We've been playing every other Saturday since 4E came out and I don't know what you guys are talking about. How much have you played 4E? It sounds like you're complaining about bad DMing or bad adventure writing.
"Basically the 3.5 to 4th edition involved too many drastic simplifications to the game. (now admitted I'm a youngin so I can't really say much on 1st to second transition..."
I DMed Bastion of Broken Souls, which was a 18th to 20th level adventure, written for 3.0, which we played under 3.5. I can tell you without any exaggeration that if D&D wan't 'drastically simplified' my group would have never played another D&D game over 10th or 12th level ever again, and probably would have jumped ship to another game system altogether. The sheer amount of bookkeeping involved in both preparing and running a 3.X game at that level was stupefying.
Geez! Lucky! When did you guys graduate?
Back in 1984 my principal told me we couldn't have a D&D club because it wasn't competitive. I told him about Car Wars. He said none of the other schools had a team. I got mad and brought up our football team's losing record and said 'they're not competetive, why do we have to be?' He threw me out.
Here in the midwest in the 80's it was very controversial. My friend's mom actually yelled at me "No he can't play dragon and dungeon with you - I don't want you boys going down in the sewers!"
I would actively discourage anyone in my group, DM or player, from talking like that during a game. Just like when there's too much Monty Python being quoted.
We've been playing 4E since it came out and I have no idea what 'aggro' and 'DPS' mean, and there are almost no 'buffs' in 4E. They make things too complicated.
My point is you're describing a player issue, not a 4E issue.
I’ve been playing with two groups of four to eight guys since 4th Edition came out.
I doesn't matter how the powers are listed.
My powers are on the back of my character sheet which is paper I soaked in tea, baked dry and scorched with a lighter. I tick them off with a pencil when I use them.
No one in my group uses cards, but if makes the game go smoother I’d say ‘go get some.’
Those powers come with flavor text that helps shy, inexperienced role players add something to the storytelling just by reading it aloud. I always had to tell my nephew’s game group to do it, and now they play more than we do.
The powers help the casual gamers enjoy the game as much as us serious gamers, so our games are better attended. Lately we’ve been running out of room around the table. How many times does that happen?
Some of the powers have become our signature moves. The best parts of our game are when everything aligns just right and one of us busts out a big cinematic stunt. Last game, we actually applauded a guy!
The powers help the DM prepare faster because everything is listed right there when he needs it.
I’m confident if Squidflakes sat in with us for a game he’d have a great time.
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We've been playing every other Saturday since 4E came out and I don't know what you guys are talking about. How much have you played 4E? It sounds like you're complaining about bad DMing or bad adventure writing.
"Basically the 3.5 to 4th edition involved too many drastic simplifications to the game. (now admitted I'm a youngin so I can't really say much on 1st to second transition..." I DMed Bastion of Broken Souls, which was a 18th to 20th level adventure, written for 3.0, which we played under 3.5. I can tell you without any exaggeration that if D&D wan't 'drastically simplified' my group would have never played another D&D game over 10th or 12th level ever again, and probably would have jumped ship to another game system altogether. The sheer amount of bookkeeping involved in both preparing and running a 3.X game at that level was stupefying.
Geez! Lucky! When did you guys graduate? Back in 1984 my principal told me we couldn't have a D&D club because it wasn't competitive. I told him about Car Wars. He said none of the other schools had a team. I got mad and brought up our football team's losing record and said 'they're not competetive, why do we have to be?' He threw me out. Here in the midwest in the 80's it was very controversial. My friend's mom actually yelled at me "No he can't play dragon and dungeon with you - I don't want you boys going down in the sewers!"
I would actively discourage anyone in my group, DM or player, from talking like that during a game. Just like when there's too much Monty Python being quoted. We've been playing 4E since it came out and I have no idea what 'aggro' and 'DPS' mean, and there are almost no 'buffs' in 4E. They make things too complicated. My point is you're describing a player issue, not a 4E issue.
I’ve been playing with two groups of four to eight guys since 4th Edition came out. I doesn't matter how the powers are listed. My powers are on the back of my character sheet which is paper I soaked in tea, baked dry and scorched with a lighter. I tick them off with a pencil when I use them. No one in my group uses cards, but if makes the game go smoother I’d say ‘go get some.’ Those powers come with flavor text that helps shy, inexperienced role players add something to the storytelling just by reading it aloud. I always had to tell my nephew’s game group to do it, and now they play more than we do. The powers help the casual gamers enjoy the game as much as us serious gamers, so our games are better attended. Lately we’ve been running out of room around the table. How many times does that happen? Some of the powers have become our signature moves. The best parts of our game are when everything aligns just right and one of us busts out a big cinematic stunt. Last game, we actually applauded a guy! The powers help the DM prepare faster because everything is listed right there when he needs it. I’m confident if Squidflakes sat in with us for a game he’d have a great time.