Micheal well Lin-Dows = Linux-Windows not (W)indows.
Microsoft knows this. They dont sue Win Linux, or WinAmp, or WinZip, or even Windows. So how can Lindows be sued by using (Dows) but others arent sued by Using (Win) or even (Windows)
Starts with Win is no diffrent than Ends with Dows.
As far as WinLinux being an application, its not. Its an OS running on the WindowsFile system.
Because its run through Windows in the same way BeOS is run through Windows, Microsoft wont sue it simply because Its made for Windows users and doesnt harm their Market Share.
Hows it Micheals fault? Hes just the CEO.
Of course hes going to do whats best for him and the company, ANY CEO would do the same.
However he isnt planning to screw people over, he takes risks, starts companies everyone else is afraid to start and pays the price by getting sued all over the place until everyone but him gets screwed over.
The reason he starts the company is to cause impact, some people will be screwed in the process, but because of Mp3.com, everyone uses mp3s now, and people know Mp3s can be profitable.
"Why*? Sure, for specialized stuff like heavy duty file servers, this makes sense, but why for your own personal computer? So your file copies go slightly faster?"
Ever used a file sharing program downloaded about 5 gigs worth of files in a matter of days and need to organize them all? Of course not.
Ever encode an ogg, mp3. mpeg4 divx or anything? Of course you havent. Ever tried encoding a few hundred files all at the same time while downloading by the gigs and playing a game of quake? Oh of course not. You need RAID if you are going to be dealing with gigs of files and as we now have the ability to download by the gig, its time to have harddrives which can handle alot of data movement with some speed, no one wants to wait all day for a file to copy, delete etc etc. Some people want instant speed.
"Oh, get real. Completely depends on what you're doing. If it's a Renderman array, no, the RAM speed is not an issue. If you're just doing massive matrix multiplications, then the RAM is probably the bottleneck. And frankly, the difference in RAM speed you can be getting with a given type of processor is not that significant."
Right it does matter what you are doing, but this isnt about building a very specialized box, its about building the fastest machine possible. Fast machines are fast because they have NO bottlenecks. The machine i described would be an all around fast machine, and perfect for a serious desktop user. Yes some people DO use linux on the desktop, and some people DO like to have speed.
"
And you can get an Itanium, SPARC, etc when Linux on the Itanium and SPARC is as tweaked an optimized as vanilla x86 Linux. Waay more people and more core developers are x86 people -- guess where performance has been worked on the most. Much as I dislike Solaris relative to Linux, if I were going SPARC, that's where I'd be."
Good point, it may be optimized for x86, so compile the software yourself so its optimized for your hardware, then run it. Usually theres source code which works on just about everything(like mozilla for example) and can be optimized slightly.
"What the hell are you talking about? Photoshop in WINE, maybe? If you're talking about Linux, presumably you mean GIMP and povray. Povray *does* have a hack to let it run in multiple threads to use multiple processors (though Povray wasn't exactly architected around MP), but the GIMP's filters are all (that I know of) single-threaded."
Gimp, Photoshop, you get the point. Anyhow graphics manipulation programs run faster with dual processors.
As far as Gforce3, linux cant even fully use Gforce2
You make a few good arguements but this is assuming that you are using the PC, I assumed nothing, the PC example i gave is simply the best PC that can be built for pure SPEED, its not the more powerful, its just the best PC you can have for speed on the desktop.
You can of course add a ton of CPUs and make a PC for some specific calculations and have it be faster, but it wont be faster all around.
Bloat is only called "Too many features" Because your computer cant handle it all.
Plugins and configure your bloat. Or have every feature turned on. When you have a fast machine with more than enough power, does it make a diffrence how many features as on when the program loads instantly? Why not turn them all on and use them when needed?
Linux isnt for everyone, neither is Windows however saying people cannot handle Linux is like sayingn back in 95 people cant handle Windows and demanding everyone use the more expensive easier macOS.
Education has nothing to do with computer skill. Do you think bill gates, steve jobs, or most linux programmers have degrees? If you can read and write, you can learn to code, you can read the manual and learn linux, and you can master the computer.
Linux is not user friendly? Last i checked it was GUI. Have you used KDE? EASIER THAN WINDOWS XP!!!!
Percentages arent fair considering people dont buy Windows, they are taxed for it when they buy their PC. Its not like people are given a choice, so dont even mess with biased statistics.
Desktop Failure? IT JUST started to aim for the Desktop, give it 5 years, it took Windows years to surpass MacOS.
