Users up/downmodding comments is not censorship. The posts are still there for everyone to read, which is not censorship. The rating gives an idea of what readers think about the comment, which is also free speech - but apparently you would like to censor / regulate that.
"If your opinion of the guy is correct, then his methods will cause fewer people to listen to him and he will thereby undermine his own efforts. This means such a situation would be self-correcting."
And that, to a large extent, is what is happening. There was the reaction against his sexist jokes at conferences, and his totally tactless words about Steve Jobs death, the videos of him eating his foot cheese while giving a talk, and a litany of other behavior that has made him irrelevant in today's world.
May as in might does not equal always and you will never know if the doctor is a die hard fundy, a goreific sociopath.
So why assume the worst? "Might get a supportive ear" is far better than "will not get a supportive ear." Any doctor who has ethical problems with it will usually refer the case to someone else. I've only encountered one doctor who was a little bit discombobulated by it (in the ER), and he referred me to another one right away.
BTW, there's a huge difference between a "christian therapist" and a real licensed board-certified psychiatrist or other doctor. That girl didn't deserve to die that way, just like she didn't deserve to be told that it could be fixed by prayer and faith. But even in death, the parents still mis-gender her, because they simply don't know any alternative for dealing with this sort of situation. If you've ever heard fundies discussing LGBT, it can get pretty hateful without them even noticing because they're "doing righteous work to help the sinners."
You're right - it's not a law, but an acknowledgement that the right to assisted suicide a a constitutional right. Lets hope the government doesn't use the notwithstanding clause to cater to their base for the next election.
People can suffer from a non-terminal disease that still leaves them in pain, unable to fend for themselves, and with zero hope of recovery, so I think it's a good thing that they didn't limit it to the terminally ill. If you had to decide between being hooked up to machines, unable to fend for yourself for even basic needs, always in pain, without even the hope of dying because it's not terminal, I think many would opt for help in shuffling off their mortal coil.
And I see people here calling you names and talking about how a freak of nature you are. They do this via anonymous log in but it happens and you cannot deny it. It has even happened in this article posting over the same damn post I started replying to. Or does your LGBT club shield you from those comments? They will not shield a lot of others. And even if they did, you as well as anyone else will always know what others are thinking and saying- even if they do not say it to your face.
I was outed on slashdot a decade ago, so it was inevitable that someone would eventually try to use it against me. After that had been going on for a while, I changed my signature to send the signal that I'm not ashamed of being a transsexual, and neither should others be. It's all part of "paying it forward.":-)
If they were to log in, or at least make salient points as to why they feel the way they do, I would be happy to engage them in dialog. In the meantime, I think most people don't really have a problem with it.
When you tell a friend and they say "Is that all? I thought it would be something bad." you know they're good with it. I lost one friend over it. I was disappointed, but that's old news. As for the people around me, we talk about it on occasion - usually after I make a joke that only works because I'm trans and someone present didn't know, so I have to explain why it's so funny to everyone else. Drives my sisters nuts, because most of them think I should be ashamed. But sometimes I get a laugh out of them, and I think that finally they're "getting it." Sort of. Hopefully.
Yes, adults torment kids. So do other kids. And they've been charged and convicted. We also run regular PSAs reminding kids that sharing a "special" photo of another kid is distributing child pornography (yes, kids have been convicted for that. And courts are now allowing parents and the media (with the parents consent) to name the victims who have committed suicide, to put a face to the act.
We're not there bet, but we're making remarkable progress on multiple fronts.
The current maintainer has said he will apply the patches anyway so it's really a non issue. None of that seems to be mentioned in the summary at least.
That part IS mentioned in the summary
The Emacs maintainer has called the statements irrelevant and won't affect their decision to merge the LLDB support.
You can be sure Stallman is miffed. Publicly calling his input irrelevant on code he wrote is one step away from calling him irrelevant.
build a cloud of servers in poorer Greeks' basements
Do you really want to put servers in the basement? Didn't Japan's Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power station meltdown not teach anyone anything? Or the floods on wall street that filled the basements completely?
