90 of the 5,067" by Nutria · · Score: 4, Insightful

    That's... less than 2%. Naturally, we want it to be 0%, but 1.8% is nothing to generate scare headlines over.

    --
    "I don't know, therefore Aliens" Wafflebox1
    1. Re:"90 of the 5,067" by hey! · · Score: 3, Funny

      You stole the words right from my mouth: 90/5067? That's significant at the p < 0.02 level!

      --
      Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
    2. Re:"90 of the 5,067" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ssshhhh, we're busy creating hysteria over a phantom problem to distract everybody from the increase in the Chocolate Ration due to the war with EastAsia.

    3. Re:"90 of the 5,067" by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 5, Insightful

      That's... less than 2%. Naturally, we want it to be 0%, but 1.8% is nothing to generate scare headlines over.

      They only caught the dumb ones. It would have been easy to generate fake data that fits a known distribution. For instance, in Python, just use numpy.random.normal instead of numpy.random.uniform.

      The 2% is just the floor. The actual fraud and/or incompetence rate is likely higher.

    4. Re:"90 of the 5,067" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Clickbait aside, I support investigating these 90 cases of suspected fraud. The fact that the suspicious studies are all related to medicine does not make this less urgent.
      In an ideal world all studies would be repeated by multiple independent teams for confirmation, but the remaining 4977 ones will probably be given low priority in reality.

      On a sidenote, /. seems not to like the HTML code for a non-breaking space.

    5. Re:"90 of the 5,067" by SharpFang · · Score: 5, Informative

      Seems like artifact of randomness - Prosecutor's Fallacy.

      Yes, some will be genuine falsifications. But some WILL be genuine results.

      You write a paper on a list of 1000 tosses of a coin, noting each result. The chance for the coin to land on edge in one toss is around 1 in 100,000.

      Then your paper is reviewed along with 100,000 others. If you have the coin land on edge more than once in your dataset, it's flagged as a falsified dataset.

      Roughly 10 papers in the 100,000 tested flagged as falsified will be false positives.

      ------

      Statistical results are subject to the same randomness as single tests contributing to these results. The scale of the randomness is reduced by a factor related to the number of tests, but still exist. And take enough correctly obtained statistical results, and you WILL find outliers.

      --
      45 5F E1 04 22 CA 29 C4 93 3F 95 05 2B 79 2A B2
    6. Re:"90 of the 5,067" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      This sort of effect is always a concern. But, per TFS, they found 43 trials in which the "measurements that had about a one in a quadrillion probability of occurring by chance". Unless there were a quadrillion trials (unlikely), the Prosecutor's Fallacy isn't relevant here.

    7. Re:"90 of the 5,067" by digitig · · Score: 1

      Some of the ones that fail the 1 in 10,000 test are quite possibly an effect of randomness, although 82 out of 5015 is a much higher failure rate than would be expected. And 43 of those 5015 having a probability of less than 1 in 10^15 really isn't a plausible random artefact.

      --
      Quidnam Latine loqui modo coepi?
    8. Re:"90 of the 5,067" by Dunbal · · Score: 1

      Those are the ones easily caught. There are bound to be more. How many turds do you want to see in the punchbowl before you stop wanting to drink punch?

      --
      Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
    9. Re:"90 of the 5,067" by joneil · · Score: 2

      One other thing to consider.
      I am a funeral director. I see deaths first hand from medical mistakes and malpractice. In fact, I only see that "2%".
      You know that old joke "an undertaker is somebody who cleans up the doctor's mistakes"? Well, more truth to it than you might want to know.

        So, for all you people who say "it's only 2%", you come, sit with me when I deal with a family who has had a death because they were part of that "2%". You look them in the eyes, and say" hey, science is still good, it is less than 2%".

      Or better yet - when one you who thinks 2% is nothing, when one of your family members has a serious issue or dies, you look yourself in the mirror and say "hey, it's okay, it was still below 2%."

      Maybe OT, but it's like my uncle the aircraft mechanic used to say "5% or 2% doesn't sound like much, until you are 10,000 in the air and you suddenly find out your service tech on the engine of the airplane only got 90% of the rebuild done correctly."

