Yet the best we've seen out of Mozilla has been the rather pointless Rust and Servo.
Speak for yourself. Currently I use Chrome on desktop. Once most of Firefox has been redone in Rust, I'll switch to it. Why? Because if it's written in Rust, it's secure by design -- that's something I won't pass up, even if Chrome is faster or some pages don't work in FF.
"We are confident that all our cloud accounting is proper and correct." == "We are confident we paid off the right politicians to get nothing beyond a slap on the wrist for our doctored books."
Well, I haven't been digging around in that part of the system much lately, but as I understand it, systemd has pretty well taken over the udev process (like so many other things). So there's a fairly high probability that systemd is at least part of the problem.
Even if systemd itself isn't driving udev abnormally, there's still the question to be answered of whether systemd is aiding or hindering the diagnostic and repair processes.
And those are VERY significant to me. One reason I liked Linux better than OS/2 was because despite working in a major IBM shop, when I had problems with OS/2, neither IBM nor third parties provided much in the way of problem resolution (Thomas Watson probably spun out in his grave long ago). Linux, on the other hand, had fairly detailed logs and diagnostics despite not having any Fortune Corporations backing it at the time.
I'll just make a few points about journald, since that's important to you (and as I already said, I actually like it a lot):
1. You can turn off journald and use rsyslog or syslog-ng instead.
2. journald starts at the same time as the previous two daemons started in the init process, so the same amount of info is at your hands when you're debugging boot problems.
3. You can use journalctl with all your favorite tools that you're accustomed to (i.e. journalctl | grep foo is the same as cat/var/log/syslog | grep foo | less).
If you're a hardened unix admin with decades of experience, you're probably just as fast or faster than anybody using journald is to find whatever you're looking for in the logs. I'm not knocking your experience in any way, and if you think journalctl sucks, I'm sure you have a perfectly valid reason (except for "it's different therefore I hate it"). That being said, for somebody that's been in unix for less than a decade, I really think journalctl is much easier to use. For example, if I want all the kernel errors from two boots ago, it's just journalctl -p err -b -2 -k. You can get the same thing with grep but it's a lot more work.
Sound: probably a PulseAudio bug. Try reporting it and see what happens.
Things failing to start: you're not being specific enough for me to comment on whatever problems you're having or whose fault it is. Your lack of error messages is contingent upon a lot of things (are you start services via an init script? shell command? by clicking the button in Unity/whatever your DE is?). But I will say that the only part of systemd that I'll actively defend is journalctl because of how easy it is to use (see here for a nice primer).
I know Greg's been using that "must upgrade" line for a while. For example in 2013 he did "The Linux Kernel 3.12.1 is now available for the users and all the users of 3.12 kernel series must upgrade". Does anybody know if that's a reference to some pop culture or something?
I assumed it was because his first language is German.
if your system is hosed, what do you do?
Screenshot at Ubuntu is great proof, seen this stuff before, but does it help?
Do you have a FS backup to go back before the upgrade and how long did it take you to do the FS backup + restore the IM backups you took?
Honesty !
Maybe you can to into Grub cl and do it, but if your system is under LiLo because your HW can't take grub - go RIP with disk and try it from there - figure out the cl...
Good luck with it hope it does not take you 1/2 night or day to get it worked out.
Yukk!
Ubuntu by default saves the last three or so kernels that you've gone through, so that if the new release is unbootable, you can still use an older one. It's selectable from GRUB.
LILO is now maintained by Slackware, so you'll have to ask a slacker what they do in that case. Probably the same thing, I would guess.
Yet another Linux boot issue causing problems, once again proving open source is amateur hour.
Right, because Windows or OS X have never ever had booting problems in their release history?
I'll have you know that I've experienced TONS of Windows booting problems. And that's in the stable release (Win7 Pro) that my employer paid for! This isn't even a fair comparison, because only developers and extreme tinkerers compile their own Linux kernel (on the same day as the release, no less). The stable kernel that's packaged in the Debian, RHEL, etc. releases is infinitely more stable than NT.
Systemd in Ubuntu has been unstable as shit I know that.
Perhaps you could back that up with some kind of facts? I've been on systemd since the very first release (15.04), and I've had zero problems with it so far.
Just to make it clear, I'm not a systemd defender or apologist or anything. My opinion towards it is totally neutral (except journald, which I happen to like). I'm just really tired at the amount of uninformed and insane trolling ("systemd has NSA backdoors!" "there's no stderr!" "it has taken over the whole ecosystem and there's no alternatives!") in comments.
