This is nonsense. If companies are willing to post below the price they are paying (considering things like loss leading customer acquisition which seems unlikely in this scenario) they are dumb and the software developers they employ are dumb. A simple "if the price is I paid to acquire this, stop offering downward" would stop this. Nonsense.
PS - I have the book - it is not good. Get a real book about Datamining/ AI/ Machine Learning etc. Learn how to program elsewhere. This book is neither a good AI book or a good C# book.
Well folks - I must say - based on the posts I usually see - 99% of/. -ers need a smack.
Anyone can say something useless like -- errghh -- uuhhmm ".Net sucks man", "They bit Java", "Bill Gates is the devil"... but is any of that useful?
I am proud of everyone that can make a living programming - or doing something else that you love. I love programming. I have programmed what you could call 'real' AI/ Datamining applications - I have done so using C#, C++, and Java. People trade futures and stocks with the results - they make money. You want to know which version is STILL IN USE - the C# one. Do you want to know why - because it worked best in total.
At the end of the day - C#/.Net works. I am sorry that the narrow minded cannot see this. I am also sorry for the narrow minded that they do not see that business value is added every day by people writing on the MS platform. Yes - value is added to businesses using MANY MANY programming languages.
Lets get it over with here - lets everyone just say:
"What I know is cool - and everyone else (since they are not as cool or bright as I am) - really really really sucks!"
This is what everyone keeps saying in every trollfest post regarding MS, or anything that is not linux and C (just about).
Agree - do what you do. People get good at doing stuff- work that:) Also - do what you LOVE. Sometimes embedded c dev is fun. Sometimes trading systems is fun. Sometimes Datamining software is fun sometimes web stuff is fun. DO what you love! I was just confirming that the demand is THERE for sure for.net - but there is PLENTY more to do in IT:)
PS - me linux lover. I am also a windows lover. Accept it and your life will be easier and more profitable. Programming is a job. It is a job that I LOVE!!! I program professionaly in a few languages. Make the most $ doing C# now.... that is all there is to it. Leave the idealism to broke folks. Program in a language you love - but it is a job - go where the demand is - do not be locked to windows, linux, novel, mainframe etc.... learn, move, adapt - keep relevant - add value to businesses - in whatever language/ platform you can.
I have been working in NYC hiring developers that do C# development at the expert developer level for some time now. I am currently working for a boutique consulting firm.. Finetix (http://www.finetix.com/).. doing software development for the major investment banks and hedge funds in NYC and London mostly. They do Java and.Net development - and the.Net pull is STRONG. We cannot hire enough STRONG developers. I have been interviewing developers for full time and/ or consulting positions for the better part of the last 4 years in the NYC area. The market for software devlopers that can program C# is very strong right now. A friend and collegue of mine posted last week on his blog http://magmasystems.blogspot.com/ that the baseline salary for strong C# AND Java devs in NYC area is ~150k$. I agree with this. I can say that companies want C# devs for building DESKTOP APPLICATIONS in the major banks, funds etc. Swing does not cut it yet - sorry. VB is old and dead. I hate to break the news to all you Flamer Style OSS or die slashdotters - but MS makes a great programming model for building insanely rich desktop applications.On top of that EVERYONE IN MOST PLACES HAS A WINDOWS DESKTOP. Traders that make millions of dollars doing what they do DO NOT WANT WEB APPLICATIONS. They need RICH desktop applicaions (always N tier communicating with web services, message queues etc.). There is a super strong need for REAL software developers (not ASP kiddies or VBers just awakened). That all said - I am typing all this on my laptop running linux, I can code in C# as an expert, Java at the mid level - I can program Ruby some as well as some C++, and lots more. I can say that having lead teams of developers - YOU CAN DO AN AMAZING AMOUNT with C# and.Net. I have led teams to build both the 30th and the 60th busiest sites on the web for a former client - all.Net/ C#. It works. I have seen one after another huge class desktop/ N tier 'smart client' application be build succesfully using.Net on the client at least. It works. It pays the bills. Do not discount or flame it as it shows you do not understand it. Accept that C#/.Net is here - it is ready for the enterprise. People are making great money doing it.