The criminal code was revised to remove suicide as an offense in 1972. This law isn't about that - this law is specifically allowing for people to ask a doctor (actually, a team of doctors) for help in terminating their lives.
Some people who have gone to the courts for the right for help, like Sue Rodriguez, have medical conditions (in her case advanced Lou Gehrig Disease) that make it impossible to do anything without assistance. Others are afraid of the result of a botched attempt which just makes their situation worse.
Someone making fun of you is not an "unbearable life." I'm pretty sure that many/most of us went through periods where we were miserable because others teased of bullied us. Such cases simply don't justify assisted suicide, just as they don't justify suicide. Unfortunately, people take that route when they really don't see any other way to end the suffering and have nobody there to help them deal with it.
That's one of the reasons to be "out" if you're part of the LGBT - it normalizes the situation in people's minds. The sky didn't fall in when TV shows started featuring same-sex couples, or when actresses are open about their previous gender. Knowing you're not alone, and having a few famous role models, makes a diff.
Look, I understand why you might find it's the wrong thing to do. For most "normals" it absolutely would be. And then there are those who want it for all the wrong reasons. The typical "wrong" candidate is what I call a "transvestite that went too far." They game the system, and get what they want, instead of what they need. They're not happy afterwards, they blame everyone else but themselves for the negative outcome, join some religion that will back up their need to blame the doctors, the "system", everyone else but themselves.
On the knee: Surgeons did my left knee the old way (a 4-inch cut to get access) to fix a torn meniscus when draining off the fluid didn't work - but it's lasted decades with no real problems. Maybe it's because I was younger (19) so I healed better. The scar is pretty much invisible now, even with a tan.
Now on the question of advertisers and host files, it's not a question of proving anything. I'm just saying you'll have a better reception by being less "loud" in how you offer it. If you don't want to put it in a.sig, another way would be to post one paragraph that says "you might want to consider this as well" with a link. Posting those long challenges just makes it look like you're shouting. Give a chance for people to make up their own minds instead.
And if it's causing them mental problems, they have a right to be helped.
Plus they have the right to bring up a complaint with the human rights commission, which should end it, or at least put people on notice that hating on someone because of their sexual preference is going to cost them.
Also, in Canada harassing someone over their sexual or gender identity is a hate crime. So there are plenty of remedies available.
Except now that siucidal gay teen or the boy who thinks he is a girl doesn't have to kill themselves when they are tormented for not fitting into society- they can get a doctor to do it for them.
Gays and lesbians have full rights in Canada, including same-sex marriage. If one were to turn to a doctor because they are tormented for not fitting in society, the ER doctor would have them see a psychiatrist the same day.
As for the boy who thinks she's (gotta watch those pronouns in Canada - it's the law:-) a girl, they would also be interviewed by a psychiatrist, then a specialized team. If it is confirmed that they're transsexual (instead of going through a phase or just questioning who they are), taking the road to a future sex change is one of several options they'll be offered.
If you didn't know about it, you were one of the few:-) I was originally outed in 2005 or 2006 on slashdot and made no secret about it. That's why you'd see me referred to by others as "she" or "her" in others posts even under that account.
See, there's an advantage to having an account. You would have probably heard it through the grapevine (great song, btw)..
I get where you're coming from, so no more anti-APK posts from me. But you're free to continue making fun of me, because it is a free world, and I do believe in freedom of speech.
BTW, the uninstall of vivaldi has been running for 4 hours now... turns out it had installed in my startup, and since it couldn't display a window due to the settings bug, you can guess the rest. It's gone now, but sheesh!. Oh well, c'est la vie.
And I really would encourage you to get an account. If you just put your hosts file in your.sig instead of repeatedly on every page, you might be surprised at how people will appreciate it. Just a thought.
That was before the supreme court ruled that in one year those parts of the criminal code would no longer apply in such situations. A year from now, as I posted, it will not be murder.
I'm sorry for your loss, but if there was a DNR or the doctors decided that attempts to save her life were going to be futile, nobody will prosecute because it doesn't make sense to continue any treatment in such cases.
