The Air doesn't (no room), I forgot about the basic Macbook (as opposed to the Pro) which dropped firewire a couple of years ago but the mini most definitely does have firewire.
I don't think most MacBook buyers care about "having a Unix", nor do they care about the "niche software" that won't appear in the App Store. They care about "the user experience" and as long as Apple provides the same polished and stylish experience, being behind a walled garden wouldn't affect MacBook sales one bit.
There are more of us than you think, I see a lot of macs among unix admins. Anecdotal ? Maybe, but then so are your opinions on the matter.
The walled garden didn't stop you from buying an iPhone or iPad, and I don't believe that when the day comes it will stop you from buying a MacBook. And maybe Apple will keep the top-of-the line Macbook outside the garden, as I predict they will with the Mac Pro.
Another anecdote: a lot of people in my experience hold off buying the latest iPhone until there's a jailbreak and a lot more buy in the presumption that there will be a jailbreak in the near future (a pretty safe bet.) You can't say how these people would react in your hypothetical. And sadly we'll never know because it'll never happen:-)
the ability to unlock may only be available in a separate "professional" version of the OS.
Apple has never done this. They've got exactly 2 version of OSX: client and server and those differ only in a very few extra tools. They are not MS with their myriad confusing versions.
We object to the situation Apple has created with the iPhone/iPad/etc. were you are not allowed to install software that is not from the app store.
It'll never happen. The best evidence for this is that "analysts" keep saying it will, you know the same bunch of "experts" that wrote off Apple for dead a decade ago and have been wrong every step of the way since.
Mac-mini:~ CharlyFoxtrot$ which ruby /usr/bin/ruby Mac-mini:~ CharlyFoxtrot$ which python /usr/bin/python Mac-mini:~ CharlyFoxtrot$ which java /usr/bin/java Mac-mini:~ CharlyFoxtrot$ which perl /usr/bin/perl Mac-mini:~ CharlyFoxtrot$ which cc /usr/bin/cc Mac-mini:~ CharlyFoxtrot$ which gcc /usr/bin/gcc Mac-mini:bin CharlyFoxtrot$ which nasm /usr/bin/nasm
I can remember people bashing Lightpeak on this site because optical connectors were deemed impractical on household pc's, the fibre-optic cables to fragile, etc. Now everyone's on Apple's case for using copper instead. It's just the usual whining because people have decided not to like Apple.
It seems these days any new technology which Slashdot takes a dislike to goes on to enjoy huge success. Take for example the iPad, Facebook, Twitter... I am almost tempted to predict that Thunderbolt will be a huge success:)
Without high volume, the price will never come down. THAT is what the author meant.
Let's see intel will probably be including it in all their chipsets and motherboards and it'll ship on all macs. That's a lot of volume. And the price can be a little higher in the beginning since mac users are known for willing to spend a little extra on their peripherals.
Apple abandoned their previously beloved Firewire right after I purchased several peripheral that used it. For me, that's reason enough not to trust them with Thunderbolt.
I'll just stick with USB.
Firewire is still on all macs, how is it abandoned ? Besides this is an intel tech, do you trust them ?
No it won't. USB will be the next USB. The connector is too common now to ever be replaced as the default digital interface for most things. It's on the front of my car radio, for damn sake.
I can imagine someone making this kind of argument for the serial port just a couple of years ago and that's almost completely disappeared.
XFCE is suffering (through no fault of their own) from the same mindset that seems to want to restrict open source to Linux-only. From the 4.8 release :
"We hope that everyone will enjoy this release as much as we do. Sadly, this will not be the case as the folks using any of the BSD systems will notice a sudden loss of features. We think that this announcement is a good opportunity to express our disagreement with the recent "Linux-only" developments in the open source ecosystem, especially with regards to the utilities we need in desktop environments."
find-and-replacing in text files is what Unix has been all about for decades, trivial and easy.
You might want to take a look at what AIX and Solaris have been up to in the last decade. From the ODM to Solaris' SMF and its XML tangle, the basic text file has been steadily losing ground.
Numerous other applications, made by companies far smaller, manage to handle this right while retaining excellent app quality. If Netflix is having problems here, they should hire better devs or something.
Smaller companies have much less reputation at risk. A company like Netflix has a brand image to protect. Look at the link I posted elsewhere in the thread to the reaction of customers that couldn't run Angry Birds properly, it damages your reputation as a company. Sure it might work, but you won't know if you don't test and if you want to assure the quality that people expect from your brand, you absolutely have to test.
Linux boxes don't need tweaking all the time, set it up run updates and be done with it. Sounds like Unix admin in your case means Mac Weenie.
