there is no accountability for the government, the US Govt and its three letter bureaucracies degenerate in to gangs of criminals, you can bet they milked that information for all its worth, i bet valuable data went to their criminal friends on wallstreet, the US Govt has degenerated in to a kleptocratic gang of fascists that are liars, thieves and murderers. and they know they can get away with it because there is no accountability
This is one more step in the breakdown of our society. When the average person sees that powerful people are not subject to the law, they start to wonder why they themselves should be subject to the law. When they see people lying, cheating and stealing to get ahead, and it working, they conclude that only chumps play by the rules. When they perceive that there is one set of rules for the rich and powerful, and another for everyone else, they lose respect for the system.
These attitudes are a cancer on our society. When trust and respect break down, all that is left to order society is force. When people can't trust the authorities, they become an adversary. This won't end well.
Based on personal experience I will say that cycling is dangerous, at least in a city. I used to ride a bike to work and eventually came to the conclusion that I was taking my life in my hands every time I did it. Having cars that close to cyclists, with such a speed and weight difference is asking for trouble, even with bike lanes. I remember bike and scooter lanes in Munich, Germany that shared space with pedestrians on the sidewalk. That seems much safer to me than having the bikes share the street with cars.
The NSA's job is to spy on anyone and everyone who might be a potential threat to the USA.... the only limit on this is when they are specifically told not to...
Might be a potential threat? That's gotta be the broadest brush I've ever seen. If we're guarding against anything that might be a potential threat (under some circumstance at some point in the indeterminate future), then we're guarding against everything. I can think of a scenario in which air might be a potential threat.
the bond of trust is broken. its painfully obvious that rules don't apply to those in power. therefore, the rules are void. feel free to follow your concience and break any laws you want.
welcome to the brave new world. maybe world 2.0 will be a better one. maybe.
This is a good explanation of the problem, that a lot of people don't seem to understand. When people see that the rules don't apply to a certain class of other people, they start to think they shouldn't have to play by the rules either. That's why it is important to lead by example, rather than just insist people obey authority while maintaining a double standard.
There are legitimate reasons to spy, but that does not make all spying legitimate. The NSA may be looking for all the things you suggested and more. But they were already suspected of using their powers for industrial espionage. So the idea that they are still doing that is not far-fetched.
Cold you don't seem to understand that the waterboard is not OK under international law. What the US subjects its special forces and pilots does not change the legal definitions.
As I'm sure you've noticed he's a big fan of false equivalences and excusing one's own behavior by comparing it to that of another.
If you want to tap dance around the subject and hint that blackmail is going on without proof, fine, but I'll remain skeptical. Correlation without documentation doesn't necessarily equal proof. But point me towards something, if you care to. There are plenty of people on Slashdot that "know" things that aren't necessarily so.
If that were true I would expect it would be pretty high priority for Greenwald to leak, and there is nothing like it so far from him, or anyone else for that matter. Due to the total lack of supporting data I'm going to call this a wild fabrication.
Glenn Greenwald hasn't reported it? Well, I guess that settles it then.
If you answered "yes" to either of these questions, then you can assume that yes, the NSA is monitoring you.
Along with the Chinese, Russians, French, British, Canadians,...., and just about everyone else in the local neighborhood.
Sorry, no. No other country has the surveillance capabilities and resources the US does. We spend waaay more on this stuff than anyone else. Sure, other countries spy, but not on the scale and scope of the NSA.
obama is a puppet, he is owned by his handlers (military/industrial complex & wallstreet & federal reserve) and he does exactly what they want him to do
So, you are thinking that they wanted:
- The sequester to cut $50 billion per year out of the defense budget? (With the MIC already down to 4-5% of GDP from 9.3% in 1962?)
GDP in 1962 was $3.1 trillion, while it is $13.75 trillion today. So defense spending has gone from $288.3 billion to $618.75 billion. You think the MIC would be unhappy with that? It may be down in recent years; don't think so short term. The fear of terrorism isn't going away, and thus neither is the defense and intelligence money.
- Massive new financial regulations on loans, consumer credit, and much increased Federal government oversight?
The financial industry fought against the financial reforms and were successful in weakening them before passage. Dodd-Frank was better than nothing, but it didn't do as much as it needed to to really stave off future financial catastrophe. Too big to fail is still too big.
- Massive increases to Federal regulations across most sectors of the economy which raise the cost of business and threaten uncertainty?
Massive? Such as?
- The Obamacare debacle?
You think they seek their own weakening or destruction? I think you haven't thought that through all the way.
They're the Elite, not deities. A bad website roll out is evidence against Elite control of government?
