The argument of "Relational or Not" has the same religious overtones that the "Perl vs. Python" or "Emacs vs. VI" or "Linux vs. Windows" or "Democrat or Republican" arguments take. At the end of the day it is a subjective opinion and a personal choice made for personal reasons. One would hope that people would the better tool for the job.
There is also the little issue -- that many have pointed out -- of needing to get work done. IF (and that is a big if) we all were to accept the premise that a truly relational model is the end all be all data model, it fails to address the fact that such an implementation is much more cumbersome: it takes more programming, more SQL, more time. And in the business world time is money and money matters.
In the article to which this slashdot story is linked, Pascal says:
Note: Participants in the thread use aliases rather than real names. So much for the courage of their convictions.
That would be a circumstantial ad hominem attack. In fact his first bullet point response to the post is more straw man and ad hominem attacks. Certainly many of the posters on slashdot do the same but to get in a pissing match with fallacious arguments adds nothing meaningful to the debate and is probably counterproductive.
Pascal's writing are littered with fallacious arguments. Take for example from his original "No Integrity: A Systemic Problem" article on dbazine.com where he starts a paragraph with "As long as inferior nonrelational products are bought...". Throwing the "inferior" word in there is begging the question and it is a loaded word. All of this is quite unfortunate because there is some useful information sprinkled in his articles. Just like it is good for a programmer to know both functional and object oriented programming, it is good to know about the relational data model.
May 14, 2003 Today every previous and current Linux kernel developer filed a class-action lawsuit against SCO claiming that since SCO has access to the Linux kernel source and mailing lists they might have taken some of the code or ideas from the mailing list and incorporated them into their own kernel.
IBM later announced that they too will join the lawsuit since they have contributed code not part of the original UNIX code and fear that SCO may inappropriately be using their copyrighted work without following the license of the Linux kernel.
The lawsuit aims for two outcomes: Monetary compensation and to force SCO to release their source code so that it can be reviewed for possible infringements.
Linus was quoted as saying: "There is no way they could have written any UNIX like operating system since they only seem to have lawyers working in the company."
I cannot believe that people are ragging in ID so much. I am disappointed
that there will not be a Linux boxed version of TA (I did purchase the
boxed Linux version of Q3A). I am disappointed that they are not going to
let Tux Games put the Linux binary on a CD -- although I have DSL so that
matters less to me. But they are still going to release something that is
Linux capable and try to improve Linux 3D in the process. That is giving
a lot to the Linux community.
This whole "If ID had just released the Linux version at the same time..."
mantra is getting old. If it is right or not we will never know. Yes I
wish that they had and yes I believe that it would have made a difference
but that is not how it played out. Live with it. I just hope folks "have
learned their lesson" and are NOT going to purchase the Windoze version
instead of a Linux version just because it is available sooner.
I have read on the Loki news groups a few times that 3D drivers are Loki's
biggest support issues. That is why I try to read the news groups and
even make a post when I discover a problem and solution even if I did not
see that someone else had a problem. If you have any knowledge about 3D
on Linux, I ask that you do the same. The better we can get 3D working
for folks and the less support Loki and company have to do the more likely
developers are to develop for Linux.
Thank you ID for your Linux support! Now everyone go vote with your
dollars: Purchase games from Loki; Purchase games from Tribesoft.
Slashdot Mirror
There is also the little issue -- that many have pointed out -- of needing to get work done. IF (and that is a big if) we all were to accept the premise that a truly relational model is the end all be all data model, it fails to address the fact that such an implementation is much more cumbersome: it takes more programming, more SQL, more time. And in the business world time is money and money matters.
In the article to which this slashdot story is linked, Pascal says:
That would be a circumstantial ad hominem attack. In fact his first bullet point response to the post is more straw man and ad hominem attacks. Certainly many of the posters on slashdot do the same but to get in a pissing match with fallacious arguments adds nothing meaningful to the debate and is probably counterproductive.Pascal's writing are littered with fallacious arguments. Take for example from his original "No Integrity: A Systemic Problem" article on dbazine.com where he starts a paragraph with "As long as inferior nonrelational products are bought...". Throwing the "inferior" word in there is begging the question and it is a loaded word. All of this is quite unfortunate because there is some useful information sprinkled in his articles. Just like it is good for a programmer to know both functional and object oriented programming, it is good to know about the relational data model.
May 14, 2003
Today every previous and current Linux kernel developer filed a class-action lawsuit against SCO claiming that since SCO has access to the Linux kernel source and mailing lists they might have taken some of the code or ideas from the mailing list and incorporated them into their own kernel.
IBM later announced that they too will join the lawsuit since they have contributed code not part of the original UNIX code and fear that SCO may inappropriately be using their copyrighted work without following the license of the Linux kernel.
The lawsuit aims for two outcomes: Monetary compensation and to force SCO to release their source code so that it can be reviewed for possible infringements.
Linus was quoted as saying: "There is no way they could have written any UNIX like operating system since they only seem to have lawyers working in the company."
I have seen royalty-free sample-cds at clearance houses every once in a while.
I cannot believe that people are ragging in ID so much. I am disappointed that there will not be a Linux boxed version of TA (I did purchase the boxed Linux version of Q3A). I am disappointed that they are not going to let Tux Games put the Linux binary on a CD -- although I have DSL so that matters less to me. But they are still going to release something that is Linux capable and try to improve Linux 3D in the process. That is giving a lot to the Linux community.
This whole "If ID had just released the Linux version at the same time..." mantra is getting old. If it is right or not we will never know. Yes I wish that they had and yes I believe that it would have made a difference but that is not how it played out. Live with it. I just hope folks "have learned their lesson" and are NOT going to purchase the Windoze version instead of a Linux version just because it is available sooner.
I have read on the Loki news groups a few times that 3D drivers are Loki's biggest support issues. That is why I try to read the news groups and even make a post when I discover a problem and solution even if I did not see that someone else had a problem. If you have any knowledge about 3D on Linux, I ask that you do the same. The better we can get 3D working for folks and the less support Loki and company have to do the more likely developers are to develop for Linux.
Thank you ID for your Linux support! Now everyone go vote with your dollars: Purchase games from Loki; Purchase games from Tribesoft.