Ah, luckily we have you, someone who DOES understand what is a symptom and what is an underlying cause, to tell those idiots who've spent their lives studying things like psychology, sociology, and childhood development, that they are idiots who don't understand anything.
You know, it's funny how often 'chose not to be a perpetual victim' translates to 'I got mine, now screw everybody else.'
No, I'm sure that undertakers and EMTs don't joke about killing people. Some cops may, but not the one in my family.
You an take all the isolated parts of the video, the callous jokes, the attack on a vehicle trying to rescue the journalist, the wish that the journalist would make a move for a weapon, killing him even though he doesn't, the lack of any evidence that the people fired upon were combatants, the fact that they never acted like combatants: you can take all those and attempt to dismiss each, point by point. Or you can look at the whole picture, which is harder to dismiss.
Thank you for that. I see a group of civilians walking casually down the center of the street, not insurgents in fighting stance, using tactics of any sort. No firefight at all.
So, maybe that was a mistake. But then they shoot everyone, cheer about it, and beg the journalist to go for a weapon, when there obviously aren't any around. Then a van pulls up to try to rescue the wounded, and they open fire again, killing two children.
Right, keep telling yourself 'PTSD and chronic drug abuse are not a problem. Our soldiers are FINE and don't need special care,' if that helps you sleep at night.
These guys are going to be tomorrow's homeless vets
The 'homeless vets' thing has been blown way out of proportion. Most of the 'vets' you see on the street are bums with an angle. The only thing they know about the service is what they've seen on the movies.
These guys - and tens of thousands of others - are going to be just what their peers were after coming back from Kuwait, Vietnam, Bosnia, Korea and the Pacific. Business leaders, professors, bus drivers, technicians. Quiet men who don't talk a lot about what they did but know their own value and get things done.
Keep telling yourself that if it helps you sleep better at night.
The civilians didn't have any weapons. Perhaps you are right, and someone did, but not the group of civilians and children who were massacred. And they live there, you know? Are you saying they should run from their homes? Why, so we don't shoot them? Is that just how we roll?
Please don't quote a hate site called 'my pet jawa' that is dedicated to eradicating 'sand people.' You won't earn points or garner any respect amongst civilized readers.
That means nothing without context. The group that was attacked were not using any kind of tactics and were not firing on anyone, they were simply walking down the center of the street. You claim you can see a gun and an RPG, okay, but even if you are right, that does not indict the group of innocent civilians.
If, as others claim, there was an attack ongoing a block away, why shoot the people who clearly are not involved?
If we just wrote him off as 'trash' we would never understand how he came to exist.
I understand fairly well how the trash in my kitchen rubbish bin came to exist.
Yes, I imagine you do. I'm guessing your idea is that 'someone tossed it there,' which, coincidentally, is also the reason for trashy people: society tossed them there.
Circumstance only goes so far as a rationalization for bad behavior and there comes a point when the individual needs to be held accountable for his or her choices.
I disagree. Somewhat. I will say this: a certain percentage of people simply are born good. A smaller percentage are born evil. Nothing society can do to either type of person will make them any different. However, the vast majority of people are only what society and their family make of them.
When you see unfairness around, do you say, "Oh noes, society isn't fair?!? wah!" or do you try to do something about it? If you are one of those people who are just born good, you try to do something, because you don't really have a choice. Witnessing unfairness is painful to people who were born with a powerful sense of justice and no way of turning off their empathy. Trust me, if I could choose to be a heartless bastard like you, I would. My life would be simpler, and less painful.
Way to maintain compassion towards the less fortunate. Only sociopaths like killing other people. Most people join the military for a paycheck, hoping they won't have to go to war. Or because they feel it is their duty, and they hope they won't have to go to an unjust war.
I'm sure that's true. But most sad sack losers aren't born sociopaths. They had their loser-nature beaten into them by circumstance. Most of the real sociopathic parasites on the ass of society are CEOs or board members of Fortune 500 companies, not sad children of broken families. Blame the sociopaths, not their victims.
My workplace blocks youtube, so I will have to wait until I get home to check the veracity and relevance of these statements, but at least you provide a reference so I can do so. I'll let you know what I find.
