india and china have many minor border disputes, but also two major disputes over absolutely huge areas that are indeed mostly mountainous, but i don't know why that magically makes them unimportant
russia is a weak, dying, crazy, corrupt cult of personality kleptocrat petrostate
china is a huge, economically powerful, and growing militarily imperialist power
compared to:
the usa has problems with creeping plutocracy
mexico is poor and overrun with narcoterrorism
the point? the usa's problems are tiny compared to russia's
and the neighboring country of china is not in any way like the neighboring country of mexico
russia's far east is vulnerable to swinging away from the decaying power and to the stronger power. yes, if the usa was a failing weak crazy state and mexico was a massive growing power, then yes: texas, california, etc might swing to mexico. but that's not the case is it?
china can sponsor fake independence movements, supply them clandestinely
no actual war has to be declared, so there is no one to nuke. even so, if russia decides to attack china on its own, that's a formal declaration on russia's head and china will be happy to respond in full force. not now. in the near future where russia has decayed further and china has strengthened further, and russia's hold on it's far east is weaker and china's expat community in siberia is yet even more influential and it's economic influences much larger
the new countries carved out of weak dying russia like tuva, irkutsk, yakutia, etc. can be satellite puppets, they don't have to be formally absorbed into china politically, if ever. they can be like texas, independent for awhile after the usa carved up northern mexico
does this tactic sound familiar? it should:
this is the same evil shit russia is pulling on ukraine right now and pulled on georgia with abhakazia
kind of a delectable irony, russia deserves it. beijing is an imperial thug like moscow, stealing islands from weak neighbors, but in outer manchuria and siberia, i'm rooting for china. fuck russia that fucking impotent bully
ukraine is begging to get into NATO. all the new eastern european states begged to get into NATO. fuck what the usa or what the west thinks. fuck what russia thinks
does what the actual fucking countries in question think matter at all to you?
only moscow matters? only washington dc? you utterly dismiss the wishes of poles, slovaks, bulgars, etc? that makes you a patronizing, condescending asshole
if warsaw wants to be in NATO, who gives a flying fuck what moscow thinks. why should what moscow thinks be the ultimate point about what POLES want? why? please, justify that. makes beleive you are talking to a pole. tell the pole why they have to stay under moscow's thumb, in spite of what poles want, nevermind americans or western europeans. please, explain
the US would respond with all kinds of measures to address that threat. Like, say, by orchestrating coups..?
the USA of course has done plenty of vile imperialist things. of course. what does that change?
so two wrongs make a right? the usa does something bad so it's ok that russia does something bad? that's how morality works to you? i knew a guy once who killed someone so it's ok if this other guy kills someone? do you have principles or mindless contrarianism as your motivation?
I'm not Slavic.
the only thing worse than a russian propagandized idiot on this topic who thinks russia is the victim here is some airhead western moron who thinks russia is the victim here. at least the russian has the excuse of nationalism and wall-to-wall propaganda. what is your excuse for being so unprincipled and unintelligent on the topic?
(often as noun catfishing) Back to top 1 [NO OBJECT] Fish for catfish: with the Mississippi River far below its normal level, the catfishing kept getting better and better MORE EXAMPLE SENTENCES Some friends and I were catfishing the Minnesota River until well past midnight on a cloudy, moonless night. I hooked a carp that was yellow as a goldfish while I was catfishing. He'd spent more than a few cheery nights with them as they catfished on the Clinch River.
2 [WITH OBJECT] US informal Lure (someone) into a relationship by means of a fictional online persona: he was being catfished by a cruel prankster a victim of catfishing [Originally with reference to the 2010 documentary film Catfish, which concerns such a relationship] MORE EXAMPLE SENTENCES While there isn't much data at this point, catfishing is becoming more common anecdotally. His words are instead funneled through Nick, who has been catfishing his best friend. He said the athletic department catfished several athletes to teach them the dangers of social networking.
which links to a story by RT.com, aka Russia Today
so...
yeah, pretty much, it's propaganda, you're right
How much the state department is paying you?
uh... you mean the Kremlin
although, the idea that Russia Today is actually run by the US State Dept is exactly the sort of low iq paranoid schizophrenic fantasy you sort of crackpots believe, so... carry on my wayward son
"don't antagonize the imperial thug, or what the imperial thug does is your responsibility"
gee, i would think anything vile that the imperial thug did was the imperial thug's fault, perhaps? is that a little beyond your brain wattage?
