you are completely correct... I was only suggesting that the impact amounted to fractions of a cent by being able to position ahead of the trades going through
also didn't mean to suggest that there was actually any fee being taken... rather that the traders that front-run pay result in in increased exchange fees which is why exchanges wont stamp it out
They could and do with stable core systems, but...
suppose someone scatters $1,000,000 of cash in the street... what do you do?
plan out the lowest risk way to collect all the cash? well, you just got beaten by all the people who jump on it with elbows and knees flying everywhere and injures to be had
HFT by itself does not pervert the market... it creates liquidity which typically reduces volatility as well
There are 2 main concerns though: 1. algorithm errors which can cause runaway price movements 2. front running
in the first case, it has no impact on long-term investors and typically little impact on short-term traders but can act as a catalyst for wider sentiment moves.. but then so can many things (major bankruptcies, terrorist attacks, move in debt markets, etc) when the human traders are looking for triggers
typically, the market will correct straight back to its original level and someone will have profited on the opposite side of the error
in the second case, this is a major problem which is not strictly HFT but is an add-on to HFT... it allows the HF traders to effectively take fractions of cents on every deal done at the expense of institutional and private investors (ie investors not traders) in return for increase exchange fees being paid
so effectively the exchange are taking a small backdoor fee on every deal done while allowing HFT to keep some and assumed the real investors wont notice fractions of cents
So i'd suggest HFT is fine but front running isn't - every trader/investor should have equal information or a simple trading lag (eg 1 second) would suffice
Who lifts 50kg with their finger tips anyway - not even a static 50kg could be simulated. And even if this is expanded to whole-of-hand can it really apply 500N of force ???
Fine motor control for remote applications - whole different story and a fantastic application...
With 6 million annual visitors and a 20+% growth rate, it currently is ahead of places like Argentina, Brazil, India, Japan and Australia... while rapidly closing in on Hawaii, Portugal, South Africa and Egypt.
Also for the US audience - already twice the tourism level of Cancun - so don't doubt the big money that is about to pour into that place.
Vietnam is clearly heading to replace Thailand for many people.
mmm... guarantee there are not many HFT that are also MBAs... completely different segments of the financial markets
it is widely reported that Mark Zuckerberg engineered the whole acquisition over a 3 day period and I'd guarantee it wasn't done on a $/user basis
but more importantly, it would be the MBAs and investment banks telling the Facebook founders to get out - quite an astute recommendation... while it would be the uneducated mom-and-dad investors investing... so who's the dummies there?
Agreed but Instagram's market is not sending photos - email, facebook and phone messaging did that just fine - that is just a commodity market now (every smartphone and $50 camera can do that) with little differentiation other than scope of recipients.
The Instagram market is around the filters and allowing people to express themselves via that, rather than just 'capturing' the moment. The sharing is secondary in this context.
But if you take 80M of my profitable customers from me, it doesn't matter if you make no profit from them or not - I might be happy to just pay you $1B to go away
The marginal benefits of switching to an equivalent is always small for such a simple product and being a mass market social media product dictates that people will gravitate to the market leaders - that is, little point in joining a social platform is no-one else is there
So that limits Instagram competitors to: - niche "photo" markets such as where Flickr is now placed - disruptive "photo" products like Pinterest has done with a different take on "photo sharing"
Clearly the acquisition of Instagram was a defensive move in the social networking space - it was starting to build a market that would otherwise chip away at Facebook - and you'd think they learnt their lesson from letting Twitter grow into a competitor
So, of course, you'd expect it to get written-down as just enough functionality is incorporated into Facebook to ensure another competitor doesn't pop up in the same "social photo" space. But also expect them to let it die a slow death (rather than shut it down) to maximise the defensive value of the acquisition.
Doesn't keep American mass brewed junk from being the most popular beer in those locales.
Interesting that even though I'm the troll according to the mods, you are the one making value judgements and slandering people based on their preferred beverage.
First paragraph of wikipedia entry nicely sums up why this would be the case... that is, it was a clone that was ported to run on a different (albiet VERY similar) instruction set, a different file system and obviously different hardware support.
You'd think after that either: - not much of the original code with survive IF it was copied and then adapted - it was probably easier to copy the functionality and write from ground-up which is what this article implies
MS-DOS was a renamed form of 86-DOS – informally known as the Quick-and-Dirty Operating System or Q-DOS – owned by Seattle Computer Products, written by Tim Paterson.