I am sorry - i cannot believe how much hype there is over 'ajax'. This is something that has been going on for so long. In the past - we have done this using 1x1 frames and parsed the Xml with light Js libraries. I guess I must be getting old - I always sneered at the 'mainframers' that would complain and say 'that is nothing new - we have been doing that since 1876'. Now - I guess I see the same thing. A new marketing hype name - and the old technique is here
I hope that the next version of the web is much more than HTML pages that don't refresh with a full round trip. Really though - we did this at least 5 or 6 years ago..... I like google maps, Flickr and the others, but it is NOT a revolution. Someone innovate for real and show me a revolution if you want to justify the Ajax hype or the Web 2.0 hype!!!!
I am not always surprised when I see the trolls out on slashdot (it is one of my fav sites - not a total bash). In this case - I am somewhat surprised to see how many nay sayers are posting. I have been an agile advocate and user for some time now. I can say that while it is 'nothing new' - neither is anything entirely new. Putting together old ideas into a newer unification is what is usually happening with most things. In any case - the end of the story is - "DO WHAT WORKS FOR YOUR BUSINESS". I believe - as do many other practicioners that Scrum specifically has enabled me and my groups to stay closer to the business needs and to meet what the business needs more adeptly. This is really the crux of the matter. So - I would also gather that all the nay-sayers are waterfallers for the last N years. All I can say is - nay say what you know - be skeptical, but do not show yourself until you have some real experience in something. So - DO a Scrum based project for a few sprints - then come back and post about how useless it is.
I can say from real experience in the enterprise (Implemened the 30th and 60th busiest sites on the net today - MediaMetrix). These COULD NOT HAVE BEEN DONE without stored procs. The level of performance increase is completely non-trivial. YOU WILL GET HUGE PERFORMANCE GAINS - especially when you have a complex AND PROPERLY RELATIONAL db. You CAN NOT use string SQL at the enterprise level like this. You CAN NOT maintain string SQL all over. When you do things like 1 click place an order, register a user, enter some survey questions etc - do you think you can maintain 5000 concurrent users while each are making 5 string based SQL trips????
The level of business logic being embeded in procs can be maintained so you KEEP YOUR REALL OO MODEL. It is KEY from an app development perspective to maintain a good OO model. Everyone acts like if you put ANYTHING beyond 5 lines of SQL in a proc - you are commiting an evil act of embedding 'business logic' in a proc - God forbid. The REAL truth is that you CAN put LOTS AND LOTS of SQL in a proc - have it work REALLY REALLY fast and STILL have a GREAT OO model.
The caveats; you need to have people that write good procs and have a properly structured DB.
That is a ludicrous statement. You are obviously not informed as to the contributions of Creationists to the body of scientific evidence. There are many over strict Creationists that refuse to aknowledge scientific evidence, but there is a large body of very intelligent and accredited scientists that believe in an intelligent designer. Far more accredited than you I would wager.
I CHALLENGE YOU, in your attempts to argue with little evididence to listen to this THIS is a man qualafied to argue on this topic, a Brown Graduate in Organic Biology with a laundry list of credits to his scientific merits, You will hear his credentials in the 1st minute of these streams:
(real) http://www.icoc.cc/axs/ax.pl?http://www.icoc.cc:31 688/ramgen/RealFiles/_Serm_DF_ShieldOfFaith.rm
or(windows media)
http://www.icoc.cc/axs/ax.pl?/ASX/_Serm_DF_Shiel dO fFaith.asx
Again, accept the challenge so you can understand, otherwise you are weak in your attemp for finding truth. Don't rest your conscience on little information.
Good luck in finding a truth amoungst the arguments,
Chris
Slashdot Mirror
This is nonsense. If companies are willing to post below the price they are paying (considering things like loss leading customer acquisition which seems unlikely in this scenario) they are dumb and the software developers they employ are dumb. A simple "if the price is I paid to acquire this, stop offering downward" would stop this. Nonsense.
