sorry to rain on the theo was mean, the other *bsd's were mean, it was a netbsd person who added a patch that would cause openbsd to fail to boot. and that was deliberate.
yes, it's old news, but the netbsd's core team is amazingly cliqueish. the *bsd method of organising around "core" while seeming like a great idea all too often ends up as an old boy network where newbies dare not tread.
RedHat deals with it by listing the software the include on the box. In addition each of their packages tends to have a description, it copies readme files into/usr/doc and of course the SRPMS have detail as well.
i disagree. i didn't read the trolls on stephen's obit, and i'm not about to lower my threshold to do so. i've attempted to always use my moderation points to moderate *up*, not down.
stephen's taught a lot of people. he wrote books that were technical and yet you could sense a person on the other side of the pen. i've had the pleasure of reading others like that, but for unix development he was the sole provider of such work. he leaves behind many wonderful and caring people - family, friends, and readers.
we are a community, and we just lost a member. all communities will occasionally have people enter them that don't belong, that won't (for whatever reason) conform to the rules of that society. those people should leave, or be forced to leave. the american indians for example would have been well served by such reasoning.
rob's changes affect five people at most. five people who intended and did inflict a lot of real pain on people. yes people need thick skin online - they also need to attempt to conduct themselves in a decent and respectful way. as one of seven's readers i would hope that no matter what was said about him i'd have a thick enough skin to ignore it. but for his friends and family they'd need armor plating, something that no one online should be required to lug around.
I don't think the IIA (whoever they are) have done you any favors. If the law is as bad as it's been made out it should have been fully enforced in a draconian enough style to make people sit up and get it repealed.
As it stands now you have a law on the books that gives the Aussie gov't the power to do very distasteful things. Theoretically they could just impliment it piecemeal so no one will notice just how bad it is; the age requirements and the requirement for isp's to tell subscribers to use filters being step #1.
Yeah, no one has paid to get it certified. Actually, that's not true, a German company did over 2 years ago. If NT can get posix certification, Linux surely can.
one comment in the story is interesting. "everyone saw the possibilities; there was an AP story that said an electronic brain had been created." (paraphrased) while a mild exageration it was along the right lines - my question: why can't today's media grok computers?
the end is also interesting: "with the removal of sperry's patent the computer industry flourished." (again, paraphrased) yes, it did. on the same topic, what's the reasoning for software patents again?
x has problems that can be fixed with either better implementations or a slight change in the design.
far better then building everything from scratch again. particularly since most projects seem determined to repeat the mistakes x fixes (namely platform independence).
It's only a challenge to Apple indirectly in that they're taking a market Apple *could* take if they'd produce cheap enough boxes.
Cheap, volume produced PPC boxes, using off the shelf parts... and people see that as challenging *Apple*?! Am I watching the same market as everyone else, or have I accidentally slipped into a world where Mac users actually consider using something other then MacOS?
Well, I suspect it means stable. Additional releases fix bugs that almost all reasonably complex software will have, update or add drivers, and backport the occasional useful feature.
and nasa doesn't derive benefit from it's work in linux? you realise why donald becker and nasa are well served by good ethernet drivers, yes?
in general most people feel that the best free software is software that solves the programmer's problem. linus needed an os - so he wrote one. he released his code to help others and also to get help extending it for himself. by your definition he is a symbiote.
i think you need to rethink your definition. redhat spent $2.2 million on r they lost $100,000. if they cut their r&d budget they'd be profitable. i don't really use a scale, but that fact alone puts them to benefactor status to me.
for 25 years the internet was "useless." it was only the domain of academics and researchers providing little of any value.
now i can research multiple sclerosis in minutes if i learn a friend has just been diagnosed with it. or keep in contact with friends from when i was 6. or parents can watch their kids at daycare, and extended families can see pictures of the newest members of their family. people can telecommute reducing traffic congestion and pollution. we can search for aliens and crack keys. we can collaborate and creat art, literature and operating systems.
all that from a 25 year program that for most of it's history has been a useless gov't funded program useful to only researchers and academics.
