any defense attorney worth their salt could argue out of a charge such as this.... i mean, incognito mode because wife! seriously, if you knew my wife and my, um, habits, you would know all of this already..... just sayin'./CF
It's all about the money. I believe it was Steve Gibson that reported that the FBI told him, if the damage wasn't in excess of $20,000.00 ($200k perhaps?) they wouldn't have time to look at it.
Now what kind of law enforcement agency are we allowing to police our country? Certainly we have better protection than this?
> I wish each computer had a traceable code.
> It would help catch and kill those script > kiddies too. I don't fear being tracked,
> I do nothing wrong.
You are an idiot.
What makes you think the stuff that you are doing now will not be outlawed in the future and come back to haunt you? Like posting here? Maybe this will be held against you in 20 years. Who knows? You can't assure me 100% that it *couldn't* happen. Especially with you anti-privacy nuts out there. You allow shit like that to happen.
Freedom. If you don't like it, move to a totalitarian state and see how well YOU LIKE THAT, fucker.
>Free speech isn't about saying whatever you
> want without repercussions,
true and not true. Free speech is just that, free. You must be held accoutable for your actions. Cotse is a privacy shield, not an anonymous remailer. You have the options of filing a civil lawsuit and obtaining the logs through a court of law. Your lawyer may subpoena the logs. You _can_ get to a little more information that MAY OR MAY NOT allow you to find the actual poster. (The same holds true with any ISP or webmail provider)
>it's the possibility to speak the truth aloud.
Not possibility. The FACT that you can speak the truth or anything your THINK is the truth, without being held accountable for things that are not within the scope of your knowledge. You cannot be held libel for something you didn't know to be different from the OPINION you submitted. However, if you KNOW FOR A FACT that the information you delivered was false and fraudulent, you may be in jeopardy of a libel suit against you.
>The net has given many cowards the ability to >spread lies without recourse to those slandered >or otherwise defamed.
It's libel and not slandered. Slandered is spoken, libel is written.
As for being a coward, how about not wanting KOOKS knocking at your front door tryin to get you to ride Hale/Bopp to the corners of the galaxy? How about keep script kiddies from tormenting you while online? How about keeping the pedophiles from scoping out your children, just because you accidently crossposted to some obscure pedophile's newsgroup without watching what you were doing?
People make mistakes. Privacy Sites help shield them from criminals.
Cotse maintains a strict Abuse Policy and an even more strict Privacy Policy. What you have been witness to is the whinning of usenet posters that think all the information about someone should be open to the public and nothing to be held Private.
Cotse will not release the information of someone to the general public without a subpoena, it says so plainly in their Terms of Service. People want that IP address to harrass posters. They want the ability to send the originating ISP an abuse complaint and try to get their Internet Service term'd.
With Cotse, if you don't have a subpoena, you don't get the info. Don't like that? Tough.
The problem with usenet is not anonymity. The problem is people don't know how to use a kill file. If you don't like the way someone posts, use a kill file and get over it.
What's the difference between one posters idea of having "...Cotse.com banned at my ISP level." and using a kill file???
ISP's blocked at the ISP level will still be delivering messages to usenet, in this case, you won't be able to read ANY OF THEM. But, if you had it kill filed, at least you have the ability to turn it off/on whenever you want. If the ISP blocks, you no longer have that right.
And that's what this is all about isn't it? Individual Rights?
Do I have the right to tell you to "...kiss my ass." Of course I do. Do I also have the right to say ".... there's a bomb on the plane." Of course I have that right. The difference is, I must be held accountable for my actions. If I violate the law, whether using anonymous services or not, I should be held accountable.
If a judge/jury see's fit to find me guilty of libel because I told you to "kiss my ass", then so be it. But, and here's where the shit hits the berry bowl, the law of the land says that if I make threats concerning a bomb on an airplane, I can be held for questioning immediately. It's criminal. Libel is Civil.
Cotse users are accountable for their actions. Which is more to say for the thousands of anonymous remailer proxy types that have no accountability for their actions.
I applaud Mr. Gielda's efforts and the efforts of other privacy advocates out there. They are fighting "the good fight" and whether you like to admit it or not, they are also boosting your rights as an individual.
The reason that people like Colin get all flustered over an actual privacy advocate site; They cannot obtain the IP address and personal information on the people they wish to stalk and harrass. It has nothing to do with flames and/or trolls, for god sakes, how friggin easy is it to use a kill file? Evidently, it's over Colin's head.
Decrease accountability? Are you mad? lol. Maybe not *everyone* out there uses anonymous postings to hide from would-be prosecutors. A lot of the people use to it for reasons such as; Hiding from third world dictators, oh yes, it happens. Freedom Fighters love the use of anonymous services, they can deliver valuable information, without worry of being traced back.
And of course usenet flaming. We see the bad side of things all the time, it's the good stuff that escape out attention. Common human nature at work.
No, anonymity should be for everyone. If everyone was anonymous, how would a stalker, "stalk" someone? It would be impossible if anonymity was 100%.
Slashdot Mirror
any defense attorney worth their salt could argue out of a charge such as this.... i mean, incognito mode because wife! seriously, if you knew my wife and my, um, habits, you would know all of this already..... just sayin'. /CF
Now what kind of law enforcement agency are we allowing to police our country? Certainly we have better protection than this?
--
Colonel Flagg
http://www.geocities.com/pentagon/1475/
"Big Brother is watching you, Little Brother is too. When Big Brother goes to sleep, Little Brother goes through his stuff." - Unknown Author
"...Pepper spray works nicely, unless your assailant uses it as a condiment." - CF, 2001
> I wish each computer had a traceable code.