       

    10. Re: "90 of the 5,067" by KGIII · · Score: 1

      Huh... Thanks. I'd never read/seen that fallacy. In my defense, I was on the debate team at the collegiate level, but this fallacy was coined more recently than my experiences in said team. Yeah, I'm that old...

      Anyhow, I am trying to wrap my head around it.

      The odds of winning without cheating at 1:1000.
      The odds of winning with cheating are 1:100.
      They won, ergo the most probable reason for their winning was they cheated. Which, while true, doesn't actually mean that they cheated - it just means someone doesn't understand statistics and probability. Thus, the assumption that the win was because of cheating is fallacious.

      Am I understanding that properly?

      I am also pretty sure this is covered by another formal fallacy classification but, for the life of me, the name escapes me at the moment.

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
    11. Re:"90 of the 5,067" by Nutria · · Score: 2

      See, or... statistically estimate?

      --
      "I don't know, therefore Aliens" Wafflebox1
    12. Re:"90 of the 5,067" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Unless the actual distribution (as opposed to the theoretical distribution to which the data were compared) has a fat tail. In that case, the problem isn't the data, it's the statistical test.

    13. Re: "90 of the 5,067" by SharpFang · · Score: 1

      Yes. It's a good heuristic to point out suspects for more thorough tests (which may be too expensive to conduct on the whole statistic base) but it isn't a proof by itself.

      --
      45 5F E1 04 22 CA 29 C4 93 3F 95 05 2B 79 2A B2
    14. Re:"90 of the 5,067" by AK+Marc · · Score: 1

      You can't fake the expected results if you use a RNG. Also, RNGs don't generate Normal results. They generate random results. Most real-world "random" events are not "random", but are "normal". So a computer-generated RNG would fail to make reasonable results. That would be obvious to anyone who has faked a result. You need to overlay a normal distribution on your RNG. It's easier to just guess results, using your brain as both the RNG and normal distribution.

      The good frauds can't be caught. The bad ones are usually obvious, and only pass because nobody looks that hard.

    15. Re:"90 of the 5,067" by TechyImmigrant · · Score: 2

      >You can't fake the expected results if you use a RNG
      Yes you can.

      >Also, RNGs don't generate Normal results.
      They most certainly can. Look up the Box Muller method or the Ziggurat algorithm.

      >They generate random results.
      If the designer knew what he or she was doing. Usually they don't.

      >Most real-world "random" events are not "random", but are "normal".
      That depends on how you measure it. Poisson distributions are an example of something you can force by choosing your measurement method.

      >So a computer-generated RNG would fail to make reasonable results.
      A computer properly programmed is quite capable of generating any of the usual distributions you desire and the result will be statistically indistinguishable from other data conforming to the same distribution.

      >You need to overlay a normal distribution on your RNG.
      See above. Box Muller and Ziggurat.

      > It's easier to just guess results, using your brain as both the RNG and normal distribution.
      No it isn't. Humans are awful RNGs.

      --
      I should use this sig to advertise my book ISBN-13 : 978-1501515132.
    16. Re:"90 of the 5,067" by Xylantiel · · Score: 1

      It also seems like poorly constructed samples might fail this test, so it is possible that some fraction of the 43 are not intentional fraud, but just poor science. My impression is that it can be tricky to construct a good sample for a lot of medical studies, so it's not surprising that some of them are imperfect. I can also think of situations where correctly constructed samples might fail this test, but it's possible that the analysis is accounting for that.

    17. Re:"90 of the 5,067" by Obfuscant · · Score: 1

      Most real-world "random" events are not "random", but are "normal".

      And when you are doing a clinical trial on some potential new drug, your test population is never "random" or "normal". It is selected for the disease or condition that you are trying to fix. It will not be unusual for 100% of test population to have a BMI of 50 when you're testing a new diet drug for significantly overweight people, for example. The fact that a very large proportion of those same people will also have high blood pressure and high cholesterol is not unusual, it is to be expected. And oh, my, an unusual percentage of them also have diabetes.