PS - I have the book - it is not good. Get a real book about Datamining/ AI/ Machine Learning etc. Learn how to program elsewhere. This book is neither a good AI book or a good C# book.
-CD
Well folks - I must say - based on the posts I usually see - 99% of /. -ers need a smack.
.Net works. I am sorry that the narrow minded cannot see this. I am also sorry for the narrow minded that they do not see that business value is added every day by people writing on the MS platform. Yes - value is added to businesses using MANY MANY programming languages.
Anyone can say something useless like -- errghh -- uuhhmm ".Net sucks man", "They bit Java", "Bill Gates is the devil"... but is any of that useful?
I am proud of everyone that can make a living programming - or doing something else that you love. I love programming. I have programmed what you could call 'real' AI/ Datamining applications - I have done so using C#, C++, and Java. People trade futures and stocks with the results - they make money. You want to know which version is STILL IN USE - the C# one. Do you want to know why - because it worked best in total.
At the end of the day - C#/
Lets get it over with here - lets everyone just say:
"What I know is cool - and everyone else (since they are not as cool or bright as I am) - really really really sucks!"
This is what everyone keeps saying in every trollfest post regarding MS, or anything that is not linux and C (just about).
-CD
Agree - do what you do. People get good at doing stuff- work that :) Also - do what you LOVE. Sometimes embedded c dev is fun. Sometimes trading systems is fun. Sometimes Datamining software is fun sometimes web stuff is fun. DO what you love! I was just confirming that the demand is THERE for sure for .net - but there is PLENTY more to do in IT :)
:)
PS - Lisp is nice too
-Chris
PS - me linux lover. I am also a windows lover. Accept it and your life will be easier and more profitable. Programming is a job. It is a job that I LOVE!!! I program professionaly in a few languages. Make the most $ doing C# now.... that is all there is to it. Leave the idealism to broke folks. Program in a language you love - but it is a job - go where the demand is - do not be locked to windows, linux, novel, mainframe etc.... learn, move, adapt - keep relevant - add value to businesses - in whatever language/ platform you can.
-Chris
I have been working in NYC hiring developers that do C# development at the expert developer level for some time now. I am currently working for a boutique consulting firm .. Finetix (http://www.finetix.com/) .. doing software development for the major investment banks and hedge funds in NYC and London mostly. They do Java and .Net development - and the .Net pull is STRONG. We cannot hire enough STRONG developers. I have been interviewing developers for full time and/ or consulting positions for the better part of the last 4 years in the NYC area. The market for software devlopers that can program C# is very strong right now. A friend and collegue of mine posted last week on his blog http://magmasystems.blogspot.com/ that the baseline salary for strong C# AND Java devs in NYC area is ~150k$. I agree with this. I can say that companies want C# devs for building DESKTOP APPLICATIONS in the major banks, funds etc. Swing does not cut it yet - sorry. VB is old and dead. I hate to break the news to all you Flamer Style OSS or die slashdotters - but MS makes a great programming model for building insanely rich desktop applications.On top of that EVERYONE IN MOST PLACES HAS A WINDOWS DESKTOP. Traders that make millions of dollars doing what they do DO NOT WANT WEB APPLICATIONS. They need RICH desktop applicaions (always N tier communicating with web services, message queues etc.). There is a super strong need for REAL software developers (not ASP kiddies or VBers just awakened). That all said - I am typing all this on my laptop running linux, I can code in C# as an expert, Java at the mid level - I can program Ruby some as well as some C++, and lots more. I can say that having lead teams of developers - YOU CAN DO AN AMAZING AMOUNT with C# and .Net. I have led teams to build both the 30th and the 60th busiest sites on the web for a former client - all .Net/ C#. It works. I have seen one after another huge class desktop/ N tier 'smart client' application be build succesfully using .Net on the client at least. It works. It pays the bills. Do not discount or flame it as it shows you do not understand it. Accept that C#/ .Net is here - it is ready for the enterprise. People are making great money doing it.