I'm a Mac weenie on my own time (OSX is a fully certified Unix too btw), at work I'm a Solaris/AIX sysadmin (there's even 1 or 2 Linux boxes in there that we need for interoperability with another company.) Linux on the desktop sucks, there's no middle ground either you are using it as set up by default or you're constantly tweaking it. That's just my opinion though and I've never really liked Linux, if given the choice I'd take a FreeBSD system over Linux any day.
Your iphone does not just work, send it a mime/multipart message that really only has html and text. Sure that should be mime/alternative, but either way showing nothing not even an error sure is not just working. We tested this on an iPhone 4 with all the updates and still it showed nothing, as though the email was blank.
I didn't say it was completely free from bugs but I don't have to admin it. There's no, or very little, maintenance to be done. I could give an iPad to my parents and they could happily use it for years without having to do maintenance on it.
Maybe I'm just very lucky but I'm not seeing a lot of video's that don't load, this is with Safari maybe there are less WebM video's than H.264 ? The interface could use a little TLC but I guess non-flash technologies are taking a backseat at Google at the moment.
The iPad being replaced by a newer version is completely different from not being able to run an application on all current devices. If you look at that list there are devices on there that are still being sold. Look at the comments, they speak for themselves :
"when officially compatible with Wildfire ?"
"I basically got the finger from Rovio. [...] I am not happy. I can download Seasons, play it once and it still self closes on launch. What next "Oh we're sorry because T&T won't allow you to upgrade to Eclair or Gingerbread you can't use our program". Bad Rovio"
"I have downloaded the original, Rio and Seasons. Rio works great while the original will not even load. Seasons will load but a lot of the graphics are whited out. I have a transform which is unsupported but will run some of them just fine.... just curious as to why this is?"
"Okay. This one goes in your mouth. This one's for your ear. And... This one goes in your butt." [scrambles plugs] "No wait, THIS one goes in your mouth,..."
Having to read a couple sentences means ordinary Joes are screwed?
You have one hell of a low expectation of those folks. As far as I can tell basically all of them made it through elementary school, reading is something they are quite clearly capable of.
I'm sure they can read them, understanding them is another matter. Go hang out in a department store computer section, see how many ask "how much memory a pc has" when they mean HD-size or how many grasp what a GPU is. This isn't something I hold against them, I'm equally useless when it comes to cars but they just work and I'm not expected to fiddle with them to get them to run.
So this type of app runs fine on all devices (for now), a better example would be when Rovio could not support Angry Birds on all Android devices because of performance worries. And what if Netflix implements some feature or eye-candy in a future version that would cause problems for some phones ? Then their customers would feel cheated, like Netflix dropped them. A PR disaster waiting to happen and Netflix' brand is one of their most important assets, far better from their standpoint to err on the side of caution.
My iPhone "just works", my mac does a good job of just working most of the time especially compared to a Windows box or a Linux that needs tweaking for every little thing. They're not time-sinks which is why I got them in the first place, I've got a kid and the remains of my social life which I'd rather put my time into. Don't get me wrong I love that these things exist for you to tweak and play with and maybe I'll get one of these Android phones one of these days as a hobby thing, but my main computer and phone are utensils: they have to work as well as possible with as little maintenance as possible.
So, every application on every platform is tested on every combination of hardware that is available for that platform? Thought not. And that hasn't been a problem. Until the trolls dreamed it up as a way to attack Android.
No not every application on every platform is tested with all hardware, that's how we got "system requirements" list and the paragon of application stability that is Windows (!) People keep comparing iOS vs Android with Mac vs Windows, as if going down the Windows path is a good thing. That's why it is used to critique Android.
It runs flawlessly on my OG Droid which is by far the slowest and most memory poor of any remotely modern Android phone with enough market share to matter.
So this one works for you, what if it had been a game or something more demanding ? That's the general point.
Support? For a streaming video player? Troll on, brother!
Again, I was making a general point. So you don't need support for this app, next time it'll maybe be a paid app and you'll be risking your money without a guarantee of support.
P.S. Looks like Slashdot has hit a new low when people are scorned for using their devices the way they want and not at the whim of the corporate nanny. Truly a sad day.
I think all users should be able to "root" or "jailbreak" any device they own if they so choose. The point was that he had to root it to do what he did, by your definition the iPhone isn't crippled either because it can be rooted to install unapproved apps or run another OS too.
Slashdot Mirror
The Air doesn't (no room), I forgot about the basic Macbook (as opposed to the Pro) which dropped firewire a couple of years ago but the mini most definitely does have firewire.