> It would help catch and kill those script
> kiddies too. I don't fear being tracked,
> I do nothing wrong. You are an idiot.
What makes you think the stuff that you are doing now will not be outlawed in the future and come back to haunt you? Like posting here? Maybe this will be held against you in 20 years. Who knows? You can't assure me 100% that it *couldn't* happen. Especially with you anti-privacy nuts out there. You allow shit like that to happen.
Freedom. If you don't like it, move to a totalitarian state and see how well YOU LIKE THAT, fucker.
> want without repercussions,
true and not true. Free speech is just that, free. You must be held accoutable for your actions. Cotse is a privacy shield, not an anonymous remailer. You have the options of filing a civil lawsuit and obtaining the logs through a court of law. Your lawyer may subpoena the logs. You _can_ get to a little more information that MAY OR MAY NOT allow you to find the actual poster. (The same holds true with any ISP or webmail provider)
>it's the possibility to speak the truth aloud. Not possibility. The FACT that you can speak the truth or anything your THINK is the truth, without being held accountable for things that are not within the scope of your knowledge. You cannot be held libel for something you didn't know to be different from the OPINION you submitted. However, if you KNOW FOR A FACT that the information you delivered was false and fraudulent, you may be in jeopardy of a libel suit against you.
>The net has given many cowards the ability to >spread lies without recourse to those slandered >or otherwise defamed. It's libel and not slandered. Slandered is spoken, libel is written.
As for being a coward, how about not wanting KOOKS knocking at your front door tryin to get you to ride Hale/Bopp to the corners of the galaxy? How about keep script kiddies from tormenting you while online? How about keeping the pedophiles from scoping out your children, just because you accidently crossposted to some obscure pedophile's newsgroup without watching what you were doing?
People make mistakes. Privacy Sites help shield them from criminals.
--
Colonel Flagg
http://www.geocities.com/pentagon/1475/
"Big Brother is watching you, Little Brother is too. When Big Brother goes to sleep, Little Brother goes through his stuff." - Unknown Author
"...Pepper spray works nicely, unless your assailant uses it as a condiment." - CF, 2001
Cotse will not release the information of someone to the general public without a subpoena, it says so plainly in their Terms of Service. People want that IP address to harrass posters. They want the ability to send the originating ISP an abuse complaint and try to get their Internet Service term'd.
With Cotse, if you don't have a subpoena, you don't get the info. Don't like that? Tough.
The problem with usenet is not anonymity. The problem is people don't know how to use a kill file. If you don't like the way someone posts, use a kill file and get over it.
What's the difference between one posters idea of having "...Cotse.com banned at my ISP level." and using a kill file???
ISP's blocked at the ISP level will still be delivering messages to usenet, in this case, you won't be able to read ANY OF THEM. But, if you had it kill filed, at least you have the ability to turn it off/on whenever you want. If the ISP blocks, you no longer have that right.
And that's what this is all about isn't it? Individual Rights?
Do I have the right to tell you to "...kiss my ass." Of course I do. Do I also have the right to say ".... there's a bomb on the plane." Of course I have that right. The difference is, I must be held accountable for my actions. If I violate the law, whether using anonymous services or not, I should be held accountable.
If a judge/jury see's fit to find me guilty of libel because I told you to "kiss my ass", then so be it. But, and here's where the shit hits the berry bowl, the law of the land says that if I make threats concerning a bomb on an airplane, I can be held for questioning immediately. It's criminal. Libel is Civil.
Cotse users are accountable for their actions. Which is more to say for the thousands of anonymous remailer proxy types that have no accountability for their actions.
I applaud Mr. Gielda's efforts and the efforts of other privacy advocates out there. They are fighting "the good fight" and whether you like to admit it or not, they are also boosting your rights as an individual.
--
Colonel Flagg
http://www.geocities.com/pentagon/1475/
"Big Brother is watching you, Little Brother is too. When Big Brother goes to sleep, Little Brother goes through his stuff." - Unknown Author
"...Pepper spray works nicely, unless your assailant uses it as a condiment." - CF, 2001
Cotse's Abuse Policy, actually, very strict. And they abide by it!
The reason that people like Colin get all flustered over an actual privacy advocate site; They cannot obtain the IP address and personal information on the people they wish to stalk and harrass. It has nothing to do with flames and/or trolls, for god sakes, how friggin easy is it to use a kill file? Evidently, it's over Colin's head.
--
Colonel Flagg
http://www.geocities.com/pentagon/1475/
"Big Brother is watching you, Little Brother is too. When Big Brother goes to sleep, Little Brother goes through his stuff." - Unknown Author
"...Pepper spray works nicely, unless your assailant uses it as a condiment." - CF, 2001
If you don't like what someone says, mentally block it. Are you so lame that you MUST READ EVERY friggin thing that comes across your news reader?
Idiot.
--
Colonel Flagg
http://www.geocities.com/pentagon/1475/
"Big Brother is watching you, Little Brother is too. When Big Brother goes to sleep, Little Brother goes through his stuff." - Unknown Author
"...Pepper spray works nicely, unless your assailant uses it as a condiment." - CF, 2001
And of course usenet flaming. We see the bad side of things all the time, it's the good stuff that escape out attention. Common human nature at work.
No, anonymity should be for everyone. If everyone was anonymous, how would a stalker, "stalk" someone? It would be impossible if anonymity was 100%.
--
Colonel Flagg
http://www.geocities.com/pentagon/1475/
"Big Brother is watching you, Little Brother is too. When Big Brother goes to sleep, Little Brother goes through his stuff." - Unknown Author
"...Pepper spray works nicely, unless your assailant uses it as a condiment." - CF, 2001