It seems to me that the truth typically lies in the middle.
That's bullshit. The truth typically lies where the facts point. Or are you saying that the truth is between Flat Earth and Round Earth? Earth being the center and the universe, and not being the center of the universe? Christ.
Yes, sometimes the world is warming. Sometimes the world is cooling.
Stop parroting the same old denialist bullshit. It's warming right now, and it's outside the natural cycles. According to the natural cycles, it should be colder.
So your problem with science is that your grandmother made claims? Wow.
I understand that there is global warming. I also understand that there is global cooling. There's that whole cyclic thing going on.
You don't understand shit. The "natural cycles" bullshit is just another denialist canard. Stop parroting denialist bullshit, please.
Seems that even within the scientific community, there are those who are for and there are those who are against. If those doing the science can't make up their minds, why is it wrong that I continue to disbelieve?
No, everyone accepts AGW, except a tiny group of right-wing loons like Richard Lindzen. There are even biologists who reject Evolution. Do you therefore reject it too?
I think the global warming hypothesis is somewhere around "preponderance of evidence" (civil standard) and nowhere close to "beyond a reasonable doubt" (criminal standard).\
It's not a hypothesis. That the globe is warming is an observed fact. Way to throw away facts you don't like.
So I guess extreme cold weather is blamed on global warming, and extreme hot weather is blamed on global warming. That's a convenient position to take.
Why don't you look at what the science actually says instead of jumping to conclusions and ending up looking like a complete idiot?
Unfortunately, along with global warming comes a lot of anti-capitalist garbage from iPod-using urban hippies
So you reject AGW because you don't like what other people are doing with the facts?
There's way too much emotionalism infecting what should be a strictly scientific viewpoint.
Yes, on your part. Not on part of the actual scientists.
Nope, they are still using "global warming." What difference does it make anyway? Don't tell me you are saying that "if they say 'climate change' it is because they secretly doubt that it's warming"... Do you not get it? Even skeptics accept that it is warming, for farks sake!
If the science is settled, why do we keep paying for reports and research to determine its existence? Surely we would have moved onto and well past determining its effect, and how to prevent it by now.
Um, yes, that's exactly what's happening. Scientists moved on a long time ago. The science is settled. AGW is upon us. Now they are looking further into the details. Just like the Theory of Evolution is settled, but there is still much to learn about the details.
Advocates of AGW would have us believe most/all scientists approve of AGW, and that the vast, vast majority of citizens do to. At least, judging by the contempt and outright ridicule shown for those the least bit sceptical of the current AGW theories. If this is indeed the case, why do AGW-believers insist every single last person has to agree with them?
Just about all climate scientists agree about AGW. What other people believe is irrelevant to the science. I don't know if the vast majority of non-scientists accept AGW, but I doubt it, considering the propaganda being spewed by the denialist industry.
Surely the "vast majority" of the population that already agrees with AGW - if those people do in fact exist - would be enough to take the required actions to prevent a major disaster. Say if 90% of the population believed in AGW, surely that would be enough to take affirmitive action, the remaining 10% could pollute as much as they want without affecting the Earth-saving efforts.
Except the denialist industry is spreading FUD, propaganda and lies, and fooling people into not accepting the facts of AGW.
If acting on AGW is all about risk management, why do we act on AGW but not the crazy guy on the street corner who says we should repent for our sins for the apocalypse is nigh? I was under the impression Pascal's Wager was debunked many centuries ago, killing any "risk management" concerns we had so we could safely act on proven issues instead of imaginary ones.
What are you talking about? AGW is established science with huge amounts of evidence. The crazy guy on the corner has nothing but his own craziness to show.
Naturally I have many other issues with how the AGW debate is held.
You don't have any problems with the blatant lies being actively spewed by the denialist propaganda machinery?
The use of the "No True Scotsman" fallacy. ie. "No REPUTABLE scientist disagrees the AGW theory" (that's quoted, verbatim, from a debate I've seen). Apparently, "REPUTABLE scientist" means "any scientist who promotes AGW theory as a fact".
Actually, hardly any reputable scientists reject AGW, and skeptical scientist like Richard Lindzen have so far failed to produce evidence against AGW.
The use of the word "AGW denier", for anyone the least bit sceptic
This is BS. A denier is someone who denies. It is true that true skeptics are rare, because someone who is genuinely skeptical will look at the fact in a neutral way, and end up concluding that AGW is happening.