As far as seeking one's own destruction, think about this: When asset prices go down it is a buying opportunity for those with the means. So when the stock market or housing market crashes and sends asset prices down, you could say that is bad for the rich because they lose value in their investments. Or you could say it is good because they have so much money, it doesn't matter and they are able to pick up equities and real estate at bargain prices. They know the price will eventually recover, so they come out better in the end. Likewise, a bad economy can help the wealthy because labor becomes really cheap. You think a billionaire cares about a "bad economy"? His lifestyle doesn't change, so what does he care? Besides, 95% of the gains from the most recent recovery went to the top 1%. So it seems their interests are being served just fine.
Why is my Rite Aid's freedom not to be robbed less important to you than crooks having the freedom to move untracked by law enforcement? What I don't understand is how this helps anyone but the crooks? If they weren't robbing a store, what bad would have come from having a GPS unit attached to their car?
Define "crooks". You mean like armed robbers or anti-fracking activists?
* Financial records. I scan all my paychecks and store them (on SkyDrive, not Box.com - fortunately). Our tax form PDFs are all on some cloud storage service, either SkyDrive or Dropbox, as are all our receipts. These would have been in the hands of a total stranger - perfect fodder for identity theft.
They were already in the hands of total strangers; he uploaded them to SkyDrive.
All that is coming to an end, thanks the libs abd useful idiots who put these statists into office,
Oy, this left vs. right crap. Look, the state serves the interests of Big Money. That is the financial industry, energy extraction, defense contractors, big agriculture, etc. If you focus on left and right, lib and con, you are missing the real action. The government does not operate according to a left or right ideology. It operates under a good-for-business ideology. The rest is just what the Republicans and Democrats serve up to their constituents to fire up the base and scare them about the other team. All that goes out the window once their in office and they're serving their real masters.
"An external god-like observer" sounds like major woo-woo red alert all mind poop shields on full verification required.
It's a thought experiment, relax. Surely we can all agree that God can exist as a theoretical construct. Some would say that's the only way he can exist.
"One thing I've noticed as a passenger is that the most dangerous-feeling aspect of flying right now seems to be the winding security line itself."
Really? I despise the TSA and the burdensome screening process as much as the next person, and this is far from sympathising, but you honestly mean to say you felt endangered by the screening process? Of all the legitimate dangers you face in your daily life, and you're going to try to convince people that walking through a winding line and submitting to largely no-contact screening makes you fearful? And then you expect people to take you just as seriously after that?
The security line is a much easier target than the airplane itself. If you want to terrorize people, bombing the security line is a good way to do it. Can you imagine what it would do to air travel if you could be killed waiting in line?
The thing is that before 9/11 the identities and whereabouts of most of the hijackers were already known to US intelligence. This type of screening would not have been necessary because the CIA and DIA knew these people were terrorists and knew they were in the country. Two of them lived with an FBI informant for crying out loud. So the intelligence agencies already had the power and capabilities they needed to identify terrorists even before they got these new powers. It's a power grab.
"One thing I've noticed as a passenger is that the most dangerous-feeling aspect of flying right now seems to be the winding security line itself."
Exactly this. You wouldn't need to worry about getting past security, or even having a plane ticket, to cause all kinds of panic & pandemonium with a b*mb. At times there are hundreds of people standing in those lines in the larger airports...
The security line is an easy target. It would be trivial to successfully attack one. And yet it doesn't happen. It almost makes one think that terrorism isn't much of a threat.
So while they spin this as "you'll get through screening quicker" what they really want is background checks on nearly everyone that travels by plane.
Fucking seriously let's save all that tax money and the tax money being wasted now, and just racially profile. What's the fucking problem?
On the other side of that, I have not flown commercially since before 9/11 and don't plan on it anytime soon.
Flying is no more dangerous now than it was before 9/11/01. In fact, it's probably less dangerous because passengers will not tolerate a hijacker nowadays. The security measures in place now would not have prevented the 9/11 hijackers from boarding the planes. That same attack would succeed today (at least the getting-on-the-planes part).
So what are we doing here? Security is no more effective than it was, but the government is keeping much tighter tabs on everyone. I used to get called a tinfoil-hatter when I suggested there is another agenda at play. That doesn't happen as much anymore.
Slashdot Mirror
there is no accountability for the government, the US Govt and its three letter bureaucracies degenerate in to gangs of criminals, you can bet they milked that information for all its worth, i bet valuable data went to their criminal friends on wallstreet, the US Govt has degenerated in to a kleptocratic gang of fascists that are liars, thieves and murderers. and they know they can get away with it because there is no accountability
This is one more step in the breakdown of our society. When the average person sees that powerful people are not subject to the law, they start to wonder why they themselves should be subject to the law. When they see people lying, cheating and stealing to get ahead, and it working, they conclude that only chumps play by the rules. When they perceive that there is one set of rules for the rich and powerful, and another for everyone else, they lose respect for the system.