Linux is no reliable? And Windows95 was? or 98? PLEASE!! It too Microsoft 5 years to become reliable. Give Linux 5 years too, and hey people didnt say "Windows isnt ready for the desktop, go use MacOS"
The linux community is elitist? No thats not the community, thats the programmers working on projects who dont have time to teach newbies.
You are bashing linux? You tried it? Once? How many times have you tried Windows? How many years did it take to learn Windows?
Tell it to redhat!!! Redhats busy trying to promote linux in US schools, If i were redhat, Suse, Mandrake, I'd be trying to push these people into using linux and GIVE them all the software they need to do it.
Sure linux can run with a weak machine, you just cant run powerful software. You can run weak software and add plugins as needed. So tell me are you running blackbox? afterstep?
No this is not a flamebait, or a troll post. I'm simply sayin when you have a machine like this, you dont have the right to say KDE or Gnome or Enlightenment is slow.
First, any machine I'm designing for Linux, 2 most important things will be.
Ram, Its going to have at least a gig.
Harddrive must be SCSI raid, or fibre channel array.
4 Harddrives in Raid0 mode transfering data at about over 200 megs a second, and a gig of ram. The next thing you will need is good motherboard which can handle the bandwidth.
And when choosing a motherboard you'll need a Good CPU. THE best but most expensive is the Itanium, the sparc CPUs seem better designed to handle the bandwidth than the AthlonXP, Sparc CPU has about 8 megs of L2 cache, and top it off with a high quality harddrive such as the Cheetah Series from Seagate, the one with the 16 megs of vcache is the best one (the one i use)
With this you'll have the most speed possible because you wont have any bottlenecks.
Stupid to have a fast CPU and slow ram.
Stupid to have a slow CPU and fast ram.
Stupid to have a gaming card which cant be used (Gforce3)
Stupid to have a slow harddrive and fast everything else.
And last, if you are going to use linux, theres no rule saying you must use X86 based CPU, but if you do, you'd be better off with Xeons or AthlonMP over the XP series of Athlon.
Dual processing power really helps when dealing with 3d graphics and photoshop effects.
Seems to be designed for Windows users. I mean you have athlonXP, which is an OK cpu for gaming, but it gets totally smoked by Itanium, Sparc, and other more powerful CPUs.
Also bandwith is a major issue, speed of ram is an issue, your CPU is only as fast as your RAM and HARDDRIVE not your damn CPU.
Having alot of L2 cache would make a diffrence as well, the 3d card in Linux couldnt even be used due to the lack of games, poor driver support, and the GUI itself cant even use the card for 2d stuff like alpha channeling, Windows speeds up the GUI using 2d speed of the video card.
Beyond all of this the CPU design of x86 is just inferior to alot of other CPUs which arent x86. Take the Itanium i know its a fortune but if I'm going to call something system of the year, and its a Linux box not a Windows box, why would i care if its compatible with x86 based Windows applications and games?
Thats what Windows users care about mostly.
Linux users want a powerful workstation to run powerful applications, or they want a server, but for gaming Windows is the only option.
When x86 is the weakest design of them all.
Good for gaming perhaps, but Linux isnt really a gamers OS.
Why no Itanium based PC? Sparc? What about SCSI Raid 0, what about bandwith?
As if a Gforce3 really matters on a Linuxbox that cant even do Alpha channeling yet in the GUI, and as if it matters if you have an AthlonXP thats designed for Windows?
System of the year for a Windows user yes.
But for Linux? I could do better. When building a system you build it for the software that you run on it, not build it because everythings name brand.
Ok so lets say you run games, Thats when you need Gforce 3. (Linux users dont apply here)
Lets say you do alot of graphics manipulation, then you need perhaps another card.
Things that all users can use is alot of ram, SCSI raid, and a fast CPU, but unlike Windows Linux runs on any CPU, people always forget that.
The only problem with Itanium is its price, but for System of the year, price shouldnt be the issue.
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Micheal well Lin-Dows = Linux-Windows not (W)indows.
Microsoft knows this. They dont sue Win Linux, or WinAmp, or WinZip, or even Windows. So how can Lindows be sued by using (Dows) but others arent sued by Using (Win) or even (Windows)
Starts with Win is no diffrent than Ends with Dows.
As far as WinLinux being an application, its not. Its an OS running on the WindowsFile system.
Because its run through Windows in the same way BeOS is run through Windows, Microsoft wont sue it simply because Its made for Windows users and doesnt harm their Market Share.
Ok so now you cant create an Internet Hexplorer which runs on everything but Windows via commandline and displays websites as hex?
Hows it Micheals fault? Hes just the CEO.
Of course hes going to do whats best for him and the company, ANY CEO would do the same.
However he isnt planning to screw people over, he takes risks, starts companies everyone else is afraid to start and pays the price by getting sued all over the place until everyone but him gets screwed over.