      In fact, if you find a drug trial that IS completely random in baseline characteristics, THAT would be the fraud.

    18. Re:"90 of the 5,067" by alvinrod · · Score: 1

      It's trivial to get an RNG to generate normally distributed results by applying the central limit theorem. Consider generating a random number between 1 and 10. Run it 100,000 times and track the results and you'll have a uniform distribution, or should unless your RNG is terrible. Instead of doing that, generate 10 random numbers and take the average (which will always be a number between 1 and 10) and record that, then repeat that 100,000 times. You end up with a normal distribution. You can write the code to do it yourself if you don't believe me.

    19. Re: "90 of the 5,067" by alvinrod · · Score: 2

      Not quite, because knowing the odds of winning with cheating by itself says nothing. It's like having over one thousand people play, but always concluding that the winner cheated because the odds that they could win (.1%) are so small that they must have cheated, without considering that when you have that many people playing, even though the odds of winning are individually low, there are enough people to make it likely that at least one person wins.

      If you do a binomial calculation with .1% chance of success it only takes 693 people playing before there's a 50% chance of seeing at least one winner. The fallacy is mistakenly believing that it's 99.9% likely that a person cheated to win instead of something much, much smaller if we use your 1:100 odds of winning with cheating above. Even if cheating guarantees a win, then it's still only 50% likely at most (remember with 693 people all playing fair, we expect at least one winner 50% of the time) so you're basically convicting on a coin flip. Now if on the other hand there's a lot of other evidence to suggest that a person cheated, then it can valid to use the low likelihood of success in support of that other evidence. But if there's absolutely nothing else to support a claim of cheating, then it isn't reasonable to assume a person cheated based on low likelihood of individual success when there are a large number of players.

    20. Re:"90 of the 5,067" by quantaman · · Score: 1

      Seems like artifact of randomness - Prosecutor's Fallacy.

      Yes, some will be genuine falsifications. But some WILL be genuine results.

      You write a paper on a list of 1000 tosses of a coin, noting each result. The chance for the coin to land on edge in one toss is around 1 in 100,000.

      Then your paper is reviewed along with 100,000 others. If you have the coin land on edge more than once in your dataset, it's flagged as a falsified dataset.

      Roughly 10 papers in the 100,000 tested flagged as falsified will be false positives.

      You're assuming the authors of the study weren't very good at stats.

      If their standard for false data was 2/1000 coins landing on edge then yes, they got false positives.

      If their standard was 100/1000 coins landing on their edge then I'm pretty sure those data sets were wrong.

      --
      I stole this Sig
  5. This how the medical cartel... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    controls is. They refuse to allow new drugs and procedures to be used.

    1. Re:This how the medical cartel... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They refuse to allow new drugs and procedures to be used.

      ... until their old patents expire and they have new patents on the new ones.

    2. Re: This how the medical cartel... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well Trump destroy science about twenty-two years ago.

  6. Considering how the medical cartel... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    hates this people, this is no surprise. They always stand against medical advances since it hurts their profits.

  7. Outlier data by Vitriol+Angst · · Score: 3, Interesting

    So 90 of the 5,067 were outlier-like data and this is concluding results on these outliers.

    I knew that publish or perish was ruining science, but this is actually the most heartening news I've heard of its credibility.

    I've learned that less than 1.8% of these studies used non-extreme crazy data. My faith in science is restored!

    --
    >>"ad space available -- low rates!!!"
    1. Re:Outlier data by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The interesting scientific advances come from unexpected sources, though. By ruling out the "extreme" results we're probably ignoring meaningful advances.

    2. Re:Outlier data by Gilgaron · · Score: 1

      Well you wouldn't have to rule them out, so much as identify studies that could use replication studies better. Although clearly incentivizing replication studies is needed, as well.

  8. Only in Clinical studies ..... by sl149q · · Score: 0, Troll

    It is fortunate that fraud (or incompetence) like this never occurs in other areas. For example think of the implications of this happening in Climate Science papers and studies. Luckily we can trust those implicitly, especially the model based ones.