These attitudes are a cancer on our society. When trust and respect break down, all that is left to order society is force. When people can't trust the authorities, they become an adversary. This won't end well.
I hope you have your sextant ready, as I wouldn't count on GPS satellites staying in operation if society collapses to that extent.
GPS is run by the military; it'll still be there.
Remember folks, you're not the customer, you're the product.
No kidding. Facebook: not even once.
You have slave mentality. The injustice is anyone having to take off his shoes at all.
You have a suicidal mentality. The injustice is bombs on planes.
Which bombs are these that the TSA has prevented from being taken onto a plane?
Based on personal experience I will say that cycling is dangerous, at least in a city. I used to ride a bike to work and eventually came to the conclusion that I was taking my life in my hands every time I did it. Having cars that close to cyclists, with such a speed and weight difference is asking for trouble, even with bike lanes. I remember bike and scooter lanes in Munich, Germany that shared space with pedestrians on the sidewalk. That seems much safer to me than having the bikes share the street with cars.
The NSA's job is to spy on anyone and everyone who might be a potential threat to the USA .... the only limit on this is when they are specifically told not to ...
Might be a potential threat? That's gotta be the broadest brush I've ever seen. If we're guarding against anything that might be a potential threat (under some circumstance at some point in the indeterminate future), then we're guarding against everything. I can think of a scenario in which air might be a potential threat.
the bond of trust is broken. its painfully obvious that rules don't apply to those in power. therefore, the rules are void. feel free to follow your concience and break any laws you want.
welcome to the brave new world. maybe world 2.0 will be a better one. maybe.
This is a good explanation of the problem, that a lot of people don't seem to understand. When people see that the rules don't apply to a certain class of other people, they start to think they shouldn't have to play by the rules either. That's why it is important to lead by example, rather than just insist people obey authority while maintaining a double standard.
There are legitimate reasons to spy, but that does not make all spying legitimate. The NSA may be looking for all the things you suggested and more. But they were already suspected of using their powers for industrial espionage. So the idea that they are still doing that is not far-fetched.
Cold you don't seem to understand that the waterboard is not OK under international law. What the US subjects its special forces and pilots does not change the legal definitions.
As I'm sure you've noticed he's a big fan of false equivalences and excusing one's own behavior by comparing it to that of another.
If you want to tap dance around the subject and hint that blackmail is going on without proof, fine, but I'll remain skeptical. Correlation without documentation doesn't necessarily equal proof. But point me towards something, if you care to. There are plenty of people on Slashdot that "know" things that aren't necessarily so.
Indeed there are. I can point you to this: http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2013/06/nsa-whistleblower-nsa-spying-on-and-blackmailing-high-level-government-officials-and-military-officers.html. It's not blackmailing of ordinary citizens, it's actually worse.
If that were true I would expect it would be pretty high priority for Greenwald to leak, and there is nothing like it so far from him, or anyone else for that matter. Due to the total lack of supporting data I'm going to call this a wild fabrication.
Glenn Greenwald hasn't reported it? Well, I guess that settles it then.
If you answered "yes" to either of these questions, then you can assume that yes, the NSA is monitoring you.
Along with the Chinese, Russians, French, British, Canadians, ...., and just about everyone else in the local neighborhood.
Sorry, no. No other country has the surveillance capabilities and resources the US does. We spend waaay more on this stuff than anyone else. Sure, other countries spy, but not on the scale and scope of the NSA.
It would be great to have more time and resources to correct some of the nonsense that floats around the intertubes.
It would, but you post too much and I don't have that much time.
obama is a puppet, he is owned by his handlers (military/industrial complex & wallstreet & federal reserve) and he does exactly what they want him to do
So, you are thinking that they wanted:
- The sequester to cut $50 billion per year out of the defense budget? (With the MIC already down to 4-5% of GDP from 9.3% in 1962?)
GDP in 1962 was $3.1 trillion, while it is $13.75 trillion today. So defense spending has gone from $288.3 billion to $618.75 billion. You think the MIC would be unhappy with that? It may be down in recent years; don't think so short term. The fear of terrorism isn't going away, and thus neither is the defense and intelligence money.
- Massive new financial regulations on loans, consumer credit, and much increased Federal government oversight?
The financial industry fought against the financial reforms and were successful in weakening them before passage. Dodd-Frank was better than nothing, but it didn't do as much as it needed to to really stave off future financial catastrophe. Too big to fail is still too big.
- Massive increases to Federal regulations across most sectors of the economy which raise the cost of business and threaten uncertainty?
Massive? Such as?
- The Obamacare debacle?
You think they seek their own weakening or destruction? I think you haven't thought that through all the way.