Living in DDO, QC., the Quebec legislation directly affects me, and I'm good with it. Completely OT, what part of town are you in?
Fortunately in Canada there's no insurance company to put pressure on people to off themselves. It's not an ideal world, but it's the one we've got, so we do our best.
It's been my experience that doctors encourage patients to ask questions about their treatment. They put the "informed" in informed consent because to do otherwise would be malpractice and/or assault.
As for eugenics, once a person is no longer capable of reproducing, you can't "clean up" the gene pool by offing them. Also, natural selection is eugenics. It's the environment that controls who wins and who loses, and the gene pool is improved in terms of survivability.
Kind of hard to claim that a video wherein the patient outlines the reasons for their decision is faked, especially if family and friends are also present.
Quebec has already changed its laws to allow assisted suicide. This is because they recognize sometimes, for some people, there's no point in extending the suffering. So no, the law now says that not every person who considers suicide is mentally ill.
Also, we allow people to sign DNRs. That can be seen as a form of suicide, but it's legal and rational. What isn't rational is to only allow people to actively end their lives by refusing food and letting them starve to death. How is that NOT sick?
People in Canada have had the legal right to kill themselves for years - 1972 to be specific. That's how long it hasn't been a crime.
Any new laws the government proposes will have to be around regulating "how it works", because the supremes have found that banning assisted suicide infringes on 3 different constitutionally-guaranteed fundamental rights. If they do nothing, then it's up to the provinces to pass their own laws concerning the mechanics of assisted suicide (Quebec has already enacted its own law setting out such guidelines), though they too cannot pass an outright ban.
"And what do you do about the sort of person who thinks they want to die but decided that irrationally and you expect would change their minds between jumping off a building and hitting the floor?"
If the doctors believe that the person is acting irrationally and they expect the person would change their mind, it just isn't going to happen. That's the whole point of having mandatory safeguards.
"Also, given that for most suicide "attempts" the objective is to get people's attention rather than to die"
Like Landsberg said in one interview: "You're in a meeting and you look at your watch and say 'Sorry, I've got an appointment with my dentist.' No problem. But when you say "Sorry, I've got an appointment with my psychiatrist'... " Look at how many people say "Gee, I never suspected they were having problems" because of the stigma of mental illness.
So maybe some people are trying to get attention. Maybe that's their way of saying "Why won't someone help me?" But there's nothing selfish about suicide.
I should imagine it's the same as any other suicide. After all, if it saves the insurance company money keeping someone alive who doesn't want to be, they're in no position to complain.
Note that "assisted suicide" isn't about you killing yourself, it's about your doctor helping you to do so. Which meets the legal definitions of murder in most places.
According to the supreme court, it no longer meets the definition of murder. I expect to see a lot of Americans coming to Canada to seek relief from a system that insists on cruelly punishing people who can no longer bear the pain and suffering they're experiencing.
Also, 2 states have already legalized it, so please don't blame Canada:-)
If the person has the right to end their life because it's not possible to help them and they want to end their suffering, and you deny them assistance when they are not physically capable of doing it themselves (just do a search for Sue Rodriguez), you have effectively removed the right for that person to end their life.
And that is unconstitutional in Canada.
And as the court noted, other jurisdictions have installed safeguards that work; there's no reason to believe and slippery slope will occur.
It will become very hard to sue someone who have killed someone else in the conditions described by the Court to prove the killed one has never asked to be killed.
The conditions that the court envisions would make what you describe impossible.
Slashdot Mirror
Users up/downmodding comments is not censorship. The posts are still there for everyone to read, which is not censorship. The rating gives an idea of what readers think about the comment, which is also free speech - but apparently you would like to censor / regulate that.
Okay, whatever works for you. In the end, free speech is free speech, right ? :-) TTYL
"If your opinion of the guy is correct, then his methods will cause fewer people to listen to him and he will thereby undermine his own efforts. This means such a situation would be self-correcting."