    1. Re:Only in Clinical studies ..... by religionofpeas · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Luckily we can trust those implicitly, especially the model based ones.

      Trust is not required. Full source code and input data is available for your inspection and verification.

    2. Re:Only in Clinical studies ..... by quantaman · · Score: 2

      It is fortunate that fraud (or incompetence) like this never occurs in other areas. For example think of the implications of this happening in Climate Science papers and studies. Luckily we can trust those implicitly, especially the model based ones.

      Because when confronted with the evidence that 90/5,067 studies in one field (likely) contain fabricated data the obvious implication is that an entire field is fabricated?

      Your conspiracy theory seems to be missing a few steps.

      --
      I stole this Sig
    3. Re:Only in Clinical studies ..... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Full source code and input data is available for your inspection and verification.

      I don't know which scientists you listen too, but the last time I heard from those they refused to share exactly that because of "reasons".

      I lost my believe in climate "science" when that "science" seemed to consist of <strike>trumming up</strike> extrapolating lots of measuring stations from a handfull, and <strike>doctoring</strike> adjusting decades old old data to <strike>conform with the expected results</strike> make up for differencess in the used measuring equipment.

      And for the record, I cannot say if the percieved climate change is in any way significant and/or deviates from a normal, but I do know that unknowingly/unwillingly tailoring data to match a certain preconception (or worse, doing it consiously to generate money to fill ones pockets) is an long-existing and known problem (hence the existance of double-blind tests -- too bad they are not applicable here).

    4. Re:Only in Clinical studies ..... by religionofpeas · · Score: 1

      I don't know which scientists you listen too, but the last time I heard from those they refused to share exactly that because of "reasons".

      I bet that "last time you heard" was a while ago ? https://www.newscientist.com/a...

    5. Re:Only in Clinical studies ..... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ah yes, because 1.8% of studies are bogus, clearly the consensus view in a totally different field is bogus too.

      Doesn't it make you think that it might be more likely that the few percent of climate scientists who push the "everything is fine" hypothesis of climate invulnerability (whilst being funded by shady groups with an interest in perpetuating fossil fuel use) might be the ones who are using wonky data?

      I'm not saying that scientific consensus is always right; in my field (geology) the idea of plate tectonics was ridiculed for decades until cut-and-dried evidence was presented. It's now universally accepted and one of the cornerstones of the field. The thing is that as scientists we were able to examine the evidence, test it, and admit we were wrong. That is true of every branch of physical science I have worked with.

      I make computer models of fault zones as part of my work. I'm very clear that they have limited predictive power when it comes to specific events (I cannot predict when an earthquake will happen). but I can say that certain conditions will make one more or less likely, and how and where to build structures that are less likely to fall down.

      I've not spent a lot of time digging into climatology, but I'm pretty certain it's not a scam. Few climatologists aren't getting rich or famous through their work (it isn't a particularly well-funded branch of science), and they all seem to agree that global warming is a real, man-made effect. They disagree vehemently on mechanisms, contributions of different causes, predicted of change, likelihood of positive/negative feedback triggers and so on and so forth, but that's to be expected: the reason why we research stuff is because there are a lot of unknowns.

      Even to a relative layman, however, it's easy to see that if you mess with one part of a chaotic system that is in relative equilibrium (like the Earth), you're likely to see widespread short-term changes. You can get "run away" events that permanently alter the character of a system, but even if it's oscillatory and eventually settles down to a new equilibrium not too far from this one, it would be very bad for anything in that system requiring stable conditions (e.g. plants, animals, us). It's a bear that we keep poking, and we really don't have to: the alternatives are good enough that we can make them work, if we just ignore those voices focused on quarterly profits rather than quaternary extinction events.

    6. Re: Only in Clinical studies ..... by KGIII · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Hmm...

      I am not a climate scientist. I am a retired scientist. What did I do? I modeled traffic. As strange as it might sound, there is a lot of similarity between the two. I will try to give some history, as it may help this make more sense. Sorry for the lack of brevity.