as we bask in an internet boosted economy, i wonder just what it would be like if we seriously invest in space exploration for the next 25 years. if instead of constantly checking the bottom line we just tried to explore, learn, research and build.
why should your isp know which censorware products ban them? censorware companies don't say who they ban - they consider that a competitive edge.
no, the fault lies with the authors of the software, and the people that use it. your headhunter is a moron. your isp is dead right. you, well, you need to think more.
dunno if you've thought this far, but serial cameras would need the same number of serial ports as cameras. maybe you sould look into the multiport serial cards linux supports? in a linux kernel menuconfig is lists them though i'm not sure what they are. getting around the speed issues though, that's another story. are you sure webcams can only do one picture per 15 secs? what about quickcams?
Well golly gee. Up until RedHat announced the IPO all we heard was that distributors skimmed off the hard work of others. With the IPO we heard that RedHat had confirmed their "grab money and run" intentions.
Now RedHat is attempting to allow developers access to their stock - before the big players grab it up and raise the price.
Nowhere in this has RedHat done anything to say that other distributions can't do the same. They haven't patented the IPO method of giving back to the free s/w community.
Debian is free to offer cash or stock back to free software developers. So are Caldera, SUSE, Corel, etc.
RedHat is the first distribution to attempt to give money back to as many developers as it fiscally and legally can. Being first they'll obviously make a few missteps.
Now when Linus first released Linux to the net, which would have encouraged him?
"You fucking moron! Don't initialise a console like that. Get a fucking clue, and quit spamming the *MINIX* newsgroup."
or
"Linus, your console init routine has some goofs. Here's a patch that fixes some of them. You might also want to check in this paper at the following ftp site (user anonymous, password your email address)..."
Provide a form on their website? And that would have been harder then digging through source files for email addresses?
not.
don't get me wrong, i love sed/awk/grep as much as the next guy, but to write up a script to grab email addresses, good ones, that's not easy.
the web form would have been a much better way.
now... how should they have announced it?
they could put a post on slashdot, but a lot of developers probably don't read slashdot. in fact there are probably quite a few developers who don't read most linux related web sites since a lot of the userland stuff is shared between the *bsd's and linux.
of course they should get a chance to get redhat shares since their code is contributing to redhat's success.
essentially redhat wants to come up with a way to share their success with the developers that created their success. if you don't want to take part in that, then just press d and move on.
I'm sorry, but you're just a complete moron. People have asked time and again how companies like redhat can give back to the developers. This is one way. You obviously don't want companies like RedHat to share their profits.
In order to pass on the cash they have to *contact* you after all.
Perhaps you don't like the way they're doing it. Present an alternative. Quit whining like a two year old.
at the point where at&t suggested aol buy some broadband infrastructure and quit whining, i agreed to some degree. it would be cool if aol bought out some broadband infrastructure and cooperatively built it out for competition.
cooperative competition is not an oxymoron. it's a business model that i see redhat, mandrake, debian, and all the other free software linux distro's following.
and then i read that his company is essentially trying to force the cable industry to do just that. way to go. it's not perfect, the cable/phone mix sucks, but it's a step in the right direction.
and here i thought private industry would be more efficient then the evil gov't. the nsi and icann seem to both be rather annoying entities, and yet when the gov't ran it it all seemed to go quite smoothly.
maybe it's because gov't agencies and companies can both be run by annoying people that we sometimes get bad service rather then what type of framework offers the service.
perhaps that's getting too complex for this debate, political things always work better with short mindless statements...
redhat spent $2.2 million on development last year. cygnus did a fair amount of development last year. so did suse. and caldera. and the debian developers. and the samba team. and the apache team.
the old rdist has an acceptable license. we fork. it's that simple.
less hand wringing, more code. more clue, less talk.
actually dilbert's mom is probably more adept with computers then he is. maybe his dad's the compu-illiterate of the family. so your comment would best be phrased "linux needs to be accessible to both dilbert and his dad..."
Slashdot Mirror
sorry to rain on the theo was mean, the other *bsd's were mean, it was a netbsd person who added a patch that would cause openbsd to fail to boot. and that was deliberate.
yes, it's old news, but the netbsd's core team is amazingly cliqueish. the *bsd method of organising around "core" while seeming like a great idea all too often ends up as an old boy network where newbies dare not tread.