And that, to a large extent, is what is happening. There was the reaction against his sexist jokes at conferences, and his totally tactless words about Steve Jobs death, the videos of him eating his foot cheese while giving a talk, and a litany of other behavior that has made him irrelevant in today's world.
May as in might does not equal always and you will never know if the doctor is a die hard fundy, a goreific sociopath.
So why assume the worst? "Might get a supportive ear" is far better than "will not get a supportive ear." Any doctor who has ethical problems with it will usually refer the case to someone else. I've only encountered one doctor who was a little bit discombobulated by it (in the ER), and he referred me to another one right away.
BTW, there's a huge difference between a "christian therapist" and a real licensed board-certified psychiatrist or other doctor. That girl didn't deserve to die that way, just like she didn't deserve to be told that it could be fixed by prayer and faith. But even in death, the parents still mis-gender her, because they simply don't know any alternative for dealing with this sort of situation. If you've ever heard fundies discussing LGBT, it can get pretty hateful without them even noticing because they're "doing righteous work to help the sinners."
You're right - it's not a law, but an acknowledgement that the right to assisted suicide a a constitutional right. Lets hope the government doesn't use the notwithstanding clause to cater to their base for the next election.
People can suffer from a non-terminal disease that still leaves them in pain, unable to fend for themselves, and with zero hope of recovery, so I think it's a good thing that they didn't limit it to the terminally ill. If you had to decide between being hooked up to machines, unable to fend for yourself for even basic needs, always in pain, without even the hope of dying because it's not terminal, I think many would opt for help in shuffling off their mortal coil.
And I see people here calling you names and talking about how a freak of nature you are. They do this via anonymous log in but it happens and you cannot deny it. It has even happened in this article posting over the same damn post I started replying to. Or does your LGBT club shield you from those comments? They will not shield a lot of others. And even if they did, you as well as anyone else will always know what others are thinking and saying- even if they do not say it to your face.
I was outed on slashdot a decade ago, so it was inevitable that someone would eventually try to use it against me. After that had been going on for a while, I changed my signature to send the signal that I'm not ashamed of being a transsexual, and neither should others be. It's all part of "paying it forward." :-)
If they were to log in, or at least make salient points as to why they feel the way they do, I would be happy to engage them in dialog. In the meantime, I think most people don't really have a problem with it.
When you tell a friend and they say "Is that all? I thought it would be something bad." you know they're good with it. I lost one friend over it. I was disappointed, but that's old news. As for the people around me, we talk about it on occasion - usually after I make a joke that only works because I'm trans and someone present didn't know, so I have to explain why it's so funny to everyone else. Drives my sisters nuts, because most of them think I should be ashamed. But sometimes I get a laugh out of them, and I think that finally they're "getting it." Sort of. Hopefully.
Yes, adults torment kids. So do other kids. And they've been charged and convicted. We also run regular PSAs reminding kids that sharing a "special" photo of another kid is distributing child pornography (yes, kids have been convicted for that. And courts are now allowing parents and the media (with the parents consent) to name the victims who have committed suicide, to put a face to the act.
We're not there bet, but we're making remarkable progress on multiple fronts.
The current maintainer has said he will apply the patches anyway so it's really a non issue. None of that seems to be mentioned in the summary at least.
That part IS mentioned in the summary
The Emacs maintainer has called the statements irrelevant and won't affect their decision to merge the LLDB support.
You can be sure Stallman is miffed. Publicly calling his input irrelevant on code he wrote is one step away from calling him irrelevant.
build a cloud of servers in poorer Greeks' basements
Do you really want to put servers in the basement? Didn't Japan's Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power station meltdown not teach anyone anything? Or the floods on wall street that filled the basements completely?
The criminal code was revised to remove suicide as an offense in 1972. This law isn't about that - this law is specifically allowing for people to ask a doctor (actually, a team of doctors) for help in terminating their lives.
Some people who have gone to the courts for the right for help, like Sue Rodriguez, have medical conditions (in her case advanced Lou Gehrig Disease) that make it impossible to do anything without assistance. Others are afraid of the result of a botched attempt which just makes their situation worse.