this is the crap you are trying to sell:
"why did you wear that sexy dress? that guy looked at you. so that means i have to beat you now. and it's your fault i have to beat you because you wore that dress"
that's wife beater logic
"why did you accept states fleeing the soviet union, NATO, forcing me to dismember tiny weak georgia and ukraine in my self-destructive frustration and impotent rage?"
have you been beaten too much dear poor shell shock propagandized wife?
especially since "antagonism" as you define it is: the country's and regions momentarily not under the thug's boot after the fall of the USSR doing their damned best to scramble away and not be victims anymore
but of course, you spin that as evil NATO expanding and tricking poor poland, czech, hungary, romania, lithuania, etc... good soviet member states tricked by the evil west, right?
they all hate and fear russia now, moron!
they run to the west as fast as they fucking can
NATO expansion has nothing to do with what NATO did, but everything to do with how maltreated those states were under the russian thug's boot
ukraine are, *were*, your slavic brothers for centuries. they should be your loyal friends after being on the same side for centuries. but no. they had the gall to say they have the right to decide their own fate. and the impotent rage of putin and his small dick says they have to be mercilessly punished for that "crime"
all slavic comradery completely null and void
pathetic, stupid, the logic of the wife beater and the beaten ignorant propagandized serf wives who swallow and accept that mafia thug shit
china plays the long game. they're an empire which has expanded and contracted for dozens of centuries. the area russia stole from them has been chinese many centuries more than russian
so the chinese are on the long view. they're just waiting. when the time comes, they will pounce, and no one will be able to do anything about it
outer manchuria is there's, they are certain of it, and when the time comes, it will be there's again. all it takes is a few more decades of russia continuing to rot economically, socially, and politically as it is, and china to continue to grow economically (and if they have social and political upheaval, then an ultranationalist demagogue may seize control and we'll see this happening sooner)
siberia is already overflowing with chinese. china can complain about the poor treatment of minorities
sound familiar?
run it like russia in georgia in ukraine: inflame and create puppet separatist movements
russia can bitch as loudly as it wants that china is behind the whole thing. china can simply say it's a local uprising
if russia tries anything militarily against china itself, muscular china will smack dying russia (this is in 20 years, considering russia's current economic trajectory and china's current economic trajectory)
meanwhile china will have much more money, and simply provide "humanitarian aid" to chinese and other "repressed minorities" in siberia
small weak independent state in siberia will be created, and china will dominate them with money and social influence. no need for actual declared political control
there is no openly declared war of total destruction, so there is no reason to use nukes
you're talking about an openly declared war of total destruction
if russia continues it's economic, political, and social degradation, it will become weak enough that china can free siberia the way texas was carved from mexico: an uprising by locals, controlled by china covertly. buy off corrupt russian officials, provide "humanitarian aid", etc
then there is no war declared and no one for russia to nuke
russia can whine and bitch that china is supporting the whole thing, and china can just say it's a local uprising
if russia attacks china anyway, now muscular china has every right to openly attack dying russia
either way, you absorb the "independent state" later
sounds familiar?
