Lead Developer of Popular Windows Application Classic Shell Is Quitting

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Lead Developer of Popular Windows Application Classic Shell Is Quitting

Posted by msmash on Monday December 4, 2017 @09:20AM from the good-run dept.

WheezyJoe writes: Classic Shell is a free Windows application that for years has replaced Microsoft's Start Screen or Start Menu with a highly configurable, more familiar non-tile Start menu. Yesterday, the lead developer released what he said would be the last version of Classic Shell. Citing other interests and the frequency at which Microsoft releases updates to Windows 10, as well as lagging support for the Win32 programming model, the developer says that he won't work on the program anymore. The application's source code is available on SourceForge, so there is a chance others may come and fork the code to continue development. There are several alternatives available, some pay and some free (like Start10 and Start Is Back++), but Classic Shell has an exceptionally broad range of tweaks and customizability.

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Hope someone picks it up by p51d007 · 2017-12-04 09:23 · Score: 3, Interesting

Only way I'll have Win10, is for classic shell putting it back to look like Windows 7
1. Re: Hope someone picks it up by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 09:29 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  Of all the issues with Windows 10 like the telemetry and forced updates, your primary issue is with the shell? Holy shit, get some perspective. There are other shells and it's a matter of convenience more than anything else. The bigger issues I named actually affect important issues that go beyond what you find convenient.
2. Re:Hope someone picks it up by chispito · 2017-12-04 09:40 · Score: 1
  
  I don't even use the start button 95% of the time. I hit the win key and start typing the name of the application I'm looking for. It was a habit I picked up with Win 8.1, and even though 10 has a decent start menu in comparison, I like typing better.
  
  --
  The Daddy casts sleep on the Baby. The Baby resists!
3. Re: Hope someone picks it up by Monster_user · 2017-12-04 09:42 · Score: 2
  
  Windows 8.1? That has been there since Vista. Windows 8 just made it confusing, and hid it away.
4. Re:Hope someone picks it up by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 09:45 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  I hit the win key and start typing the name of the application I'm looking for.
  
  This is the retarded fuckery of Windows 8 & 10.
  The whole point of a GUI operating system (e.g. Windows) is NOT having to type the name of every program you want to run, like you did back in the days of MS-DOS.
  Nothing like going backward 25 years.
5. Re:Hope someone picks it up by BronsCon · 2017-12-04 09:53 · Score: 1
  
  This. I used Classic Shell for a while with Win10, but quickly dropped it when I barely noticed a difference -- because I don't typically use the parts of the UI it changes. I bet most people who are aware of Classic Shell and savvy enough to be able to install and use it are in the same boat.
  
  --
  APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
6. Re:Hope someone picks it up by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 10:21 · Score: 0
  
  It is so helpful of Windows to search the store with your entry too.
7. Re: Hope someone picks it up by Austerity+Empowers · 2017-12-04 10:24 · Score: 0
  
  Yes, but those aren't things easily fixed by the community, whereas replacing the stupid ass start menu atrocity is relatively actionable. The best solution I see for telemetry and forced update is to never run on a machine with networking, or if you absolutely must, run within a VM that has very restricted firewall settings. Even that is sketchy.
  Of course you're right, at the end of the day the best solution is to just throw out the steaming turd and replace it with something better, which is just about everything at this point.
8. Re: Hope someone picks it up by JohnFen · 2017-12-04 10:39 · Score: 2
  
  The bigger issues I named actually affect important issues that go beyond what you find convenient.
  All of those issues are important, including the start menu replacement. The Win 10 start menu, while less abysmal than the Win 8 one, is still awful enough that replacing it is, if not "critical", at least "extremely important".
9. Re:Hope someone picks it up by tlhIngan · 2017-12-04 10:52 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  This is the retarded fuckery of Windows 8 & 10.
  The whole point of a GUI operating system (e.g. Windows) is NOT having to type the name of every program you want to run, like you did back in the days of MS-DOS.
  Nothing like going backward 25 years.
  No, it's good UI design.
  If you don't want to type the name of the program, you never have to. The start menu/whatever it is lets you find the application visually like you always could.
  But the search bar method lets you accelerate getting to the commonly used programs you use. For example, it's far quicker for me to hit Windows and type "calc" then Enter, than try to find Calculator by going to Start, All Programs, Accessories, Calculator. It's not much different in time - maybe one second by typing versus 2-3 using the menu, and maybe I only save a minute total every day, but it feels quicker that way.
  UI fuckery is forcing a person to use one way over all else. For example, the first Mac back in 1984 had a keyboard that lacked cursor keys. You were expected to use the mouse instead. That's awful. It's also bad if keyboard accelerators didn't exist - why do we use Ctrl/Command-Z/C/X/V for undo/copy/cut/paste? Why shouldn't we just use the Edit menu? Why not go File..Save instead of Ctrl/Command-S?
  Now, I don't do this with all programs - only the few that I use often enough that I learn their names. I wouldn't do it to start Word since I don't launch Word dozens of times a day.
10. Re:Hope someone picks it up by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 10:52 · Score: 0
  
  What kind of retarded faggot uses Window$ anyway? Fuck your big money.
11. Re: Hope someone picks it up by Monster_user · 2017-12-04 11:00 · Score: 1
  
  I only use search (Windows key) for programs which are not in my $PATH.
  
