the point of this spec is to retain compatibility with and seem natural to those familiar with Ethernet
Why? This technology won't be for links to the desktop for a decade. This is pretty much backbone only stuff right now. Ethernet has had it's share of phyiscal links. There is no reason for them not to brake compatability with existing cabling.
I've seen system controllers that had the memory controller, CPU bus, and 10 gigabit ethernet in the same chip. If you can get 10 gigabit to memory, you can use all the bandwidth. At least in bursts...
3) How far is 10Gb Ethernet from getting to the consumer/business market?
I know of companies that have had 10 gigabit ethernet chips working internally for over 3 years now. They were just waiting for the standard to come out. Now they'll tweak their chips to meet the standard and release them. You should be seeing these in stores Real Soon Now(TM). Expect them to cost between $1k and $3k per HBA at first though. They probably won't reach an affordable level for 5 years or so. We still haven't completed the transition to gigabit.
Gigabit ethernet took all it's electronic specifications from fibre channel. When Gigabit came out, there was already copper available for fibre channel, and there was nothing stopping you from using those GBICs. The recent development was that they figured out how to get the signal over regular CAT5.
I'm sure that there will be a copper spec for 10 gigabit too, it's probably just not ready yet. Consider that people will be wanting to use this on the backplane of embedded network hardware, and blade servers.
Don't let the fork get you down, the kimberlite-dev list is still active, and kimberlite is still supported. Unlike some other companies, we don't make it difficult to find the code if you want to contribute, and you can peak into the CVS repository if you want to see what's going on. You'll need to look in CVS for the latest code, since we don't seem to have updated the packages or tarballs for quite some time. Check out the kimberlite website for mailing lists and such.
Download it and try it out. Or better yet, call us and buy the commercial version. It's about the same price or cheaper then RedHat advanced server, and you're not stuck running RedHat.
Having no speed limit doesn't do much good for a state's speeding-ticket revenue. They've gotten themselves addicted to the extra money and don't want to give it up.
You've hit the nail on the head. I remember when trafic laws were supposed to be about safety. I've seen as many accidents in the last month caused by people slamming on their brakes from seeing a cop in the rain as I have for any other reason.
More realistically, if you loaded 4 people into it, you probably have a hard time going up hills, and your max speed would be 90 only down steep hills. Just like any car with a sub-100 horsepower engine.
Why aren't you refusing to use IE because it doesn't support CSS correctly? It's time for MS to bite the bullet, and support some web standards like everybody else.
The problem with the ICC is that we can't both go along with it, and assure US citizens all of their constitutional rights. Becoming a member of the ICC is unconstitutional.
Re:Wonder what EMC thinks?
on
IBM Spins Down
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· Score: 2
EMC and IBM have been in competition for a long time. They've been buying drives from their next door neighbor, Maxtor/Quantum, for quite a while now.
I would think that they'd want security in there to protect their trade secrets. If information like this gets out (oops) then people will be able to make unlicenced games, and that would trash Microsoft's console business model.
It's necissary if you want to create a compatible and competing unit, or if you want to create compatable but competing software, which was completely allowed last I checked.
I agree that there are no quality solutions on the market at present, but I happen to work with USB all the time, like writing actual code, and creating actual devices. I'm not talking out of my ass. The bus technology is not to blame. There are issues, and they can be overcome.
A full DVD video feed with 5.1 audio only uses 80.4% of USBs available bandwidth. If you're going to blame the poor quality of existing devices on manufacturers trying to save a few cents per unit, then that's one thing, but there is no reason you can't reliably stream DVD quality content over USB. That is, in fact, what USB was designed for: streaming media.
If you want to assume that a USB video device will be low quality based on available products, don't pin the blame on a perfectly capable technology. If you do that you'll just end up with the same crappy devices that plug into a more expensive bus.
I dream that one day future PCs will be designed based on technological merits instead of marketing doublespeak. Unfortunatly that day will likely never come.
Unions make life more difficult for hard workers..
on
The Venture Cafe
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· Score: 1, Troll
Working in a union environment means that it's harder to get rid of the poeple who don't work as hard as they should. It also removes alot of incentive to try and achieve more. Why work hard to get that raise if you're already guaranteed it in your union contract? There's a whole host of other issues that come up in typical union environments too. Someone has to pick up the slack when a union worker only does as much work as necissary for the union to keep him/her from getting fired. Sure, not all union workers do that, but it only takes a few.
Don't get me wrong, I think that unions are important. I also think they should be temporary. Workers should be allowed to organize to overcome an important problem, and then they should go away until the next 'unresolvable' issue. They shouldn't be allowed to stick around and engage in what is essentially racketeering. Companies should also be allowed to hire replacements for workers that are on strike, as long as the new workers are hired on the same terms that the strikers are protesting against.
And what is this mythical 40 hour work week you speak of? Don't you mean 80 hours?