Microsoft needed an operating system for the then-new Intel 8086 but it had none available, so it bought 86-DOS for $75,000 and licensed it as its own then released a version of it as MS-DOS 1.0. Development started in 1981, and MS-DOS 1.0 was released with the IBM PC in 1982.
86-DOS, in turn, was a clone of Digital Research's CP/M for 8080/Z80 processors ported to run on 8086 processors and with two notable differences compared to CP/M, an improved disk sector buffering logic and the introduction of FAT12 instead of the CP/M filesystem
Seems like $2 coffee is strange when quality coffee is $3.50 and premium is $4-$4.20 (in my part of the world and I'd assume similar elsewhere).... but your beer analogy is a very good one
Poor trolling or advanced irony... I'm not sure ???
Seattle has a good reputation for coffee - right up there with cities like Rome, Vienna, Buenos Aires and my home town of Melbourne.
We closed 16 of our Starbucks that couldn't turn a profit and you'd have to be insane to drink coffee from McDonalds, DD or 7-11 given the other choices. I'd assume the same in Seattle and Pacific NW in general.
So trolling Starbucks or being ironic about the others... not sure !
Counting through the predictions I'd say 10-20% of those accurate with maybe 50% pointing to trends that may happen (and probably where started before 1987 anyway like credit cards leading the way for cashless society).
Pretty crappy performance really - and generally over-estimating the rate of progress. But I think that is well known phenomenon where people over-estimate progress over 10-30 years but substantially fall short on predictions for 50-100 years. Interesting paradox !!!
That sounds fairly ambitious but best of luck to you...
If your handicap is a poor memory then I would suggest that you try self-taught initially as you'll need to find YOUR own way to learn that will work for YOUR memory - I suspect the school approach of memorise to pass exams would be a major disadvantage.
If that really doesn't work then I'd consider why... if you are hampered in your ability to structure the learning or just genuinely need more explanation of the content then I'd go the schooling route.
AFAIK there is not a single country that has repealed copyrights laws at the bequest of its 'governed' population - there is a very VOCAL minority for sure and many/most people here would be part of that but it is still just a minority
We need an established law that states that a content owner must prove that they are making available the content they own for purchase in ALL available markets, shops, and storefronts.
While most of your comment makes sense, this is clearly not practical... These all seem to be available in DVD format (as the source of the pirated copies) so your argument appears to be that this is not suitable format for you - not sure if you'd dont own a DVD player or region coding is the issue.
So if I understand, you are saying piracy is okay because you dont "want" to buy DVDs because you prefer digital formats?
Or, are you are suggesting 30 year old TV shows need to be available to cater to EVERYONE'S needs: - Betamax NTSC, various PAL, SECAM - VHS multiple standard - Laserdisc - DVD - Bluray - Digital including all standard formats (MP4, WMV, MOV, AVI, etc) and proprietary formats - in all languages combinations - in all digital outlets (Netflix, Amazon, iTunes, etc, etc) - and god knows what else
Actually the more I type the more ridiculous it seems
On one hand we have a profitable entertainment industry (that people love and feed) who want to retain their profits
On the other hand we have a large group of people with a deluded sense of "entitlement": - i shouldn't have to wait because I'm international - i shouldn't have to watch advertising - i shouldn't have to buy a whole cable package - i shouldn't be limited to what device i watch it on
So lets be honest, we (and myself included) pirate because "we want", we know there is almost no chance of being caught and view it as victimless.
The NY Times article is interesting but is not going to change any of those fundamentals...
The one thing that will change piracy is either technological block (which is unlikely) or the music model of cheaper prices. Music piracy decreased dramatically since the Napster days because of single track pricing and better infrastructure.
What does that have to do with being a country of not?
Curiously, I am a New Zealander and this island is New Zealand territory with the New Zealand mainland funding the entire project and being constructed by New Zealand companies.
So, as a matter of fact, it is MY country...
BTW - nice troll on the anti-USA war/oil thing... a nice old standard... i rate 3/10 for effort
Slashdot Mirror
you are completely correct ... I was only suggesting that the impact amounted to fractions of a cent by being able to position ahead of the trades going through
also didn't mean to suggest that there was actually any fee being taken ... rather that the traders that front-run pay result in in increased exchange fees which is why exchanges wont stamp it out
They could and do with stable core systems, but ...
suppose someone scatters $1,000,000 of cash in the street ... what do you do?
plan out the lowest risk way to collect all the cash? well, you just got beaten by all the people who jump on it with elbows and knees flying everywhere and injures to be had
that's kind of how HFT works !!!