yes, because this is how russia operates in abhakazia (georgian province), eastern ukraine, crimea: inflame, create, and encourage a puppet separatist movement
so what i'd like to see is: in 20-30 years china rushes in to "help" chinese minorities abused by russia
just for the irony
watch russia complain in blind hypocrisy
ukrainians and georgians are nodding their heads knowingly right now
already, chinese minorities in siberia are huge and a worry for moscow:
it won't be but 10-20 years before the chinese are running siberia by economic and social fiat, undeclared, informally, if not officially politically, with russia's weak economy and small population. the actual political control can come later, even much later
siberia breaks from moscow with chinese covert encouragement, just like russia in ukraine and georgia today, and china runs siberia as small weak puppet states
well yeah, on a trajectory of 100-200 years. i'm talking about right now
i even said so in my comment you are replying to: "someday, in only a few decades maybe the way technology and world populations are going, then the scheme would realize a profit" over a shorter period
china is currently picking on vietnam, philippines, japan, india, etc., thugging han imperialist efforts to steal land
meanwhile, all is quiet on the northern border with crazy, dying russia
at some point, china will notice that it's stealing speck islands and barren mountains from its neighbors according to hilarious historical made-up "justifications," when russia actually stole vast tracts of resource-rich land from china only 150 years ago:
then things will get interesting with the derelict work force you are talking about, who can easily be handed a gun and told to charge. perhaps china will have some social/ political upheaval, an ultranationalist demagogue will take charge, and, like after every revolution (french, russian, arab spring, etc.) things quickly turn imperial on its neighbors
russia is a failed cult of personality petrostate that everyone hates because it also is a neoimperial thug (only on weak neighbors of course, like any insecure bully). it will continue to decay and have old rusty weapons someday
but china is a rising power a huge economy and with 10x the population of russia will continue to militarize with sophisticated advanced weaponry
THAT is the story with china and siberia, not this silly bridge
the world powers have to talk about how to divide russia when it finally implodes, that's the end game of the trajectory the joke country is currently on
japan gets back sakhalin, kirils
kamchatka would have to be "occupied briefly" by japan and the usa so it is not completely overrun by china when the inevitable happens
i welcome the new countries of tuva, irkutsk, yakusia, etc. (quickly and easily run over by china, and now new north korean style puppet states: i hope not, hopefully more like mongolia)
russia gets pushed back to the urals
and let's not even get started on the revenge that will happen in the european side of things...
hey germany, want to revive konigsberg?
finalnd, you deserve karelia back
abkhazia, crimea...
it's a continuation of the rot and decay that started in 25 years ago with the collapse of the USSR. that's the long term trend that has never been reversed. a brief lull with some petroleum money that is now gone, and mafia goon putin putting a face of denial on that, it doesn't change that trajectory
if you think the kgb thug chest thumping by putin on small, weak georgia and ukraine is supposed to impress anyone other than propagandized neoserfs in a walled media garden inside russia. no: the thugging just isolates russia internationally and makes everyone despise them. so they have absolutely zero friends, and enemies all around when the longterm implosion deepens
and if you think russia's nukes would prevent this scenario: no, any use of nukes would only hasten it
russia: you lost a maritime conflict with a rising japan and then a civil war 100 years ago. get ready for a much more humiliating conflict with china, and much more internal decay
i give it 20-50 years. sooner if china gets internal strife soon and therefore the desperate need to redirect that energy to han ultranationalism on the border
i would actually prefer if it happens in putin's lifetime. let's see that asswipe humiliated. unfortunately, he'll probably die a "hero" and then all the heroic destruction he's done to russia politically and socially will result in the country's serious collapse after he dies
the cost, including building the roads/ rails to get to the bridge, greatly dwarfs, by many orders of magnitude, the quantity of commerce that would flow
finally, compare the cost to your average container ship fees and where you want to ship it
waiting for a many century payoff is not wise
someday, in only a few decades maybe the way technology and world populations are going, then the scheme would realize a profit in maybe 50 years
but we're not there yet
file this story under "will happen when i am a very, very old man or after"
they can rule against them in an international tribunal
The Philippines' attempt to haul China to an international tribunal is a problem because it is invoking the very compulsory jurisdiction which China has disavowed since 2006. But even if the Philippine attempt to arbitrate fails, any marshaled argument can subsist, and that case may be fielded in other venues. If a military engagement were to ensue, the same case could be brought to the United Nations Security Council -- the principal repository of enforcement powers under the UN system. A state can be found to be in violation of a substantive legal norm even without a coercive or compulsory judgment in a given venue, provided, of course, that there is truth to the argument supporting a violation, and that it is acknowledged by an alternative venue.