Well, you get your wish. All their marketing material says "Product lifetime". Also, this is way different then a warranty. If a lifetime product waranty ended with the lifetime of the product, you would get nothing. With a service you use all the time, you get the benifit of the service for as long as you maintain your unit. I think that "Product lifetime" is a better name then "unit subscription". You can tell what "product lifetime" means without ambiguity.
What makes you assume that the video quality would suffer due to MPEG2 over USB? USB can easily stream DVD quality MPEG2 video with bandwidth to spare, and MPEG2 can encode to quite high quality. Where's your source video coming from if that quality isn't high enough?
Not only do they put it in the not so fine print, but when you call to subscribe (at least when I called), they made sure I understood clearly that lifetime meant life of the box. There's no conspiracy here. Move along.
(BTW, I think this lifetime arrangement it better then most other 'lifetime' things, that don't transfer to a new owner. What 'lifetime' contract or guarantee have you ever heard of that continues on to something new you buy?)
Maybe now some young Computer Science student can spend more time on developing a good overall program, instead of spending a bunch of time writing simple things like their own sorting routine.
Yeah, that's great. Maybe now all the new CS grads will be so clueless that I'll have more job security.... </sarcasm>
Unfortunatly this isn't a perfect world, and if students stop learning the basics like writing a good sort routine it just means that in a few years I'm going to have some really obnoxious coworkers, and I'm going to end up doing a higher percentage of the work. Good job Georgia tech!
If you learn what you are supposed to from a computer science education, you learn that all the problems can be broken down to layers of simple soultions. Then you learn to understand the simple solutions. If you really understand the simple solutions, you already know how to put the parts to gether into a good whole. If you can't understand the simple stuff, what good are you? It's important to make CS students prove they understand the simple stuff. The rest isn't nearly as important.
Practically everying I download is copyrighted, including the slashdot page I'm typing this into. Most of it is freely available. Copyright doesn't imply that payment is necissary. It's unfortunate that the people with the most money available to buy laws with have the narrowest view as to how the existing laws work.
Slashdot Mirror
They call it ethernet because of the frame type, not because of the physical layer. You don't need to do any encapsulation.
the point of this spec is to retain compatibility with and seem natural to those familiar with Ethernet
Why? This technology won't be for links to the desktop for a decade. This is pretty much backbone only stuff right now. Ethernet has had it's share of phyiscal links. There is no reason for them not to brake compatability with existing cabling.
you won't need to broadcast your own
That's a crock. How do you not broadcast your own? You need to transmit to be on the network. Everybody using the network broadcasts.
I've seen system controllers that had the memory controller, CPU bus, and 10 gigabit ethernet in the same chip. If you can get 10 gigabit to memory, you can use all the bandwidth. At least in bursts...
the only way to have 10Gb over copper is to limit the connection distance to centimeters!
Why is that bad? Centimeters is plenty for backplane traffic.
Also, who said it had to be over CAT5?
3) How far is 10Gb Ethernet from getting to the consumer/business market?
I know of companies that have had 10 gigabit ethernet chips working internally for over 3 years now. They were just waiting for the standard to come out. Now they'll tweak their chips to meet the standard and release them. You should be seeing these in stores Real Soon Now(TM). Expect them to cost between $1k and $3k per HBA at first though. They probably won't reach an affordable level for 5 years or so. We still haven't completed the transition to gigabit.
Gigabit ethernet took all it's electronic specifications from fibre channel. When Gigabit came out, there was already copper available for fibre channel, and there was nothing stopping you from using those GBICs. The recent development was that they figured out how to get the signal over regular CAT5.
I'm sure that there will be a copper spec for 10 gigabit too, it's probably just not ready yet. Consider that people will be wanting to use this on the backplane of embedded network hardware, and blade servers.
Don't let the fork get you down, the kimberlite-dev list is still active, and kimberlite is still supported. Unlike some other companies, we don't make it difficult to find the code if you want to contribute, and you can peak into the CVS repository if you want to see what's going on. You'll need to look in CVS for the latest code, since we don't seem to have updated the packages or tarballs for quite some time. Check out the kimberlite website for mailing lists and such.
Download it and try it out. Or better yet, call us and buy the commercial version. It's about the same price or cheaper then RedHat advanced server, and you're not stuck running RedHat.
Hey! We're not out of business! We're still here, and we still make cluster software. Kimberlite 2.0 has been in CVS for quite some time. Try it out!
Having no speed limit doesn't do much good for a state's speeding-ticket revenue. They've gotten themselves addicted to the extra money and don't want to give it up.
You've hit the nail on the head. I remember when trafic laws were supposed to be about safety. I've seen as many accidents in the last month caused by people slamming on their brakes from seeing a cop in the rain as I have for any other reason.
More realistically, if you loaded 4 people into it, you probably have a hard time going up hills, and your max speed would be 90 only down steep hills. Just like any car with a sub-100 horsepower engine.
Some more intellegent states have removed the daytime speed limit on interstate straightaways. I wonder what the rest of us are waiting for.
