There's a whole bunch of kicking and screaming going on over Google Street Map right now because they dare actually do the work and make an actual product that has scared a few people into realizing that maybe the idea of "public space" wasn't exactly what they thought it was. "When you're in public you can be photographed in public, get over it" is my opinion but some have the idea that Google has shown that the law of "you can photograph anything that is 'in public'" is flawed and , in-fact, there's an expectation of privacy that goes beyond the 4th amendment (in the US) and reeks of something we can only call "cultural values".. and Google threatens to erode those values.. Boo Hoo.
So no, this isn't a freakin' troll, it's a pertinent point on the current battle that is going on between those who want more freedom or those who want more privacy or those who just want to be able to find the restaurant they're looking for in the 20 minutes they've got to arrange their trip.
Grow a spin. When Mr Security says "I'll take your camera" you say "just fucking try" and if they don't go off to get their superior then you call your lawyer. And that's the problem with authority, people are not willing to stand up to it so people overstepping their position become the norm and then the norm becomes unspeakable and then the unspeakable becomes unquestionable. So take your pictures and when they ask you to stop, say no.
Security guards on private property only have you the power to leave and, if you refuse, escort you from the premises. So, if they fuck with you, that's what you should say... "are you asking me to leave?".. as soon as they say no, you just say oh ok, thanks for the advice on your corporate policy. And hey, getting ejected from some random private property because you refuse to conform with their corporate policy is hardly something to be shameful about.
Why is UW not releasing their source code? If they intend to spin off commercial products, why are they releasing demos? Hell, even *Microsoft* is releasing demos of this stuff.. is Apple and Google the only companies that can ship product these days (even if it is "beta" you can at least freakin' use it).
No more demos. We know you're smart, now make something useful please.
Why can't you use <quote>? When you did your Google search for Shuttleworth comments did you happen to get the date of the comment? People change their opinions over time you know.. Actually install a the latest version of Ubuntu on a machine with a 3d graphics card.. watch as it automatically installs the restricted drivers.
You'll notice he's modded up to +5 too. Slashdot "moderators" don't read the entire thread, and these posts are too big for them to read past the first paragraph. He's openly admitted that he's talking about Ubuntu fron two years ago and yet he insists that he knows what he's talking about.
I've done this about five times on Slashdot. Someone asks me what I don't like about Ubuntu, I get modded down troll for answering a question, etc.
I can see why. You're wrong and you seem to be uninterested in learning this.
Kubuntu is a separate project worked on by seperate devs. It doesn't get the baseline Ubuntu features for precisely that reason.
No it isn't. What gave you that idea?
Fire up a Knoppix CD, or Kubuntu and you'll basically see a vanilla KDE desktop. They don't customize the packages, install addition patches, or do anything. Now fire up Mandriva, or openSUSE, or PCLinuxOS, or Arch's KDEMod, or Sabayon, etc. You'll see they've added other patches to expand functionality, fix bugs, backport features, etc. What is the point of 20 million distros if they all ship the same packages?
Many Ubuntu packages are largely the vanilla, upstream package with no changes. (Ubuntu has a decent number of kernel patches and toolchain patches, like many other distros, but they largely inherit these from Debian). openSUSE (my most common example recently, because it is my new favorite of all the major distros I've tried recently) hires devs to backport features, and make the best possible packages they can. Again, many Gnome users praise openSUSE for putting out a bettter Gnome desktop than Ubuntu, because they don't ship vanilla packages.
Oh, so "vanilla" means "like debian".. that's ok, I like debian. Sounds like you have a different personal preference. This is probably the most legitimate thing you have said in this thread.
I'm not saying Ubuntu is wrong. I'm saying I don't like it. I want options in my install process to customize it. Ubuntu is targeted at a certain audience. I'm not a member of it. I used to recommend Kubuntu to people who weren't computer savvy and wanted something very simple, and yet I discovered that other distros were just as simple to use, while providing better packages to boot.
Again, personal preference, good for you.
I always change the theme on any desktop, but you asked what I don't like. I really don't like Ubuntu brown and orange. A recent poll on the openSUSE forums showed most responders saying they never bother changing the default theme. I don't understand that. Why wouldn't you customize your desktop?
