Re:Luke, use the source...
on
Is RPM Doomed?
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· Score: 1
Not true. 'rpm -ivh package.src.rpm'. Cd to/usr/src/redhat/SPECS, edit the spec file, then 'rpm -bb package.spec' or 'rpm -ba package.spec' to build a binary plus SRPM.
> What are you talking about? There's GNU, Suse, RedHat, Mandrake, etc. Most have utilities that do > not run on the others.
You said there is software that runs only on RedHat and nowhere else. I'm still waiting to find out what this mystery program is.
> Many have filesystem layouts that differ. Maybe > something like the LSB could help -- oops, RedHat isn't sure they want to support that.
That doesn't mean a program won't run on some other dist. of Linux... one just has to *gasp* be knowledgable enough to install it. Keep trying.
> Do you speak officially for RedHat or Metrowerks?
And your point would be....??
>...if all Linuces are the same, maybe it shouldn't say "RedHAt", and have the "GNU Edition" -- which cost $99 -- ship free with RedHat products.
A business decision. What's wrong with that? Why don't we ever hear people complaining about Caldera? They pack tons of proprietary crap in their dist. Oh, because they're never in the news.
> I have never called RedHat evil, but I am concerned that they are having a lot of success without giving a lot of credit where credit is due. I suspect FSF/Gnu/RMS and others are being given short shrift when they made, and continue to make, real and substantial contributions to Linux.
What would you have them do? What would be appropriate in your opinion?
> I'm just saying that these constant "RedHat" announcements seem unfair, and whether or not anyone else agrees, I'm about ready to jump ship on RedHat.
What does fairness have to do with anything? RMS could go into business tomorrow selling a Linux dist. with GNU stamped up and down all over it. Why doesn't he, do you think?
> I agree with you that people can pick and use their own distro, but it seems like you think I should just shut up and go away.
No, I simply want people like you to "give credit where credit is due". RedHat has kept the GNOME project alive and contributed to it in spades. RedHat appealed to Adaptec to release actual low-level support rather than reverse engineering. RedHat hasn't done anything bad yet and your original post implied as much. After much beratement, you've filtered out the extraneous and seem to be saying, "RedHat getting all this attention seems Microsoft'ish and may not credit all those involved."
Fair enough. If that's all you're saying. I still don't compeletely agree, but at least it's a start.
However, you shouldn't get your clit in a knot because I asked you to ante up on your other claims.
> I never said it was wrong for them to make money. But how many people, who helped them up, are being left in the wake?
Oh for God's sake, you can't read Slashdot/ZDnet/Wired without RMS reminding you about this...believe me, no one is being left at the wayside.
You read what I write as some agressive punk blindly following some RedHat jihad. I've used most all of the dist's at least once. I'm not even defending RedHat. You were errant in your early criticisms and I merely called you on it.
PS I'm not a "slasshole" and I would never DoS you or anyone else and am not really thrilled about being labeled as such. If I disagree with you, I'll do so with the written word. No offense, but your opinion doesn't mean enough to me to do something like that.
Unfortunately, as you've seen, there are those among us who...
1) Don't remember all the infighting that did the unices in the first time around.
2) Have watched too much X-Files and are looking for a new conspiracy theory to replace Microsoft since they're not gonna be as high on the list after the butt-whipping from the DoJ.
Oh well, nothing new really. The best way you can have fun with these idiots is to ask them to back up what they're talking about. As they stare slackjawed at the terminal because they *can't*, they formulate insults because that's all they *can* say at that point.
> oh yeah -- you're not attacking me. I looked, I can't find it. Fuck you, Brian
OOOOOH! That hurt. Heh. Well, I'm glad you turned to your limited vocabulary rather than backup what you were talking about with PROOF. Look a little harder if you like. Won't matter. You're wrong.
I *know* you don't know what you're talking about...I just wanna hear you *say* it.