You'd have to be a moron to buy anything from Dell or Lenovo by choice, after the root certificate crap they both pulled.
So what Windows OEMs are left that don't fuck up their computers? Let's start by eliminating the five mentioned in TFS, and also Microsoft, Sony and Samsung because they have a history of abusing their customers and have terrible support. That leaves us with... LG, Toshiba and MSI. And a bunch of tiny companies.
To be fair, you're replying to an AC, so "nothing useful" should be the expected norm. That said, his point over "concerns" seems valid. I've certainly seen people complain that they can't see the contents of the telemetry because it's all sent over secure connections. Of course, if it was sent in the clear, these same people would complain about that, so...
Do you not think it ridiculous that you have to play guessing games as to what of your personal information is being transmitted to the 107 domains that Windows 10 connects to whenever you do anything?
Instead of dismissing the people concerned about spyware by saying 'nothing will please the complainers', why don't you take note of the fact that millions of people use FOSS every day because they DON'T want to be spied on? The fact that Microsoft's clients and subsidiaries are getting their surveillance over a secure connection does nothing to sway us.
It's obviously not meant for plebians. It's meant for the programmer who makes >$200 an hour, i.e. the time lost to compiling is worth more than this extreme high-end CPU is.
The entire point of this reaction is to get opinions expressed one way or another before things have gone so far down the path that changing course *again* would just be even messier.
That would be a nice point to emphasize. Some of the comments on this article are mouth-foaming at the thought of this change going through, as if the doomsday clock is two minutes to midnight and suddenly all your servers will be gobbled up by this abhorrent break. The reality is: the very worst case scenario is that you'll be inconvenienced for less than a minute if your distro-of-choice chooses to side against your preference and you have to manually edit the config file.
This headline is completely wrong: "Systemd Starts Killing Your Background Processes By Default."
Unless you run a rolling release distro and you blindly update, you're not going to get systemd 230 without knowing it. (You could argue that it's still a problem regardless, but it's no bigger problem that Linux kernel/coreutil releases that have terminal boot errors and what not.) So this panic-inducing clickbait title is preposterous. It's nothing like how Windows 10 forcefully installs on peoples' computers with Windows 7 or 8.1 even if they deny the update.
Respondet ad telemetry & spying: Ubuntu IF EXPLICITLY TOLD TO DO SO will deliver crash data to Launchpad. Ubuntu also communicates across an encrypted connection to Canonical's servers to get packages using APT any Snappy -- it doesn't tell the other side what you have installed or anything like that, dependency management is done locally after syncing with their repositories (think I'm lying? Go look at the source code -- isn't FOSS great?). By comparison, why the fuck is Microsoft sending my personal data to bingads.microsoft.com and watson.live.com whenever I do something rudimentary and local like opening Notepad?
Respondet ad uncontrollable updates: Regardless of what you set your update settings to, Windows 10 will update anyway, even when you're in the middle of something. There's lots of reports of this happening.
Respondet at uninstalling your programs: No, the link details that Windows 10 will uninstall your programs during major updates for apparently arbitrary reasons.
That's a good point, since Unity is the only GUI available for the Linux desktop and none others exist and there is no possible way to use anything but Unity. It's a sad state of affairs that FOSS users are trapped with this single option.
Just because you masturbate nightly to your Windows 7 Home Edition every night before bed doesn't mean most of the world wouldn't want to upgrade to the latest, most secure version of the operating system that powers 90% of the world. Fuck.
You make a good point. I would in fact like to upgrade to "the latest, most secure version of the operating system that powers 90% of the world" -- I'll get to compiling Linux 4.7 tonight.
Problem: some people don't install security patches.
Rational solution: turn on automatic security updates by default. If disabled, explicitly warn the user that the vendor is not liable for any breaches that happen because of derelict upgrades.
Slashdot Mirror
Yet the best we've seen out of Mozilla has been the rather pointless Rust and Servo.
Speak for yourself. Currently I use Chrome on desktop. Once most of Firefox has been redone in Rust, I'll switch to it. Why? Because if it's written in Rust, it's secure by design -- that's something I won't pass up, even if Chrome is faster or some pages don't work in FF.
"We are confident that all our cloud accounting is proper and correct." == "We are confident we paid off the right politicians to get nothing beyond a slap on the wrist for our doctored books."