Someone making fun of you is not an "unbearable life." I'm pretty sure that many/most of us went through periods where we were miserable because others teased of bullied us. Such cases simply don't justify assisted suicide, just as they don't justify suicide. Unfortunately, people take that route when they really don't see any other way to end the suffering and have nobody there to help them deal with it.
That's one of the reasons to be "out" if you're part of the LGBT - it normalizes the situation in people's minds. The sky didn't fall in when TV shows started featuring same-sex couples, or when actresses are open about their previous gender. Knowing you're not alone, and having a few famous role models, makes a diff.
Look, I understand why you might find it's the wrong thing to do. For most "normals" it absolutely would be. And then there are those who want it for all the wrong reasons. The typical "wrong" candidate is what I call a "transvestite that went too far." They game the system, and get what they want, instead of what they need. They're not happy afterwards, they blame everyone else but themselves for the negative outcome, join some religion that will back up their need to blame the doctors, the "system", everyone else but themselves.
A few famous cases have shown that it isn't for everyone. Still,with proper screening, it works. (more reading). And there are a lot more of us than the official numbers indicate. Other countries have upped the prevalence by several orders of magnitude after trolling through their medical databases (single-payer universal health care makes that easy) to between 1 in 500 and 1 in 50!!!
On the knee: Surgeons did my left knee the old way (a 4-inch cut to get access) to fix a torn meniscus when draining off the fluid didn't work - but it's lasted decades with no real problems. Maybe it's because I was younger (19) so I healed better. The scar is pretty much invisible now, even with a tan.
Now on the question of advertisers and host files, it's not a question of proving anything. I'm just saying you'll have a better reception by being less "loud" in how you offer it. If you don't want to put it in a .sig, another way would be to post one paragraph that says "you might want to consider this as well" with a link. Posting those long challenges just makes it look like you're shouting. Give a chance for people to make up their own minds instead.
You might be surprised :-) TTYL
And if it's causing them mental problems, they have a right to be helped.
Plus they have the right to bring up a complaint with the human rights commission, which should end it, or at least put people on notice that hating on someone because of their sexual preference is going to cost them.
Also, in Canada harassing someone over their sexual or gender identity is a hate crime. So there are plenty of remedies available.
I knew that for at least a week now. Old news.
No you didn't because today is Sunday, Feb 8 2015 and the decision was announced Friday Feb 6 2015. That's 2 days ago, and I submitted the story the same morning.
Or you can read the date on the actual judgment, again just 2 days ago.
Except now that siucidal gay teen or the boy who thinks he is a girl doesn't have to kill themselves when they are tormented for not fitting into society- they can get a doctor to do it for them.
Gays and lesbians have full rights in Canada, including same-sex marriage. If one were to turn to a doctor because they are tormented for not fitting in society, the ER doctor would have them see a psychiatrist the same day.
As for the boy who thinks she's (gotta watch those pronouns in Canada - it's the law :-) a girl, they would also be interviewed by a psychiatrist, then a specialized team. If it is confirmed that they're transsexual (instead of going through a phase or just questioning who they are), taking the road to a future sex change is one of several options they'll be offered.
If you didn't know about it, you were one of the few :-) I was originally outed in 2005 or 2006 on slashdot and made no secret about it. That's why you'd see me referred to by others as "she" or "her" in others posts even under that account.
See, there's an advantage to having an account. You would have probably heard it through the grapevine (great song, btw)..
I get where you're coming from, so no more anti-APK posts from me. But you're free to continue making fun of me, because it is a free world, and I do believe in freedom of speech.
BTW, the uninstall of vivaldi has been running for 4 hours now ... turns out it had installed in my startup, and since it couldn't display a window due to the settings bug, you can guess the rest. It's gone now, but sheesh!. Oh well, c'est la vie.
And I really would encourage you to get an account. If you just put your hosts file in your .sig instead of repeatedly on every page, you might be surprised at how people will appreciate it. Just a thought.