  I use Win+R for the apps I have learned the name for, and that are in my $PATH. Its much less of a pain than the search.
12. Re: Hope someone picks it up by chispito · 2017-12-04 12:57 · Score: 1
  
  I'm curious how that makes it faster. Using the built-in search, I don't have to use modifiers (win+r) and I don't even have to type in the full program name. Like, for Chrome: Win-C-H-R-(ENTER). If you can share how it's better, I'd appreciate it as I'm always game for a lazier or more efficient keyboard shortcut.
  
  --
  The Daddy casts sleep on the Baby. The Baby resists!
13. Re:Hope someone picks it up by chispito · 2017-12-04 13:01 · Score: 1
  
  The whole point of a GUI operating system (e.g. Windows) is NOT having to type the name of every program you want to run
  I don't have to, I choose to because it is faster, easier, and works on any recent version of desktop or server Windows OS.
  
  --
  The Daddy casts sleep on the Baby. The Baby resists!
14. Re:Hope someone picks it up by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 13:07 · Score: 1
  
  The start menu/whatever it is lets you find the application visually like you always could.
  Did you ever *see* the Win 8 "Start Menu"? It's a literal junk drawer with a search bar; a giant scrolling mess of random icons that couldn't be meaningfully organized and was absolutely unusable except via text search. Looking for something by directly digging through c:\program files\ was faster than trying to find what you want in there. And I have no intention of ever exposing myself to Windows 10, but based on the screenshots I've seen the situation hasn't meaningfully improved.
15. Re:Hope someone picks it up by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 13:18 · Score: 0
  
  People who want to use software that doesn't run on anything else.
16. Re: Hope someone picks it up by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 13:41 · Score: 1
  
  No it really isn't important. The new start menu is perfectly fine. All this whinging is just sad.
17. Re: Hope someone picks it up by Berkyjay · 2017-12-04 14:19 · Score: 0
  
  You sound like a typical developer who shits on the importance of user experience. Go away.
18. Re:Hope someone picks it up by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 14:28 · Score: 1
  
  This is the retarded fuckery of Windows 8 & 10. The whole point of a GUI operating system (e.g. Windows) is NOT having to type the name of every program you want to run, like you did back in the days of MS-DOS. Nothing like going backward 25 years.
  
  You sir are an idiot.
  Install 300 programs on your machine, arranged in various levels of GUI menus. Now find that one program called Foobar that you ran a year ago. You have no idea what company it's from or what menu category it's under. Your only choice is to randomly hunt through menus and submenus and subsubmenus praying you come across it. Good fucking luck.
  Half the time I can't even find a program on my computer that I used last week. I know the name, I know the vendor, but it's buried in the menu under Generic Conglomerate Name -> Vendor Name -> Tools -> Other -> Fuck It I'm Just Making Life Difficult -> Turned Over Rock -> Disused Lavatory -> Beware of Leopard.
  A pox on your menu bullshit. Give me a good typeable search field any day.
19. Re:Hope someone picks it up by freeze128 · 2017-12-04 14:28 · Score: 1
  
  Didn't Ubuntu do something like that a while ago? You wanted to search for a file on your local machine, and their search also searched the internet.
20. Re: Hope someone picks it up by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 14:55 · Score: 1
  
  Yes, but those aren't things easily fixed by the community
  O rly?
  https://www.safer-networking.org/spybot-anti-beacon
  https://www.oo-software.com/en/shutup10
  http://pxc-coding.com/portfolio/donotspy10/
  https://www.ashampoo.com/en/eur/pin/1004/security-software/Antispy-for-Windows-10
  https://www.winprivacy.de/english-home
  http://www.getblackbird.net
  https://www.securilla.com/privacy-repairer
  http://www.site2unblock.com/win10-spy-disabler
  https://github.com/Nummer/Destroy-Windows-10-Spying
  https://github.com/10se1ucgo/DisableWinTracking
  https://github.com/crazy-max/WindowsSpyBlocker
  The community shouldn't have to battle Microsoft over shit like this, which just goes to show how much more scummy Microsoft has become (seriously after Windows 10, I actually wish Ballmer had never left) and how much of a steaming turd Windows 10 is. If you run Windows 10, you don't own the computer that you paid money for because you don't control it and you will forever be fighting against your OS^H^HMicrosoft Marketing Platform(tm) as Microsoft continuously pushes out broken patches written by amateurs developers that undo all of the customisation and settings that you have tried to put into place.
21. Re: Hope someone picks it up by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 14:59 · Score: 0
  
  The new start menu is perfectly fine if you don't want to be able to organise anything and just want all of your apps in a straight A-Z list.
  Oh and if you don't have more the 500 programs installed and love animating, flashing tiles full of advertising.
22. Re: Hope someone picks it up by Monster_user · 2017-12-04 15:00 · Score: 2
  
  Once you've typed in the full name into the run dialog box, you never have to type the whole thing again. Effectively it works very similarly, but there are a few differences.
  