Oh? You DIDN'T leave as promised...well then, let's continue. I would refer to you by name, but then again you're a wuss...
> Untrue. It's a fact; some progs will not run on > anything but RedHat.
Name one. Programs may require that you install the RPM package, but no such program exists to my knowledge that will ONLY run under RedHat's distribution of Linux. Put up or shut up, asshole. I'm waiting.
> All I am saying is that RedHat gets the glory while others get the shaft. Where is the humility?
What does "humility" have to do with anything and who cares? Why do you bash RedHat for the oversight of others?
> i can't remember the details, but it would be useless to show evidence to someone like you, anyway.
Right, right...Yeah, jerks like me have the audacity to tell people like you to put your money where your mouth is and *surprise* you can't.
> like many others here, you denigrate fsf/gnu, and you constantly twist my words.
The only person screwing up your sentiments is you. I've used *nothing but Linux* for four years, moron, I do NOT denigrate GNU. Do you even read what I wrote or do you just spout off martyr rheotoric endlessly??
How bout you STOP responding to me unless you can provide one iota of proof to your pointless rants?
> I'm sure you hate the term "Gnu/Linux" -- that > would be bad, eh? But perhaps "Redhat Linux" is > perfectly acceptable?? Hypocrites!
No, I say Linux. If anyone else says GNU/Linux, Debian Linux, Slackware Linux, or I couldn't care less. I realize something you don't; */Linux==LINUX.
You say "RedHat, and it's supporters, have apparently become GNU/FSF detractors and I will not longer tolerate that." Where is your proof??? They GPL EVERYTHING THEY DO. Good grief, Charlie Brown, you've got nothing to base this on!! Show me something they've written that they haven't GPL'd and I'll eat my (Red) hat.
> I do post anonymously, since I fear attacks from > vehement people like yourself.
Attacks == People with a clue pointing out that I'm unable to substantiate my opinions with fact. I don't blame you; I wouldn't want my name on what you've posted either.
First, Linux is linux is linux. Regardless of the distribution. If you don't understand that, then stop reading and reboot into Windows right now.
RedHat's name plastered on the product is NOT RedHat's fault...you should blame Metrowerks. But no, your kind assumes that you should label RedHat as "evil" since they make a profit from Linux.
Nevermind they've not done anything anti-competitive and they give away source to the code they pay people to write, you apparently don't like them for being successful.
Fine. Don't use their distribution.
However, you're not being attacked by me.
You prove that, while you have concerns, you don't see the big picture. It is impossible for a 100% open source company that gives everything it does back to the community to be another Microsoft. It cannot happen. If other companies associate Linux with RedHat, so be it, but it's not RedHat's fault nor should they be blamed. Your lack of comprehension amazes me, but your assinine opinion does not.
I also do not reject the contributions of the GNU project (I've run linux for four years exclusively). However, I could've run BSD and gotten a very nice Un*x clone that is *not* GPL'd if I chose to.
You're entitled to your opinions, but spreading general FUD (RedHat is gonna be another Microsoft! RedHat is evil for making any money!) is wrong, pointless, and not very smart.
Don't get mad at the community for pointing out that you're opinion is based in misconception and ignorance.
1) What is proprietary to redhat that will keep codewarrior from running on any other dist. of linux since everything they do is 100% open source??
2) Use whatever distribution you like, but without RMS, we'd still be at 2.2.5 as Linus would've simply used BSD-style tools. Contrary to popular myth...other tools DID exist before RMS wrote GPL'd ports.
3) You obviously have no idea what you're talking about and you're only serving up more FUD that has no place here. RedHat is not the enemy.
Slashdot Mirror
Not true. 'rpm -ivh package.src.rpm'. Cd to /usr/src/redhat/SPECS, edit the spec file, then 'rpm -bb package.spec' or 'rpm -ba package.spec' to build a binary plus SRPM.