I like the default theme, personally. I also don't really care too much about it. You obviously do and that's your preference.
openSUSE offers a 1-click installer. Sabayon includes them by default. Heck, Mint (a nicer fork of Ubuntu) includes them by default. I followed the instructions on Ubuntu's wiki, yet they never worked. I asked for help and was repeatedly attacked for attempting to use ATI. Mind you, on the exact same laptop (my wife's old laptop) I ran Gentoo with the ATI drivers (custom kernel, -viper release), Sabayon with the ATI drivers, and openSUSE 10.1 with the ATI drivers. The only distro I had problems with was Ubuntu.
When was this? I have a machine with ATI drivers, Ubuntu installed them by default and alerted me that it had done it.
You're not seeing what I'm getting at. I know how to compile my own kernel. I've been doing it for years. Since I'm impatient, even on binary distros I compile my own kernel and manually patch in drivers rather than wait for distros to releasing updated packages. On Ubuntu and Kubuntu, after I made my own kernel, it would not load the ATI module at all. It gave me an error about how it could not load the module because it was missing a restricted modules.deb package. They've gone out of their way to patch into their kernel sources a measure to stop you from using proprietary modules. I've never seen another distro do this. For the stock Ubuntu kernels, this package exists. For custom kernels (I downloaded a -mm kernel and then patched in the Ub
4 - Basically zero options in the install process. I get the default packages, and that is it.
You get what is needed and you can do your customization after the install process. This is the best decision ever made by the Ubuntu community.
5 - I could never get the ATI drivers to work well with Ubuntu on my wife's laptop, but they worked great with Sabayon and openSUSE.
Thousands of others have no problem. Can you install these drivers by clicking "yes" to an option on these other distros?
6 - I compiled a custom kernel by hand, but then I couldn't get the ATI driver to load at all, because Ubuntu demands that there be a restricted module package for the kernel, and I couldn't make one for a custom kernel.
If you do advanced things you're expected to know what you are doing. This is the same for any linux distro.
7 - Never could get madwifi to work on Ubuntu well, when it worked out of the box with openSUSE and Sabayon.
When was this?
8 - When I asked for support in the forums I was repeatedly flamed in PMs, and on the IRC support channel. I was told that I needed to install the 32-bit version, even when I asked for help the in the 64-bit forums. I was repeatedly told the 64-bit version is unsupported, even though Cannonical sells commercial support for it.
Again, when was this? Ubuntu has one of the best communities of any distro.
9 - Asking about restricted formats also provoked several flames, and Ubuntu fights methods that allow people to easily install them.
When was this? It's actually one click to install them now.
10 - I eventually tried out Kubuntu to find arguably the single worst KDE desktop I've seen in a distro.
Oh, so you have tried Kubuntu. Makes your point 1 a straight up lie. Can you say *why* you thought it was so bad? And when was this?
11 - I was repeatedly instructed not to install a toolkit or attempt to compile anything manually. "I might screw something up, and frankly you shouldn't ever try to to do things on your own."
Well, it seems from 6 above that you have demonstrated that you don't know what you're doing so they've been giving you good newbie advice.
12 - At every turn Ubuntu removed choice. It was the most simplistic, straight-forward distro I've ever tried. There is a target audience for that, and it isn't me.
All the choice is there, you just have to know what you're doing. The universe repository has more packages than any other distro.
13 - Ubuntu supposedly "simply works" just like Apple. Fans would like you to believe neither Apple nor Ubuntu ever have problems, and yet Ubuntu has had some serious bugs with their last four releases I've witnessed.
Apple doesn't "just work" either. Computers don't "just work". If you want something that "just works", go buy a toaster or a microwave - if it breaks, take it back to the manufacturer for a full refund.
14 - Kubuntu is a bastard child that not only receives little developer attention, but it is usually a release behind Ubuntu on *buntu features.
You mentioned Kubuntu. Again I ask, when was the last time you looked at it?
15 - A forum moderator actually told me I was an idiot for owning ATI hardware, to which I replied "it is the laptop my wife bought" to which he later replied "then you should divorce the bitch." I expect better from moderators. It is the single worst community I've ever dealt with. I really got spoiled on the Gentoo forums. I really love reading those.
Report him. That shit is not tolerated in the Ubuntu community.
Nominations are a great idea. As is changing administrations regularly. The big problem with modern democracy is that political parties collude to water down their principles to pander to voters who are largely ignorant of everything. The stated goal of voting is thus subverted as the government no longer represents the people. So why have voting at all? The only reason we still do is because people consider it a "fair" way to choose which candidate gets power. Well there's nothing more fair than chance, and the modern understanding of statistics makes it just as verifiable as voting, if not more so.