  One difference is since it isn't a search, it never hits the file system after it loads. Which makes a big difference in performance if you're still using a mechanical drive, or simply have a lot of files to search through. I've considered indexing the entire drive simply to avoid the slowdowns and unresponsiveness once the search finishes sith the indexed locations.
  
  Another difference is that since it doesn't search, there is usually a lower amount of risk of hitting enter on the wrong App or file, while Windows shuffles them around as you type. This is the biggest reason I avoid search.
  
  The old school search history is pretty good at learning, which means the items you call upon most frequently are there waiting.
  
  The final difference is you can add batch scripts to your $PATH to be more precise, and to automate various tasks. (I have a game mode script, which kills everything but Steam. I've also got an iTunes script which fires all the related executables and services, and kills them when I'm done. Best one is for the corporate VPN. Emergency purposes only, no reason to have it running all the time.)
23. Re: Hope someone picks it up by Monster_user · 2017-12-04 15:10 · Score: 1
  
  I used Windows 8 very early in its life. I'm also using Windows 8.1, and Windows 10 Pro, and Windows Vista on a daily basis.
  
  The tiles on Windows 8 could be organized, but if I recall, you had to zoom out on the Start Menu to get to the grouping system. I haven't replicated the functionality on 8.1 yet, but it seems to be a step backwards.
  
  Windows 10 significantly improves the functionality. Anniversary seemed good, but I barely used it. I have few complaints about the Fall Creators' Start Menu. It functions the way you would expect the Windows 8 Metro interface should work, and it is very customizable. With enough work I am beginning to think it is actually an improvement over the Windows 7 start menu. The lack of Jump Lists of any kind does hold it back, but otherwise I think they've finally managed an improvement, if only slightly, over the Vista/7 Start Menu.
  
  Where Windows 10 shines is on the Surface. Sure I've said it is a prototype of sorts, but it really demonstrates what Windows 10 is capable of. It proves itself to be a transitionary or dualistic OS.
24. Re:Hope someone picks it up by Gabest · 2017-12-04 16:32 · Score: 1
  
  Try running regedit. You start typing reg, rege, reged. NOTHING comes up, until you fully type its name.
25. Re:Hope someone picks it up by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 16:43 · Score: 0
  
  Apples and oranges. Two problems with your ridiculous comparison:
  1) Canonical listened and learned from the backlash. Microsoft has not and will not.
  2) Ubuntu gives the user ultimate control over everything. If you don't like something, you can easily change it and, if needed, get Canonical and/or the community to give you a hand. Windows 10 restricts users from being able to control what their computers do.
  I'll also mention that if someone doesn't like a particular Linux distro, there are many others that they can choose from. If someone doesn't like Windows 10, that's too bad because Microsoft and their constituents are artificially crippling previous version of Windows and they don't provide any source code for any of them.
26. Re: Hope someone picks it up by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 16:53 · Score: 0
  
  Do you actually believe these measures would prevent telemetry for more than a single update cycle of Windows 10 ?
  After each update of Windows, the telemetry could flow for the amount of time it takes for the new paths to be blocked by these apps.
  Also, only the source-code versions on GitHub could possibly be trusted (after studying the code). The irony of a "security" app actually worsening security is widely celebrated today -- with Windows 10 itself boasting its "security".
27. Re: Hope someone picks it up by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 17:02 · Score: 0
  
  This. I rarely use the menu. With Windows 8 that I used and loved (8.1 at least) I discovered Launchy. It's a search bar with a configurable catalog. It's fast, it's smart, just love it.
28. Re: Hope someone picks it up by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 17:35 · Score: 0
  
  If it's fine why it does not use subpixel font hinting and systemwide themes?
29. Re:Hope someone picks it up by fuzzywig · 2017-12-04 21:35 · Score: 1
  
  You can also type the name of commonly used documents and load them straight up.
  Really handy if, for example, you have a spreadsheet that you need to update every few days. I could open LibreCalc, and go to it's recent documents list, or I can just type the first few letters of it's name and hit 'enter'
30. Re: Hope someone picks it up by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 22:40 · Score: 0
  
  Really? I thought they gave it more of a push in 8.0/8.1. Although I agree with you in the Vista comment. Although I'm one of the types to use shortcuts with the Run window mainly (documents, appwiz.cpl, mstsc /admin, etc), then the WIN key then type. I started using the Win Key + typing much more in 8.0+ iterations of Windows.
31. Re:Hope someone picks it up by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-05 01:48 · Score: 0
  
  Windows 7 did that as well. And its a lot faster than navigating your mouse through a series of level to find the icon you want. Try it some time.
  They also did not get rid of the giant list of programs you can mouse through in the start menu. It's still there if you are a masochist.
32. Re:Hope someone picks it up by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-05 03:12 · Score: 0
  
  Well aren't you a salty little prick.
33. Re: Hope someone picks it up by JohnFen · 2017-12-05 04:11 · Score: 1
  
  It may be fine for you, and that's OK. But lots of people find it seriously lacking. Your experience is not universal.
34. Re:Hope someone picks it up by ConceptJunkie · 2017-12-05 10:52 · Score: 1
  
  That's because you rely on a ridiculously designed menu that lets the software authors turn it into advertising for their company, rather than as a place to organize your programs. I organize my Programs folder in a way that's similar to what KDE 3.5 used to do, and I have no problems finding anything. Sure, it's more work, but no one else is smart enough to do it (even though it would have been easy enough for Microsoft to implement such a feature).
  