If you don't care for much else on the site, which is clearly a hate site calling for death to 'sand people,' then how do you know what is on the site? Why is that the site you link to? The fact that you would not even think such a site would be offensive to 99.9% of people on earth does much to illustrate your bias.
I'm not using an ad hominem fallacy. I'm making a logical argument: you are a bigot with an axe to grind, and therefore, information provided by you should be viewed in that light. If someone linked to a white supremacy site, that would be another example of bias clear enough to call judgment into question.
Remember, an ad hominem is an irrelevant personal attack. Poisoning the well is an irrelevant questioning of sources and motives. Neither one is a logical fallacy if it is actually relevant.
The choices that people make do not come out of the blue. They are not uncaused causes. They are part of an unbroken chain of cause and effect, and if we want to have a better world with less suffering, we must understand why people make the choices they do. Just saying 'they are worthless people' doesn't answer anything, contains no predictive power as a theory, and does nothing except provide an excuse not to care about a problem.
Honestly? You expect ANYONE to believe anything put up at a site called 'mypetjawa.mu.nu' You would debase yourself in front of all decent people by linking to an obvious hate site like that? You really don't mind that people now know you are a total bigot who thinks 'sand people' should all die?
Nobody in the group had RPGs or anything that looked remotely like them.
Did you even watch the video?
Did you? I saw nothing that made the group that was attacked look like anything but civilians. Tell me at what point in the video you saw an RPG, and I'll see if I can spot it.
Simply not true. One of the guys had an RPG and is clearly shown in the video with it. In addition, another US unit was under attack one block away.
Which guy, at what point in time in the video? What unit was under attack, one block in which direction exactly? If a unit was under attack, why were the helicopters mowing down civilians instead of helping the unit that was actually receiving fire? Why did none of these supposed enemy combatants try to find cover, if there was gunfire going on? Why did they not react to the presence of US military helicopters?
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The difference is that undertakers and medical examiners are not laughing at someone they have just murdered.
Ah, luckily we have you, someone who DOES understand what is a symptom and what is an underlying cause, to tell those idiots who've spent their lives studying things like psychology, sociology, and childhood development, that they are idiots who don't understand anything.
You know, it's funny how often 'chose not to be a perpetual victim' translates to 'I got mine, now screw everybody else.'
No, I'm sure that undertakers and EMTs don't joke about killing people. Some cops may, but not the one in my family.
You an take all the isolated parts of the video, the callous jokes, the attack on a vehicle trying to rescue the journalist, the wish that the journalist would make a move for a weapon, killing him even though he doesn't, the lack of any evidence that the people fired upon were combatants, the fact that they never acted like combatants: you can take all those and attempt to dismiss each, point by point. Or you can look at the whole picture, which is harder to dismiss.
Thank you for that. I see a group of civilians walking casually down the center of the street, not insurgents in fighting stance, using tactics of any sort. No firefight at all.
So, maybe that was a mistake. But then they shoot everyone, cheer about it, and beg the journalist to go for a weapon, when there obviously aren't any around. Then a van pulls up to try to rescue the wounded, and they open fire again, killing two children.
So what was your point again?
Right, keep telling yourself 'PTSD and chronic drug abuse are not a problem. Our soldiers are FINE and don't need special care,' if that helps you sleep at night.
These guys are going to be tomorrow's homeless vets
The 'homeless vets' thing has been blown way out of proportion. Most of the 'vets' you see on the street are bums with an angle. The only thing they know about the service is what they've seen on the movies.
These guys - and tens of thousands of others - are going to be just what their peers were after coming back from Kuwait, Vietnam, Bosnia, Korea and the Pacific. Business leaders, professors, bus drivers, technicians. Quiet men who don't talk a lot about what they did but know their own value and get things done.
Keep telling yourself that if it helps you sleep better at night.
The civilians didn't have any weapons. Perhaps you are right, and someone did, but not the group of civilians and children who were massacred. And they live there, you know? Are you saying they should run from their homes? Why, so we don't shoot them? Is that just how we roll?
Please don't quote a hate site called 'my pet jawa' that is dedicated to eradicating 'sand people.' You won't earn points or garner any respect amongst civilized readers.