The reason he starts the company is to cause impact, some people will be screwed in the process, but because of Mp3.com, everyone uses mp3s now, and people know Mp3s can be profitable.
http://www.mslinux.org/
Why Isnt Microsoft sueing them?
Ok so what about WinLinux?
So why hasnt Microsoft sued WinLinux? Oh right. Win Linux runs via Windows.
http://www.winlinux.net/2001/
Win Linux, Its as bad as Lindows with its naming, Microsoft has not sued them.
Why? Because it runs via Windows.
Lindows is the opposite, and its sued because its actually not running via Windows.
Then theres a few Winux's. Like Pogo Winux Desktop Computer and http://www.linux-france.org/prj/winux/English/
WinGroove http://www.cc.rim.or.jp/~hiroki/english/wgdl.html
And lots of other companies with Programs using Windows not just Indows like Lindows but WINDOWS. None of them get sued.
Even OS's that run on top of windows like Win Linux dont get sued.
Guess you forgot about WinLinux
http://www.winlinux.net/2001/
Start recording music in surround then then geez
make the quality so high that copying on mp3 wouldnt do it justice.
"Why*? Sure, for specialized stuff like heavy duty file servers, this makes sense, but why for your own personal computer? So your file copies go slightly faster?"
Ever used a file sharing program downloaded about 5 gigs worth of files in a matter of days and need to organize them all? Of course not.
Ever encode an ogg, mp3. mpeg4 divx or anything? Of course you havent. Ever tried encoding a few hundred files all at the same time while downloading by the gigs and playing a game of quake? Oh of course not. You need RAID if you are going to be dealing with gigs of files and as we now have the ability to download by the gig, its time to have harddrives which can handle alot of data movement with some speed, no one wants to wait all day for a file to copy, delete etc etc. Some people want instant speed.
"Oh, get real. Completely depends on what you're doing. If it's a Renderman array, no, the RAM speed is not an issue. If you're just doing massive matrix multiplications, then the RAM is probably the bottleneck. And frankly, the difference in RAM speed you can be getting with a given type of processor is not that significant."
Right it does matter what you are doing, but this isnt about building a very specialized box, its about building the fastest machine possible. Fast machines are fast because they have NO bottlenecks. The machine i described would be an all around fast machine, and perfect for a serious desktop user. Yes some people DO use linux on the desktop, and some people DO like to have speed.
"
And you can get an Itanium, SPARC, etc when Linux on the Itanium and SPARC is as tweaked an optimized as vanilla x86 Linux. Waay more people and more core developers are x86 people -- guess where performance has been worked on the most. Much as I dislike Solaris relative to Linux, if I were going SPARC, that's where I'd be."
Good point, it may be optimized for x86, so compile the software yourself so its optimized for your hardware, then run it. Usually theres source code which works on just about everything(like mozilla for example) and can be optimized slightly.
"What the hell are you talking about? Photoshop in WINE, maybe? If you're talking about Linux, presumably you mean GIMP and povray. Povray *does* have a hack to let it run in multiple threads to use multiple processors (though Povray wasn't exactly architected around MP), but the GIMP's filters are all (that I know of) single-threaded."
Gimp, Photoshop, you get the point. Anyhow graphics manipulation programs run faster with dual processors.
As far as Gforce3, linux cant even fully use Gforce2
You make a few good arguements but this is assuming that you are using the PC, I assumed nothing, the PC example i gave is simply the best PC that can be built for pure SPEED, its not the more powerful, its just the best PC you can have for speed on the desktop.
You can of course add a ton of CPUs and make a PC for some specific calculations and have it be faster, but it wont be faster all around.
Bloat is only called "Too many features" Because your computer cant handle it all.
Plugins and configure your bloat. Or have every feature turned on. When you have a fast machine with more than enough power, does it make a diffrence how many features as on when the program loads instantly? Why not turn them all on and use them when needed?
Linux isnt for everyone, neither is Windows however saying people cannot handle Linux is like sayingn back in 95 people cant handle Windows and demanding everyone use the more expensive easier macOS.
Education has nothing to do with computer skill. Do you think bill gates, steve jobs, or most linux programmers have degrees? If you can read and write, you can learn to code, you can read the manual and learn linux, and you can master the computer.
in the USA used Dos, Windows 3.1, Windows95 etc, Linux is easy enough. We didnt start out with OSX and WinXP
This is a flame. And now it begins.
Linux is not user friendly? Last i checked it was GUI. Have you used KDE? EASIER THAN WINDOWS XP!!!!