While China is disavowing the UN Convention of the Law of the Sea (UNCLOS) against the Philippines, it is expressly invoking UNCLOS provisions in its claims against Japan -- so it wants to have its cake and eat it, too. In 2009, China submitted a claim over the Senkaku Islands (which, like Scarborough Shoal and the Spratlys, are believed to be fuel rich) and turned to UNCLOS rules in defining and delineating its continental shelf beyond the 200 nautical mile exclusive economic zone, again within the meaning of UNCLOS. There is some international legal doctrine supporting the view that a state's acts in one place can be used as an admission and adversely bind that State in another set of circumstances.
a legal claim against china won't make the han imperialists move, but the ruling will stay dormant
then, after any sort of conflict in the future where china loses, china is going to lose these islands in the peace treaty
Slashdot Mirror
no
india and china have many minor border disputes, but also two major disputes over absolutely huge areas that are indeed mostly mountainous, but i don't know why that magically makes them unimportant
these are very large areas, read up:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
and then we can get into the issue of tibetan independence...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
russia is a weak, dying, crazy, corrupt cult of personality kleptocrat petrostate
china is a huge, economically powerful, and growing militarily imperialist power
compared to:
the usa has problems with creeping plutocracy
mexico is poor and overrun with narcoterrorism
the point? the usa's problems are tiny compared to russia's
and the neighboring country of china is not in any way like the neighboring country of mexico
russia's far east is vulnerable to swinging away from the decaying power and to the stronger power. yes, if the usa was a failing weak crazy state and mexico was a massive growing power, then yes: texas, california, etc might swing to mexico. but that's not the case is it?
china can sponsor fake independence movements, supply them clandestinely
no actual war has to be declared, so there is no one to nuke. even so, if russia decides to attack china on its own, that's a formal declaration on russia's head and china will be happy to respond in full force. not now. in the near future where russia has decayed further and china has strengthened further, and russia's hold on it's far east is weaker and china's expat community in siberia is yet even more influential and it's economic influences much larger
the new countries carved out of weak dying russia like tuva, irkutsk, yakutia, etc. can be satellite puppets, they don't have to be formally absorbed into china politically, if ever. they can be like texas, independent for awhile after the usa carved up northern mexico
does this tactic sound familiar? it should:
this is the same evil shit russia is pulling on ukraine right now and pulled on georgia with abhakazia
kind of a delectable irony, russia deserves it. beijing is an imperial thug like moscow, stealing islands from weak neighbors, but in outer manchuria and siberia, i'm rooting for china. fuck russia that fucking impotent bully
give anyone who repeats this feat 10x the amount of money they steal from ISIS
the CIA and FSB can trip over themselves encouraging this
ukraine is begging to get into NATO. all the new eastern european states begged to get into NATO. fuck what the usa or what the west thinks. fuck what russia thinks
does what the actual fucking countries in question think matter at all to you?
only moscow matters? only washington dc? you utterly dismiss the wishes of poles, slovaks, bulgars, etc? that makes you a patronizing, condescending asshole
if warsaw wants to be in NATO, who gives a flying fuck what moscow thinks. why should what moscow thinks be the ultimate point about what POLES want? why? please, justify that. makes beleive you are talking to a pole. tell the pole why they have to stay under moscow's thumb, in spite of what poles want, nevermind americans or western europeans. please, explain
the USA of course has done plenty of vile imperialist things. of course. what does that change?
so two wrongs make a right? the usa does something bad so it's ok that russia does something bad? that's how morality works to you? i knew a guy once who killed someone so it's ok if this other guy kills someone? do you have principles or mindless contrarianism as your motivation?
the only thing worse than a russian propagandized idiot on this topic who thinks russia is the victim here is some airhead western moron who thinks russia is the victim here. at least the russian has the excuse of nationalism and wall-to-wall propaganda. what is your excuse for being so unprincipled and unintelligent on the topic?
no
language evolves. deal with it. no one cares about your strange mentally brittle sensitivities. adapt or die
http://www.oxforddictionaries....
prove it
the link goes to yahoo.com
which links to a story by RT.com, aka Russia Today
so...
yeah, pretty much, it's propaganda, you're right
uh... you mean the Kremlin
although, the idea that Russia Today is actually run by the US State Dept is exactly the sort of low iq paranoid schizophrenic fantasy you sort of crackpots believe, so... carry on my wayward son
hope they are actually russian trolls, propagandized nationalist fools
because any westerner who believes in russia as victim or russia as strong, is pathetic beyond belief
"don't antagonize the imperial thug, or what the imperial thug does is your responsibility"
gee, i would think anything vile that the imperial thug did was the imperial thug's fault, perhaps? is that a little beyond your brain wattage?