  --
  You are in a maze of twisty little passages, all alike.
35. Re: Hope someone picks it up by Gornkleschnitzer · 2017-12-06 04:53 · Score: 1
  
  I made a folder full of program shortcuts - nicely shortened such as "ch" for Chrome and "ide" for Codeblocks - and added it to my $PATH. Makes it extremely quick to open my common software. As an added bonus, the folder has a shortcut to itself, just called "path," and I can type that to add program shortcuts or remind myself which ones I have.
Closed source since Windows 8.1 or 10. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 09:27 · Score: 0

The version on sourceforge only supported Win 7 and maybe 8 or 8.1. So in addition to forking it all the later work would need to be reproduced.
1. Re:Closed source since Windows 8.1 or 10. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 09:32 · Score: 5, Informative
  
  The source has been updated to the latest version which supports Windows 10 Creator's Update.
  It's still not a good reason to use a pile of shit like Windows 10.
2. Re:Closed source since Windows 8.1 or 10. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 09:59 · Score: 0
  
  Wrong.
3. Re:Closed source since Windows 8.1 or 10. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-05 08:59 · Score: 0
  
  The source has been updated to the latest version which supports Windows 10 Creator's Update.
  It's still not a good reason to use a pile of shit like Windows 10.
  Windows 10 is the worst OS yet from M$, except for, (in no particular order): 8, Vista, XP (Yeah, they did get that POS to work right, after about 3 years), NT 3,5, 98, 95, ME and of course, MSDOG.
Diminished need by williamyf · 2017-12-04 09:31 · Score: 0

While, in the bad old times of Windows8 Applications like ClassicShell and their ilk were a must, Windows 10 start button and shell are "Pasable".
Do not get me wrong, Windows10's start button/menu/shell leave a lot to be desired, but are functional enough to do the job.
Therefore, the need for this sort of app is diminished. Nonetheles, thanks a lot to "ivo", as ClasicShell was my go-to app for that type of task. May (s)he have success in her/his future endeavours.

--
*** Suerte a todos y Feliz dia!
1. Re:Diminished need by KiloByte · 2017-12-04 09:41 · Score: 1
  
  On Windows 10, can't you just run a proper shell? Too bad, you can only run win64 processes from it, not win32. Running some desktop environment this way could be interesting.
  
  --
  The creatures outside looked from Alt-Right to Antifa; but already it was impossible to say which was which.
2. Re:Diminished need by vux984 · 2017-12-04 09:53 · Score: 2
  
  Do not get me wrong, Windows10's start button/menu/shell leave a lot to be desired, but are functional enough to do the job.
  This is a fair statement.
  And the flipside of it is that Windows 7's start menu is itself a dogs breakfast of poor usability and poor design choices.
  Given a choice between windows 7 and windows 10, I'll take 10. Neither is perfect, but 10 is better than 7. I've removed all the tiles on mine so its basically just a menu. Hit windows and start typing works well, and there is lots of useful stuff on the right click menu.
  Win8 was an abortion with its hot corners, and full screen nonsense... and well like you said, Windows 10 is passable. But windows 7 was not the pinnacle of all that was good. It was clunky and awkward and about the only reason people want it is 'familiarity'. Familiarity is valuable, but it should get in the way of progress. Win10's menu is flawed, but it is progress.
3. Re:Diminished need by Hal_Porter · 2017-12-04 10:00 · Score: 1
  
  Yeah, I haven't got any machines running 10, but I've got some VMs running it. And it's honestly pretty passable even without Classic Shell. Unlike Windows 8 and 8.1, both of which were highly irritating until you installed it.
  I think if you write something like Classic Shell to bodge Windows 8 you must know that if Microsoft come to their senses in later releases, your product is going to be obsolete.
  Also you have to wonder the economics of something like Classic Shell. It's got a lot of users but how many of them donate? Probably when people were pissed at Windows 8 and Classic Shell was being recommended all over the internet the huge number of users made the fact that <0.1% paid not matter so much. But Windows 10 hasn't attracted the same notoriety for pushing Metro onto people, so fewer people will install it. And then that low rate of payment will start to bite. Especially if you've got other stuff you could be working on.
  