Thanks for leaving out where I proved you were full of shit and couldn't prove anything.
Real objective, but I would expect no less from an unbiased, ANONYMOUS guy like yourself.
> What are you talking about? There's GNU, Suse, RedHat, Mandrake, etc. Most have utilities that do > not run on the others.
... one just has to *gasp* be knowledgable enough to install it. Keep trying.
...if all Linuces are the same, maybe it shouldn't say "RedHAt", and have the "GNU Edition" -- which cost $99 -- ship free with RedHat products.
You said there is software that runs only on RedHat and nowhere else. I'm still waiting to find out what this mystery program is.
> Many have filesystem layouts that differ. Maybe > something like the LSB could help -- oops, RedHat isn't sure they want to support that.
That doesn't mean a program won't run on some other dist. of Linux
> Do you speak officially for RedHat or Metrowerks?
And your point would be....??
>
A business decision. What's wrong with that? Why don't we ever hear people complaining about Caldera? They pack tons of proprietary crap in their dist. Oh, because they're never in the news.
> I have never called RedHat evil, but I am concerned that they are having a lot of success without giving a lot of credit where credit is due. I suspect FSF/Gnu/RMS and others are being given short shrift when they made, and continue to make, real and substantial contributions to Linux.
What would you have them do? What would be appropriate in your opinion?
> I'm just saying that these constant "RedHat"
announcements seem unfair, and whether or not anyone else agrees, I'm about ready to jump ship on RedHat.
What does fairness have to do with anything? RMS could go into business tomorrow selling a Linux dist. with GNU stamped up and down all over it.
Why doesn't he, do you think?
> I agree with you that people can pick and use their own distro, but it seems like you think I should just shut up and go away.
No, I simply want people like you to "give credit where credit is due". RedHat has kept the GNOME project alive and contributed to it in spades. RedHat appealed to Adaptec to release actual low-level support rather than reverse engineering.
RedHat hasn't done anything bad yet and your original post implied as much. After much beratement, you've filtered out the extraneous and seem to be saying, "RedHat getting all this attention seems Microsoft'ish and may not credit all those involved."
Fair enough. If that's all you're saying. I still don't compeletely agree, but at least it's a start.
However, you shouldn't get your clit in a knot because I asked you to ante up on your other claims.
> I never said it was wrong for them to make money. But how many people, who helped them up, are being left in the wake?
Oh for God's sake, you can't read Slashdot/ZDnet/Wired without RMS reminding you about this...believe me, no one is being left at the wayside.
You read what I write as some agressive punk blindly following some RedHat jihad. I've used most all of the dist's at least once. I'm not even defending RedHat. You were errant in your early criticisms and I merely called you on it.
PS I'm not a "slasshole" and I would never DoS you
or anyone else and am not really thrilled about being labeled as such. If I disagree with you, I'll do so with the written word. No offense, but your opinion doesn't mean enough to me to do something like that.
Amen, brother. You hit the nail on the head.
...
Unfortunately, as you've seen, there are those among us who
1) Don't remember all the infighting that did the unices in the first time around.
2) Have watched too much X-Files and are looking for a new conspiracy theory to replace Microsoft since they're not gonna be as high on the list after the butt-whipping from the DoJ.
Oh well, nothing new really. The best way you can have fun with these idiots is to ask them to back up what they're talking about. As they stare slackjawed at the terminal because they *can't*, they formulate insults because that's all they *can* say at that point.
> oh yeah -- you're not attacking me. I looked, I can't find it. Fuck you, Brian
OOOOOH! That hurt. Heh. Well, I'm glad you turned to your limited vocabulary rather than backup what you were talking about with PROOF. Look a little harder if you like. Won't matter. You're wrong.
I *know* you don't know what you're talking about...I just wanna hear you *say* it.
Heh. Moron.
> Is this your ass taking to your head, Brian?
Oh? You DIDN'T leave as promised...well then, let's continue. I would refer to you by name, but then again you're a wuss...