this is the crap you are trying to sell:
"why did you wear that sexy dress? that guy looked at you. so that means i have to beat you now. and it's your fault i have to beat you because you wore that dress"
that's wife beater logic
"why did you accept states fleeing the soviet union, NATO, forcing me to dismember tiny weak georgia and ukraine in my self-destructive frustration and impotent rage?"
have you been beaten too much dear poor shell shock propagandized wife?
especially since "antagonism" as you define it is: the country's and regions momentarily not under the thug's boot after the fall of the USSR doing their damned best to scramble away and not be victims anymore
but of course, you spin that as evil NATO expanding and tricking poor poland, czech, hungary, romania, lithuania, etc... good soviet member states tricked by the evil west, right?
they all hate and fear russia now, moron!
they run to the west as fast as they fucking can
NATO expansion has nothing to do with what NATO did, but everything to do with how maltreated those states were under the russian thug's boot
ukraine are, *were*, your slavic brothers for centuries. they should be your loyal friends after being on the same side for centuries. but no. they had the gall to say they have the right to decide their own fate. and the impotent rage of putin and his small dick says they have to be mercilessly punished for that "crime"
all slavic comradery completely null and void
pathetic, stupid, the logic of the wife beater and the beaten ignorant propagandized serf wives who swallow and accept that mafia thug shit
hey, at least you read that one, THEN replied
we're making progress today!
pat yourself on the back son!
1. read, then comment: ok
2. read, don't comment: ok
3. don't read, don't comment: ok
4. don't read, then comment: total shitbag
china says the spratlys are on ancient chinese maps (as if that's justification, just mapping something). no chinese ever lived there
all that happened is someone drew a nine dotted line on a napkin 70 years ago:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
china plays the long game. they're an empire which has expanded and contracted for dozens of centuries. the area russia stole from them has been chinese many centuries more than russian
and is currently oveflowing with chinese:
http://abcnews.go.com/Internat...
remember how texas became part of the usa?
china wants resources
china is becoming imperialistic (they are boldly grabbing islands and you're claiming they aren't bold?)
outer manchuria was gobbled from them during the century of humiliation and unequal treaties
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
so the chinese are on the long view. they're just waiting. when the time comes, they will pounce, and no one will be able to do anything about it
outer manchuria is there's, they are certain of it, and when the time comes, it will be there's again. all it takes is a few more decades of russia continuing to rot economically, socially, and politically as it is, and china to continue to grow economically (and if they have social and political upheaval, then an ultranationalist demagogue may seize control and we'll see this happening sooner)
but you reply nonetheless, making you more useless than what you complain about
it won't be a nuclear war
siberia is already overflowing with chinese. china can complain about the poor treatment of minorities
sound familiar?
run it like russia in georgia in ukraine: inflame and create puppet separatist movements
russia can bitch as loudly as it wants that china is behind the whole thing. china can simply say it's a local uprising
if russia tries anything militarily against china itself, muscular china will smack dying russia (this is in 20 years, considering russia's current economic trajectory and china's current economic trajectory)
meanwhile china will have much more money, and simply provide "humanitarian aid" to chinese and other "repressed minorities" in siberia
small weak independent state in siberia will be created, and china will dominate them with money and social influence. no need for actual declared political control
there is no openly declared war of total destruction, so there is no reason to use nukes
you're talking about an openly declared war of total destruction
if russia continues it's economic, political, and social degradation, it will become weak enough that china can free siberia the way texas was carved from mexico: an uprising by locals, controlled by china covertly. buy off corrupt russian officials, provide "humanitarian aid", etc
then there is no war declared and no one for russia to nuke
russia can whine and bitch that china is supporting the whole thing, and china can just say it's a local uprising
if russia attacks china anyway, now muscular china has every right to openly attack dying russia
either way, you absorb the "independent state" later
sounds familiar?
yes, because this is how russia operates in abhakazia (georgian province), eastern ukraine, crimea: inflame, create, and encourage a puppet separatist movement
so what i'd like to see is: in 20-30 years china rushes in to "help" chinese minorities abused by russia
just for the irony
watch russia complain in blind hypocrisy
ukrainians and georgians are nodding their heads knowingly right now
already, chinese minorities in siberia are huge and a worry for moscow:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
it won't be but 10-20 years before the chinese are running siberia by economic and social fiat, undeclared, informally, if not officially politically, with russia's weak economy and small population. the actual political control can come later, even much later
siberia breaks from moscow with chinese covert encouragement, just like russia in ukraine and georgia today, and china runs siberia as small weak puppet states
that's eurocentric history
yes, napoleon and hitler fucked up badly
from the asian side, it's different. for example, genghis khan
in my defense:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
well yeah, on a trajectory of 100-200 years. i'm talking about right now
i even said so in my comment you are replying to: "someday, in only a few decades maybe the way technology and world populations are going, then the scheme would realize a profit" over a shorter period
china?