I don't think most MacBook buyers care about "having a Unix", nor do they care about the "niche software" that won't appear in the App Store. They care about "the user experience" and as long as Apple provides the same polished and stylish experience, being behind a walled garden wouldn't affect MacBook sales one bit.
There are more of us than you think, I see a lot of macs among unix admins. Anecdotal ? Maybe, but then so are your opinions on the matter.
The walled garden didn't stop you from buying an iPhone or iPad, and I don't believe that when the day comes it will stop you from buying a MacBook. And maybe Apple will keep the top-of-the line Macbook outside the garden, as I predict they will with the Mac Pro.
Another anecdote: a lot of people in my experience hold off buying the latest iPhone until there's a jailbreak and a lot more buy in the presumption that there will be a jailbreak in the near future (a pretty safe bet.) You can't say how these people would react in your hypothetical. And sadly we'll never know because it'll never happen :-)
the ability to unlock may only be available in a separate "professional" version of the OS.
Apple has never done this. They've got exactly 2 version of OSX: client and server and those differ only in a very few extra tools. They are not MS with their myriad confusing versions.
We object to the situation Apple has created with the iPhone/iPad/etc. were you are not allowed to install software that is not from the app store.
It'll never happen. The best evidence for this is that "analysts" keep saying it will, you know the same bunch of "experts" that wrote off Apple for dead a decade ago and have been wrong every step of the way since.
Below average trolling this. From my mac :
Mac-mini:~ CharlyFoxtrot$ which ruby
/usr/bin/ruby
/usr/bin/python
/usr/bin/java
/usr/bin/perl
/usr/bin/cc
/usr/bin/gcc
/usr/bin/nasm
Mac-mini:~ CharlyFoxtrot$ which python
Mac-mini:~ CharlyFoxtrot$ which java
Mac-mini:~ CharlyFoxtrot$ which perl
Mac-mini:~ CharlyFoxtrot$ which cc
Mac-mini:~ CharlyFoxtrot$ which gcc
Mac-mini:bin CharlyFoxtrot$ which nasm
What the hell more do you need ?
Or the humble question mark.
I can remember people bashing Lightpeak on this site because optical connectors were deemed impractical on household pc's, the fibre-optic cables to fragile, etc. Now everyone's on Apple's case for using copper instead. It's just the usual whining because people have decided not to like Apple.
It seems these days any new technology which Slashdot takes a dislike to goes on to enjoy huge success. Take for example the iPad, Facebook, Twitter... I am almost tempted to predict that Thunderbolt will be a huge success :)
forgot the infamous iPod story.
Without high volume, the price will never come down. THAT is what the author meant.
Let's see intel will probably be including it in all their chipsets and motherboards and it'll ship on all macs. That's a lot of volume. And the price can be a little higher in the beginning since mac users are known for willing to spend a little extra on their peripherals.
Apple abandoned their previously beloved Firewire right after I purchased several peripheral that used it. For me, that's reason enough not to trust them with Thunderbolt.
I'll just stick with USB.
Firewire is still on all macs, how is it abandoned ? Besides this is an intel tech, do you trust them ?
No it won't. USB will be the next USB. The connector is too common now to ever be replaced as the default digital interface for most things. It's on the front of my car radio, for damn sake.
I can imagine someone making this kind of argument for the serial port just a couple of years ago and that's almost completely disappeared.
XFCE is suffering (through no fault of their own) from the same mindset that seems to want to restrict open source to Linux-only. From the 4.8 release :
"We hope that everyone will enjoy this release as much as we do. Sadly, this will not be the case as the folks using any of the BSD systems will notice a sudden loss of features. We think that this announcement is a good opportunity to express our disagreement with the recent "Linux-only" developments in the open source ecosystem, especially with regards to the utilities we need in desktop environments."
More info here.
Please refrain from using logic, it interferes with the Two Minutes Hate.
Must all be done by female coders as we all know men can't commit.
find-and-replacing in text files is what Unix has been all about for decades, trivial and easy.
You might want to take a look at what AIX and Solaris have been up to in the last decade. From the ODM to Solaris' SMF and its XML tangle, the basic text file has been steadily losing ground.
Numerous other applications, made by companies far smaller, manage to handle this right while retaining excellent app quality. If Netflix is having problems here, they should hire better devs or something.
Smaller companies have much less reputation at risk. A company like Netflix has a brand image to protect. Look at the link I posted elsewhere in the thread to the reaction of customers that couldn't run Angry Birds properly, it damages your reputation as a company. Sure it might work, but you won't know if you don't test and if you want to assure the quality that people expect from your brand, you absolutely have to test.