Oh, and thanks for the "get well."
That was before the supreme court ruled that in one year those parts of the criminal code would no longer apply in such situations. A year from now, as I posted, it will not be murder.
I'm sorry for your loss, but if there was a DNR or the doctors decided that attempts to save her life were going to be futile, nobody will prosecute because it doesn't make sense to continue any treatment in such cases.
Living in DDO, QC., the Quebec legislation directly affects me, and I'm good with it. Completely OT, what part of town are you in?
Most insurance policies don't cover suicide in the first 2 years, but do cover it after.
Fortunately in Canada there's no insurance company to put pressure on people to off themselves. It's not an ideal world, but it's the one we've got, so we do our best.
It's been my experience that doctors encourage patients to ask questions about their treatment. They put the "informed" in informed consent because to do otherwise would be malpractice and/or assault.
As for eugenics, once a person is no longer capable of reproducing, you can't "clean up" the gene pool by offing them. Also, natural selection is eugenics. It's the environment that controls who wins and who loses, and the gene pool is improved in terms of survivability.
Kind of hard to claim that a video wherein the patient outlines the reasons for their decision is faked, especially if family and friends are also present.
Quebec has already changed its laws to allow assisted suicide. This is because they recognize sometimes, for some people, there's no point in extending the suffering. So no, the law now says that not every person who considers suicide is mentally ill.
Also, we allow people to sign DNRs. That can be seen as a form of suicide, but it's legal and rational. What isn't rational is to only allow people to actively end their lives by refusing food and letting them starve to death. How is that NOT sick?
People in Canada have had the legal right to kill themselves for years - 1972 to be specific. That's how long it hasn't been a crime.
Any new laws the government proposes will have to be around regulating "how it works", because the supremes have found that banning assisted suicide infringes on 3 different constitutionally-guaranteed fundamental rights. If they do nothing, then it's up to the provinces to pass their own laws concerning the mechanics of assisted suicide (Quebec has already enacted its own law setting out such guidelines), though they too cannot pass an outright ban.
"And what do you do about the sort of person who thinks they want to die but decided that irrationally and you expect would change their minds between jumping off a building and hitting the floor?"
If the doctors believe that the person is acting irrationally and they expect the person would change their mind, it just isn't going to happen. That's the whole point of having mandatory safeguards.
"Also, given that for most suicide "attempts" the objective is to get people's attention rather than to die"
[citation needed]
I'm pretty sure that Robin Williams would have disagreed with you. Michael Landsberg certainly does.
And so do I.
Like Landsberg said in one interview: "You're in a meeting and you look at your watch and say 'Sorry, I've got an appointment with my dentist.' No problem. But when you say "Sorry, I've got an appointment with my psychiatrist' ... " Look at how many people say "Gee, I never suspected they were having problems" because of the stigma of mental illness.
So maybe some people are trying to get attention. Maybe that's their way of saying "Why won't someone help me?" But there's nothing selfish about suicide.
I should imagine it's the same as any other suicide. After all, if it saves the insurance company money keeping someone alive who doesn't want to be, they're in no position to complain.
Note that "assisted suicide" isn't about you killing yourself, it's about your doctor helping you to do so. Which meets the legal definitions of murder in most places.
According to the supreme court, it no longer meets the definition of murder. I expect to see a lot of Americans coming to Canada to seek relief from a system that insists on cruelly punishing people who can no longer bear the pain and suffering they're experiencing.
Also, 2 states have already legalized it, so please don't blame Canada :-)
If the person has the right to end their life because it's not possible to help them and they want to end their suffering, and you deny them assistance when they are not physically capable of doing it themselves (just do a search for Sue Rodriguez), you have effectively removed the right for that person to end their life.
And that is unconstitutional in Canada.
And as the court noted, other jurisdictions have installed safeguards that work; there's no reason to believe and slippery slope will occur.
It will become very hard to sue someone who have killed someone else in the conditions described by the Court to prove the killed one has never asked to be killed.
The conditions that the court envisions would make what you describe impossible.