RedHat deals with it by listing the software the include on the box. In addition each of their packages tends to have a description, it copies readme files into /usr/doc and of course the SRPMS have detail as well.
i disagree. i didn't read the trolls on stephen's obit, and i'm not about to lower my threshold to do so. i've attempted to always use my moderation points to moderate *up*, not down.
stephen's taught a lot of people. he wrote books that were technical and yet you could sense a person on the other side of the pen. i've had the pleasure of reading others like that, but for unix development he was the sole provider of such work. he leaves behind many wonderful and caring people - family, friends, and readers.
we are a community, and we just lost a member. all communities will occasionally have people enter them that don't belong, that won't (for whatever reason) conform to the rules of that society. those people should leave, or be forced to leave. the american indians for example would have been well served by such reasoning.
rob's changes affect five people at most. five people who intended and did inflict a lot of real pain on people. yes people need thick skin online - they also need to attempt to conduct themselves in a decent and respectful way. as one of seven's readers i would hope that no matter what was said about him i'd have a thick enough skin to ignore it. but for his friends and family they'd need armor plating, something that no one online should be required to lug around.
I don't think the IIA (whoever they are) have done you any favors. If the law is as bad as it's been made out it should have been fully enforced in a draconian enough style to make people sit up and get it repealed.
As it stands now you have a law on the books that gives the Aussie gov't the power to do very distasteful things. Theoretically they could just impliment it piecemeal so no one will notice just how bad it is; the age requirements and the requirement for isp's to tell subscribers to use filters being step #1.
and people should have confidence in snail mail? how do you know where it came from?
Yeah, no one has paid to get it certified. Actually, that's not true, a German company did over 2 years ago. If NT can get posix certification, Linux surely can.
one comment in the story is interesting. "everyone saw the possibilities; there was an AP story that said an electronic brain had been created." (paraphrased) while a mild exageration it was along the right lines - my question: why can't today's media grok computers?
the end is also interesting: "with the removal of sperry's patent the computer industry flourished." (again, paraphrased) yes, it did. on the same topic, what's the reasoning for software patents again?
x has problems that can be fixed with either better implementations or a slight change in the design.
far better then building everything from scratch again. particularly since most projects seem determined to repeat the mistakes x fixes (namely platform independence).
It's a challenge to intel.
It's only a challenge to Apple indirectly in that they're taking a market Apple *could* take if they'd produce cheap enough boxes.
Cheap, volume produced PPC boxes, using off the shelf parts... and people see that as challenging *Apple*?! Am I watching the same market as everyone else, or have I accidentally slipped into a world where Mac users actually consider using something other then MacOS?
Good luck SGI!
If anyone here uses the STL under Linux you should be rooting SGI on too!
i didn't click on the link, so no increased hit count from me.
Well, I suspect it means stable. Additional releases fix bugs that almost all reasonably complex software will have, update or add drivers, and backport the occasional useful feature.
Uh... it's 9am here in Ireland.
Yes Virginia, there is a world outside of America...
and nasa doesn't derive benefit from it's work in linux? you realise why donald becker and nasa are well served by good ethernet drivers, yes?
in general most people feel that the best free software is software that solves the programmer's problem. linus needed an os - so he wrote one. he released his code to help others and also to get help extending it for himself. by your definition he is a symbiote.
i think you need to rethink your definition. redhat spent $2.2 million on r they lost $100,000. if they cut their r&d budget they'd be profitable. i don't really use a scale, but that fact alone puts them to benefactor status to me.
gee, i would have expected anti-nasa people would appreciate privately financed advertising...
for 25 years the internet was "useless." it was only the domain of academics and researchers providing little of any value.
now i can research multiple sclerosis in minutes if i learn a friend has just been diagnosed with it. or keep in contact with friends from when i was 6. or parents can watch their kids at daycare, and extended families can see pictures of the newest members of their family. people can telecommute reducing traffic congestion and pollution. we can search for aliens and crack keys. we can collaborate and creat art, literature and operating systems.