Let's abolish the two party system. Let's have a lottery for every member of the cabinet.
Well, in other democracies voters recognize that they are not experts so they don't let expert matters determine their voting preferences. One has to admit one does not know everything to start down that path though. Whereas, in the US, voters don't choose how they vote at all, they just do what the loud mouth people on the tv tell them to do.
This is why science needs to make a supreme being, then it just becomes a practical question: which would you rather worship? A God that doesn't care or a God that ensures you have enough to eat and something interesting to watch on tv?
Hmm.. damned if you do and damned if you don't indeed.
Of course, if you don't want to move on because you actually like where you work then the only thing you should be thankful for is that they don't reduce your pay. And the only reason why that is the case is because of convention.
Of course, there's also the "artists" out there who are asking why they can't "just make a living" by doing what they love. The answer, all too often, is that plenty of other people want to do the same thing, and society is just not interested in supporting that many people to do that thing. Once there's "enough" professionals doing a certain activity, there needs to be competition to choose between who gets paid and who goes and does something else. Otherwise everyone will be doing the "fun" jobs and no-one will be doing the hard jobs.
No...... what I'm saying is that a court should be able to order you to pay damages for slander, but they should not be able to order you to stop slandering someone. If you're happy to keep paying the damages, then you're free to keep saying what you like about the other person. At no point should the government be able to tell you to shut up, but this does not negate the fact that people who suffer damage by your statements can seek compensation for that damage.
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Everyone over 30 has a family lawyer.. otherwise you're just a smuck.
Who modded this troll? Wake the fuck up alright?
There's a whole bunch of kicking and screaming going on over Google Street Map right now because they dare actually do the work and make an actual product that has scared a few people into realizing that maybe the idea of "public space" wasn't exactly what they thought it was. "When you're in public you can be photographed in public, get over it" is my opinion but some have the idea that Google has shown that the law of "you can photograph anything that is 'in public'" is flawed and , in-fact, there's an expectation of privacy that goes beyond the 4th amendment (in the US) and reeks of something we can only call "cultural values".. and Google threatens to erode those values.. Boo Hoo.
So no, this isn't a freakin' troll, it's a pertinent point on the current battle that is going on between those who want more freedom or those who want more privacy or those who just want to be able to find the restaurant they're looking for in the 20 minutes they've got to arrange their trip.
Grow a spin. When Mr Security says "I'll take your camera" you say "just fucking try" and if they don't go off to get their superior then you call your lawyer. And that's the problem with authority, people are not willing to stand up to it so people overstepping their position become the norm and then the norm becomes unspeakable and then the unspeakable becomes unquestionable. So take your pictures and when they ask you to stop, say no.
Security guards on private property only have you the power to leave and, if you refuse, escort you from the premises. So, if they fuck with you, that's what you should say... "are you asking me to leave?".. as soon as they say no, you just say oh ok, thanks for the advice on your corporate policy. And hey, getting ejected from some random private property because you refuse to conform with their corporate policy is hardly something to be shameful about.
Why is UW not releasing their source code? If they intend to spin off commercial products, why are they releasing demos? Hell, even *Microsoft* is releasing demos of this stuff.. is Apple and Google the only companies that can ship product these days (even if it is "beta" you can at least freakin' use it).
No more demos. We know you're smart, now make something useful please.
So true. I should go on a rant about how I hate Redhat.. even though I haven't used it since 2001.
Or slackware.. oh wait, slackware hasn't changed since 2001.
When it comes to open source stuff one really has to keep up or shut up.
Why can't you use <quote>? When you did your Google search for Shuttleworth comments did you happen to get the date of the comment? People change their opinions over time you know.. Actually install a the latest version of Ubuntu on a machine with a 3d graphics card.. watch as it automatically installs the restricted drivers.
You'll notice he's modded up to +5 too. Slashdot "moderators" don't read the entire thread, and these posts are too big for them to read past the first paragraph. He's openly admitted that he's talking about Ubuntu fron two years ago and yet he insists that he knows what he's talking about.
What a dick.
But it was two years ago dude. ATI have likely released source code for those drivers by now. Keep up or keep quiet.
I've done this about five times on Slashdot. Someone asks me what I don't like about Ubuntu, I get modded down troll for answering a question, etc.
I can see why. You're wrong and you seem to be uninterested in learning this.
