The problem with your example is that there are many human languages that are object->verb (postfix) order. German and Japanese come to mind. Some other languages are at least as radically different from English as Forth is from C. It's only a matter of familiarity, not basic "rightness". Matrix math in C doesn't much resemble the mathematical notation, either, but I haven't heard that used as a reason why C shouldn't be used for that.
As an alternative example, you could write a problem as you'd actually solve it on paper:
2012
1776
1865
+ 1588
-------
7241
Looks a lot closer to either postfix or prefix notation to me.
You can write obfuscated code in any language. C can be really _horrible_ to read and understand when pointers are involved. Also, it's an almost trivial exercise in Forth (or Lisp) to add infix capability, and such packages have been around a _long_ time. There are very good reasons why very few programmers experienced in either of these languages have any use for them. William Tanksley previously covered some of them.
I'm pretty sure the first ANSI C standard came out in 1989, so C has a 5 year, not 10+ year lead on Forth in that regard. However, there was the Forth83 standard and Forth79 before that. They weren't ANSI standards, but K&R C never was, either.
Debugging Forth is much easier and faster than debugging C. Small words ("functions") that are immediately and interactively tested make for rapid progress. Except for when I was first learning the language (1983-84), I've never had much use or need for source-level debuggers in Forth.
You've got a point when it comes to showing code to somebody who doesn't know the language, but C/C++ also has a (well deserved) reputation for being cryptic. If you want readability, Ada is much better choice than C.
I really disagree with your previous comments on RPN calculators. I found them to be very natural, faster, and easier to use than algebraic calculators. After learning how to use my first HP, I've never again willingly used an algebraic calculator.
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The problem with your example is that there are many human languages that are object->verb (postfix) order. German and Japanese come to mind. Some other languages are at least as radically different from English as Forth is from C. It's only a matter of familiarity, not basic "rightness". Matrix math in C doesn't much resemble the mathematical notation, either, but I haven't heard that used as a reason why C shouldn't be used for that. As an alternative example, you could write a problem as you'd actually solve it on paper: 2012 1776 1865 + 1588 ------- 7241 Looks a lot closer to either postfix or prefix notation to me. You can write obfuscated code in any language. C can be really _horrible_ to read and understand when pointers are involved. Also, it's an almost trivial exercise in Forth (or Lisp) to add infix capability, and such packages have been around a _long_ time. There are very good reasons why very few programmers experienced in either of these languages have any use for them. William Tanksley previously covered some of them.
I'm pretty sure the first ANSI C standard came out in 1989, so C has a 5 year, not 10+ year lead on Forth in that regard. However, there was the Forth83 standard and Forth79 before that. They weren't ANSI standards, but K&R C never was, either.
Debugging Forth is much easier and faster than debugging C. Small words ("functions") that are immediately and interactively tested make for rapid progress. Except for when I was first learning the language (1983-84), I've never had much use or need for source-level debuggers in Forth.
You've got a point when it comes to showing code to somebody who doesn't know the language, but C/C++ also has a (well deserved) reputation for being cryptic. If you want readability, Ada is much better choice than C.
I really disagree with your previous comments on RPN calculators. I found them to be very natural, faster, and easier to use than algebraic calculators. After learning how to use my first HP, I've never again willingly used an algebraic calculator.