Percentages arent fair considering people dont buy Windows, they are taxed for it when they buy their PC. Its not like people are given a choice, so dont even mess with biased statistics.
Desktop Failure? IT JUST started to aim for the Desktop, give it 5 years, it took Windows years to surpass MacOS.
Linux is no reliable? And Windows95 was? or 98? PLEASE!! It too Microsoft 5 years to become reliable. Give Linux 5 years too, and hey people didnt say "Windows isnt ready for the desktop, go use MacOS"
The linux community is elitist? No thats not the community, thats the programmers working on projects who dont have time to teach newbies.
You are bashing linux? You tried it? Once? How many times have you tried Windows? How many years did it take to learn Windows?
Microsoft didnt give Us the right to choose, it was Windows PC, or no PC.
They dont know Windows, they dont know anything, they know what they are introduced to first.
Introduce the wholee population to linux and soon youll have a bunch of linux experts.
Tell it to redhat!!! Redhats busy trying to promote linux in US schools, If i were redhat, Suse, Mandrake, I'd be trying to push these people into using linux and GIVE them all the software they need to do it.
Yes.
If it works with the hardware, it will have all the software people need.
Theres no shortage of Linux software, theres just not enough windows software on linux.
Considering Windows was inferior to Mac when it came out, people used it because it was cheaper.
Sure linux can run with a weak machine, you just cant run powerful software. You can run weak software and add plugins as needed. So tell me are you running blackbox? afterstep?
No this is not a flamebait, or a troll post. I'm simply sayin when you have a machine like this, you dont have the right to say KDE or Gnome or Enlightenment is slow.
I mean its all wrong.
First, any machine I'm designing for Linux, 2 most important things will be.
Ram, Its going to have at least a gig.
Harddrive must be SCSI raid, or fibre channel array.
4 Harddrives in Raid0 mode transfering data at about over 200 megs a second, and a gig of ram. The next thing you will need is good motherboard which can handle the bandwidth.
And when choosing a motherboard you'll need a Good CPU. THE best but most expensive is the Itanium, the sparc CPUs seem better designed to handle the bandwidth than the AthlonXP, Sparc CPU has about 8 megs of L2 cache, and top it off with a high quality harddrive such as the Cheetah Series from Seagate, the one with the 16 megs of vcache is the best one (the one i use)
With this you'll have the most speed possible because you wont have any bottlenecks.
Stupid to have a fast CPU and slow ram.
Stupid to have a slow CPU and fast ram.
Stupid to have a gaming card which cant be used (Gforce3)
Stupid to have a slow harddrive and fast everything else.
And last, if you are going to use linux, theres no rule saying you must use X86 based CPU, but if you do, you'd be better off with Xeons or AthlonMP over the XP series of Athlon.
Dual processing power really helps when dealing with 3d graphics and photoshop effects.
Seems to be designed for Windows users. I mean you have athlonXP, which is an OK cpu for gaming, but it gets totally smoked by Itanium, Sparc, and other more powerful CPUs.
Also bandwith is a major issue, speed of ram is an issue, your CPU is only as fast as your RAM and HARDDRIVE not your damn CPU.
Having alot of L2 cache would make a diffrence as well, the 3d card in Linux couldnt even be used due to the lack of games, poor driver support, and the GUI itself cant even use the card for 2d stuff like alpha channeling, Windows speeds up the GUI using 2d speed of the video card.
Beyond all of this the CPU design of x86 is just inferior to alot of other CPUs which arent x86. Take the Itanium i know its a fortune but if I'm going to call something system of the year, and its a Linux box not a Windows box, why would i care if its compatible with x86 based Windows applications and games?
Thats what Windows users care about mostly.
Linux users want a powerful workstation to run powerful applications, or they want a server, but for gaming Windows is the only option.
When x86 is the weakest design of them all.
Good for gaming perhaps, but Linux isnt really a gamers OS.
Why no Itanium based PC? Sparc? What about SCSI Raid 0, what about bandwith?
As if a Gforce3 really matters on a Linuxbox that cant even do Alpha channeling yet in the GUI, and as if it matters if you have an AthlonXP thats designed for Windows?
System of the year for a Windows user yes.
But for Linux? I could do better. When building a system you build it for the software that you run on it, not build it because everythings name brand.
Ok so lets say you run games, Thats when you need Gforce 3. (Linux users dont apply here)
Lets say you do alot of graphics manipulation, then you need perhaps another card.
Things that all users can use is alot of ram, SCSI raid, and a fast CPU, but unlike Windows Linux runs on any CPU, people always forget that.
The only problem with Itanium is its price, but for System of the year, price shouldnt be the issue.
How do you know the timeframe? They must have started before they announced it, as in years