Kubuntu is a separate project worked on by seperate devs. It doesn't get the baseline Ubuntu features for precisely that reason.
No it isn't. What gave you that idea?
Fire up a Knoppix CD, or Kubuntu and you'll basically see a vanilla KDE desktop. They don't customize the packages, install addition patches, or do anything. Now fire up Mandriva, or openSUSE, or PCLinuxOS, or Arch's KDEMod, or Sabayon, etc. You'll see they've added other patches to expand functionality, fix bugs, backport features, etc. What is the point of 20 million distros if they all ship the same packages?
Many Ubuntu packages are largely the vanilla, upstream package with no changes. (Ubuntu has a decent number of kernel patches and toolchain patches, like many other distros, but they largely inherit these from Debian). openSUSE (my most common example recently, because it is my new favorite of all the major distros I've tried recently) hires devs to backport features, and make the best possible packages they can. Again, many Gnome users praise openSUSE for putting out a bettter Gnome desktop than Ubuntu, because they don't ship vanilla packages.
Oh, so "vanilla" means "like debian".. that's ok, I like debian. Sounds like you have a different personal preference. This is probably the most legitimate thing you have said in this thread.
I'm not saying Ubuntu is wrong. I'm saying I don't like it. I want options in my install process to customize it. Ubuntu is targeted at a certain audience. I'm not a member of it. I used to recommend Kubuntu to people who weren't computer savvy and wanted something very simple, and yet I discovered that other distros were just as simple to use, while providing better packages to boot.
Again, personal preference, good for you.
I always change the theme on any desktop, but you asked what I don't like. I really don't like Ubuntu brown and orange. A recent poll on the openSUSE forums showed most responders saying they never bother changing the default theme. I don't understand that. Why wouldn't you customize your desktop?
I like the default theme, personally. I also don't really care too much about it. You obviously do and that's your preference.
openSUSE offers a 1-click installer. Sabayon includes them by default. Heck, Mint (a nicer fork of Ubuntu) includes them by default. I followed the instructions on Ubuntu's wiki, yet they never worked. I asked for help and was repeatedly attacked for attempting to use ATI. Mind you, on the exact same laptop (my wife's old laptop) I ran Gentoo with the ATI drivers (custom kernel, -viper release), Sabayon with the ATI drivers, and openSUSE 10.1 with the ATI drivers. The only distro I had problems with was Ubuntu.
When was this? I have a machine with ATI drivers, Ubuntu installed them by default and alerted me that it had done it.
You're not seeing what I'm getting at. I know how to compile my own kernel. I've been doing it for years. Since I'm impatient, even on binary distros I compile my own kernel and manually patch in drivers rather than wait for distros to releasing updated packages. On Ubuntu and Kubuntu, after I made my own kernel, it would not load the ATI module at all. It gave me an error about how it could not load the module because it was missing a restricted modules .deb package. They've gone out of their way to patch into their kernel sources a measure to stop you from using proprietary modules. I've never seen another distro do this. For the stock Ubuntu kernels, this package exists. For custom kernels (I downloaded a -mm kernel and then patched in the Ub
1 - Gnome only
No, Kubuntu.
2 - Fairly vanilla packages
I have no idea what you're on about here.
3 - Really ugly themeing
It's a theme, you can change it.
4 - Basically zero options in the install process. I get the default packages, and that is it.
You get what is needed and you can do your customization after the install process. This is the best decision ever made by the Ubuntu community.
5 - I could never get the ATI drivers to work well with Ubuntu on my wife's laptop, but they worked great with Sabayon and openSUSE.
Thousands of others have no problem. Can you install these drivers by clicking "yes" to an option on these other distros?
6 - I compiled a custom kernel by hand, but then I couldn't get the ATI driver to load at all, because Ubuntu demands that there be a restricted module package for the kernel, and I couldn't make one for a custom kernel.
If you do advanced things you're expected to know what you are doing. This is the same for any linux distro.
7 - Never could get madwifi to work on Ubuntu well, when it worked out of the box with openSUSE and Sabayon.
When was this?
8 - When I asked for support in the forums I was repeatedly flamed in PMs, and on the IRC support channel. I was told that I needed to install the 32-bit version, even when I asked for help the in the 64-bit forums. I was repeatedly told the 64-bit version is unsupported, even though Cannonical sells commercial support for it.
Again, when was this? Ubuntu has one of the best communities of any distro.
