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Apple Shuts Swift Mailing List, Migrates to Online Forum (swift.org)

Posted by EditorDavid on from the shifting-Swift dept.

An anonymous reader writes: Apple's Swift project "has completed the process of migrating to the Swift Forums as the primary method for discussion and communication!" announced a blog post on Friday. "The former mailing lists have been shut down and archived, and all mailing list content has been imported into the new forum system."

While they're still maintaining a few Swift-related mailing lists, they're moving discussions into online forums divided into four main categories: Evolution, Development, Using Swift, and Site Feedback. Forum accounts can be set up using either email registration or GitHub accounts.
It was one year ago that Swift creator Chris Lattner answered questions from Slashdot readers.

25 comments

  1. OK. by jira · · Score: 1

    Noted

  2. Thanks for the update. by Gherald · · Score: 0

    Super informative. Don't know what I'd do without you, Slashdot.

    --
    The unofficial /. digest
    1. Re:Thanks for the update. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is serving for the daily Apple (s)hit piece.

  3. I prefer forums over mailing lists by 93+Escort+Wagon · · Score: 1

    But I know lots of other people who are the exact opposite.

    Forums are easier to moderate, though, which appeals to manager types.

    --
    #DeleteChrome
    1. Re:I prefer forums over mailing lists by alvinrod · · Score: 1

      I'm not part of terribly many mailing lists and most of them are rather niche and don't have a lot of activity so perhaps I can't generalize this, but I can't recall them ever really needing moderation. I suppose you'll never stop dedicated trolls, but it seems like they're less likely to get involved with mailing lists in the first place, whereas forums seem far more likely to draw their attentions.

      I doubt that the Swift mailing list was getting a lot of GNAA trolls or people whining about Trump/Obama/Bush/Clinton or a lot of the other shit that gets posted here regularly.

    2. Re:I prefer forums over mailing lists by willy_me · · Score: 1

      Forums have the advantage of being easier to search for those just observing the conversation. Having a known viewing platform also has it's advantages - when using email one has to assume text only. The switch to a forum is a good idea so long as email alerts / updates to new content are provided. If people really do not want to abandon their email, perhaps an email bot could automate forum posts from an email reply. Perhaps they could write it in Swift?

    3. Re:I prefer forums over mailing lists by SuperKendall · · Score: 1

      As a modern developer, I prefer moderatable forums myself - people have gotten a bit more extreme over the years and while you used to not need developer forum moderation, nowadays I think that tool has to be in place.

      --
      "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
    4. Re:I prefer forums over mailing lists by lucm · · Score: 1

      a lot of the other shit that gets posted here regularly.

      Are you by any chance talking about a controversial init system that was born in the desktop world and managed to spread like a cancer into the server world?

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      lucm, indeed.
    5. Re:I prefer forums over mailing lists by lucm · · Score: 1

      If people really do not want to abandon their email, perhaps an email bot could automate forum posts from an email reply. Perhaps they could write it in Swift?

      they could call it iSlack

      --
      lucm, indeed.
    6. Re:I prefer forums over mailing lists by u801e · · Score: 1

      Forums have the advantage of being easier to search for those just observing the conversation.

      How does that differ from using NNTP to access mailing list archives through a service like gmane? My local email and news client has no problems searching through past messages and is faster than an online forum is.

      Having a known viewing platform also has it's advantages - when using email one has to assume text only.

      Usually forums have a subset of markup that's available and it seems to differ from platform to platform (i.e., how do I use bold, italic, or underlined text). For a text based mailing list or newsgroup, the standard was *bold*, /italic/, and _underline_. Some clients would even support that type of informal markup when rendering plain text.

      The switch to a forum is a good idea so long as email alerts / updates to new content are provided.

      It would be nice if they could set up a NNTP server with an email to NNTP gateway for those who want to continue using email and allow for participants to register for accounts to post to the group. It could peer with gmane for archival purposes.

  4. Looks like it makes it easier to edit or delete st by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    Looks like it makes it easier to edit or delete stuff after the fact

  5. Re: And nothing of value has been lost by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Huh? Works better than web based forums.

  6. Re:And nothing of value has been lost by ptaff · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Come on, mailing list?

    Before you kids' webmail made e-mail cumbersome and inefficient to deal with, there was a thing called local mail clients. Managing a large amount of mail messages in a decent client is much more efficient than doing click-clicks in a forum. Maybe you should ask Linus why the kernel mailing list is not moved to a forum yet.

    Now get off my lawn.

  7. Re:Tanks for teh udpate.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Cynical much? Just cuz you can't get Trump to put his junk in your trunk don't take it out here. Move on, young filly.

  8. Do people actually like this style of forum? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    I call them semi-organized chaos.
    I get it, they look pretty, but usability, at least for me, is severely hampered compared to a traditional forum layout. They are categorized, but every landing page is a mass clumping of every category below it and only when you drill down a few times do you actually get to anything specific, leading to people posting everywhere.

    It just seems to me that they were designed more with first impression in mind before any other consideration, which often means some manager with no actual experience is behind the choice.

  9. Re:And nothing of value has been lost by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Holy crap this made my night XD

    Preach it - a local mail client streamlines email to the point of sanity. It's amazing compared to webmail.

  10. Re: And nothing of value has been lost by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    I totally agree. Mailing lists are most efficient.

  11. Who uses swift outside of Apple products? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Serious question.

  12. Re:And nothing of value has been lost by sproketboy · · Score: 1

    NNTP you insensitive clod!!!!

  13. Forums are more censorship-friendly by jbn-o · · Score: 1

    It is, and this alone is a big reason why an organization keen on controlling its image favors shifting the control to their favor. This certainly includes a more censor-friendly forum over the typically quick turnaround of an unmoderated mailing list. Unmoderated mailing lists offer no means of cancellation, editing (including edits by non-posters such as sysadmins) and mailing lists typically send out posts to subscribers very quickly. Add in the use of Javascript for even more control over the user's computer by literally sending users code to run in the context of their user account (which every major browser dutifully does by default). Accessible archives are also under more server-side control with a forum: the server admins decide how much history they want to continue to publish and how accessible that is to indexers, whereas with mailing lists and netnews the users have a say.

    So many other corporate media repeater sites are forums (/., Hacker News, reddit, every corporate news outlet, many so-called alternative news outlets, etc.). Mailing lists aren't as free speech friendly as netnews (particularly when one considers newsgroups carried by many netnews servers such as Usenet) but unmoderated mailing lists are typically more free speech friendly than web forums.

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    Digital Citizen
    1. Re:Forums are more censorship-friendly by u801e · · Score: 1

      Mailing lists aren't as free speech friendly as netnews (particularly when one considers newsgroups carried by many netnews servers such as Usenet) but unmoderated mailing lists are typically more free speech friendly than web forums.

      Usenet also had moderated groups. For a discussion list, moderation may be necessary if there's too much spam or spew directed at the group. But if they were to set up an NNTP server instead and limited who they peer with to limit the spam, then they probably could get away without having to moderate the group at all.

  14. Cool, thanks by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Another login to keep track of, no easy way to locally save or archive postings, have to use yet another external interface to read the content instead of one local client that can read everything, more exposure to tracking and advertising.

    But it's "modern".

  15. Re:And nothing of value has been lost by u801e · · Score: 1

    At least we have gmane for that.