Well, I haven't been digging around in that part of the system much lately, but as I understand it, systemd has pretty well taken over the udev process (like so many other things). So there's a fairly high probability that systemd is at least part of the problem.
Even if systemd itself isn't driving udev abnormally, there's still the question to be answered of whether systemd is aiding or hindering the diagnostic and repair processes.
And those are VERY significant to me. One reason I liked Linux better than OS/2 was because despite working in a major IBM shop, when I had problems with OS/2, neither IBM nor third parties provided much in the way of problem resolution (Thomas Watson probably spun out in his grave long ago). Linux, on the other hand, had fairly detailed logs and diagnostics despite not having any Fortune Corporations backing it at the time.
I'll just make a few points about journald, since that's important to you (and as I already said, I actually like it a lot): /var/log/syslog | grep foo | less).
1. You can turn off journald and use rsyslog or syslog-ng instead.
2. journald starts at the same time as the previous two daemons started in the init process, so the same amount of info is at your hands when you're debugging boot problems.
3. You can use journalctl with all your favorite tools that you're accustomed to (i.e. journalctl | grep foo is the same as cat
If you're a hardened unix admin with decades of experience, you're probably just as fast or faster than anybody using journald is to find whatever you're looking for in the logs. I'm not knocking your experience in any way, and if you think journalctl sucks, I'm sure you have a perfectly valid reason (except for "it's different therefore I hate it"). That being said, for somebody that's been in unix for less than a decade, I really think journalctl is much easier to use. For example, if I want all the kernel errors from two boots ago, it's just journalctl -p err -b -2 -k. You can get the same thing with grep but it's a lot more work.
Sound: probably a PulseAudio bug. Try reporting it and see what happens.
Things failing to start: you're not being specific enough for me to comment on whatever problems you're having or whose fault it is. Your lack of error messages is contingent upon a lot of things (are you start services via an init script? shell command? by clicking the button in Unity/whatever your DE is?). But I will say that the only part of systemd that I'll actively defend is journalctl because of how easy it is to use (see here for a nice primer).
I know Greg's been using that "must upgrade" line for a while. For example in 2013 he did "The Linux Kernel 3.12.1 is now available for the users and all the users of 3.12 kernel series must upgrade". Does anybody know if that's a reference to some pop culture or something?
I assumed it was because his first language is German.
if your system is hosed, what do you do? Screenshot at Ubuntu is great proof, seen this stuff before, but does it help?
Do you have a FS backup to go back before the upgrade and how long did it take you to do the FS backup + restore the IM backups you took? Honesty ! Maybe you can to into Grub cl and do it, but if your system is under LiLo because your HW can't take grub - go RIP with disk and try it from there - figure out the cl...
Good luck with it hope it does not take you 1/2 night or day to get it worked out. Yukk!
Ubuntu by default saves the last three or so kernels that you've gone through, so that if the new release is unbootable, you can still use an older one. It's selectable from GRUB.
LILO is now maintained by Slackware, so you'll have to ask a slacker what they do in that case. Probably the same thing, I would guess.
Is it the kernel? Or some userspace boot process? udev sounds like the init system has a problem.
I have programs A and B
I update A
A now no longer works
so it must be B's fault
(replace A and B with "Linux" and $INIT)
Yet another Linux boot issue causing problems, once again proving open source is amateur hour.
Right, because Windows or OS X have never ever had booting problems in their release history?
I'll have you know that I've experienced TONS of Windows booting problems. And that's in the stable release (Win7 Pro) that my employer paid for! This isn't even a fair comparison, because only developers and extreme tinkerers compile their own Linux kernel (on the same day as the release, no less). The stable kernel that's packaged in the Debian, RHEL, etc. releases is infinitely more stable than NT.
If the new release of the kernel is causing problems that weren't present in the previous version, it's a regression, no?
Systemd in Ubuntu has been unstable as shit I know that.
Perhaps you could back that up with some kind of facts? I've been on systemd since the very first release (15.04), and I've had zero problems with it so far.
Just to make it clear, I'm not a systemd defender or apologist or anything. My opinion towards it is totally neutral (except journald, which I happen to like). I'm just really tired at the amount of uninformed and insane trolling ("systemd has NSA backdoors!" "there's no stderr!" "it has taken over the whole ecosystem and there's no alternatives!") in comments.
You'd have to be a moron to buy anything from Dell or Lenovo by choice, after the root certificate crap they both pulled.