  --
  echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
4. Re:Diminished need by Khashishi · 2017-12-04 10:10 · Score: 1
  
  It's only passable if you remove the animated tiles.
5. Re:Diminished need by coastwalker · 2017-12-04 10:40 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  Anyone with a lot of software and hardware benefited from the ability to organise program shortcuts into folders. I have dozens of camera software links associated with different cameras for example. It helps being able to keep the Cannon raw file converter separate from the Sony one and to group both sets of software in their own folders. Of course modern users only need facebook and a full frontal lobotomy so won't be needing customiseable start menus. I expect I will have to create folders of shortcuts to replace this functionality once the cretins at Microsoft break Classic Shell. It was great having a full featured graphical user interface in Windows whilst it lasted but times change and the era of the general purpose computer for the public is drawing to a close. You can fcuk off if you think I am going to use an App on a smartphone to edit video. Cretins.
  
  --
  Facts are history now plebs have politics for religion on social media.
6. Re:Diminished need by JohnFen · 2017-12-04 10:46 · Score: 1
  
  And the flipside of it is that Windows 7's start menu is itself a dogs breakfast of poor usability and poor design choices.
  True. But I disagree with you in that I think that Win 10's, while better than Win 8's, sucks more than Win 7's.
7. Re:Diminished need by williamyf · 2017-12-04 11:02 · Score: 1
  
  It's only passable if you remove the animated tiles.
  Which you can do in a relatively simple manner, without the aid of an Application.
  
  --
  *** Suerte a todos y Feliz dia!
8. Re: Diminished need by Monster_user · 2017-12-04 11:10 · Score: 2
  
  And the flipside of it is that Windows 7's start menu is itself a dogs breakfast of poor usability and poor design choices.
  
  How exactly would you improve on a compact, low mouse travel distance UI, with user customizable organization methods, and a built-in search feature which will return applications in the organization system, as well as those which are not?
  
  Windows 7's Start Menu is clearly an evolved design centered around practical application.
9. Re:Diminished need by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 11:13 · Score: 1
  
  And it's honestly pretty passable even without Classic Shell.
  
  Does your passing grade come from Microsoft telemetry? You mean they haven't told your insurance company about your shaky hand that's probably some pre-existing condition that they can use to cancel your policy?
10. Re:Diminished need by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 11:46 · Score: 0
  
  Fucking this. I still use the XP style start menu because I got into the habit of organising the shortcuts into a structure that met my needs: \dev, \tools, \office, \web, \office, \hardware, \multimedia, \games. MS screwed the pooch here because so many limited-XP users are quite happy leaving something in Programs\SomeSoftwareDevelopmentCompany\Application\Trial\v1.0\...
  S
11. Re:Diminished need by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 11:49 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  All the start menus beyond Windows 7 are garbage, and Windows 10 seems FAR worse than Windows 8.x ever was.
  Windows 10 kept the tile garbage, but now added Bing results that have a negative value to the default search results. I remember searching for the control panel once... The first result (which was helpfully titled "Control Panel") opened Edge (yuck), which opened the first hit from Bing (no...) which was a page that said to search for it in the menu by typing. Yeah, so fucking helpful! It seems like everything they do just removes further value with every new build...
  Metro/Modern/UWP/name-of-the-week appy apps remain crippled junk made for cretins that have no use for a computer.
12. Re:Diminished need by vux984 · 2017-12-04 12:51 · Score: 1, Troll
  
  "Anyone with a lot of software and hardware benefited from the ability to organise program shortcuts into folders"
  Ok. So your idea of the optimum way to do that was to cram everything on your computer into a popup window overloaded with tons of other unrelated functions?? Really?
  Why not just create a folder hierchy with shortcuts, documents, files, and anything you want in it organized howerver you want it, and only with what you want it.
  Then rightclick on the taskbar, select 'toolbars', add a toolbar, and select your little folder hierarchy, and voila.
  Or divide it up and add multiple toolbars to the taskbar.
  "Of course modern users only need facebook and a full frontal lobotomy so won't be needing customiseable start menus."
  Windows 10 gives you as many customizable heirarchical popup menus from the taskbar as you want. You claim to be some sort of power user, yet you seem dead set against learning even the barest minimum about the operating system's power user features. Perhaps you've already received your lobotomy?
13. Re: Diminished need by vux984 · 2017-12-04 13:17 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  "How exactly would you improve on a compact, low mouse travel distance UI, with user customizable organization methods"
  Let's see:
  I wouldn't make it a popup window that has tendency to disappear on its under a variety of situations that don't involve the user wanting it to disappear.
  I certainly wouldn't make it fixed size and crammed into a corner.
  I wouldn't do a hierarchical tree navigation with a single vertical panel showing just one level of one branch. We have far better tree navigation GUI.
  And I definitely wouldn't mix the system administration elements with the user configured application elements.
  Nor would I make it so cumbersome to manage. The 'stuff I need' vs 'everything installed on the PC' all mashed together, plus control panels and turning it off.
  "Windows 7's Start Menu is clearly an evolved design centered around practical application."
  It evolved by throwing everything into it, like a kitchen sink, with no real plan.
  Windows 10's system admin stuff on the right click is a big improvement -- I love that. Windows 10's settings and control panel situation is just miserable. The search has improved over 7 a lot. The menu is vertically resizable which is a step in the right direction. The tree navigation is still pretty weak. Manuging custom start menu folders by moving it to toolbars is actually an improvement... but on that still needs more improvement.
  cortana is fine for desktop search, but its annoying that you have to tell it not to suggest shit from the web, news headlines, the stupid app store.
  I quite like spotlight on OSX, and launchpad isn't bad either -- far better than windows 8, but still kind of clunky. The problem hasn't been fully solved yet. ClassicShell however wasn't a step forward, its just stuck holding onto a mediocre past.
14. Re:Diminished need by Drethon · 2017-12-04 13:18 · Score: 1
  