AGW is like when everyone believed the Earth was flat, and the Sun revolves around it. Look! Existing widely held beliefs turned out to be wrong! Therefore AGW must be too!
Except this is bullshit. AGW is science. Everyone believing that the Earth was flat and the center of the universe was not science (actual scientists knew otherwise, but would be executed if they stated it in public).
Using anecdotal evidence. Yes, some people really are stupid enough to do this. "I felt hotter this year than last year, therefore global warming is real."
No one is better at anecdotal evidence than AGW denialists.
Personally, for a scientific theory that apparently was accepted decad
Who cares about Gore, Obama and Gillard? Listen to what the scientists are saying instead. Stop being selective about the facts based on your ideology, and look at what the science says instead.
Since past global warmings were not, there's not a lot of reason to believe that this one is. CO2 levels have been higher in the past, atmospheric water vapor has been higher in the past, etc..
That's your problem. You have your irrational belief. The facts, on the other hand, show that human activity is causing the warming.
You apparently don't find it difficult to rationalize your denial of the facts. You are simply making up lies about global warming to ignore that the facts show global warming.
I'm sorry, but the debate is settled. The warming is caused by humans, as all the research shows. Of course, a tiny minority is trying to trick others into thinking that the debate isn't settled, just like with creationists and tobacco denialists.
What happens today will not happen naturally. Natural cycles are extremely long, whereas the changes we are talking about now are mere generations into the future. This kind of rapid change is disastrous to humanity, which would otherwise be able to adapt to the slower natural changes.
You should perhaps educate yourself a bit. Global warming increases humidity, which also increases snowfall. Snow won't go away with a warmer planet, but the patterns will change.
And if you are a liberal and an environmental lobby shill then you don't see anything wrong with these leaps of faith:
These are not leaps of faith. You are just throwing up a straw man and red herring in one.
The science clearly shows that the planet is warming, and that it is caused by human activity. That's the science.
You disagree with the policies proposed to address this issue, so you throw the baby out with the bathwater. "I don't like the policies, therefore the science the policies are based on must be wrong."
Yes, people are indeed denying that there is climate change, and that the climate is warming. Sometimes they'll change their position and accept that the climate might be warming, but it is certainly not because of humans! Those are dogmatic positions based on political ideology. The scientific facts clearly show warming, and that the warming is man-made.
Using your logic by the time we find out CO2 is NOT the cause we will have destroyed the world economy and have the devastation to humanity already also.
Unfortunately, all the facts show that CO2 IS the cause. You can of course continue to be religious about it and willfully ignore the facts...
I don't trust anyone on the Green Madness side as there has been numerous cases of hidden data that once exposed proved incorrect.
Nope. The science is clear, and there is no hidden data that has been proved incorrect.
The most obvious source of bias is funding. As I see it, climatologists whose research can be used to support the theory of AGW are better funded than climatologists whose work cannot be used to support AGW. That creates bias all by itself.
Except that's not the case. Skeptical scientists are getting the same funding. It's just that they are a tiny minority because the facts all show AGW. The skeptical scientists are getting the same funding, but they have been unable to show that their skepticism is well-founded.
It's happening because of human activity, and it is going to have severe consequences for millions or billions of people. But hey, who cares if them there black skinned people in Farawayistan die in massive numbers, eh?
You don't believe we have anything to do with it, despite the massive amounts of research showing that we do? Why don't you stop believing, and instead educate yourself and look at the facts?
The sun is at a low right now, so the planet should be cooling. And yet it is warming.
We are between ice ages, and it should be getting colder. And yet it is warming.
Slashdot Mirror
You are clearly deeply ignorant.
That's bullshit. The truth typically lies where the facts point. Or are you saying that the truth is between Flat Earth and Round Earth? Earth being the center and the universe, and not being the center of the universe? Christ.
Stop parroting the same old denialist bullshit. It's warming right now, and it's outside the natural cycles. According to the natural cycles, it should be colder.
You don't understand shit. The "natural cycles" bullshit is just another denialist canard. Stop parroting denialist bullshit, please.
No, everyone accepts AGW, except a tiny group of right-wing loons like Richard Lindzen. There are even biologists who reject Evolution. Do you therefore reject it too?
It's not a hypothesis. That the globe is warming is an observed fact. Way to throw away facts you don't like.