So what Windows OEMs are left that don't fuck up their computers? Let's start by eliminating the five mentioned in TFS, and also Microsoft, Sony and Samsung because they have a history of abusing their customers and have terrible support. That leaves us with... LG, Toshiba and MSI. And a bunch of tiny companies.
No wonder the PC market is declining so hard.
ever!
To be fair, you're replying to an AC, so "nothing useful" should be the expected norm. That said, his point over "concerns" seems valid. I've certainly seen people complain that they can't see the contents of the telemetry because it's all sent over secure connections. Of course, if it was sent in the clear, these same people would complain about that, so...
Do you not think it ridiculous that you have to play guessing games as to what of your personal information is being transmitted to the 107 domains that Windows 10 connects to whenever you do anything?
Instead of dismissing the people concerned about spyware by saying 'nothing will please the complainers', why don't you take note of the fact that millions of people use FOSS every day because they DON'T want to be spied on? The fact that Microsoft's clients and subsidiaries are getting their surveillance over a secure connection does nothing to sway us.
Then the answer should be obvious.
It's obviously not meant for plebians. It's meant for the programmer who makes >$200 an hour, i.e. the time lost to compiling is worth more than this extreme high-end CPU is.
The entire point of this reaction is to get opinions expressed one way or another before things have gone so far down the path that changing course *again* would just be even messier.
That would be a nice point to emphasize. Some of the comments on this article are mouth-foaming at the thought of this change going through, as if the doomsday clock is two minutes to midnight and suddenly all your servers will be gobbled up by this abhorrent break. The reality is: the very worst case scenario is that you'll be inconvenienced for less than a minute if your distro-of-choice chooses to side against your preference and you have to manually edit the config file.
"Do note that Intel is intentionally not calling it deca-core."
Perhaps somebody could elaborate on this?
This headline is completely wrong: "Systemd Starts Killing Your Background Processes By Default."
Unless you run a rolling release distro and you blindly update, you're not going to get systemd 230 without knowing it. (You could argue that it's still a problem regardless, but it's no bigger problem that Linux kernel/coreutil releases that have terminal boot errors and what not.) So this panic-inducing clickbait title is preposterous. It's nothing like how Windows 10 forcefully installs on peoples' computers with Windows 7 or 8.1 even if they deny the update.
Respondet ad telemetry & spying: Ubuntu IF EXPLICITLY TOLD TO DO SO will deliver crash data to Launchpad. Ubuntu also communicates across an encrypted connection to Canonical's servers to get packages using APT any Snappy -- it doesn't tell the other side what you have installed or anything like that, dependency management is done locally after syncing with their repositories (think I'm lying? Go look at the source code -- isn't FOSS great?). By comparison, why the fuck is Microsoft sending my personal data to bingads.microsoft.com and watson.live.com whenever I do something rudimentary and local like opening Notepad?
Respondet ad uncontrollable updates: Regardless of what you set your update settings to, Windows 10 will update anyway, even when you're in the middle of something. There's lots of reports of this happening.
Respondet at uninstalling your programs: No, the link details that Windows 10 will uninstall your programs during major updates for apparently arbitrary reasons.
So you can run Windows 7 in a VM?
Running Windows in a VM is like lowering the toilet lid without flushing. The shit might be contained, but it still stinks.
Correction: *50 million.
> Who gives a shit?
Because if people in the tech industry who work with it on a daily basis won't use it for a desktop OS, why the hell would some grandma?
Linux on the desktop has a 1% market share -- doesn't sound like much, but keep in mind that's something like 500 million computers.
Grandma can get on just fine with Linux. Please stop spreading this stupid myth.
That's a good point, since Unity is the only GUI available for the Linux desktop and none others exist and there is no possible way to use anything but Unity. It's a sad state of affairs that FOSS users are trapped with this single option.
(For the dolts: all of the above is sarcasm.)
Just because you masturbate nightly to your Windows 7 Home Edition every night before bed doesn't mean most of the world wouldn't want to upgrade to the latest, most secure version of the operating system that powers 90% of the world. Fuck.
You make a good point. I would in fact like to upgrade to "the latest, most secure version of the operating system that powers 90% of the world" -- I'll get to compiling Linux 4.7 tonight.
Problem: some people don't install security patches.
Rational solution: turn on automatic security updates by default. If disabled, explicitly warn the user that the vendor is not liable for any breaches that happen because of derelict upgrades.