china is currently picking on vietnam, philippines, japan, india, etc., thugging han imperialist efforts to steal land
meanwhile, all is quiet on the northern border with crazy, dying russia
at some point, china will notice that it's stealing speck islands and barren mountains from its neighbors according to hilarious historical made-up "justifications," when russia actually stole vast tracts of resource-rich land from china only 150 years ago:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
then things will get interesting with the derelict work force you are talking about, who can easily be handed a gun and told to charge. perhaps china will have some social/ political upheaval, an ultranationalist demagogue will take charge, and, like after every revolution (french, russian, arab spring, etc.) things quickly turn imperial on its neighbors
russia is a failed cult of personality petrostate that everyone hates because it also is a neoimperial thug (only on weak neighbors of course, like any insecure bully). it will continue to decay and have old rusty weapons someday
but china is a rising power a huge economy and with 10x the population of russia will continue to militarize with sophisticated advanced weaponry
THAT is the story with china and siberia, not this silly bridge
the world powers have to talk about how to divide russia when it finally implodes, that's the end game of the trajectory the joke country is currently on
japan gets back sakhalin, kirils
kamchatka would have to be "occupied briefly" by japan and the usa so it is not completely overrun by china when the inevitable happens
i welcome the new countries of tuva, irkutsk, yakusia, etc. (quickly and easily run over by china, and now new north korean style puppet states: i hope not, hopefully more like mongolia)
russia gets pushed back to the urals
and let's not even get started on the revenge that will happen in the european side of things...
hey germany, want to revive konigsberg?
finalnd, you deserve karelia back
abkhazia, crimea...
it's a continuation of the rot and decay that started in 25 years ago with the collapse of the USSR. that's the long term trend that has never been reversed. a brief lull with some petroleum money that is now gone, and mafia goon putin putting a face of denial on that, it doesn't change that trajectory
if you think the kgb thug chest thumping by putin on small, weak georgia and ukraine is supposed to impress anyone other than propagandized neoserfs in a walled media garden inside russia. no: the thugging just isolates russia internationally and makes everyone despise them. so they have absolutely zero friends, and enemies all around when the longterm implosion deepens
and if you think russia's nukes would prevent this scenario: no, any use of nukes would only hasten it
russia: you lost a maritime conflict with a rising japan and then a civil war 100 years ago. get ready for a much more humiliating conflict with china, and much more internal decay
i give it 20-50 years. sooner if china gets internal strife soon and therefore the desperate need to redirect that energy to han ultranationalism on the border
i would actually prefer if it happens in putin's lifetime. let's see that asswipe humiliated. unfortunately, he'll probably die a "hero" and then all the heroic destruction he's done to russia politically and socially will result in the country's serious collapse after he dies
ok, what does that change?
opening a small part a little early offsets by a tiny fraction the tiny amounts that would make the route profitable
we're talking about comparing the price of shipping on a container ship and the price of going by rail/ truck on this crazy route
but this is nuts
if the cost is {Y}
and the profit per year is {X}
then 500 years * {X} = {Y} roughly
the cost, including building the roads/ rails to get to the bridge, greatly dwarfs, by many orders of magnitude, the quantity of commerce that would flow
finally, compare the cost to your average container ship fees and where you want to ship it
waiting for a many century payoff is not wise
someday, in only a few decades maybe the way technology and world populations are going, then the scheme would realize a profit in maybe 50 years
but we're not there yet
file this story under "will happen when i am a very, very old man or after"
sorry, i forgot the source
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/...
they can rule against them in an international tribunal
a legal claim against china won't make the han imperialists move, but the ruling will stay dormant
then, after any sort of conflict in the future where china loses, china is going to lose these islands in the peace treaty
this is an interesting, informative, and comprehensive post
mod +6