9 - Asking about restricted formats also provoked several flames, and Ubuntu fights methods that allow people to easily install them.
When was this? It's actually one click to install them now.
10 - I eventually tried out Kubuntu to find arguably the single worst KDE desktop I've seen in a distro.
Oh, so you have tried Kubuntu. Makes your point 1 a straight up lie. Can you say *why* you thought it was so bad? And when was this?
11 - I was repeatedly instructed not to install a toolkit or attempt to compile anything manually. "I might screw something up, and frankly you shouldn't ever try to to do things on your own."
Well, it seems from 6 above that you have demonstrated that you don't know what you're doing so they've been giving you good newbie advice.
12 - At every turn Ubuntu removed choice. It was the most simplistic, straight-forward distro I've ever tried. There is a target audience for that, and it isn't me.
All the choice is there, you just have to know what you're doing. The universe repository has more packages than any other distro.
13 - Ubuntu supposedly "simply works" just like Apple. Fans would like you to believe neither Apple nor Ubuntu ever have problems, and yet Ubuntu has had some serious bugs with their last four releases I've witnessed.
Apple doesn't "just work" either. Computers don't "just work". If you want something that "just works", go buy a toaster or a microwave - if it breaks, take it back to the manufacturer for a full refund.
14 - Kubuntu is a bastard child that not only receives little developer attention, but it is usually a release behind Ubuntu on *buntu features.
You mentioned Kubuntu. Again I ask, when was the last time you looked at it?
15 - A forum moderator actually told me I was an idiot for owning ATI hardware, to which I replied "it is the laptop my wife bought" to which he later replied "then you should divorce the bitch." I expect better from moderators. It is the single worst community I've ever dealt with. I really got spoiled on the Gentoo forums. I really love reading those.
Report him. That shit is not tolerated in the Ubuntu community.
umm, dare I ask, what exactly don't you like about it?
Nominations are a great idea. As is changing administrations regularly. The big problem with modern democracy is that political parties collude to water down their principles to pander to voters who are largely ignorant of everything. The stated goal of voting is thus subverted as the government no longer represents the people. So why have voting at all? The only reason we still do is because people consider it a "fair" way to choose which candidate gets power. Well there's nothing more fair than chance, and the modern understanding of statistics makes it just as verifiable as voting, if not more so.
Let's abolish the two party system. Let's have a lottery for every member of the cabinet.
Well, in other democracies voters recognize that they are not experts so they don't let expert matters determine their voting preferences. One has to admit one does not know everything to start down that path though. Whereas, in the US, voters don't choose how they vote at all, they just do what the loud mouth people on the tv tell them to do.
Where the power from the electric car will come from.
English clearly isn't your forte either.
This is why science needs to make a supreme being, then it just becomes a practical question: which would you rather worship? A God that doesn't care or a God that ensures you have enough to eat and something interesting to watch on tv?
Hmm.. damned if you do and damned if you don't indeed.
It's pretty obvious that the writers of that article (let alone the quiz) are mostly ignorant of "science".
Especially seeing as a big factor of science is recognizing one's own ignorance.
A friend's father trains train drivers. I once asked him that question. You know what he said?
SHUT UP!
The trick is to work on more than one thing at a time.
I can write good code 18 hours a day. But hey, I've been doing it for 15 years.
That doesn't mean I *want* to.
Manage your manager.
Of course, if you don't want to move on because you actually like where you work then the only thing you should be thankful for is that they don't reduce your pay. And the only reason why that is the case is because of convention.
Agreed.
Of course, there's also the "artists" out there who are asking why they can't "just make a living" by doing what they love. The answer, all too often, is that plenty of other people want to do the same thing, and society is just not interested in supporting that many people to do that thing. Once there's "enough" professionals doing a certain activity, there needs to be competition to choose between who gets paid and who goes and does something else. Otherwise everyone will be doing the "fun" jobs and no-one will be doing the hard jobs.
Yeah, cause no-one thinks of artists as just being freeloaders on society. Musicians don't "work" ok?
It's neither a penalty nor a tax. It's compensation for damages caused to a fellow citizen.
No...... what I'm saying is that a court should be able to order you to pay damages for slander, but they should not be able to order you to stop slandering someone. If you're happy to keep paying the damages, then you're free to keep saying what you like about the other person. At no point should the government be able to tell you to shut up, but this does not negate the fact that people who suffer damage by your statements can seek compensation for that damage.