That means nothing without context. The group that was attacked were not using any kind of tactics and were not firing on anyone, they were simply walking down the center of the street. You claim you can see a gun and an RPG, okay, but even if you are right, that does not indict the group of innocent civilians.
If, as others claim, there was an attack ongoing a block away, why shoot the people who clearly are not involved?
Absinthe? It will take more than that to put me under. Got any ketamine?
I guess that's why you posted AC, you don't want anyone knowing you read hate sites calling for the death of all 'sand people.'
I understand fairly well how the trash in my kitchen rubbish bin came to exist.
Yes, I imagine you do. I'm guessing your idea is that 'someone tossed it there,' which, coincidentally, is also the reason for trashy people: society tossed them there.
Circumstance only goes so far as a rationalization for bad behavior and there comes a point when the individual needs to be held accountable for his or her choices.
Okay, well that I can completely agree with.
I disagree. Somewhat. I will say this: a certain percentage of people simply are born good. A smaller percentage are born evil. Nothing society can do to either type of person will make them any different. However, the vast majority of people are only what society and their family make of them.
When you see unfairness around, do you say, "Oh noes, society isn't fair?!? wah!" or do you try to do something about it? If you are one of those people who are just born good, you try to do something, because you don't really have a choice. Witnessing unfairness is painful to people who were born with a powerful sense of justice and no way of turning off their empathy. Trust me, if I could choose to be a heartless bastard like you, I would. My life would be simpler, and less painful.
Thanks for clearing that up, now we know your bias.
You really think your post doesn't expose your bias?
Yes. I have an anti-massacre-of-civilians bias.
Way to maintain compassion towards the less fortunate. Only sociopaths like killing other people. Most people join the military for a paycheck, hoping they won't have to go to war. Or because they feel it is their duty, and they hope they won't have to go to an unjust war.
I'm sure that's true. But most sad sack losers aren't born sociopaths. They had their loser-nature beaten into them by circumstance. Most of the real sociopathic parasites on the ass of society are CEOs or board members of Fortune 500 companies, not sad children of broken families. Blame the sociopaths, not their victims.
My workplace blocks youtube, so I will have to wait until I get home to check the veracity and relevance of these statements, but at least you provide a reference so I can do so. I'll let you know what I find.
If you don't care for much else on the site, which is clearly a hate site calling for death to 'sand people,' then how do you know what is on the site? Why is that the site you link to? The fact that you would not even think such a site would be offensive to 99.9% of people on earth does much to illustrate your bias.
I'm not using an ad hominem fallacy. I'm making a logical argument: you are a bigot with an axe to grind, and therefore, information provided by you should be viewed in that light. If someone linked to a white supremacy site, that would be another example of bias clear enough to call judgment into question.
Remember, an ad hominem is an irrelevant personal attack. Poisoning the well is an irrelevant questioning of sources and motives. Neither one is a logical fallacy if it is actually relevant.
The choices that people make do not come out of the blue. They are not uncaused causes. They are part of an unbroken chain of cause and effect, and if we want to have a better world with less suffering, we must understand why people make the choices they do. Just saying 'they are worthless people' doesn't answer anything, contains no predictive power as a theory, and does nothing except provide an excuse not to care about a problem.
Sorry. It's just that some people actually do think that way. I'm glad you don't.
Choices come from life experience, genetics, and circumstance. "Choices" are not uncaused causes. Every choice has a reason it was made.
Honestly? You expect ANYONE to believe anything put up at a site called 'mypetjawa.mu.nu' You would debase yourself in front of all decent people by linking to an obvious hate site like that? You really don't mind that people now know you are a total bigot who thinks 'sand people' should all die?
Did you even watch the video?
Did you? I saw nothing that made the group that was attacked look like anything but civilians. Tell me at what point in the video you saw an RPG, and I'll see if I can spot it.
Simply not true. One of the guys had an RPG and is clearly shown in the video with it. In addition, another US unit was under attack one block away.
Which guy, at what point in time in the video? What unit was under attack, one block in which direction exactly? If a unit was under attack, why were the helicopters mowing down civilians instead of helping the unit that was actually receiving fire? Why did none of these supposed enemy combatants try to find cover, if there was gunfire going on? Why did they not react to the presence of US military helicopters?