HFT by itself does not pervert the market ... it creates liquidity which typically reduces volatility as well
There are 2 main concerns though:
1. algorithm errors which can cause runaway price movements
2. front running
in the first case, it has no impact on long-term investors and typically little impact on short-term traders but can act as a catalyst for wider sentiment moves .. but then so can many things (major bankruptcies, terrorist attacks, move in debt markets, etc) when the human traders are looking for triggers
typically, the market will correct straight back to its original level and someone will have profited on the opposite side of the error
in the second case, this is a major problem which is not strictly HFT but is an add-on to HFT ... it allows the HF traders to effectively take fractions of cents on every deal done at the expense of institutional and private investors (ie investors not traders) in return for increase exchange fees being paid
so effectively the exchange are taking a small backdoor fee on every deal done while allowing HFT to keep some and assumed the real investors wont notice fractions of cents
So i'd suggest HFT is fine but front running isn't - every trader/investor should have equal information or a simple trading lag (eg 1 second) would suffice
Exactly !
Who lifts 50kg with their finger tips anyway - not even a static 50kg could be simulated. And even if this is expanded to whole-of-hand can it really apply 500N of force ???
Fine motor control for remote applications - whole different story and a fantastic application ...
On 7500 sample you are looking at a std dev of around 0.5% ... so error bars (at 95% confidence) would be VERY ROUGHLY plus/minus 1%
'troll' or 'off-topic' --- take your choice
They indeed do ... even if you were being funny.
With 6 million annual visitors and a 20+% growth rate, it currently is ahead of places like Argentina, Brazil, India, Japan and Australia ... while rapidly closing in on Hawaii, Portugal, South Africa and Egypt.
Also for the US audience - already twice the tourism level of Cancun - so don't doubt the big money that is about to pour into that place.
Vietnam is clearly heading to replace Thailand for many people.
mmm ... guarantee there are not many HFT that are also MBAs ... completely different segments of the financial markets
it is widely reported that Mark Zuckerberg engineered the whole acquisition over a 3 day period and I'd guarantee it wasn't done on a $/user basis
but more importantly, it would be the MBAs and investment banks telling the Facebook founders to get out - quite an astute recommendation ... while it would be the uneducated mom-and-dad investors investing ... so who's the dummies there?
Are you aware that Instagram also had its own networking aspects away from Facebook?
In the same way you tweet to Facebook but Twitter has its own standalone network as well.
Agreed but Instagram's market is not sending photos - email, facebook and phone messaging did that just fine - that is just a commodity market now (every smartphone and $50 camera can do that) with little differentiation other than scope of recipients.
The Instagram market is around the filters and allowing people to express themselves via that, rather than just 'capturing' the moment. The sharing is secondary in this context.
You are correct ...
But if you take 80M of my profitable customers from me, it doesn't matter if you make no profit from them or not - I might be happy to just pay you $1B to go away
Might be simple and easy to replicate but http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First-mover_advantage is important
The marginal benefits of switching to an equivalent is always small for such a simple product and being a mass market social media product dictates that people will gravitate to the market leaders - that is, little point in joining a social platform is no-one else is there
So that limits Instagram competitors to:
- niche "photo" markets such as where Flickr is now placed
- disruptive "photo" products like Pinterest has done with a different take on "photo sharing"
Clearly the acquisition of Instagram was a defensive move in the social networking space - it was starting to build a market that would otherwise chip away at Facebook - and you'd think they learnt their lesson from letting Twitter grow into a competitor
So, of course, you'd expect it to get written-down as just enough functionality is incorporated into Facebook to ensure another competitor doesn't pop up in the same "social photo" space. But also expect them to let it die a slow death (rather than shut it down) to maximise the defensive value of the acquisition.
Doesn't keep American mass brewed junk from being the most popular beer in those locales.
Interesting that even though I'm the troll according to the mods, you are the one making value judgements and slandering people based on their preferred beverage.
Love you work ... that is classic
First paragraph of wikipedia entry nicely sums up why this would be the case ... that is, it was a clone that was ported to run on a different (albiet VERY similar) instruction set, a different file system and obviously different hardware support.
You'd think after that either:
- not much of the original code with survive IF it was copied and then adapted
- it was probably easier to copy the functionality and write from ground-up which is what this article implies
MS-DOS was a renamed form of 86-DOS – informally known as the Quick-and-Dirty Operating System or Q-DOS – owned by Seattle Computer Products, written by Tim Paterson.