They're the Elite, not deities. A bad website roll out is evidence against Elite control of government?
As far as seeking one's own destruction, think about this: When asset prices go down it is a buying opportunity for those with the means. So when the stock market or housing market crashes and sends asset prices down, you could say that is bad for the rich because they lose value in their investments. Or you could say it is good because they have so much money, it doesn't matter and they are able to pick up equities and real estate at bargain prices. They know the price will eventually recover, so they come out better in the end. Likewise, a bad economy can help the wealthy because labor becomes really cheap. You think a billionaire cares about a "bad economy"? His lifestyle doesn't change, so what does he care? Besides, 95% of the gains from the most recent recovery went to the top 1%. So it seems their interests are being served just fine.
Why is my Rite Aid's freedom not to be robbed less important to you than crooks having the freedom to move untracked by law enforcement? What I don't understand is how this helps anyone but the crooks? If they weren't robbing a store, what bad would have come from having a GPS unit attached to their car?
Define "crooks". You mean like armed robbers or anti-fracking activists?
* Financial records. I scan all my paychecks and store them (on SkyDrive, not Box.com - fortunately). Our tax form PDFs are all on some cloud storage service, either SkyDrive or Dropbox, as are all our receipts. These would have been in the hands of a total stranger - perfect fodder for identity theft.
They were already in the hands of total strangers; he uploaded them to SkyDrive.
All that is coming to an end, thanks the libs abd useful idiots who put these statists into office,
Oy, this left vs. right crap. Look, the state serves the interests of Big Money. That is the financial industry, energy extraction, defense contractors, big agriculture, etc. If you focus on left and right, lib and con, you are missing the real action. The government does not operate according to a left or right ideology. It operates under a good-for-business ideology. The rest is just what the Republicans and Democrats serve up to their constituents to fire up the base and scare them about the other team. All that goes out the window once their in office and they're serving their real masters.
You're hawking that shit here?
"An external god-like observer" sounds like major woo-woo red alert all mind poop shields on full verification required.
It's a thought experiment, relax. Surely we can all agree that God can exist as a theoretical construct. Some would say that's the only way he can exist.
"One thing I've noticed as a passenger is that the most dangerous-feeling aspect of flying right now seems to be the winding security line itself."
Really? I despise the TSA and the burdensome screening process as much as the next person, and this is far from sympathising, but you honestly mean to say you felt endangered by the screening process? Of all the legitimate dangers you face in your daily life, and you're going to try to convince people that walking through a winding line and submitting to largely no-contact screening makes you fearful? And then you expect people to take you just as seriously after that?
The security line is a much easier target than the airplane itself. If you want to terrorize people, bombing the security line is a good way to do it. Can you imagine what it would do to air travel if you could be killed waiting in line?
The thing is that before 9/11 the identities and whereabouts of most of the hijackers were already known to US intelligence. This type of screening would not have been necessary because the CIA and DIA knew these people were terrorists and knew they were in the country. Two of them lived with an FBI informant for crying out loud. So the intelligence agencies already had the power and capabilities they needed to identify terrorists even before they got these new powers. It's a power grab.
"One thing I've noticed as a passenger is that the most dangerous-feeling aspect of flying right now seems to be the winding security line itself."
Exactly this. You wouldn't need to worry about getting past security, or even having a plane ticket, to cause all kinds of panic & pandemonium with a b*mb. At times there are hundreds of people standing in those lines in the larger airports...
The security line is an easy target. It would be trivial to successfully attack one. And yet it doesn't happen. It almost makes one think that terrorism isn't much of a threat.
So while they spin this as "you'll get through screening quicker" what they really want is background checks on nearly everyone that travels by plane. Fucking seriously let's save all that tax money and the tax money being wasted now, and just racially profile. What's the fucking problem?
On the other side of that, I have not flown commercially since before 9/11 and don't plan on it anytime soon.
Flying is no more dangerous now than it was before 9/11/01. In fact, it's probably less dangerous because passengers will not tolerate a hijacker nowadays. The security measures in place now would not have prevented the 9/11 hijackers from boarding the planes. That same attack would succeed today (at least the getting-on-the-planes part).
So what are we doing here? Security is no more effective than it was, but the government is keeping much tighter tabs on everyone. I used to get called a tinfoil-hatter when I suggested there is another agenda at play. That doesn't happen as much anymore.
Outside view on US customs. This is an article from a Dutch writer who was treated quite shabbily at the US borders: http://dasmag.nl/why-i-will-never-return-to-the-usa/
Wow. Stupidity and power are a dangerous combination.
I am not going to visit that country. I wanted to, but I don't want to anymore. Let the world know when you've dealt with your fascists.
Unfortunately, there is a scenario I could foresee that involves the rest of the world dealing with our fascists.