> Untrue. It's a fact; some progs will not run on > anything but RedHat.
Name one. Programs may require that you install
the RPM package, but no such program exists to my knowledge that will ONLY run under RedHat's distribution of Linux. Put up or shut up, asshole. I'm waiting.
> All I am saying is that RedHat gets the glory while others get the shaft. Where is the humility?
What does "humility" have to do with anything and who cares? Why do you bash RedHat for the oversight of others?
> i can't remember the details, but it would be useless to show evidence to someone like you, anyway.
Right, right...Yeah, jerks like me have the audacity to tell people like you to put your money where your mouth is and *surprise* you can't.
> like many others here, you denigrate fsf/gnu, and you constantly twist my words.
The only person screwing up your sentiments is you. I've used *nothing but Linux* for four years, moron, I do NOT denigrate GNU. Do you even read what I wrote or do you just spout off martyr rheotoric endlessly??
How bout you STOP responding to me unless you can provide one iota of proof to your pointless rants?
Well he says "I can't find support for my statement about RPM anywhere in the news archives. So, I will say that it must have been something else."
Yeah, complete and utter horseshit.
Don't let the door hit you on the ass on your way out. If only the rest of the clueless would follow suit.
I just couldn't let this go...
> I'm sure you hate the term "Gnu/Linux" -- that
> would be bad, eh? But perhaps "Redhat Linux" is > perfectly acceptable?? Hypocrites!
No, I say Linux. If anyone else says GNU/Linux,
Debian Linux, Slackware Linux, or I couldn't care less. I realize something you don't; */Linux==LINUX.
You say "RedHat, and it's supporters, have apparently become GNU/FSF detractors and I will not longer tolerate that." Where is your proof???
They GPL EVERYTHING THEY DO. Good grief, Charlie
Brown, you've got nothing to base this on!! Show me something they've written that they haven't GPL'd and I'll eat my (Red) hat.
> I do post anonymously, since I fear attacks from > vehement people like yourself.
Attacks == People with a clue pointing out that
I'm unable to substantiate my opinions with fact.
I don't blame you; I wouldn't want my name on what you've posted either.
Ok, now I'm done.
First, Linux is linux is linux. Regardless of the
distribution. If you don't understand that, then stop reading and reboot into Windows right now.
RedHat's name plastered on the product is NOT RedHat's fault...you should blame Metrowerks. But no, your kind assumes that you should label RedHat as "evil" since they make a profit from Linux.
Nevermind they've not done anything anti-competitive and they give away source to the code they pay people to write, you apparently don't like them for being successful.
Fine. Don't use their distribution.
However, you're not being attacked by me.
You prove that,
while you have concerns, you don't see the big
picture. It is impossible for a 100% open source
company that gives everything it does back to the community to be another Microsoft. It cannot happen. If other companies associate Linux with RedHat, so be it, but it's not RedHat's fault nor should they be blamed.
Your lack of comprehension amazes me, but your assinine opinion does not.
I also do not reject the contributions of the GNU project (I've run linux for four years exclusively). However, I could've run BSD and gotten a very nice Un*x clone that is *not* GPL'd if I chose to.
You're entitled to your opinions, but spreading general FUD (RedHat is gonna be another Microsoft! RedHat is evil for making any money!) is wrong, pointless, and not very smart.
Don't get mad at the community for pointing out
that you're opinion is based in misconception and
ignorance.
The End.
1) What is proprietary to redhat that will keep
codewarrior from running on any other dist. of linux since everything they do is 100% open source??
2) Use whatever distribution you like, but without
RMS, we'd still be at 2.2.5 as Linus would've simply used BSD-style tools. Contrary to popular
myth...other tools DID exist before RMS wrote GPL'd ports.
3) You obviously have no idea what you're talking about and you're only serving up more FUD that has no place here. RedHat is not the enemy.