Linux boxes don't need tweaking all the time, set it up run updates and be done with it. Sounds like Unix admin in your case means Mac Weenie.
I'm a Mac weenie on my own time (OSX is a fully certified Unix too btw), at work I'm a Solaris/AIX sysadmin (there's even 1 or 2 Linux boxes in there that we need for interoperability with another company.) Linux on the desktop sucks, there's no middle ground either you are using it as set up by default or you're constantly tweaking it. That's just my opinion though and I've never really liked Linux, if given the choice I'd take a FreeBSD system over Linux any day.
Your iphone does not just work, send it a mime/multipart message that really only has html and text. Sure that should be mime/alternative, but either way showing nothing not even an error sure is not just working. We tested this on an iPhone 4 with all the updates and still it showed nothing, as though the email was blank.
I didn't say it was completely free from bugs but I don't have to admin it. There's no, or very little, maintenance to be done. I could give an iPad to my parents and they could happily use it for years without having to do maintenance on it.
Maybe I'm just very lucky but I'm not seeing a lot of video's that don't load, this is with Safari maybe there are less WebM video's than H.264 ? The interface could use a little TLC but I guess non-flash technologies are taking a backseat at Google at the moment.
The iPad being replaced by a newer version is completely different from not being able to run an application on all current devices. If you look at that list there are devices on there that are still being sold. Look at the comments, they speak for themselves :
"when officially compatible with Wildfire ?"
"I basically got the finger from Rovio. [...] I am not happy. I can download Seasons, play it once and it still self closes on launch. What next "Oh we're sorry because T&T won't allow you to upgrade to Eclair or Gingerbread you can't use our program". Bad Rovio"
"I have downloaded the original, Rio and Seasons. Rio works great while the original will not even load. Seasons will load but a lot of the graphics are whited out. I have a transform which is unsupported but will run some of them just fine.... just curious as to why this is?"
These are real problems real users are having.
"Okay. This one goes in your mouth. This one's for your ear. And... This one goes in your butt." ..."
[scrambles plugs]
"No wait, THIS one goes in your mouth,
Having to read a couple sentences means ordinary Joes are screwed?
You have one hell of a low expectation of those folks. As far as I can tell basically all of them made it through elementary school, reading is something they are quite clearly capable of.
I'm sure they can read them, understanding them is another matter. Go hang out in a department store computer section, see how many ask "how much memory a pc has" when they mean HD-size or how many grasp what a GPU is. This isn't something I hold against them, I'm equally useless when it comes to cars but they just work and I'm not expected to fiddle with them to get them to run.
So this type of app runs fine on all devices (for now), a better example would be when Rovio could not support Angry Birds on all Android devices because of performance worries. And what if Netflix implements some feature or eye-candy in a future version that would cause problems for some phones ? Then their customers would feel cheated, like Netflix dropped them. A PR disaster waiting to happen and Netflix' brand is one of their most important assets, far better from their standpoint to err on the side of caution.
My iPhone "just works", my mac does a good job of just working most of the time especially compared to a Windows box or a Linux that needs tweaking for every little thing. They're not time-sinks which is why I got them in the first place, I've got a kid and the remains of my social life which I'd rather put my time into. Don't get me wrong I love that these things exist for you to tweak and play with and maybe I'll get one of these Android phones one of these days as a hobby thing, but my main computer and phone are utensils: they have to work as well as possible with as little maintenance as possible.
So, every application on every platform is tested on every combination of hardware that is available for that platform? Thought not. And that hasn't been a problem. Until the trolls dreamed it up as a way to attack Android.
No not every application on every platform is tested with all hardware, that's how we got "system requirements" list and the paragon of application stability that is Windows (!) People keep comparing iOS vs Android with Mac vs Windows, as if going down the Windows path is a good thing. That's why it is used to critique Android.
It runs flawlessly on my OG Droid which is by far the slowest and most memory poor of any remotely modern Android phone with enough market share to matter.
So this one works for you, what if it had been a game or something more demanding ? That's the general point.
Support? For a streaming video player? Troll on, brother!
Again, I was making a general point. So you don't need support for this app, next time it'll maybe be a paid app and you'll be risking your money without a guarantee of support.
P.S. Looks like Slashdot has hit a new low when people are scorned for using their devices the way they want and not at the whim of the corporate nanny. Truly a sad day.
I think all users should be able to "root" or "jailbreak" any device they own if they so choose. The point was that he had to root it to do what he did, by your definition the iPhone isn't crippled either because it can be rooted to install unapproved apps or run another OS too.