Enough ramble from me;
Chris
I am sorry - i cannot believe how much hype there is over 'ajax'. This is something that has been going on for so long. In the past - we have done this using 1x1 frames and parsed the Xml with light Js libraries. I guess I must be getting old - I always sneered at the 'mainframers' that would complain and say 'that is nothing new - we have been doing that since 1876'. Now - I guess I see the same thing. A new marketing hype name - and the old technique is here
I hope that the next version of the web is much more than HTML pages that don't refresh with a full round trip. Really though - we did this at least 5 or 6 years ago..... I like google maps, Flickr and the others, but it is NOT a revolution. Someone innovate for real and show me a revolution if you want to justify the Ajax hype or the Web 2.0 hype!!!!
-Irate -
Chris
I am not always surprised when I see the trolls out on slashdot (it is one of my fav sites - not a total bash). In this case - I am somewhat surprised to see how many nay sayers are posting. I have been an agile advocate and user for some time now. I can say that while it is 'nothing new' - neither is anything entirely new. Putting together old ideas into a newer unification is what is usually happening with most things. In any case - the end of the story is - "DO WHAT WORKS FOR YOUR BUSINESS". I believe - as do many other practicioners that Scrum specifically has enabled me and my groups to stay closer to the business needs and to meet what the business needs more adeptly. This is really the crux of the matter. So - I would also gather that all the nay-sayers are waterfallers for the last N years. All I can say is - nay say what you know - be skeptical, but do not show yourself until you have some real experience in something. So - DO a Scrum based project for a few sprints - then come back and post about how useless it is.
I can say from real experience in the enterprise (Implemened the 30th and 60th busiest sites on the net today - MediaMetrix). These COULD NOT HAVE BEEN DONE without stored procs. The level of performance increase is completely non-trivial. YOU WILL GET HUGE PERFORMANCE GAINS - especially when you have a complex AND PROPERLY RELATIONAL db. You CAN NOT use string SQL at the enterprise level like this. You CAN NOT maintain string SQL all over. When you do things like 1 click place an order, register a user, enter some survey questions etc - do you think you can maintain 5000 concurrent users while each are making 5 string based SQL trips????
The level of business logic being embeded in procs can be maintained so you KEEP YOUR REALL OO MODEL. It is KEY from an app development perspective to maintain a good OO model. Everyone acts like if you put ANYTHING beyond 5 lines of SQL in a proc - you are commiting an evil act of embedding 'business logic' in a proc - God forbid. The REAL truth is that you CAN put LOTS AND LOTS of SQL in a proc - have it work REALLY REALLY fast and STILL have a GREAT OO model.
The caveats; you need to have people that write good procs and have a properly structured DB.
thank you for ripping this comment. you gave me a good laugh this morning :)
That is a ludicrous statement. You are obviously not informed as to the contributions of Creationists to the body of scientific evidence. There are many over strict Creationists that refuse to aknowledge scientific evidence, but there is a large body of very intelligent and accredited scientists that believe in an intelligent designer. Far more accredited than you I would wager.
1 688/ramgen/RealFiles/_Serm_DF_ShieldOfFaith.rm
l dO fFaith.asx
I CHALLENGE YOU, in your attempts to argue with little evididence to listen to this THIS is a man qualafied to argue on this topic, a Brown Graduate in Organic Biology with a laundry list of credits to his scientific merits, You will hear his credentials in the 1st minute of these streams:
(real) http://www.icoc.cc/axs/ax.pl?http://www.icoc.cc:3
or(windows media)
http://www.icoc.cc/axs/ax.pl?/ASX/_Serm_DF_Shie
Again, accept the challenge so you can understand, otherwise you are weak in your attemp for finding truth. Don't rest your conscience on little information.
Good luck in finding a truth amoungst the arguments,
Chris