      In my case, I helped bring traffic modeling to the age of computers. In this process, it was learned that you could improve the model results, significantly, by increasing the amount of data available. Even seemingly trivial things can impact throughput. Simple things, such as signage fonts, can impact throughput. Even the frequency of lane markings, reflectivity of lane markings, and coloration all have an impact on throughput.

      To try to put this in perspective, I was working with data sets in the full TB size, before the turn of the century. We did distributed computing, before it even really had a name.

      Why is that important?

      Well, traffic is a bit like climate. It is a chaotic system. To be clear, a chaotic system is not a system that is random. It appears random but, with more data, you can tease out patterns and make deterministic predictions based on a variety of variables, with some levels of consistency and success.

      I am not suggesting, for the record, that the climate science models are 100% accurate. In fact, they have confidence ratings. That goes underreported, but they will tell you how confident they are in the results.

      Anyhow, that's besides the point. I just want to make it clear and avoid confusion.

      What is important is that you have to massage the data. You have to make corrections to the data. You have to remove outliers.

      See, we'd collect data and then run it against the models. We'd compare the model output with what was really happening. Sometimes, the results are pretty close. This means you can have greater confidence in the results. Sometimes, it isn't even remotely close.

      At that point, you usually start by poking at the model itself. However, you will also poke at the data. You will throw some of that data right into the trash. You will normalize the numbers, and adjust the impact factor. You will also probably swear, like a lot. You will invent whole new languages, just to swear in them.

      Either way, you will massage that data until you get the results that most closely match reality. You take existing data and run your models to see how well they match reality. When you get it to the point where you're confident, you use those methods to make predictions about the future, given new variables. This will have varied confidence levels, and pinpoint accuracy isn't expected by anyone versed in the science.

      The truth is, you can model all you want but some drunk guy is still going to drive, in reverse, the wrong direction down a one way street. So, you only have so much confidence in the predictions.

      The whole point is, you have to massage the data. If you don't, you get horrible results that don't match reality. The expected outcome isn't certainties. The expected outcome is predictions for which you can assign a confidence level.

      I suspect part of the problem is poor communication and bad journalism. I've taken some time to examine the models, methods, and reasons. I am not a climate scientist, but I have taken a reasonable amount of time to study it in a scholastic manner. You can download their data AND their models, for free, and run them yourself. You can massage that data any way you want, too. You can apply all the adjustments you want and run the models yourself - for just the cost of hardware you already own and electricity.

      Anyhow, I hope this clears a few things up. Correcting and massaging data is pretty normal. It's pretty much required, if you want meaningful results. I am pretty sure the uncorrected data sets are also available. You can get so many data sets, for free. They'll even give you the models. Hell, they'll even give you the source code for the models.

      I do want to make it clear, the goal isn't a perfect pre

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
    7. Re: Only in Clinical studies ..... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hold on. If a drunk guy driving in reverse the wrong way down a one-way street appears in the actual data but you massage it out, are you really getting a model that more closely reflects "reality"? It more closely reflects your preconceived ideas of reality, but drunk guys do happen in reality. If that is how climate science is done, your explanation weakens my trust in their models.

    8. Re: Only in Clinical studies ..... by ventsyv · · Score: 2

      Not OP but I'll give you a better example. Let's say you are processing the temperature data of all of the US over 20 years, tens of thousands of weather stations with multiple readings per day. It's likely that some of those malfunction every now and then. How do you know which readings are correct and which are not? Well you can eliminate the outliers. You take an area and you look at the temperature readings - if they are all around 75F plus or minus 3 degrees, but you have one that's showing 90F, there is pretty good change that one station is busted. That's exactly how they deal with the urban island effect. Temperature readings in cities are higher due to high area of pavement/concrete, so instead they use the readings from a rural area nearby. In the end you don't care about the ups and downs, you smooth those over and you look at direction of the average. I

    9. Re: Only in Clinical studies ..... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I simply am pointing out that adjusting the inputs is very, very common.

      Yes, it is. Some of the data will be so out-of-whack that you can almost be certain that some kind of measurment error is involved. That is the kind of data you're expected to remove from further processing.