all that from a 25 year program that for most of it's history has been a useless gov't funded program useful to only researchers and academics.
as we bask in an internet boosted economy, i wonder just what it would be like if we seriously invest in space exploration for the next 25 years. if instead of constantly checking the bottom line we just tried to explore, learn, research and build.
hello? pick up your clue phone!
why should your isp know which censorware products ban them? censorware companies don't say who they ban - they consider that a competitive edge.
no, the fault lies with the authors of the software, and the people that use it. your headhunter is a moron. your isp is dead right. you, well, you need to think more.
dunno if you've thought this far, but serial cameras would need the same number of serial ports as cameras. maybe you sould look into the multiport serial cards linux supports? in a linux kernel menuconfig is lists them though i'm not sure what they are. getting around the speed issues though, that's another story. are you sure webcams can only do one picture per 15 secs? what about quickcams?
Well golly gee. Up until RedHat announced the IPO all we heard was that distributors skimmed off the hard work of others. With the IPO we heard that RedHat had confirmed their "grab money and run" intentions.
..."
Now RedHat is attempting to allow developers access to their stock - before the big players grab it up and raise the price.
Nowhere in this has RedHat done anything to say that other distributions can't do the same. They haven't patented the IPO method of giving back to the free s/w community.
Debian is free to offer cash or stock back to free software developers. So are Caldera, SUSE, Corel, etc.
RedHat is the first distribution to attempt to give money back to as many developers as it fiscally and legally can. Being first they'll obviously make a few missteps.
Now when Linus first released Linux to the net, which would have encouraged him?
"You fucking moron! Don't initialise a console like that. Get a fucking clue, and quit spamming the *MINIX* newsgroup."
or
"Linus, your console init routine has some goofs. Here's a patch that fixes some of them. You might also want to check in this paper at the following ftp site (user anonymous, password your email address)
Provide a form on their website? And that would have been harder then digging through source files for email addresses?
not.
don't get me wrong, i love sed/awk/grep as much as the next guy, but to write up a script to grab email addresses, good ones, that's not easy.
the web form would have been a much better way.
now... how should they have announced it?
they could put a post on slashdot, but a lot of developers probably don't read slashdot. in fact there are probably quite a few developers who don't read most linux related web sites since a lot of the userland stuff is shared between the *bsd's and linux.
of course they should get a chance to get redhat shares since their code is contributing to redhat's success.
essentially redhat wants to come up with a way to share their success with the developers that created their success. if you don't want to take part in that, then just press d and move on.
I'm sorry, but you're just a complete moron. People have asked time and again how companies like redhat can give back to the developers. This is one way. You obviously don't want companies like RedHat to share their profits.
In order to pass on the cash they have to *contact* you after all.
Perhaps you don't like the way they're doing it. Present an alternative. Quit whining like a two year old.
amazing, i'm supportive of aol.
at the point where at&t suggested aol buy some broadband infrastructure and quit whining, i agreed to some degree. it would be cool if aol bought out some broadband infrastructure and cooperatively built it out for competition.
cooperative competition is not an oxymoron. it's a business model that i see redhat, mandrake, debian, and all the other free software linux distro's following.
and then i read that his company is essentially trying to force the cable industry to do just that. way to go. it's not perfect, the cable/phone mix sucks, but it's a step in the right direction.
and here i thought private industry would be more efficient then the evil gov't. the nsi and icann seem to both be rather annoying entities, and yet when the gov't ran it it all seemed to go quite smoothly.
maybe it's because gov't agencies and companies can both be run by annoying people that we sometimes get bad service rather then what type of framework offers the service.
perhaps that's getting too complex for this debate, political things always work better with short mindless statements...
dear god!
redhat spent $2.2 million on development last year. cygnus did a fair amount of development last year. so did suse. and caldera. and the debian developers. and the samba team. and the apache team.
the old rdist has an acceptable license. we fork. it's that simple.
less hand wringing, more code. more clue, less talk.
sheesh.
actually dilbert's mom is probably more adept with computers then he is. maybe his dad's the compu-illiterate of the family. so your comment would best be phrased "linux needs to be accessible to both dilbert and his dad..."