  Windows 10 gives you as many customizable heirarchical popup menus from the taskbar as you want. You claim to be some sort of power user, yet you seem dead set against learning even the barest minimum about the operating system's power user features. Perhaps you've already received your lobotomy?
  I've used this and am very pleased with it myself, though I prefer that nice hierarchical popup menu to actually be my start menu, so I am using classic shell. As a developer who releases multiple versions of software to less power users (hardware engineering customers for example), we are so far forced to deal with windows 10 eliminating start menu folder depth by releasing gawd awful folder names with versions and other crap in the folder name to differentiate from previously released versions.
15. Re: Diminished need by northerner · 2017-12-04 14:02 · Score: 0
  
  How exactly would you improve on a compact, low mouse travel distance UI, with user customizable organization methods, and a built-in search feature which will return applications in the organization system, as well as those which are not?
  I would install Classic Shell to put back the useful things that the Win7 designers took away. Thank you Ivo for creating a great product that made Win7 much more enjoyable.
16. Re:Diminished need by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 14:53 · Score: 0
  
  Then rightclick on the taskbar, select 'toolbars', add a toolbar, and select your little folder hierarchy, and voila.
  That's certainly a HUGE improvement over the menu that Windows 10 has! Now, perhaps we could also use desktop shortcuts, possibly adding them into folders, essentially recreating Windows 3.1 (shortcuts into groups) and that would STILLbe a huge improvement over the current Windows 10 start menu!
  I've never EVER seen a shittier software launcher, except possibly for Windows 8 but at least there you didn't have to suffer Cortana and other Bing-infested crap.
17. Re: Diminished need by Brockmire · 2017-12-05 08:13 · Score: 1
  
  The pre-existing condition causing shaky hand is porn.
18. Re:Diminished need by ConceptJunkie · 2017-12-05 10:56 · Score: 1
  
  Yes. This is what I've been doing since the days of Windows 3, and nothing beats it. I never have trouble finding things because I have a very simple way to organize them, very similar to what you described. The Program folder is a place to find your programs, not to use as advertising for the company that made the software.
  
  --
  You are in a maze of twisty little passages, all alike.
Is the author finally switching to OS/2 ?? by martiniturbide · 2017-12-04 09:34 · Score: 3, Insightful

You are welcome, very welcome at OS2World. We need open source OS/2 developers !!! :)
1. Re:Is the author finally switching to OS/2 ?? by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 11:49 · Score: 0
  
  When is OS/3 coming out? And will existing apps need to be ported?
2. Re:Is the author finally switching to OS/2 ?? by freeze128 · 2017-12-04 14:31 · Score: 1
  
  It will probably be released with IBM's new Personal System 3 (PS/3) hardware.
3. Re:Is the author finally switching to OS/2 ?? by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 21:22 · Score: 0
  
  Isn't PS4 already out? :P
It used to be... by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 09:44 · Score: 1

That any mention of a Windoze (TM, R, C) would be met by derision. How times have changed.
1. Re:It used to be... by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 10:11 · Score: 1
  
  It also used to be that Slashdot had high quality comments. Maybe there's a correlation?
2. Re:It used to be... by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 13:54 · Score: 0
  
  Long time windows user (using it right now). Long time windows dev (25 years and counting). Love me some visual studio. I can make this thing sing and dance and do whatever I like. Anyone developing greenfield software other than games for windows is in a losing market. Everything is moving to open source stacks and the web. There are pretty much 0 openings out there for anything win32. .NET here and there for enterprise sorts of applications. But it is hard going. The whole market moved to linux. MS wiffed it hard on windows 8 and the rest of the world never looked back. Can MS fix that? I seriously doubt it. In the past 2 years I have moved all of my dev work over to linux and open source stacks. If I want a job in the future I have to. Open source 'won' years ago and everyone is still fighting the battles of 1999. MS will open source windows at some point. It will be too late at that point (it already is).
3. Re:It used to be... by jarkus4 · 2017-12-04 17:18 · Score: 1
  