      But its a bit different to adjust all measurements done with old equipment a bit up, because that way they better correlate with the ones gotten from the newer equipment. Especially when the change is less than the error deviation of the old equipment (in other words: little-to-no certainty that the change is (f)actually correct). Double-plus suspicious when that change is more-or-less in the same order of the change-in-temperature-over-the-years they try to prove in the first place.

      Correcting and massaging data is pretty normal. It's pretty much required, if you want meaningful results.

      I can even understand that. But while that can work beautifully when you use the results of your own massaging*, it becomes a bit different when you expect others to abide by them. And you know the saying: there are lies, big lies and statistics. (The latter can give you anything you want, with the right massaging ...)

      *did I already mention the existance of, and the need for double-blind testing ? :-)

      The goal is a prediction that one can have a known confidence in

      As you already mentioned, thats not how the its presented by the "its happening!" zealots, nor how its used by the "we have to do something now" political animals (with both of them branding/second-classing anyone not agreeing with them as "deniers")

      And by the way, ever noticed how the early "its getting hotter" stance was quickly replaced by a way more encompassing "its changing" one ? Smart move, as a static situation is rather uncommon in nature. And by that technicality noone (in his right mind) could tell them they where wrong. No matter which way the temperatire will change and regardless by how much. A devious bunch (again, worthy of my distrust) ...

      Also notice that the "changed by humans" clause seems to have become ... an "extra" if you will, but not really of any relevance to most of the agreers*.
      Climate change (regardless of the underlying cause) is bad, and must be stopped. But how do we stop a (literal) force of nature ? I for one don't think we can.

      *other than for a "we caused it, so we can stop it too" reasoning -- with both parts being questionable (correlation and causation and all that).

      I haven't read very many papers that said, "This is going to happen." Most of them say, "We have x-confidence that this will happen if these conditions are met."

      I can't remember when I've heard such a nuanced stance last. The last years its just a lot of "If we don't do something now we will all get our feet wet" statements, followed by all sorts of things others need to do (and pay for ofcourse) to stop it from happening.

      Shuuuure. Here is my wallet, go fix the worlds heating system*. /s

      *a heating system they do not even seem to know half about, as the temperature regulation the oceans seems to deliver (in several ways) is most never mentioned. Heck, our treatment of the oceans as our garbage dump and enless see-life hunting-ground could be at the root of the the (percieved) problems. :-) Also, even simple deforresting could be the cause (if any).

      Journalists are no help, in this matter. No, they are less than helpful.

      And neither are the "I'm right" scientists, the "listen to me, I've got the solution" political animals, and the "you are a denier!" shouting crowd (which includes high-profile "documentary" makers, which all seem t

    10. Re: Only in Clinical studies ..... by KGIII · · Score: 1

      See, you'll never get 100% certainty. You can model, massage, and model again - until you can match reality as closely as you can - but you can never account for outliers such as the drunk guy mentioned in my original post.

      I'm not sure that it should weaken anything - it just means you may have been led to believe that the confidence levels are higher than they are. (They're pretty high, by the way.) This in no way implies certainty regarding exact timing. The models, and their results, have different confidence levels and this seems to be generally overlooked in journalism.

      The scientists are saying, "This is likely to happen within this time frame." The journalists are saying, "This is going to happen by this date."

      Overall, the science is pretty sound. We have whole bodies of work that would have to be refuted, including some pretty basic physics. The questions remaining are how much of an impact we're having and what the results are going to be - if we change, if we continue, or if we increase the amount of greenhouse gases released into our atmosphere.

      For those, we've got a whole lot of evidence to suggest what is going to happen. Specific time-lines aren't a certainty. Instead, as above, there's a certain confidence level that specific things will happen within certain amounts of time. Unfortunately, journalists, pundits, and Wikipedia Experts have muddied the waters and probably caused more confusion than we'd have had otherwise.