Microsoft needed an operating system for the then-new Intel 8086 but it had none available, so it bought 86-DOS for $75,000 and licensed it as its own then released a version of it as MS-DOS 1.0. Development started in 1981, and MS-DOS 1.0 was released with the IBM PC in 1982.
86-DOS, in turn, was a clone of Digital Research's CP/M for 8080/Z80 processors ported to run on 8086 processors and with two notable differences compared to CP/M, an improved disk sector buffering logic and the introduction of FAT12 instead of the CP/M filesystem
Fair points ...
Seems like $2 coffee is strange when quality coffee is $3.50 and premium is $4-$4.20 (in my part of the world and I'd assume similar elsewhere) .... but your beer analogy is a very good one
Poor trolling or advanced irony ... I'm not sure ???
Seattle has a good reputation for coffee - right up there with cities like Rome, Vienna, Buenos Aires and my home town of Melbourne.
We closed 16 of our Starbucks that couldn't turn a profit and you'd have to be insane to drink coffee from McDonalds, DD or 7-11 given the other choices. I'd assume the same in Seattle and Pacific NW in general.
So trolling Starbucks or being ironic about the others ... not sure !
Counting through the predictions I'd say 10-20% of those accurate with maybe 50% pointing to trends that may happen (and probably where started before 1987 anyway like credit cards leading the way for cashless society).
Pretty crappy performance really - and generally over-estimating the rate of progress. But I think that is well known phenomenon where people over-estimate progress over 10-30 years but substantially fall short on predictions for 50-100 years. Interesting paradox !!!
That sounds fairly ambitious but best of luck to you ...
If your handicap is a poor memory then I would suggest that you try self-taught initially as you'll need to find YOUR own way to learn that will work for YOUR memory - I suspect the school approach of memorise to pass exams would be a major disadvantage.
If that really doesn't work then I'd consider why ... if you are hampered in your ability to structure the learning or just genuinely need more explanation of the content then I'd go the schooling route.
Nope ... that is FAR from clear
AFAIK there is not a single country that has repealed copyrights laws at the bequest of its 'governed' population - there is a very VOCAL minority for sure and many/most people here would be part of that but it is still just a minority
We need an established law that states that a content owner must prove that they are making available the content they own for purchase in ALL available markets, shops, and storefronts.
While most of your comment makes sense, this is clearly not practical ... These all seem to be available in DVD format (as the source of the pirated copies) so your argument appears to be that this is not suitable format for you - not sure if you'd dont own a DVD player or region coding is the issue.
So if I understand, you are saying piracy is okay because you dont "want" to buy DVDs because you prefer digital formats?
Or, are you are suggesting 30 year old TV shows need to be available to cater to EVERYONE'S needs:
- Betamax NTSC, various PAL, SECAM
- VHS multiple standard
- Laserdisc
- DVD
- Bluray
- Digital including all standard formats (MP4, WMV, MOV, AVI, etc) and proprietary formats
- in all languages combinations
- in all digital outlets (Netflix, Amazon, iTunes, etc, etc)
- and god knows what else
Actually the more I type the more ridiculous it seems
not really sure why this is news
I blame it on relativistic time dilation ...
to an observer in travelling at Slashdot speed this appears to have just occurred, whilst to a stationary observer 87 years appear to have passed ...
this dilation seems to apply uniformly across most observed Slashdot articles (albiet with yet-to-be-explained time loops as well!)
or are the physicists the abstract artists of the science world while the mathematicians are the boring paint suppliers?
just saying ...
On one hand we have a profitable entertainment industry (that people love and feed) who want to retain their profits
On the other hand we have a large group of people with a deluded sense of "entitlement":
- i shouldn't have to wait because I'm international
- i shouldn't have to watch advertising
- i shouldn't have to buy a whole cable package
- i shouldn't be limited to what device i watch it on
So lets be honest, we (and myself included) pirate because "we want", we know there is almost no chance of being caught and view it as victimless.
The NY Times article is interesting but is not going to change any of those fundamentals ...
The one thing that will change piracy is either technological block (which is unlikely) or the music model of cheaper prices. Music piracy decreased dramatically since the Napster days because of single track pricing and better infrastructure.
What does that have to do with being a country of not?
Curiously, I am a New Zealander and this island is New Zealand territory with the New Zealand mainland funding the entire project and being constructed by New Zealand companies.
So, as a matter of fact, it is MY country ...
BTW - nice troll on the anti-USA war/oil thing ... a nice old standard ... i rate 3/10 for effort