  Open source isn't really relevant to lack of win32 jobs. They are actually disappearing due to move to web interfaces everywhere. Often even standalone apps get some webkit interface. If you were focused on developing commercial gui applications for linux you would have the same problem. Outside of things requiring high performance (eg games) and very complex stuff (that creators cant be bothered to rewrite from scratch) we are going to have browser only environment.
  I disagree on MS open sourcing the windows in the future. MS has a nice advantage here of games on one side (home) and legacy applications on the other (corporate). If all the new apps are os agnostic (web) they get nothing from open sourcing and only lose on the income of those two niches.
This may hurt many users who hate Windows 8-10 by evolutionary · 2017-12-04 09:57 · Score: 2

Need a more solid base of developing community. windows 8-10 still has trojan "telemetry" data collectors (header data from files accessed will certainly identify you folks sooner or later), but for those who have trouble getting Windows 7 (available from http://nerdsforless.com/softwa... ) for some reason, this was a god send for many. I recommended it to many people who hated the "tile" theme (which most people I know do, not a fun interface). Developers out there, let's take up the mantle. This was a quality tool. Sorry to hear that he's leaving us, but he certainly did his bit. Now it's time for the rest of us to do ours.

--
"Imagination is more important than knowledge" - Einstein
1. Re:This may hurt many users who hate Windows 8-10 by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 10:24 · Score: 0
  
  I don't care. I have no need for a gaming OS.
  Other than work, I haven't touched that steaming pile since 2007.
Well, that sucks ... by thomst · 2017-12-04 10:06 · Score: 3, Insightful

I fully understand the guy's frustration.
Every time M$ releases a new iteration of Win 10 - even a relatively minor one - it breaks Classic Shell. That has forced him to play a continuous game of whack-a-bug, to the detriment of adding and refining features.
And practically no one (including me) has donated even small amounts of money to him for his effort.
If I wasn't dependent on so many Line6 and Digitech patch editors - none of which run properly under Wine - I'd kick Redmond to the curb without a second thought ...

--
Check out my novel.
1. Re:Well, that sucks ... by DidgetMaster · 2017-12-04 11:01 · Score: 5, Insightful
  
  Something tells me that if even a modest amount of money had come his way for his efforts, he would have put up with the hassle of keeping the software current. Money has a way of motivating lots of people to do things that they don't necessarily like (because it tends to let us buy things that we do like). It amazes me how many people want all their software for free and then complain when someone like this guy doesn't want to work for free anymore.
2. Re:Well, that sucks ... by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 14:58 · Score: 0
  
  Every time M$ releases a new iteration of Win 10 - even a relatively minor one - it breaks Classic Shell.
  On purpose I'm sure. It's the one and only app that always breaks, "conveniently" for MS. DOS Ain't Done 'Til Lotus Won't Run...
  You will use the stupid tiles, appy apps and store, and you will like it, just like the telemetry. The beatings will continue until morale improves.
3. Re:Well, that sucks ... by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 18:45 · Score: 0
  
  Get a Mac or build a hackintosh. Best way to go for Music. Only reason I boot into OS X is for Logic and Helix.
4. Re:Well, that sucks ... by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 21:51 · Score: 0
  
  It amazes me how many people want all their software for free and then complain when someone like this guy doesn't want to work for free anymore.
  I want software for free, but I don't complain when someone stops supporting a project because it doesn't pay the bills or simply becomes too frustrating (even if they are paid). Then again, just because I want software for free doesn't mean I don't think the developer should be paid. The whole point is precisely that a lot of software is functionally useful for everyone but the amount of money to support its development is relatively small (on the order of fractions of a cent per person), so it makes more economic sense to support such software some other way than a direct payment to the person.
  Honestly, it's the sort of thing where Microsoft should be funding this sort of development (along with a lot of other stuff where they're clearly deficient at actually doing the work themselves). Whether that means directly hiring him or simply paying him regularly, I don't know. But something equivalent to the Linux Foundation makes a lot of sense for the Windows world on a lot of needed utilities that Microsoft won't or can't provide. So, yea, indirectly I and others are still paying for it. Just like we pay for Notepad, zip folders, etc even though a lot of people use alternatives because Microsoft's versions are so often horrible.
I wrote my own shell once by tatman · 2017-12-04 10:14 · Score: 1

Replacing windows shell with another is not that hard. You could make notepad your shell (I'm not saying that useful--just noting you can) as its a matter of registry setting. The hard part of making a shell is writing and maintaining all of the functionality you get/want from a shell. And that's why I gave up on it.

--
I've always said English was my second language. Had Romeo and Juliet been written in C, I might have understood it.
1. Re:I wrote my own shell once by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 16:57 · Score: 0
  
  "I wrote my own shell once..."
  "...but then I took an arrow to the knee!"
  Shell code belongs to the Nerds !! (*hack*!)
OH NOooo! by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 10:16 · Score: 0

I need classic shell! I've used it since windows 7 to make my start menu to look like win98 (+ the search).
Shit is good. Spyware is bad. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 10:22 · Score: 0

The parent comment is excessively positive about Windows 10. "Shit" is good for fertilizer.
1. Re: Shit is good. Spyware is bad. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 12:04 · Score: 0
  
  And it promotes healthy growth.
2. Re:Shit is good. Spyware is bad. by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 18:08 · Score: 0
  
  I agree. Shit, even that full of junk food and hot mexican burritos, does not deserve this.
Yet another nail in the coffin... by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 10:24 · Score: 1

...that is the garbage known as Windows 10.0
What? by DickBreath · 2017-12-04 10:33 · Score: 1

You mean I can have the classic shell on Windows 10 and Server 2012? Really?!?