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
    11. Re: Only in Clinical studies ..... by KGIII · · Score: 2

      I am not a climate scientist - I feel this needs to be made clear. I have made a quasi-scholastic study of climate science, largely to see for myself what the fuss was about. I've read a whole lot of papers, a whole lot of research, and watched a whole lot of talks. Oddly, I never watched the Gore movie. I prefer to listen to the scientists.

      Which leads me to...

      The theory behind it is pretty sound. It can be reduced to some pretty simple physics and math. If you put more energy into a system, it's going to transfer some of that energy in the form of heat. The effects of greenhouse gases are, fundamentally, well understood.

      And then it gets complicated as all hell.

      I am unqualified to opine on the affects from human output. However... The research that I've read makes a pretty good case for it and I didn't see (once I dug deep enough) anything that reeked of bad science. Note: Some does exist but, for the most part, I found that coming from proselytizers and journalists, as well as some who appear to have moved from academia to publicist.

      There's a pretty big difference between what I read for research and what is parroted by those who have decided men in lab coats are the new priests. The research is more nuanced and actually lists things like confidence ratings. Where the research may say 2, 4, or even 6 standard deviations, the journalists will take even the weakest confidence conclusions and present them as factual certainties. And, of course, this gets parroted and treated like the kid's game of Telephone.

      What baffles me is the amount of alarmists who claim to support science while parroting bad science - or just plain inaccurate science.

      Not that long ago, I had someone telling me that the oceans were going to rise 27' within the next fifty - and that this was a fact. So, I handed down citations and demonstrated that there's actually no research supporting such absurdities. They immediately decided I was anti-science and a Trump voter. I am still dumbfounded.

      I, who seems to actually understand the science to some extent, don't deny that the climate is changing. In fact, it's pretty evident that it is changing. Hell, I can even understand the science that suggests it is caused by releasing CO2 into the atmosphere. Yet, because I didn't toe the line - and agree with their kinda strange assertion, I was lumped in with the deniers and, even more strangely, assumed to be a Trump voter.

      I don't know? I just don't know, at that point. I will say, I can sure as hell understand why people would be skeptical. I can sure as fuck understand why people would negative in their responses. The oceans aren't gonna rise 27' in the next fifty years. Not even the most dire of predictions suggests that.

      Again, I'm not a "denier." I've done a lot of reading and researching. I'm not a client scientist, but I am a scientist. I didn't see anything wrong with their conclusions - and there are many, many studies. Some of those studies have data that hasn't been manipulated, to any great degree (as far as I saw). There's a whole lot of research on this.

      If I were qualified to opine, I'd suggest that they're on the right track and that we are releasing enough CO2 to have an impact. How much? What will the results of our impact be? Is there a tipping point? Those are things I can't really say. I can say that it does look like the science is fundamentally good.

      Why yes, yes I am being careful with my verbiage. ;-)

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
  9. Unbiased followups needed by Tablizer · · Score: 2

    A study should be repeated by an org that has no skin in the game per results. They should be paid to test and get the same amount of compensation regardless of outcome. A random lottery should decide the head managers/researchers for any given repeat.

  10. Opposite of the headline would be more newsworthy by Maritz · · Score: 1

    That word strikes again. "May". There is never a time when recent studies definitely had no falsified data. The opposite of this would be far more newsworthy, which is usually a good sign that someone has been wasting their time. There always has to be skepticism of studies, that's why replication is required.

    --
    I do not want your cheap brainburning drugs. They are useless for work. And I am a working man today.
  11. Most modern 'research' is fraud by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Most scientists 'can't replicate studies by their peers'

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-39054778

    Majority of landmark cancer studies cannot be replicated:

    https://science.slashdot.org/story/12/04/06/139231/majority-of-landmark-cancer-studies-cannot-be-replicated
    http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v483/n7391/full/483531a.html

    etc.etc.

    1. Re:Most modern 'research' is fraud by ceoyoyo · · Score: 2

      That's not fraud. Most of those studies are primary biology or animal studies, non-blinded. They tend to have sample sizes of around 10, and use sketchy stats. It's not particularly surprising they can't be replicated.

      The stats should be improved, and they need to be more cautious in their conclusions (as does anyone reading them), but the scientific literature is supposed to be more about "hey guys, look at this, what do you think?" and less about "this is the truth!".

