As the company referenced in the post above (www.rightstuf.com), I hesitate to post to this group, but here goes.
We were having so many problems with credit card fraud, especially internationally. All kinds of orders from all over the world, and a large % of them were junk. We had one week where one person tried to use 20 different card#s under different names shipped to different locations.
It is apparent from the posts here that most people do not understand how credit card merchants (especially internet and mail-order merchants) have to deal with cards.
Non-possession of card transactions are "trust" transactions; thus, you are trusting that the person on the other side actually has the card, owns it, and will pay according to the agreement. Credit card processors often will not defend chargbacks for non-possession of card, only chargebacks where someone had possession of the card and/or imprinted a copy of it.
Thus, if you purchase something on line, you can say you didn't order it, and even if I can prove that you received it with a POD with a signature, you can say you didn't order it and didn't receive it, and I will almost *ALWAYS* lose. The credit card companies don't lose - the MERCHANT does. The processor simply takes the full amount out of your account. Plus, the processor gets hit with a "chargeback" fee, and too many chargebacks push your processing rate way up! So, it is in the merchant's best interest to fight fraud aggressively.
Someone also mentioned that we should just use AVS. (Address Verification Service). Here's another joy... not all banks provide AVS information. Debit cards cannot be AVS certified, and cards outside of the US cannot be AVS certified. So, this helps us merchants for US customers only, and only if they are shipping to their home (which many people don't want, they want stuff shipped to their homes.) Seems silly, doesn't it. We are required to use AVS, but the banks are not all required to provide the information.
Someone else mentioned calling the customer's bank. OK, try doing this when the bank is on the other side of the world and isn't open and on top of that you have the language barrier? Is this worth it for a $25 order? Sometimes it is almost impossible (we have actually tried this.)
So, our solution for non-US customers was to ask to get a copy of the card and some form of ID (picture or not) by mail or fax. This at least tells us that the card *exists* and that there is a person with the same name having ID that matches the card, and that the address given is the same on the ID as it is on the order. Thus, it's not likely a card number made by a number generator from a list of stolen cards posted on IRC or something.
THIS IS FOR NON-US Customers only! (We can use AVS for US/some Canadian customers, which, as I mentioned above, works usually)
No - it's not foolproof. As mentioned herein, someone could spend a great deal of time mocking something up in photoshop/etc. to bypass this. However, most card thieves don't have the time or are unwilling to waste the time, when they can simply go somewhere that doesn't have such a requirement.
We only ask for this information once to set up an account, and it is never asked for again. I'm not sure that you could really do anything more with this information (the copies from a FAX) than you could with just having the card#. Maybe. Keep in mind this is a 200dpi or less image from a photocopied source to begin with, and with no colors, etc.
This procedure has dropped our international chargebacks to almost none. It has likely lost a few customers for us as well; however, what do you do as a merchant? One chargeback can be hundreds of dollars, wiping out the profit reprented by 30+ orders. I watched another company virtually get taken under by chargebacks last year. FYI: You can charge back a transaction up to 3 YEARS after you receive your statement. Talk about fun research.
I'm not familiar with how paypal or the other systems work at present, but I will certainly look into it.
I've been very interested to see the different replies posted here, ranging from "These people suck" to "yeah, being a merchant sucks."
Any suggestions that you can provide are wholeheartedly appreciated. We want to provide service to everyone, but you have to weigh the risk when you're a merchant. We've tried to come up with something that's fair.
By the way, the Tylor DVD is not out yet. We are releasing the Tylor OVAs beginning in July (Dub and Sub) and are working to see if we can make the DVD set a reality. Keep checking at www.rightstuf.com if you are interested.
Best, Shawne Kleckner President The Right Stuf International, Inc. shawnek@rightstuf.com
Slashdot Mirror
As the company referenced in the post above (www.rightstuf.com), I hesitate to post to this group, but here goes.
We were having so many problems with credit card fraud, especially internationally. All kinds of orders from all over the world, and a large % of them were junk. We had one week where one person tried to use 20 different card#s under different names shipped to different locations.
It is apparent from the posts here that most people do not understand how credit card merchants (especially internet and mail-order merchants) have to deal with cards.
Non-possession of card transactions are "trust" transactions; thus, you are trusting that the person on the other side actually has the card, owns it, and will pay according to the agreement. Credit card processors often will not defend chargbacks for non-possession of card, only chargebacks where someone had possession of the card and/or imprinted a copy of it.
Thus, if you purchase something on line, you can say you didn't order it, and even if I can prove that you received it with a POD with a signature, you can say you didn't order it and didn't receive it, and I will almost *ALWAYS* lose. The credit card companies don't lose - the MERCHANT does. The processor simply takes the full amount out of your account. Plus, the processor gets hit with a "chargeback" fee, and too many chargebacks push your processing rate way up! So, it is in the merchant's best interest to fight fraud aggressively.
Someone also mentioned that we should just use AVS. (Address Verification Service). Here's another joy... not all banks provide AVS information. Debit cards cannot be AVS certified, and cards outside of the US cannot be AVS certified. So, this helps us merchants for US customers only, and only if they are shipping to their home (which many people don't want, they want stuff shipped to their homes.) Seems silly, doesn't it. We are required to use AVS, but the banks are not all required to provide the information.
Someone else mentioned calling the customer's bank. OK, try doing this when the bank is on the other side of the world and isn't open and on top of that you have the language barrier? Is this worth it for a $25 order? Sometimes it is almost impossible (we have actually tried this.)
So, our solution for non-US customers was to ask to get a copy of the card and some form of ID (picture or not) by mail or fax. This at least tells us that the card *exists* and that there is a person with the same name having ID that matches the card, and that the address given is the same on the ID as it is on the order. Thus, it's not likely a card number made by a number generator from a list of stolen cards posted on IRC or something.
THIS IS FOR NON-US Customers only! (We can use AVS for US/some Canadian customers, which, as I mentioned above, works usually)
No - it's not foolproof. As mentioned herein, someone could spend a great deal of time mocking something up in photoshop/etc. to bypass this. However, most card thieves don't have the time or are unwilling to waste the time, when they can simply go somewhere that doesn't have such a requirement.
We only ask for this information once to set up an account, and it is never asked for again. I'm not sure that you could really do anything more with this information (the copies from a FAX) than you could with just having the card#. Maybe. Keep in mind this is a 200dpi or less image from a photocopied source to begin with, and with no colors, etc.
This procedure has dropped our international chargebacks to almost none. It has likely lost a few customers for us as well; however, what do you do as a merchant? One chargeback can be hundreds of dollars, wiping out the profit reprented by 30+ orders. I watched another company virtually get taken under by chargebacks last year. FYI: You can charge back a transaction up to 3 YEARS after you receive your statement. Talk about fun research.
I'm not familiar with how paypal or the other systems work at present, but I will certainly look into it.
I've been very interested to see the different replies posted here, ranging from "These people suck" to "yeah, being a merchant sucks."
Any suggestions that you can provide are wholeheartedly appreciated. We want to provide service to everyone, but you have to weigh the risk when you're a merchant. We've tried to come up with something that's fair.
By the way, the Tylor DVD is not out yet. We are releasing the Tylor OVAs beginning in July (Dub and Sub) and are working to see if we can make the DVD set a reality. Keep checking at www.rightstuf.com if you are interested.
Best,
Shawne Kleckner
President
The Right Stuf International, Inc.
shawnek@rightstuf.com