I'll have to look into that right after I upgrade to Windows XP.

--

I'll see your senator, and I'll raise you two judges.
Good riddance by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 10:43 · Score: 0

I tried it, hated it. It was obnoxious and had too many problems. It was hard to get rid of too, if I recall correctly.
1. Re:Good riddance by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 11:01 · Score: 0
  
  Yeah, fuck everything you don't like.
Noble work, but you can't do it forever by omfglearntoplay · 2017-12-04 10:47 · Score: 1

We understand you have to move on, Mr. Dev. Thanks for helping out untold thousands of people.
Hold your fire, there. by Picodon · 2017-12-04 11:19 · Score: 2

...the classic shell...
...after I upgrade to Windows XP.
It’s not what you think. They got rid of Program Manager and File Manager. Now, what they call “classic shell” is something with some kind of Start button.
Ivo, we appreciate your work by frist · 2017-12-04 11:41 · Score: 5, Insightful

This program has been the reason Win 8 and 10 are tolerable. Underneath they're decent OSs but that Metro monstrosity and the horrible "modern UI" is just garbage. I install classic shell on every PC I touch since Win 8 came out and I'm up and running. It's been a godsend.
Thank you Ivo Beltchev for your work these many years.
I just went and donated. I wonder how many Slashdot users also use Classic Shell. Maybe we could change Ivo's mind.
Start Menu is dying by duke_cheetah2003 · 2017-12-04 12:11 · Score: 1

I hate to be the one to admit this, but the start menu just really isn't much of a thing anymore. At least not for me. I tend to put icons for my most frequently used programs on the desktop or pinned to the task bar. I really just don't use the start menu much anymore, much easier to just hit Windows-D to get my desktop and double click the program I want to launch. Or in the case of really frequent stuff, it's already pinned to the task bar.
I think Microsoft was on to something when they ditched the Start Menu in 8, but they did it wrong. Those tiles are awful. Just having icons is good enough. Microsoft's idea was just poorly executed.
As a side note, I think Microsoft's idea of tabs in all programs sounds pretty clever and useful, making the start menu even more obsolete.
I just want to say Thank You by Snotnose · 2017-12-04 12:29 · Score: 2

From the bottom of my heart. I "upgraded" to Win10 when some other program wanted an OK, and the Win10 update msg appeared and stole my "Yes". Classic shell was the only reason I stuck with Win10. I've been using it for some 2 years now and, outside of the fucking "we've installed an update, aren't we cool?" reboots my laptop makes while I'm eating dinner, I find Win10 to be OK. Granted, get my games to run on Linux and I'm fucking out of here on a hot rocket, but, hey. Who are we kidding. If my games ran under Linux I'd be out of here so fast I'd be auditioning the the Flash TV show.

Seriously. Close my laptop, go to bed/dinner/ vacation. Open my laptop and it's rebooted? That is serious bad mojo. Fuck you Microsoft of ever thinking rebooting my machine, without me ever clicking an "OK" button, is OK. Cuz it's not. Just fuck you and the billions of bux your executives stole due to the stock going up.
1. Re: I just want to say Thank You by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-04 13:28 · Score: 0
  
  Gotta admit the only reason I have a windows version anything is that my wife refuses to let me touch her new laptop.... Until she needs technical support ... Yhen I'm the fing. Goddamn. Man... Except I haven't done anything seriously or useful in windows, from her point of view, in 15 years.
what he should do is by FudRucker · 2017-12-04 12:34 · Score: 2

start working on IceWM window manager,

--
Politics is Treachery, Religion is Brainwashing
Hm... by xlsior · 2017-12-04 14:22 · Score: 4, Interesting

Classic shell doesn't just restore the old style menus, in the process it also gets rid of all the dynamic built-in advertising and links to bundled junk like candy crush, xbox live, headline news, the windows store, etc. -- cheaply and quickly gets rid of a ton of clutter in a corporate environment.

I'm sure that's the main reason that Microsoft will never restore the old style start menu on their own.
So long... and THANKS!!! by Anonymous Coward · 2017-12-05 02:54 · Score: 0

I'm late to the Classic Shell party, but I've been using it for at least six months, it's been WONDERFUL!! Yes, I was able to avoid Windows 8~X entirely up till that point.
Last New Version?? by DERoss · 2017-12-05 17:10 · Score: 1

The gHacks news item dated 4 December linked in this Slashdot article says: "The developer of the popular Classic Shell application for Microsoft's Windows operating system released the last version of the program yesterday." The Web site for Classic Shell says the latest version is 4.3.1, the version I installed under Windows 7 more than three months ago. Was a newer version really released this month?