  12. Bonferroni... by rgbatduke · · Score: 1

    ...But, did he use a bonferroni correction to compute his p-values, since this is a classic data dredge? Sure, his method will turn up true positives (and did, for at least one known offender) but what remains to be seen is the false positive rate and the lawsuit rate, since skewed distributions could have many causes some of which are benign and this is pretty serious defamation of character if one casts aspersions without secondary supporting evidence of malpractice.

    In other words, are his "positives" really malefactors or is he picking out acne-causing green jellybeans: https://xkcd.com/882/

    Worse, the study appeals to my own confirmation bias on the matter, as I'm sure that the rate of wrongdoing in the research is if anything higher than he finds it (he "detects" just under 2% possible/probable bad articles -- I would have guessed more like 5% to 10% just from sheer incompetence and inadequate power, but perhaps he corrected somehow for inadequate power although TFA doesn't really say). So I WANT to believe him, but sans bonferroni, I don't know what to to make of his p-threshold of 1/10000 applied to 5000 samples and testing multiple statistics per sample. He really needs bonferroni twice, as he dredges for out-of-bounds statistics PER article as well, for thousands of articles.

    --
    Even when the experts all agree, they may well be mistaken. --- Bertrand Russell.
    1. Re:Bonferroni... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      From a statistician, I agree entirely. However, he does report some hits at 1e-15, which will clearly survive appropriate corrections. Given all the correlated variables it would be fine to use an FWER correction like Benjamini-Hochberg here, which would be somewhat less stringent than a Bonferroni, but either way the multiple-testing adjustments aren't great here.

  13. people are faking it left and right!!!! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    more news at eleven

  14. This won't be a problem fir much longer by Nyckname · · Score: 2

    Scott Gottlieb, the current head of the FDA, wants to end drug trials. "The free market will put the bad actors out of business."

  15. Unblinded by ceoyoyo · · Score: 1

    Most of those studies are probably not blinded. I wouldn't be surprised if all of the flagged ones are not. There doesn't have to be any fraud at all. If you know what the groups are, your brain will introduce its own bias, without you even knowing about it.

  16. What the SHOULD do. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Claim their study is related to Climate Change.

    Then they can jank the data all they want and the scientific community won't care.

  17. Marcia Angell & Skepticism on Mainstream Scien by Paul+Fernhout · · Score: 3, Informative

    http://pdfernhout.net/to-james... "The problems I've discussed are not limited to psychiatry, although they reach their most florid form there. Similar conflicts of interest and biases exist in virtually every field of medicine, particularly those that rely heavily on drugs or devices. It is simply no longer possible to believe much of the clinical research that is published, or to rely on the judgment of trusted physicians or authoritative medical guidelines. I take no pleasure in this conclusion, which I reached slowly and reluctantly over my two decades as an editor of The New England Journal of Medicine. (Marcia Angell)"

    --
    A 21st century issue: the irony of technologies of abundance in the hands of those still thinking in terms of scarcity.
  18. Create an International Study Audit Body by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I aint no fancy science nerd, but if there isnt one, there ought to be an international body of scientists who's sole purpose is to analyze and replicate past studies.

  19. Isn't that within the statistical expectation? by Solandri · · Score: 1
    I didn't read TFA, but

    90 of the 5,067 published trials had underlying patterns that were unlikely to appear by chance in a credible dataset

    The usual threshold of statistical certainty used for publishing scientific results is 95% (sometimes 98%). That is, a result becomes noteworthy enough to publish if there's a 5% or lower chance of it happening simply due to random chance.

    90 studies out of 5,067 is 1.8%. Which is below the 5% you'd expect from a 95% threshold, and even the 2% you'd expect with a 98% threshold. When you're looking at five thousand studies, about 100-250 of them will report results which aren't real, but simply happened due to chance. That only 90 such studies were found seems to indicate scientists are using an even stricter standard than 98% certainty before publishing. And those 90 aren't necessarily due to fraud, but are within the number you'd expect to find purely due to chance.