Why aren't you refusing to use IE because it doesn't support CSS correctly? It's time for MS to bite the bullet, and support some web standards like everybody else.
The problem with the ICC is that we can't both go along with it, and assure US citizens all of their constitutional rights. Becoming a member of the ICC is unconstitutional.
EMC and IBM have been in competition for a long time. They've been buying drives from their next door neighbor, Maxtor/Quantum, for quite a while now.
I would think that they'd want security in there to protect their trade secrets. If information like this gets out (oops) then people will be able to make unlicenced games, and that would trash Microsoft's console business model.
It's necissary if you want to create a compatible and competing unit, or if you want to create compatable but competing software, which was completely allowed last I checked.
80.4%? Really? Did you know that %100 of statistics such as this are made up on the spot?
.804 = 80.4%
While that may be true, this is not a statistic, it's math. Maybe you should do some math before you shoot your mouth off.
A 9.4GB (byte, not bit) DVD holds 133 minutes of full quality video with a 5.1 audio track.
(((9.4*1024*1024*1024*8)/133)/60) = 10118469 bits/sec
USB has a sustained bandwidth of 12Mb (bits, not bytes) per second.
(12*1024*1024) = 12582912 bits/sec
10118469/12582912 =
I agree that there are no quality solutions on the market at present, but I happen to work with USB all the time, like writing actual code, and creating actual devices. I'm not talking out of my ass. The bus technology is not to blame. There are issues, and they can be overcome.
A full DVD video feed with 5.1 audio only uses 80.4% of USBs available bandwidth. If you're going to blame the poor quality of existing devices on manufacturers trying to save a few cents per unit, then that's one thing, but there is no reason you can't reliably stream DVD quality content over USB. That is, in fact, what USB was designed for: streaming media.
If you want to assume that a USB video device will be low quality based on available products, don't pin the blame on a perfectly capable technology. If you do that you'll just end up with the same crappy devices that plug into a more expensive bus.
I dream that one day future PCs will be designed based on technological merits instead of marketing doublespeak. Unfortunatly that day will likely never come.
Working in a union environment means that it's harder to get rid of the poeple who don't work as hard as they should. It also removes alot of incentive to try and achieve more. Why work hard to get that raise if you're already guaranteed it in your union contract? There's a whole host of other issues that come up in typical union environments too. Someone has to pick up the slack when a union worker only does as much work as necissary for the union to keep him/her from getting fired. Sure, not all union workers do that, but it only takes a few.
Don't get me wrong, I think that unions are important. I also think they should be temporary. Workers should be allowed to organize to overcome an important problem, and then they should go away until the next 'unresolvable' issue. They shouldn't be allowed to stick around and engage in what is essentially racketeering. Companies should also be allowed to hire replacements for workers that are on strike, as long as the new workers are hired on the same terms that the strikers are protesting against.
And what is this mythical 40 hour work week you speak of? Don't you mean 80 hours?
Well, you get your wish. All their marketing material says "Product lifetime". Also, this is way different then a warranty. If a lifetime product waranty ended with the lifetime of the product, you would get nothing. With a service you use all the time, you get the benifit of the service for as long as you maintain your unit. I think that "Product lifetime" is a better name then "unit subscription". You can tell what "product lifetime" means without ambiguity.
http://www.tivo.com/get/tivo_service.asp
What makes you assume that the video quality would suffer due to MPEG2 over USB? USB can easily stream DVD quality MPEG2 video with bandwidth to spare, and MPEG2 can encode to quite high quality. Where's your source video coming from if that quality isn't high enough?
Not only do they put it in the not so fine print, but when you call to subscribe (at least when I called), they made sure I understood clearly that lifetime meant life of the box. There's no conspiracy here. Move along.
(BTW, I think this lifetime arrangement it better then most other 'lifetime' things, that don't transfer to a new owner. What 'lifetime' contract or guarantee have you ever heard of that continues on to something new you buy?)
Maybe now some young Computer Science student can spend more time on developing a good overall program, instead of spending a bunch of time writing simple things like their own sorting routine.
Yeah, that's great. Maybe now all the new CS grads will be so clueless that I'll have more job security.... </sarcasm>
Unfortunatly this isn't a perfect world, and if students stop learning the basics like writing a good sort routine it just means that in a few years I'm going to have some really obnoxious coworkers, and I'm going to end up doing a higher percentage of the work. Good job Georgia tech!
If you learn what you are supposed to from a computer science education, you learn that all the problems can be broken down to layers of simple soultions. Then you learn to understand the simple solutions. If you really understand the simple solutions, you already know how to put the parts to gether into a good whole. If you can't understand the simple stuff, what good are you? It's important to make CS students prove they understand the simple stuff. The rest isn't nearly as important.
Practically everying I download is copyrighted, including the slashdot page I'm typing this into. Most of it is freely available. Copyright doesn't imply that payment is necissary. It's unfortunate that the people with the most money available to buy laws with have the narrowest view as to how the existing laws work.