Are you going to reply to Abcd1234's comment or what?
No, "global warming" is not inaccurate. It's 100% confirmed.
Why don't you look at what the science actually says instead of jumping to conclusions and ending up looking like a complete idiot?
So you reject AGW because you don't like what other people are doing with the facts?
Yes, on your part. Not on part of the actual scientists.
Nope, they are still using "global warming." What difference does it make anyway? Don't tell me you are saying that "if they say 'climate change' it is because they secretly doubt that it's warming"... Do you not get it? Even skeptics accept that it is warming, for farks sake!
Um, yes, that's exactly what's happening. Scientists moved on a long time ago. The science is settled. AGW is upon us. Now they are looking further into the details. Just like the Theory of Evolution is settled, but there is still much to learn about the details.
Just about all climate scientists agree about AGW. What other people believe is irrelevant to the science. I don't know if the vast majority of non-scientists accept AGW, but I doubt it, considering the propaganda being spewed by the denialist industry.
Except the denialist industry is spreading FUD, propaganda and lies, and fooling people into not accepting the facts of AGW.
What are you talking about? AGW is established science with huge amounts of evidence. The crazy guy on the corner has nothing but his own craziness to show.
You don't have any problems with the blatant lies being actively spewed by the denialist propaganda machinery?
Actually, hardly any reputable scientists reject AGW, and skeptical scientist like Richard Lindzen have so far failed to produce evidence against AGW.
This is BS. A denier is someone who denies. It is true that true skeptics are rare, because someone who is genuinely skeptical will look at the fact in a neutral way, and end up concluding that AGW is happening.
Except this is bullshit. AGW is science. Everyone believing that the Earth was flat and the center of the universe was not science (actual scientists knew otherwise, but would be executed if they stated it in public).
No one is better at anecdotal evidence than AGW denialists.
Why do you believe what Watts, the notorious liar, has to say?
Who cares about Gore, Obama and Gillard? Listen to what the scientists are saying instead. Stop being selective about the facts based on your ideology, and look at what the science says instead.
That's your problem. You have your irrational belief. The facts, on the other hand, show that human activity is causing the warming.
The answer is human activity. All research shows this to be the case.
Because they were local events caused by arctic winds reaching new areas. Globally, the planet was warmer than before.
No, global warming: The globe is warming. This is an observed fact. You are the one rejecting the facts for political reasons.
You apparently don't find it difficult to rationalize your denial of the facts. You are simply making up lies about global warming to ignore that the facts show global warming.
I'm sorry, but the debate is settled. The warming is caused by humans, as all the research shows. Of course, a tiny minority is trying to trick others into thinking that the debate isn't settled, just like with creationists and tobacco denialists.
What happens today will not happen naturally. Natural cycles are extremely long, whereas the changes we are talking about now are mere generations into the future. This kind of rapid change is disastrous to humanity, which would otherwise be able to adapt to the slower natural changes.
You should perhaps educate yourself a bit. Global warming increases humidity, which also increases snowfall. Snow won't go away with a warmer planet, but the patterns will change.
These are not leaps of faith. You are just throwing up a straw man and red herring in one.
The science clearly shows that the planet is warming, and that it is caused by human activity. That's the science.
You disagree with the policies proposed to address this issue, so you throw the baby out with the bathwater. "I don't like the policies, therefore the science the policies are based on must be wrong."
Yes, people are indeed denying that there is climate change, and that the climate is warming. Sometimes they'll change their position and accept that the climate might be warming, but it is certainly not because of humans! Those are dogmatic positions based on political ideology. The scientific facts clearly show warming, and that the warming is man-made.
Unfortunately, all the facts show that CO2 IS the cause. You can of course continue to be religious about it and willfully ignore the facts...
Nope. The science is clear, and there is no hidden data that has been proved incorrect.
Except that's not the case. Skeptical scientists are getting the same funding. It's just that they are a tiny minority because the facts all show AGW. The skeptical scientists are getting the same funding, but they have been unable to show that their skepticism is well-founded.
Conspiracy theory FAIL.
That's because you are deeply ignorant.
It's happening because of human activity, and it is going to have severe consequences for millions or billions of people. But hey, who cares if them there black skinned people in Farawayistan die in massive numbers, eh?
The sun is at a low right now, so the planet should be cooling. And yet it is warming.
We are between ice ages, and it should be getting colder. And yet it is warming.